i have had a bit of spare time lately, so naturally i've playing around with arrows. anyway i had a couple of g/tip big game 100+ full length shafts lying about. so i wondered if i could work up an EFOC arrow for my bob lee 69# recurve. i tried 245gr b/head and 100gr a while ago when experimenting with arrows and i knew they were to stiff. so this time i put a 2 1/4" footing on it for 25gr. (2216 fits perfect) and a piece of 6mm bolt behind the insert, 80gr. i thought that 445gr upfront might make it a bit weak... nah. so this time i put an additional piece of bolt in, 170gr. STILL slightly stiff. though it flys well after fletching. i found an old tusker b/head that is 150gr, so i glued a 125gr adapter on it for 275gr. haven't used it yet but that should a little bit.
finished arrow is 1000-1010gr. (to heavy for my scales, so it's a rough sum of the components) with 28% EFOC. THAT'S 480gr's UPFRONT!! and it's still at full length. will have to shoot something with it oneday an see if it penetrates much. trouble is it shoots a bit lower than my usual 790gr arrows???????LOL.

these g/tip 100+ shafts a definately for 80+# bows!

also, how does anyone get 30+% FOC without 14-15 gr/#? especially with heavy bows.
just thought someone might be interested in my experiment.

an after thought- i wonder if the lengths of bolt i've got glued in there are increasing the amount of the shaft that is NOT flexible, counteracting it's weakening effect. maybe someone needs to come up with an insert that is short but very heavy, ie- brass jacketed lead????

Ive done something similar, all I did was isert a piece of tubing the whole lenth af the shaft, taking the arrow from 450 to over or close to 1100gr.
I shot my normal arrow into a bag target from a 68lb bow and it would penetrate around 8in.
The Heavy arrow blew through that and almost 3in of pine planks behind it!!
It was a while ago but I,ll look for the post to make sure Im not lying    
Ps You can shoot it at that MG Johnson fella that stuffed up our batting so far in the first innings...  

""Was just messing arround today and put hose up the entire lenth of a 2315 arrow, took the weight up from 470grains to 1040grains!
Seems to shoot ok, was getting dark.
I did notice a huge increase in penetration, I shoot at a bag target and normally get them in arround 6-8 inches, the heavy arrow blows right through and through a 1.5 inch door with a field point.
Speed is slightly down but I'm only hitting 1-1.5 inch lower at 18yards, that is at 68# on my Border Black Douglas.""

Ok so I lied a little on the wood part....  

QuoteOriginally posted by Havoc1:
Ive done something similar, all I did was isert a piece of tubing the whole lenth af the shaft, taking the arrow from 450 to over or close to 1100gr.
I shot my normal arrow into a bag target from a 68lb bow and it would penetrate around 8in.
The Heavy arrow blew through that and almost 3in of pine planks behind it!!
It was a while ago but I,ll look for the post to make sure Im not lying    
Ps You can shoot it at that MG Johnson fella that stuffed up our batting so far in the first innings...      

Hey it's gonna be a great series. Can't wait for to sit around in the hot hot house drinking beer all day and watching hours upon hours of cricket.

crickets with bats???
i thought archery was hard.
               

one of you is talking bare spine, the other shaft weight.

same idea,same outcome; different roads?

I won't (probably) ever need 1000 grns+ - but it's cool to know, just in case...Thanks guys!

How bout adding to the front of the arrow instead of inside.  Have a steel "addition" milled so it either screws into the insert or becomes an insert, and then has either a 5 degree taper for glue on or is drilled and tapped for screw in.  That way you do nothing at all to the shaft itself.  Someone needs to make a batch of these and try it out.  Might actually sell !
ChuckC

I've got some forgewood "wood" shafts that I put 210gr upfront and they came out to around 800gr. I thought that was pretty heavy! 1000+...wow!

Careful not to shoot yourself in the foot.  

Geez, I shoot the 100+ out of my compounds set at 70 and 82# and they are still a little stiff.  I don't think I'd ever get them set up for my recurves.  I shoot the 35/55's from them.

"Careful not to shoot yourself in the foot. [bigsmyl]" ha

at least if a big boar chases you up a tree and you lose your bow in the climb you can just drop the arrow into it   :cool:

on a more serious note the bolt you'r putting in if its long may be making it stiffer than the weight its offering by shortening the bending length of the arrow like you mentioned.

was trying to explain what Cricket is to a few Americans the other day "No Idea" miss a good 50 overs on a Sunday

OZY, if the bolt increases the spine you may be able to go down in shaft spine which is also less grain per " which will increase foc. This is something i`m interested in also , i like 10gr per pound of draw weight an when i put a lot weight up front i end up having a heaver arrow than i like just to get 20%foc. Right now i`m shooting 620gr arrow out of 58# bow at 19% foc i wish i was shooting 580grs at 28% foc, i just can`t get it to tune. The bolt might help if what say is happening

clint, there is nothing like a complete pass through and it sounds like ur arrows are just what i need. Them rabbits in my back paddock are plenty big.....  keppler wessels is a recurve shooter but i'm bettin the rest of the SA team shoot compounds...that Mitchell Johnson, bet he shoots a Hill....

Clinton, if you use timber shafts and barrel taper them it is a lot easier to get 30%foc and if you foot them it is easier again.
The cricket has been good so far, can't wait for the Boxing Day test to start...Glenn...

Monty Browning is in traditional bowhunter quit a bit and he use's bowfishing shafts to get his arrow weight up over 1100 grn's "this is what I have read anyway" he also use's purdy heavy longbows to shoot these bahemeth arrows! Great post,very interesting keep it up,Jason

I'd not seen, perhaps missed, anyone suggesting some of the MAGNUM weight heads that are floating about. Morriosn, AK Bowhunting have some honkin heavy heads...and then w/ a 125 gr. in there...aren't some of those super heavy heads in the 275 or 300 gr. range? Maybe they're already screw in w/ adaptors...

I used to use the GT weight system. That was 8-32 all thread with 20 gr. brass collars that threaded on.

I found even using that weight system internal to the arrow..and NOT out past the BOP, it didn't lighten the spine sufficiently..where weight out front of BOP..same weight made significant spine changes. FWIW

My Wife Karen and I have been hunting with 1020 grain 24% FOC arrows for 2-3 years. Her bow is an Adcock 70#, mine a BW 80#. The Gold Tip big game 100s take a 15" carbon smaller diameter arrow insert gorilla glued up front, behind 200 grains of brass internal weights, a regular insert, a 125 grain adaptor, and a 160 grain STOS. They plow through 3/4 inch plywood, and we each took 90" (horn size) water buffalo with one arrow. I wouldn't use any collar or outsert, because of concern that it would reduce penetration. Same reason I use Gold Tips, which are a smaller diameter than the ferrule. Bigger diameter shafts (according to Ashby and my testing) reduce penetration. As noted, you don't need this arrow for smaller game (or the 80# or the 70#), but we like it. There's an article on this buff hunt in the current (Jan Feb)Bowhunter, and an article in the current (Feb March) TBM showing that this combo is deadly on rabbits, too! :-) These arrows are nearly indestructible compared to many other carbons out there. I think the carbon shaft insert has a lot to do with the strength. Jay Campbell, JD

For the Aussies on here, when I saw 414    
I was the first to say no way, cant believe they done it!!!
I dont think Johnson is a Hill shooter, think he just bowls rocks at em...