Carbon Challenged

[Jacobm]

Before finding this site last fall, I never gave much thought of shooting anything other than POC.  With all the great reports and talk about feathers, FOC etc. I'm ready to come out of my cave and try something new.  I know nothing about carbon arrows and am looking for some guidance.  
 I shoot a 28.5" shaft out of a 64# recurve and a 56# longbow. A couple of years ago a friend gave me 2 dozen brand new carbon arrows that have just been lying around in the boxes.  One Dozen is 29" Carbon Rebel Hunter 4560.  The other is 31" Carbon Express Terminator 6075.  I was thinking of using a 100 to 125 grain steel adaptor and a 190 grain Grizzley/compariable weight field tip.
 My question is:  Will either of the shafts I have work with my bows or would a different shaft option be a better starting place?
The recurve is my #1 bow.
 I know the obvious answer is give them a try but I was hoping input from you folks could help me avoid a pitfall or two.
 I'm not sure if I will ever get away from my present setup, almost identical to Dr. Ashby's "customarily used" arrow, but I can no longer sit on the sideline while everybody else is having fun.
 I really enjoy the content and information available here at the Trad Gang site and look forward to visiting each day.
Thanks,
Mark

[Gehrke145]

45-60 for the longbow and the 60-75 for the curve both the heavy tips. ( you might have to mess around with points but they will work.

[Jacobm]

That gives me a starting point.  Thank You

[Bonebuster]

One word of advice I would give, is that whenever you cut a carbon shaft to adjust the spine, do so in small increments. 1/4" goes a long way towards making a carbon shaft more stiff.

It`s hard to imagine an arrow flying right with 250 grains on the end, but believe me,they do.

I steered clear of carbons for a long time, but now I`m glad I put in the time to learn how to get them to fly.

In the long run, because of durability, I believe carbon arrows are cheaper than any other arrow.

[Fred II]

I am by no stretch of the imagination an expert on carbon shafts or any shafts for that matter.  I really only started traditional hunting last year.  My dad, on the other hand, has been at this for quite some time now though.  Well anyway...it seems to me that carbons are much cheaper as you seemed to have noticed already but the problem that my father and I have realized is that carbons for some reason break far easier than my wooden ones.  I do not know why it is... the carbons always break right behind the insert for its the weakest point in the shaft.  Just for you to keep that in mind, I know lots of folks however that have carbons that never break em, maybe its just us.

[R H Clark]

You will get a much better tune with a carbon if you tune by length.

I've never had any breakage problems but I don't shoot stumps.

[flatbowMB]

I had been shooting carbons (beman MFX) for several years and have recently bone back to cedar shafts. I'm finding the cedars to be much more durable.  The carbons would tend to break right behind the inserts.  Using the long 100 grain brass inserts  help quite a bit, but they still were not as durable as my cedars.

The cedars are also quieter, and have less handshock.

[Jacobm]

You guys are helping a lot.  I'm going to give the brass inserts a try.  It's hard to believe 1/4" in length makes much of a difference but I've heard it said here before and I will heed the warning.  The way I see it, with free arrows, I'm only out the price of the adapters and inserts if it ends up being not right for me.
I assume the inserts are put in with hot melt.  Can the shafts take heat for insert removal?

[flatbowMB]

DO NOT use hot melt for the inserts. Use what is recommended by the shaft manufacturer. Never heat up carbon shafts.  Once the insert is glued in shaft it's in there permanently and cannot be reused.

For determining the right shaft length, progressively cut back at the nock end.  Given that you are bareshaft tuning to determine the right shaft length, cutting back the nock end by 1/4" increments is fairly hassle-free.

[Jacobm]

Flatbow - What a dummy I am.  Never thought of cutting the nock end!  Boy, do I have a lot to learn about these carbons!  I did bare shaft one last night with 150 grain up front.  Still need to add weight.  Thanks

[Dr. Ed Ashby]

Mark,

Believe them! Especially as you start getting really close to the correct dynamic spine, a 1/4" change shaft length DOES make a BIG difference.

Ed
TGMM family of the Bow

[Fred II]

FlatbowMB,
Hey its nice to see someone else out there who has the same trouble I was having with my carbons.  I never thought of using longer inserts, good idea.  However I think I'll stick to my woods!! I love making em up and everything.