FOC for wood arrows, how important?

KevinK · March 03, 2017, 09:58:00 AM

I have a new Bodnik Slick, 50# on it's way and decided to try out wood arrows with it. Knowing my other Bodnik likes arrows a little weaker than my other bows I picked up a dozen pre-finished 55-60 POC shafts. These weighed in just under 12 GPP on average. Looking at Stu's spine calculator I'm not going to have a very high FOC without going really short and really heavy. Do you guys that shoot wood arrows worry much about FOC? Is it really that important for hunting distances?

Chain2 · March 03, 2017, 10:37:00 AM

I'm watching this too. I have a wood test kit ordered.

Shadowhnter · March 03, 2017, 10:40:00 AM

You will get a lot of varied opinions on this. In the end, I suggest you do some research and decide on your own.

For what its worth, I like higher foc on woods.

Rock 'N Bow · March 03, 2017, 11:53:00 AM

I've had more pass-throughs with low FOC wood arrows than with high FOC carbons. I'm not saying there is no advantage with high FOC, just that a properly tuned arrow with a sharp broadhead will get the job done.

Pine · March 03, 2017, 12:22:00 PM

I personally never worry about it , if I have an arrow that fly's good , I consider it to be golden .

tecum-tha · March 03, 2017, 12:36:00 PM

If you hunt deer sized game, you will have to worry less about FOC. I had sometimes better penetration with wood than with carbons which had much heavier points than my wood arrows.
But each hunting situation is different.
If you plan on hunting hogs and plan on being able to shoot at the big boars which may have a shield, then a EFOC is probably a good idea from below 55-60# bows.
Traditionally there was probably higher FOC in hunting arrows than we think. All broad head arrow points were forged. Depending on the form they were thicker and heavier than a modern glue on point made mostly from layered and brazed sheet steel with a ferule made from the same materials.
Think along the lines of a regular sized broad head with a tang that can be inserted and wrapped to the arrow shaft or a hand forged ferrule. Most of these points are 250 grains+.
Another advantage was, that with heavier points, you will need a slightly larger diameter shaft.
If you have to form your shaft with hand tools from split pieces of wood, then slightly larger diameter will help you to:
1.) Get there quicker with less labor time
2.) Less chance of ruining a shaft because it became more fragile if it needs to be worked thinner.

Modern bow hunting derives mostly from target archery equipment. When modern bow hunting came up, a lot of supplies could already be machined with power tools. Power tools will allow much more consistent dimensions in large batches.
Target archery was shot to much farther distances than what is common for hunting, thus lighter arrows with lighter points gave you a flatter trajectory. The modern wood arrow standards come from a time where there was limited game and main focus was field and target archery, that's why everything is "thinner" and "lighter".

Captain*Kirk · March 03, 2017, 01:16:00 PM

Good replies! IMHO, higher FOC is good insurance even if not "necessary". You can't kill whitetail-sized quarry "too dead" and the key to a clean kill is a surgical sharp broadhead, shot placement, and (ideally) a complete pass-thru with entrance and exit wound. Remember; bullets kill by shock, arrows kill by oxygen deprivation to the brain via blood loss...the quicker the blood loss, the sooner the quarry drops.
Any wood shaft arrow can be increased in both weight and %FOC by the simple addition of a Woody Weight between the shaft and broadhead...

MnFn · March 03, 2017, 01:33:00 PM

I wonder about foc and wood. I wouldn't worry about it. My wood arrows and a STOS two blade have given me complete pass through on a 6 ft bear and an average whitetail buck the past two years.

That was with a 53# and a 50# bow. Arrow weight was around 550 grains.

KevinK · March 03, 2017, 01:52:00 PM

That is what I figured. I'll just see how these fly at full length with 160 grn points. Since I was making an investment I got 100, 125 and 145 points and a pack of 75grn woodie weights. If it is weak I can cut. If not too short after it's tuned I can cut some more and add weight. I guess I will see how they work out.

March 03, 2017, 05:05:00 PM

It is hard to judge penetration on whitetail deer. If the deer is standing on a crest the arrow will fly further and if the deer has a dirt bank as a back drop the arrow will fly as far. I can say that a file sharpened 190 grain Ribtec mounted on a 28" bop cedar shaft will fly through a Texas pig that is estimated at 110 pounds. I hope he gets another one, then I will get more of it.

WESTBROOK · March 03, 2017, 05:41:00 PM

Never worried about FOC. I've always shot heads in the 160-200 range, they work well and I'm happy with that.

Matty · March 03, 2017, 07:13:00 PM

I like everyone's points of view and opinions and heres my 2 cents. Regardless you are going to have "some" FOC. weather it's EFOC that's to be determined when you're arrow is done and made. My personal concern would be OVERALL arrow weight along with good arrow flight and a sharp head.
I'm not nocking or questioning the validity of an EFOC arrow at all. I actually believe th concept to be accurate. But sometimes it might be difficult if you are on an arrow budget or lack the means to buy and mess with them a whole bunch.
The cool thing about wood is that there's lots of variables and you can make a fairly EFOC arrow with whichever spine you end up with. If you want a heavier head you'll have to use a heavier spine you can also used Tapered ones or footed ones. I believe You can truly make the "perfect" wood arrow for whatever you intend to hunt. I think all the hoopla of carbon being super straight and super strong and super consistent has taken us far away form the real abilities of a well made wood arrow.

March 03, 2017, 07:31:00 PM

When I hear claims that wood arrows are so inferior to carbon, I immediately have doubts about how they came to such a conclusion.

longbow fanatic 1 · March 03, 2017, 07:37:00 PM

I shoot my wood shafts at 20-35 yards. I watch closely to see how the shafts react. The shafts that fly the best, with a variety of tips attached, are the shafts and tips I choose.

longbow fanatic 1 · March 03, 2017, 07:40:00 PM

BTW: there is a guy here who kills elk nearly every year with wood shafts and 125 gr. woodmans elite broadheads.

Stumpkiller · March 03, 2017, 11:04:00 PM

I put a metal broadhead on one end and a little plastic nock on the other and FOC takes care of itself.

March 04, 2017, 02:58:00 PM

I shot some at the indoor the other day. I was told that if I didn't bare shaft, even though my arrows looked to be flying straight, they were still flying where they wanted to go and the person new to recurves, declared that I would get no penetration. I said nothing, which irritated him, so he held his arrow in front of me and said, "These were bare shaft tested, you are looking at 500 grains up front, these will penetrate a GREAT....BIG... BUCK. Your's won't." He must have had 39" arrows because there was 10" of arrow left to go with his 29" draw. Get the arrow behind the head in flight and let the penetration take care of itself.

Chain2 · March 04, 2017, 03:54:00 PM

Pavan I never tire of reading your words of wisdom. Well put.

March 04, 2017, 04:52:00 PM

I did not read all the posts above, but.........

In my humble opinion, well tuned is way more imprtant than high FOC.

That being said, I do believe that well tuned with higher FOC is better than without higher FOC.

Most wood shafts are pretty heavy by nature, and it is harder to achieve really high FOC with wood arrows.

Bisch

Longtoke · March 04, 2017, 05:41:00 PM

making your arrows as short as you can and getting tapered shafts will also help FoC gains. Natually a heavy point is the first place to start when playing with FoC but with woodies you will start to get into a really heavy arrow really quickly.

Heavy arrows are great for penetration but at the cost of trajectory.