HH bug got me ... Part One!

Owlmagnet · May 31, 2012, 01:17:00 AM

Thank you, MT. I really appreciate your specific response. I think I am going to tear the leather off the side of my riser and shelf, just to see about that additional "feedback" at the shot. I have a huge callous on my ring finger and realize that my release is an issue....

Man, I LOVE this thread!!!

2treks · May 31, 2012, 05:47:00 AM

Nice job Nate and Rush,
That was outstanding,

CTT

Ric O'Shay · May 31, 2012, 06:11:00 AM

Nate and Rush -

Wonderful thing you two have done for the kids. My compliments to you both!

Mudd · May 31, 2012, 06:44:00 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Ric O'Shay:
Nate and Rush -

Wonderful thing you two have done for the kids. My compliments to you both!

Mudd · May 31, 2012, 07:42:00 AM

I was just reading in "The Art of Archery",
Edited by Henri Gallice, Translation by H. Walrond, 1901.Ca 1515, when I saw these words:"it is impossible to shoot a long arrow in an ungraceful way, if the bow is pushed forward."

I was caught up in the author's words almost as if I had my longbow in my hand.

How cool is this?... Way!!!... I'm saying.....

God's grace and peace, Mudd

Bob B. · May 31, 2012, 09:31:00 AM

I have a question about riser length. I was shooting my Shelton last night and was comparing that to my Shrew Hill. The Shelton has a riser much longer than the Shrew. I think the Shrew is only like 12 inches. While both are string follow bows, the Shrew seems to smoother and gentler on draw and release, however, it is lower poundage so it is not exactly apples to apples. The Shelton has more "crisp" release and seems a bit more stable to me. They both have narrow, deep cored limbs. My Shelton is noticibly faster, but is also heavier poundage.
Also while both bows have very slight hand shock, the Shelton has less. Does the length of the riser have much to do with the feel of the bow or the cast?

Both my bows are 68 inches long by the way.

Bob.

Owlmagnet · May 31, 2012, 10:31:00 AM

Good question Bob B! I think I am looking forward to a discussion of this topic as much as you are....

The risers on both of my Wesleys are 14". Would a 2" shorter riser ensure more working limb in a bow of the same length, (66", in my case)? I'm wondering if the increase in working limb would contribute to increased smoothness on the draw.

Also, on the one hand, a longer working "lever" might impart more energy to the arrow, but on the other hand, I could imagine that the longer working limb could be slower...

I'll bet Nate would know.

Bob W

Owlmagnet · May 31, 2012, 10:45:00 AM

Since we're talking Hillbow design, I have been thinking alot about these Shrew Hills and the notion that, at a given draw weight and bow length, the narrower the limb, the deeper the core....

A few years ago, on Captain Dick's old Howard Hill forum, I remember that one of Dick's early longbows had come out really heavy for him and he made weight by grinding the limbs really skinny. I seem to recall it shot well for him, but I don't know if he pursued exploration of the deeper core-narrower limb concept. I'm sure there must be a point of diminishing returns, but I don't know where it might be.

Bob W

May 31, 2012, 11:31:00 AM

I have pushed two bows too far in this regard. One was a glass/bamboo with a bit of string follow. It was a a good shooter with very little hand shock at 85 pounds. Trying to reduce far enough for my brother to shoot it, I went past the width versus depth ratio at the tips. It developed a severe set near the ends of the limbs and its lateral stability. In another case the bow took on a temporary set after it had been strung for the day. It shot very fast with very little hand shock and was still accurate. That bow died when I tried to turn it into a light bow with only glass on the back, I popped the belly glass off easy enough, but one major slip taking the power sander short cut, killed it.

David Mitchell · May 31, 2012, 12:57:00 PM

Bob B., my ShrewHill and Shelton have exactly the same length riser--15" fade out to fade out. Both are 68" bows. Can't really speak to the differences you mentioned. I guess I've not compared that closely but the Shelton has more string follow--the ShrewHill just a touch. Both excellent shooters but I give the edge in pleasant shooting feel to the Shelton due to the greater degree of string follow but not by much. There is only 1# difference in draw weight on my bows. Both are really fine bows and I would heartily recommend either.

That said, the Hill bug just bit me again! :rolleyes:

Rossco7002 · May 31, 2012, 01:06:00 PM

New order Dave? Do tell....

rushlush · May 31, 2012, 02:01:00 PM

Thanks for all the kind words and Nate for putting up the bow.

Nate Steen . · May 31, 2012, 02:45:00 PM

big public thank you to Rush....

I'll do my best to make you proud of the bow.

when I have time, this week not so much (working 16 hour days) I will discourse on the subject of Hill style limb function and also the Hill shooting style and how it varies in the real world from what we see everyone doing at 3d's and hunting.....stay tuned...lol

RC · May 31, 2012, 03:02:00 PM

RushLush congrats on winning the bow and thank you Nate for the donation.
I told my wife about how much the bow went for and she said she would have put me out the house at least for a couple of days so if you need a place to stay let me know..lolRC

rushlush · May 31, 2012, 03:21:00 PM

RC thanks for the offer, but I'm in the clear. LOL

K.S.TRAPPER · May 31, 2012, 04:47:00 PM

Congrats Rush on the fine bow and the money raised for the kids!

Tracy

tradlongbow · May 31, 2012, 05:37:00 PM

RC-

Rushlush isn't married anymore, that's why he can do that. lol congrats Rushlush and Nate.

Darren

MT Longbow · May 31, 2012, 06:07:00 PM

I took Nate recommendation and had Craig shorten the riser length to about 12 inches in my Redman Yew bow and it is very sweet shooting, same goes for Legendstick.

Ric O'Shay · May 31, 2012, 07:32:00 PM

All my Hills have about a 14" riser section. That's fade out to fade out. It will be interesting to hear what Nate has to say in his discourse on the subject of Hill style limb function.

Nate Steen . · May 31, 2012, 08:11:00 PM

Real quick before I head back out to work....

there is a balance to be achieved in a Hill bow for optimal performance....a short riser allows for longer working limbs...allowing for a shorter bow overall, which gives more limb bend at full draw, which gives more speed, which makes a string follow bow remain fast. It also lightens the total bow physical weight, making it less shocky....

basically, and there are lots of variables which I won't go in to, but based on the old time Hillstyle bowyers, like Schulz.....limb bend at full draw reveals alot about the bow performance.

I.E.....optimal bow for a 27" real draw, medium sized hands..... 66" long, 12" riser, narrow limbs, 3 wood lams, all one limb wood material, no tip overlays, colored glass, string follow.

Why? for a 27" real draw..... 66" minus 12" static handle results in 54" of limb length bending in a nice, tight curve. a 68" bow with 16" handle results in 52" of limb length bending in a shallower curve, which means less limb recoil speed trying to move more mass weight which equals less efficiency. A 68" bow with a 12" riser means more limb length for power, but still a shallow full draw curve so the limbs are trying to move more mass with less speed of recoil.

like I said, lots of variables and ways to tweak the bow to fit the shooter....to me, that's what Custom means. not fancy veneers. Although I will be the first to admit...a Redman or the new One Shot by Craig are fetchin bows to my eye.