Fred Bear on TV today

[COMPOUNDLESS IN CONCRETE]

I just got done watching an episode of Mike Averys Outdoor Mag tv show and at the end he showed a clip from an interview he did with Fred Bear in 1985 and I noticed that when Papa Bear was shooting, he was not anchoring at the corner of his mouth like most archers do or anywhere on his face for that matter. He was "short drawing" by today's standards. I had read the Charlie Lamb story about his chance meeting and hunting trip with him in the 70's about him drawing until the broadhead touched his knuckle and then he released the arrow and it got me thinking.  Painful, I know.  I think that is probably a lot more consistent of an anchor than using the corner of your mouth or jaw or whatever.  I went outside and shot my bow and I found I could still anchor in the corner of my mouth with my index finger while not consistently drawing by either locking my bow arm or letting it bend, slightly changing how far I draw the bow back.  I noticed as much as 8" of impact difference depending on how much or how little I drew the bow back.  By letting the broadhead touch your knuckle, your are drawing the bow to the same spot each and every time making it more consistent.  Not that I want to cut my arras down that far and start the tuning process over, but now I realize that I need to be bending my bow arm the exact same amount each time.  This is probably a no brainer for most of you guys but I am new to traditional equipment and am excited when I learn something new.  Just thought I'd share.  BTW, Papa Bear was very humble in his interview and said he was not the best bowhunter in the world and that he considered Ed Bilderback to be the best.  Sorry for such a long post.    

[Killdeer]

Well, I have been shooting since 1965 or so, and I hadn't thought of that.
Thanks for posting, even if you think it's old hat. Sometimes we need reminding, sometimes we just hadn't thought of that, and always we need to remember what it is like to discover something new, even if it is just so that we can pass it on to somebody else.

I still think that a string hand reference is necessary for accuracy. That end of the arrow is your "rear sight", and needs to be consistent.

Killdeer

[PAPA BEAR]

cool

[Ssamac]

Agree with Killdeer. If you don't anchor on the cheek or something you may have the nock out too far or in too far. Of course, Papa Bear shot a lot more arrows than most of us so maybe he had it by "feel".

I also wonder how old he was in that interview and maybe his draw was a bit shorter by then?

sam

[NY Yankee]

No. our anchor is not just a "draw stop". It is the right-left alignment for the rear of the arrow. If you draw til you hit the broadhead, but have your hand out away from your face, your arrow will fly wild. You have to anchor in a place that provides consistency, like the corner of your mouth. Keep everything the same, Change only on variable at a time

[COMPOUNDLESS IN CONCRETE]

Originally posted by Ssamac:
  I also wonder how old he was in that interview and maybe his draw was a bit shorter by then?

sam

I think it said he was 85, about 2 1/2 yrs before he passed.  I googled and looked up every pic I could find of him and I think this is the way he always drew the bow by the pics I was able to find that showed him at full draw.  I won't be switching to his method, it worked for him but I am finally getting "some" consistency with anchoring in the corner of my mouth.  I was just pointing out that it is neat to see the way the legends shot their bows back in the day and how sometimes the way they did things differs from how most people do things now.  It is my understanding he shot 65# up until his death.  Don't quote me on that, I just remember reading that somewhere.  I hope I can still draw 65# when I am 85!

[ArrowCrester]

Fred was a great bowhunter and BOW BUILDER.. his Kodiak T/D Recurve was and, I believe, still is the best designed T/D ever.

JMO!!!!
                 

[Gary Logsdon]

"Feel" is correct.  Some archers have athletic abilities that are part God given, part practice/shooting a lot of arrows.  It's like a great infielder who can find the first baseman's mitt when throwing from a variety of positions. Overhand, side arm, three quarter,even underhand.  I played a lot of organized baseball in my day and have see this first hand; I was a first baseman.  There are a few archers out there that can hit the kill zone on an animal time after time without using a consistant rear anchor point.  I'm not recommending this approach, just giving testimonial to it's existence.

[S.C. Hunter]

I have tried corner of mouth but shoot better with middle finger between the dimple in my chin and corner of mouth. I am not looking straight ahead when I shoot and find corner of mouth causes me to shoot left. I actually shoot very well when I shoot faster and have had people tell me I have a floating anchor. I do think you have to find a way to have consistency we are all different. To suggest that all have to use the same style is not the answer. Consistant anchor is one thing but to think that will produce a never failing shot is not reasonable. Unless you use a weapon that has a front and rear sight to align for elevation and windage on every single shot you will never produce the exact same shot without some luck.


 We shoot trad for the adventure and joy it brings. If I want to put a arrow through a hole the size of a quarter I will take that shot with the compound I am trying to sell. I get much more joy in a good shot with my longbow. Do I want to be proficient with my longbow absolutely but lets face it I don't know to many shooters who can put every single arrow in a spot the size of orange at 20 yds with a recurve or longbow. I am not talking about one group out of 10. If I shoot 6 arrows at 20 yds and that happens to be the number I most often shoot in a group. I can expect 2-3 groups out of ten to have every arrow in a circle about 4-6" across and I shoot about 150-200 arrows per session 3-5 times a week. I know that sounds like a lot but it takes me about 1 min to shoot 6 arrows if I slow down. I am not the best shot by any means but I can shoot pretty good. I have 2 2nd, and 1 3rd place finish with the longbow in the last 4 shoots I have attended.


 I hope no one is offended by these remarks that is not my intention. I just believe that sometimes consistency comes from feeling the shot. If technique is what your thinking about at the moment of the shot your not focused on the shot. Take a piece of paper roll it up toss it across the room to a given target. Now try to do it while thinking about how far you took your hand back the arch you threw it on and did you flip your wrist or was it straight. See what your results are and then be honest with yourself which was better.

[Clint B.]

I'm a right-handed archer. If I'm at full draw but my string hand doesn't come into and actually touch the anchor point on my face, the arrow will hit left of my intended target. The farther away from my face - the farther left I'll miss. If my string hand is in perfect right/left alignment with my achor point but I release before I come to full draw, the arrow will hit below my intended target.

[VTer]

I saw it. Pretty good. But you could hear some hoot'n and hollor'n in the background and by the looks of Fred stealing glances over there, he knew he was missing some fun at camp. I believe it was filmed at GrouseHaven.

[Hud]

posted August 25, 2010 06:04 AM                        
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This was on my Facebook page from "Mike Avery's Outdoor Magazine". Thought yous may enjoy it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEaaESlTJog&feature=player_embedded  

Fred was 83 at the time of the interview,

[rholzie]

Kinda like anything else...everyone has their way of doing things, think I'll stick with the corner of my mouth.

[Billy]

How about this as a thought...

2 anchors are better than one.

IF- an archer could get the chin/mouth to finger and broadhead to finger...would that not be more consistent left to right AND front to back????

OR, how about the Ishi-type draw; to the chest??

Consistency is where it takes you and comes from...whatever style works best for you.IMHO

Interesting info on how 1 guy's form worked, and teaches us; still.

[dave19113]

Originally posted by S.C. Hunter:
I have tried corner of mouth but shoot better with middle finger between the dimple in my chin and corner of mouth. I am not looking straight ahead when I shoot and find corner of mouth causes me to shoot left. I actually shoot very well when I shoot faster and have had people tell me I have a floating anchor. I do think you have to find a way to have consistency we are all different. To suggest that all have to use the same style is not the answer. Consistant anchor is one thing but to think that will produce a never failing shot is not reasonable. Unless you use a weapon that has a front and rear sight to align for elevation and windage on every single shot you will never produce the exact same shot without some luck.


 We shoot trad for the adventure and joy it brings. If I want to put a arrow through a hole the size of a quarter I will take that shot with the compound I am trying to sell. I get much more joy in a good shot with my longbow. Do I want to be proficient with my longbow absolutely but lets face it I don't know to many shooters who can put every single arrow in a spot the size of orange at 20 yds with a recurve or longbow. I am not talking about one group out of 10. If I shoot 6 arrows at 20 yds and that happens to be the number I most often shoot in a group. I can expect 2-3 groups out of ten to have every arrow in a circle about 4-6" across and I shoot about 150-200 arrows per session 3-5 times a week. I know that sounds like a lot but it takes me about 1 min to shoot 6 arrows if I slow down. I am not the best shot by any means but I can shoot pretty good. I have 2 2nd, and 1 3rd place finish with the longbow in the last 4 shoots I have attended.


 I hope no one is offended by these remarks that is not my intention. I just believe that sometimes consistency comes from feeling the shot. If technique is what your thinking about at the moment of the shot your not focused on the shot. Take a piece of paper roll it up toss it across the room to a given target. Now try to do it while thinking about how far you took your hand back the arch you threw it on and did you flip your wrist or was it straight. See what your results are and then be honest with yourself which was better.

I kinda of agree with "The Feel" concept. When I just concentrate on my spot I actually see the arrow fly and strike with tight groups... but when I think about form and dont let repitition and muscle memory do their job, I dont see the arrow fly and more often than not a bad shot.

[dave19113]

A really accomplished long bow shooter once told me when I was really young and first started with Trad archery; Shoot your bow and have the form of Dave not Joe or Fred or whoever. You will develope your own sweet spot and form... Then just go with it and have fun.


I think it is admirable to emulate legends of the bow. Like myself, Im a left handed shooter that shoots with an extreme cant, like Fred. Thats where my simalarites end. Its like some one above said, some have natural talent at different aspects and some consepts work great for some and not for others.

I refernce my nuckle to aim... yes I gap shoot... I tried instinctive and it didnt work... Go with what works for you .....Then just sit back, like all the rest of us and enjoy those old movies and documentaries....