I have a wool vest that I really like, but what are you guys wearing for a down mid-layer jacket or bottoms?

Thank you

Let's face it when you get wet your going to get cold. You can take wool pants and a jacket and wring them out, snap them a few times or slap them against a tree and a lot of the water will come out. This won't work with down, if your jacket gets a good dunk the down mats down and wads up in the lining of the jacket. At this point you have a mighty cold walk back to the truck. Wool works with your body heat/moisture, down seems like the heat is on all the time.

I played scuba-joe through the ice predator hunting one night when it was sub-zero. I wish people would mark spearing holes like the law says. Anyway, my wool KOM pants stood up on their own after the hike out. In a light rain I love wool. Thin down may be a great treestand item to have.

Yep, it's wool for me.  I'm pretty clumsy and end up wet sometimes

I think everyone should consider when using down in any area that has water crossings, boats over water etc that a system is designed which allows you to keep warm even if everything gets wet. Its a fool that would do otherwise.
Some good points have been made about wool getting wet and not being comfy warm either- in any case its going to be the layer next to your skin that will  save your arse if you get dunked and its cold, no matter what you are wearing. Choose wisely grasshopper...
Consider whip cord wool pants- stops wind, don't soak up 30lbs of water when wet and are very temp flexible when used with differing thickness layers under them. Snow generally does not cling up on them either like it does on more coursely woven wools.

I love down -- warm, light, and non-constricting. I try to keep pretty dry in my bowhunting exploits (never been to wet climates like certain parts of Canada or Alaska).

Down is good for insulation while mountaineering, winter camping, ice fishing and other activities where you'll be exposed to very cold, dry conditions.  Once it's wet, you will never dry it in the field.  It is very durable, if high quality, and highly compressible.  I have two down parkas and a sleeping bag.  My wife has a down parka and down expedition mitts.

Wool is good for insulation when you are hunting, snowshoeing (in layered applications only!), and any other time when moisture can be an issue.  My wife once fell into a lake at a canoe launch wearing an Icelandic wool sweater.  She popped back up and discovered that everything under the sweater stayed dry during the immersion.

Cotton is what you wear back at the lodge while telling lies about the shot you passed on earlier that day.

Noisy, worthless when wet, and just wait until you rip it on the shrubbery and have little wind indicators floating all over.

I see a lot of people "dissing" down, use whatever you want.

I like wool but it's danged heavy when it's wet and it retains a lot of water that won't be able to be wrung out.  you can freeze it and whack the ice out or so I've heard. I've been so wet with wool that i had a hard time walking and keeping my pants on, but I was still warm.  Nice stuff indeed!

Down is best for really cold, dry weather-exactly where it won't get soaked. I love my down vest and carry it a lot, I've used it in cold rainstorms, just don't get it wet....kind of a no brainer really, simply wear it under something.  I suppose if you can keep your fletching dry you ought to be able to keep your down clothing dry.

Wool will keep you warm,when soaking wet,down wont but is nice ,dont get me wrong .For extreme cold weather survival though wool is the hands down winner.I can attest to that from being lost in the wilderness of the pacific n.w.once when younger.My wool saved me from hyopothermia,no doubt in my mind.Now if a guy wants a good sleeping bag,down is the best,especially if you pay the bucks and get the good stuff.

If I fall in the creek while I'm 1/2 a mile from my truck the chances are I'm going to get completely soaked. My boots are going to be full of water, my gloves and everything else.  So I guess if I wear my filson wool jacket I'll be a little more comfortable walking back to my truck than if I was wearing my down jacket. In either case I'm not going to go sit in a treestand for another 5 hours. I'm going to go home and feel stupid for falling in the creek.

If Problem Child asked us which garment is better for a trip to alaska I think the wool arguement is appropriate. But come on guys, most of us hunt within walking distance of our house or truck. If we get wet its either raining and you have rain gear on. Or you fell in the pond/creek and are going home and in neither case will you die of hypothermia by the time you walk to your truck.

I have a down vest that I pull out for really cold days on stand and it is awesome!

Wool is a very functional garment and I own several items made of high quality wool. But wool isn't the warmest option for cold winter days.

Problem child,  if you hunt in some serious cold weather put on your down jacket under a wool coat and it will be a great day!

I like my wool, but i don't like the weight. Who makes a good down midlayer jacket?

QuoteOriginally posted by BCD:
I like my wool, but i don't like the weight. Who makes a good down midlayer jacket?

MontBell, Western Mountaineering, Marmot, LL Bean, REI, Feathered Friends, Patagonia....

Goose down: The reason wool sleeping bags went extinct.

 

Thanks- which would you recommend?

Chris, what if you break something when you fall in that creek? Rhetorical question. I try not to go out without making sure I can get back, whatever happens. If I'm stranded in the cold rain, I want to be wearing wool.

Hunting the Colorado mountains with my wife, I killed an elk and didn't leave the area until it was getting dark. While trying to reach the trail where our guide was waiting to pick us up, we ran into an avalanche path of downed aspens that was impenetrable. Eventually we made it back to camp, after midnight and totally exhausted. If the weather had turned bad, we could have been in real trouble. Stuff happens.

Well, I've owned Western Mountaineering, Patagonia, LL Bean and Feathered Friends down products. All are made very nicely. Pata and Bean are made in Asia generally. WM and FF are American made...and are not cheap. All have good websites to describe their products. If I could afford it, I'd go with WM or FF. WM uses a network of retailers, while FF is a direct order/retailer located in Seattle.

Also and not to be ignored: LL Bean has an unlimited lifetime guarantee on everything they sell. If it fails 5 years from now, it's repaired or more likely replaced on the spot.

Finally, look for goose down of at least 800 fill power if you can afford it...and 850 is better. These higher fill power downs produce lighter garments for their warmth, and I've noticed they loft tighter and more persistently than lower quality (500 - 650) down.

After reading this thread i just bought a down vest that cabelas has listed in its Bargain Cave. I plan to use it under my KOM wool jacket so I can get the best of both worlds.

Has anyone tried cabelas down long underwear?

Mr. BCD,
Got a pair of the "pants" 10 or 12 years ago.  They are very warm and comfortable, layered appropriately.  Just the ticket for -40 degrees (F).
Best Wishes

Down underwear is great in camp. But don't try to use it in the field.
There are better materials for next to skin that do what needs to be done ie: move moisture away right at the contact surface. And anytime you sit  your butt and your knees are not getting the benefit of loft since it will compress in those areas. It also is risky to use it in the field- what if it gets soaked? Its one thing to carry a down vest and if it gets soaked you pull out that extra layer you always have in the pack.  None of us are going to carry an extra set of long underwear though "just in case". You want that layer to be the one that works no matter what, if you are wet or dry.

And if you use down under a non-breathing shell in cold weather, you will find it will be the layer that absorbs the moisture- not good for long term performance. Under a breathable shell the moisture is passed along.
Its a great part of a smart system though. Just design yours to work with it, not against it.