Heres the way i look at it, if it matters.

Im sitting in my den, i decide to make a string for my widow. All i do is leave out 6 or maybe 4 strands. Low and behold doing that simple little thing i gain a little more speed and the main thing it makes my bow a lot quieter.

So i can either shoot the same arrow faster or a heavier arrow the same speed and the bow is quieter and all i did is save on string material.

I dont see a down side here.

QuoteOriginally posted by LBR:

Quote
IMO, if you are using a weapon so marginal that 5-10 fps is the difference between a clean kill and a wound or miss, you might consider a different weapon.  

[/b]

I agree. Tinkering is fun, but sometimes we need to keep things in perspective...and realistic.

QuoteOriginally posted by Jeff Strubberg:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Shelton:
like I said in another thread, you dont buy a truck and worry about MPG so you shouldnt worry about FPS with a trad bow      

Uh, I worry about the performance of both my truck and my bow.  Why should I pay more than I have to in order to get the job done? [/b]

I am sorry that was frazed wrong, I should have said you dont buy a truck and compare it to a hybrids MPG, and I think when you try and push speed out of a trad bow you are sort of comparing it to its wheelie cousin!

To me---speed equals penetration....period.

Shooting a relatively low energy bow (50@27), I want to get every bit of penetration out of that I can. Yes my arrows are tuned perfectly, and I can pretty much hit what I aim at.

I'm sure there aren't too many of us who shoot a deer, then say "man I wish my arrow hadn't penetrated that far"!!

Plus, speed is cool  

QuoteTo me---speed equals penetration....period  

Mass equals penetration.....momentum!  Slow and heavy will out penetrate fast and light anyday.  The key is to get the best of both worlds!

QuoteOriginally posted by MSwickard:
 

QuoteTo me---speed equals penetration....period  

Mass equals penetration.....momentum!  Slow and heavy will out penetrate fast and light anyday.  The key is to get the best of both worlds! [/b]

Yes, I agree. But if I'm shooting the same arrow faster-I will have more momentum. That is my point. I'm in now way advocating shooting soda straws.

I just read through this thread, and I like alot of the responses.
Even when I shot wheels, I would take quiet over fast any day. No bow can shoot fast enough to beat a whitetail's reaction, IMO.


With that being said, there are countless other variables that should move the light in our heads from green to red, or vice versa, at the moment of truth. Body language, angle of shot, distance of shot, etc.

I dont think there is a right or wrong answer in general. It is about what works for you, what you are comfortable with and efficient with. If it is a skinny string, so be it. If it is a thick one, more power to ya. I guess Im trying to say I find it hard to believe 2# of KE or 5 fps are going to make or break a hunt. When you are shooting at an animal, know your equipment, it's limits, and your limitations with it.

Maybe Im too new to be worried about it...  

It's obvious that lot's of people have different opinions on the subject.  I just wish that people would quit saying that they prefer quiet to fast, when the evidence suggests that you get both of these with skinny strings.  I see an argument being made against the skinny strings regarding creep and durability.  I think for certain types of material creep may be a factor, but with others the amount of creep is less than with standard strings.  As far as durability goes, are we talking about the strings or the bows?  Has there been any studies out there that have shown this to be fact?

Well I will take every 5fps I can get for nothing.    

By itself it might not mean much but when I add up all the little things I can shoot lighter bows and not ever worry about penitration like many seem to.I don't feel like I am giving up anything in durability or anything else to get it either.

True enough, James.  And it doesn't stop you from using back tension, having a clean release, etc..

QuoteYes, I agree. But if I'm shooting the same arrow faster-I will have more momentum. That is my point. I'm in now way advocating shooting soda straws.

In that case speed is good!!!!

A faster bow means I can shoot a heavier arrow.  I like that.

It doesn't matter that much, to me.

To steal a phrase from someone else, posted recently......

I'm a 2-3/4" shell guy.

Ishi, you sum it up very nicely.

pdk, the string and it's common sense. A 1" rope is going to be stronger, more durable, less susceptable to cuts, and last longer (doing the same job) than a 1/2" rope.

You don't get something for nothing.  You can be comfortable with the trade-offs or even ignore them, but they are there regardless.  

How much extra arrow weight does 3-7 fps allow for?

The jury is out on noise, at least until some reliable testing is done with a decimeter or similar tool.  Our ears don't hear a dog whistle, but that doesn't keep the dog from hearing it.

this question is pretty easy to figure out:
1.deer hear the sound way before the arrow gets close to them therefore they jump.
2.a fast bow will get your arrow there in time maybe,maybe not but your odds go up with a fast bow.
3.find a very fast bow thats quiet and you're in em.but they can still go matrix on ya and duck under your arrow.elk are pretty slow compared to a deer but i actually had a spike bull come in once while shooting a 280fps compound he was so wired up that when i shot at him he ducked my arrow clean as can be.i think a lot of it hinges on what emotional state the animal is in when you shoot at it....jmtc

LBR:  To my ears, the skinny strings make a big difference, but I will grant you that it hasn't been tested adequately.  Even if they are more quiet, it may not make a difference in virtually any hunting situation.  I find it more comforting, one way or another.  As far as a thicker rope being stronger and more durable, I will agree with that only if you are using the same material.  Otherwise, it is far from common sense.  You are right, you don't get something for nothing and we may not realize what lays ahead.  I don't really care if anyone uses or  doesn't use a skinny string.  Maybe it will damage the bows down the road.  Maybe instead of being able to shoot 10,000(arbitrarily chosen number) shots safely you will only be able to shoot 7000.  I know that a skinny string not only improved the performance of one of my old recurves, but also made it more quiet to my ears.  I'm gonna take the chance that this skinny string made out of a different material won't have too much of a bad effect on the bow.  For someone to say that they know otherwise at this point is disingenuous.

i don't have any experience with skinny strings ... they are an anathema to my fingers which prefer a thicker string after some attempts years ago with ' skinny strings ' . i think this all equates to ' everything in moderation ... including moderation ' .
on my string follow longbows [ my main hunting bows ]  shooting douglas fir i couldn't care less about extra speed as they shoot where i am looking very quietly and this is what i want in my hunting bows . but on my 'hotter ' ILF 'curve rigs where i often  use sights I try and get as much speed as i can without turning the bow into a 52' Telecaster through a 10 watt overdriven amp ... will the deer still jump the string ? probably ... but the pig at 35 yards may not ...
tis fun finding out though ....
Ben

Back to TJ's original question...I think it's been answered - nope, your 5fps won't help on string-ducking deer.  

The REAL answer to string ducking deer is to either become a better deer hunter or be more careful picking shots at them.

I think the idea of becoming a better overall woodsman/hunter often gets lost in trying to overcome equipment "shortcomings" - if you want to call them shortcomings - by tweaking setups.  Maybe I'm just a stick in the mud, but I think it is WAY more fun spending more time in the woods becoming a better woodsman/hunter than it is to do math at home.

Just my 2 cents (or less) worth...

R

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Shelton:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by Jeff Strubberg:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Shelton:
like I said in another thread, you dont buy a truck and worry about MPG so you shouldnt worry about FPS with a trad bow        

Uh, I worry about the performance of both my truck and my bow.  Why should I pay more than I have to in order to get the job done? [/b]

I am sorry that was frazed wrong, I should have said you dont buy a truck and compare it to a hybrids MPG, and I think when you try and push speed out of a trad bow you are sort of comparing it to its wheelie cousin! [/b]

Now there we agree.

Speed for the sake of speed isn't a good goal, IMHO.  If you can get more work out of the same setup without a tradeoff, though, it's dumb to just leave penetration sitting on the table.

yup, alot of compound hunters like speed too much.  And what good is a ultra light arrow that moves real fast if it doesnt do its job when it gets there?  But I definatly dont see no harm in a good Fast flight or something similar that would give you a few more FPS