QuoteOriginally posted by Mudd:
Can I ask a question? I don't have any experience with a "homemade" endless, just what I've seen on bows or maybe bought a few over the years out of an archery store.
Anyway, I'm guessing that they too will stretch so do you just twist them up if and when they do stretch?

yup

If that is the case, do they still shoot like an endless string or do they become a twisted string and perform like one?

a properly made endless string as very few twists in it when first put on a bow.  you'll add in some twists to account for stretch/creep.  there will way less twists in an endless than a flemish because an endless needs no twists to keep it together and a flemish is totally dependent on lotsa twists to keep it from flying apart.

Are they pre-stretched maybe?

nope.  not any different from flemish.

Thanks in advance!
God bless,Mudd

PS Does anyone make their own endless?

umm, i do.  as i have since the mid 1950's

Are they more or less difficult than the Scottish twist?

for a newbie to any kinda string making, endless is far and away easier to make than flemish, imho.

....

According to Jack Harrison, who makes a high performance bow out of Alaska in years past, and now in limited quantities,   the endless loop is a higher and better performing string.  I shoot both, but do notice there is a difference in favor of the endless loop string.  In the end, it boils down to what you want and like.  

there are no performance differences 'tween like spec'd endless and flemish strings worth mentioning.  both string types will easily get our job done - killin' critters.    

Rob,How did you hurt yourself? I must be doing something wrong.
The last few I've made were flemish twist,but was thinking of doing some multi colored endless-I havent done those yet and I like them all.

"precariously dangling on the far flung existential rim of the petri dish of life"

     

Now THAT's a quote!!

QuoteOriginally posted by Maxximusgrind:
Rob,How did you hurt yourself? I must be doing something wrong.
The last few I've made were flemish twist,but was thinking of doing some multi colored endless-I havent done those yet and I like them all.

after completing the stringmaking vid, i pulled the endless jig off the table, it slipped in hand and i planted the 20# unistrut end  on top of my right foot ... what a gusher.  good thing my bud larry was there to drive me to the er.

I voted for the flemish twist, but in all fairness it's all I have experience with.  Shoot I've never even seen an endless loop.

Flemish twist seems to be the current trend with trad equipment.

I think alot of people have never seen a multicolored endless loop string,I never have (in person).But flemish twist strings,when you see them are always pretty.Performance being equal the poor endless loop doesn't have a chance.Custom makers can make pretty endless strings,but if people dont know that,they wont ask  

QuoteOriginally posted by glass76:
Flemish twist seems to be the current trend with trad equipment.

be daring like charlie lamb and others, become a rebel and buck the 'trad flemish string trend'.  :D

my mohawk with black/yellow endless string - now, i could put in a LOT more twists, for that barber shop pole effect, but that would defeat one benefit of endless strings ...

Quotethere are no performance differences  'tween like spec'd endless and flemish strings worth mentioning.  

Quotenow, i could put in a LOT more twists, for that barber shop pole effect,  but that would defeat one benefit  of endless strings ...
 

Interesting thread but those two things confused me a little Rob.  Could you clarify please?  What in your opinion are the benefits of endless string.  I use them both interchangeably.

QuoteOriginally posted by Maxximusgrind:
I think alot of people have never seen a multicolored endless loop string,I never have (in person).But flemish twist strings,when you see them are always pretty.

I agree that flemish strings look very nice. Since I personally can't make flemish strings as well as I make endless, I started making three-color endless strings. It's not difficult, but there is a trick to getting all three colors properly separated so they don't blend together.

I couldn't begin to tell you how many people thought I had a flemish string on my bow until they saw the end servings.  

I just fazed out my endless strings and use them in a pinch or for backups. I like the the fact of being able to twist a flemish more than 20 times to lower or raise brace height. I notice the flemish strings out last the endless when the bow is shot heavily. They both perform very well which is more important than colors and looks but, flemish does look unique.

QuoteOriginally posted by poison arrow:
I just fazed out my endless strings and use them in a pinch or for backups. I like the the fact of being able to twist a flemish more than 20 times to lower or raise brace height. I notice the flemish strings out last the endless when the bow is shot heavily. They both perform very well which is more important than colors and looks but, flemish does look unique.

endless strings can -and should- be twisted up or down to adjust brace height, just like flemish.

QuoteOriginally posted by Lenny Stankowitz:
 

Quotethere are no performance differences  'tween like spec'd endless and flemish strings worth mentioning.  

Quotenow, i could put in a LOT more twists, for that barber shop pole effect,  but that would defeat one benefit  of endless strings ...
 

Interesting thread but those two things confused me a little Rob.  Could you clarify please?  What in your opinion are the benefits of endless string.  I use them both interchangeably. [/b]

it's worth repeating yet again, there are no performance differences between properly constructed flemish or endless bowstrings.

the chief difference 'tween the two string types hasta do with construction.  

flemish. you literally need nothing more than some string fiber, some serving fiber and server, wax and a sharp knife and you can make a fine flemish twist bowstring.  if you make it with one top loop, and use a bowyer's knot for the bottom loop (as was almost guaranteed done in medieval times with their ever changing selfbows) it'd be a snap to adjust and no concerns about making that second loop.  

if it's a twin loop flemish bowsgtring yer after, and since flemish strings are loosely built 'in the air' and a flemish string jig is just a ballpark way of getting down the final length, your craftsmanship and strand twisting knowledge/experience are tres important.

endless strings use the same initial components as flemish but require a special string jig.  precise lengths can be built the first time and every time thereafter.  a novice could build a good bowstring almost immediately.

This looks like as good a place as any to put in a thanks to Rob for his endless string how to video.  I'm very new to trad and just got started because I am a displaced wood worker and an archer.  I'm without a shop and decided I could do a lot of what it takes to make a bow in my house.

I haven't quite finished my first bow(a board bow that still needs some sanding and a finish) but I used Rob's video to make a string for it and have to say I was quite pleased with the ease of following along and making my first two strings(the first one was a little too short).  It was two colored also.

I just bought string,serving,serving tool and DVD.I made my first Flemish string watching the DVD,pause,stop,twist,resume.Took my time, backed up if I didn't like it, ended up with a nice round 2 bundle,16 strand string for my 65# Longbow.My next one will probably be junk but I couldn't believe how good it turned out.Proudly told my wife,"Check out my new string and it only cost $62."Shoots great,real quiet!

Flemish for me, they just look cool and aren't that hard to make, even for a first timer.

you don't even need a fancy jig to make an endless. i know a guy who made a string for a hunting buddy in bush camp with a bench and 4 nails.

Flemish twist for me, I like to make my own, and I like they way they look.  I haven't been able to tell the difference in shooting.