HH bug got me ... Part One!

Owlmagnet · July 17, 2012, 11:12:00 AM

On big handles:

I have a small hand, but I just finished modifying my second Wesley Special. I am committed to mastering the straight grip, (for reasons I am at a complete loss to explain), and I am discovering that the skinny, deep, wedge-shaped grip is, for me, more repeatable than any other, even if the tip of my thumb ends up a half-inch from the rest of my fingertips. Do I have to start worrying about the onset of early dementia, or am I on to something?

I am 66.5" tall, have a 26" draw, and have a pair of 66" Wesleys, (one back set, one string follow)--and doggone it, the Widow, the Jack Howard, the Bighorn, and the ILF rigs are staying on the pegs until I put a big game animal on the ground with a Hill bow! (The Owlmagnet has spoken....)

tg2nd · July 17, 2012, 11:29:00 AM

QuoteOriginally posted by Owlmagnet:
'Nuther random question. Does anyone know if the Hill-style longbow that John Schultz uses in the video, "Hitting'em Like Howard Hill" was backset, straight, or string follow? It seems like the more I study that video, the more interested I am getting in the specifics of that bow....

Thanks,
Bob

According to David Miller it was a reflexed/backset Trophy Hunter 64", 64#@26", 14" riser, called "Old Tom".
If I remember right.

Nate Steen . · July 17, 2012, 01:05:00 PM

Hand size is important...both for handle size and finger pinch...it all adds up.

Concerning speed....lighter limbs bent into a tighter arc will recover faster and have less shock because the limb is more efficient....and less physical weight (limb) is moving more mass weight(arrow). All this means that you can shoot a heavier arrow quicker. I think we all would take that option if given the choice. If you could shoot an arrow of 9-10 gpi as fast as an arrow of 7-8 gpi with more stability why wouldn't you?

Overspined · July 17, 2012, 01:23:00 PM

I would Nate! but where do you sign up to get a bow made exactly at the ideal specs for the shooter without a major effort? Not many bowyers are willing or have/take the time to design each bow that way. How many know how? I have read where Pavan, I think, will take a longbow and alter it to shoot a given arrow with the same velocity at a ligher draw weight. That's awesome, but where would I start without ruining bows? Do tell! BTW: I would love to shoot one of your bows!

ericmerg · July 17, 2012, 01:32:00 PM

just got my first hill bow today

ignore first 36 seconds or so

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INr8wUDjSjY

sticksnstones · July 17, 2012, 01:42:00 PM

QuoteOriginally posted by ericmerg:
just got my first hill bow today

ignore first 36 seconds or so

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INr8wUDjSjY

Congrats! The question has to be asked; who is on the phone?
Thom

Nate Steen . · July 17, 2012, 01:48:00 PM

OS....that is the million dollar question for sure. All the Hillstyle bowyers I know will build custom bows to spec within their offerings. The trick is knowing how to mesh all the factors together to get the best bow for you. Mtlongbow recently did this with a bow from Craig and loves it. It can be done....I have thrown out tech tips here and there to help guys in their search for their magic bow....but much of what makes a good shooting Hillstyle bow is lost in fancy dressings because that is what people want and what sells.

July 17, 2012, 03:19:00 PM

Sand paper tillering and checking the results with my gull wing check. That perfect shooting longer bow is achievable, but I have to say I could not predict the outcomes of any formula. On another thread it was declared that the longer bow will always be faster, there are too many variables with longbows to predict this one way or the other. A longer lean and mean reflexed bow can work better for a shorter draw for some, but there are subtle things that make it work.

cahaba · July 17, 2012, 03:48:00 PM

I have a Northern Mist Classic 68"er and a Hill 66"er. I draw 26.75. Both bows are rated at 50 lbs. but the Hill seems heavier. Even with my short 26.75 draw the Northern Mist is faster with the same arrow and smooth as butter. Steve said he would take into account my draw length and he would do some things to the bow to get optimum performance and it shows. Don't get me wrong I love my Hill too.

Nate Steen . · July 17, 2012, 04:10:00 PM

Cahaba....that's the results of optimizing the bow to your draw and hand size, etc....the effect is a great shooting bow, not just something that looks pretty. That's what I'm saying...

Gil Verwey · July 17, 2012, 04:20:00 PM

I have found that with most bows, if you buy them used and they are not tillered for your draw you may get diminishing returns in performance and feel. That includes recurves also.

I avoid buying bows that were tillered at lengths other than my draw length. I am lucky though and my draw is 28". Many people have there bows tillered 28" even if their draw is different.

I think having a bow tillered to your draw is a big advantage and makes a difference.

Overspined · July 17, 2012, 06:19:00 PM

I've bought a lot of used bows, and still do, but I don't get along with many of them. I could list 10 reasons without a thought. Usually I end up figuring out what I REALLY like and getting a custom to my specs. I have a Hill and Northern Mist of the same wt too, and shoot them equally well. Both custom builds, but one was more custom than the other. They do feel a bit different, but it doesn't amount to much so far as I can tell for accuracy, they shoot the same arrow, and I never ran them through the chrono. Often the used bows ARE custom for someone else and so don't fit me well.

Hey Gil, HHA said they have a standard at 28", so if a bow said on it x#@32", it's no different design than if marked at 28". So they shouldn't vary.

cahaba · July 17, 2012, 07:01:00 PM

Thanks Nate. I pay attention to everything you say. I do have big hands and like you said it is one factor that makes a difference. I have learned alot about my favorite bows from you. Thanks for your expertise and insite. I appreciate it.

July 17, 2012, 07:08:00 PM

Years ago with the bow tests in Longbow Shooters Digest, I noticed that a number of the bows tested had a sweet spot an inch to two inches shy of 28". At the time I thought that was just right with the 68" bows tested because my draw was 27" at the time. I wonder if that is still the case.

David Mitchell · July 17, 2012, 07:19:00 PM

cahaba, have you scaled the Hill? Most of mine run 3-4# heavier than marked--had one that was 6# heavier. The last new one I got is right on the money as marked.

Nate Steen . · July 17, 2012, 07:24:00 PM

Most of the time, HHA makes their bows to a standard 28" draw for 68" bow. 26" draw for 66" bow, etc. anything inbetween or custom is just added to that standard...ie. a 27" draw is just lighter weight but not necessarily tillered to a 27" draw.

Pavan...most of the old time bows had fairly long risers, as do the current crop. a 68" bow with a 16" riser will feel close to a 66" bow with a 12 - 14" riser. Different working limb lengths affect feel along with performance.

cedar · July 17, 2012, 07:34:00 PM

I have a Hill back at the shop right now being shaved down. It was 3 lbs over marked weight.

Nate Steen . · July 17, 2012, 08:25:00 PM

Schulz bows on Classifieds now

Overspined · July 17, 2012, 08:36:00 PM

QuoteOriginally posted by John49:
I have a Hill back at the shop right now being shaved down. It was 3 lbs over marked weight.

Me too, mine was 4.6# over.

Trad Longbow Joe · July 17, 2012, 08:41:00 PM

Nate, nice bows if I didn't just buy a Schultz I would be all over one of these bows.