I would guess the bloody one you pick out of the dirt with a trembling hand.

TTT

No trace asked about non ideal outcomes.  I have seen several.  Enough to scare me regarding elk and arrow setups.  I have been a part of 15 bow killed elk, half mine and half a partners... I have also seen several lost.  Some thoughts.

1)  I saw an eclipse broadhead bend to a near ninety degree angle after hitting a scapula
2) I sharpened an el grande grizzly with a wheel and changed the temper.  I struck a great elk in the boiler room and got 4 incheds of penetration.  After looking at the broadhead, the edge looked like a tuna can curl from rib contact.  The head acted like a barb instead of a spear.
3) I have seen a gold tip 35-55 have the insert shoved in after a rib hit.  Luckily that elk  hit was still lethal.  It did scare me and I started sleeving my arrows after that.  (still shoot gold tips and love them).  
3) I saw an old woodsman literally crumple on a good hit resulting in again a lost bull.  Several of my hunting buddies have seen the same.  This was a decade ago and the new woodsmans I think are better.  However we still all shoot two blades.  

Hope that helps

Jeff

Jeff has a point here. Every set-up has the potential to fail.

What was the shot angle with #1

This is great information, coming from someone who has actually shot quite a few elk.

What a broad sprectrum this is...

I have seen a bull at 7 yards shot with a 10 grain/lb arrow with nearly 20% FOC out of a recurve shooting 190ish fps that only penetrated 12-15 inches. (shot was lethal and the bull went 40yds) 3 blade broadhead

I also saw an 8 grains/lb arrow with aprox 10% FOC out of a black widow drawn to only 26-27 inches (making it about 45 lbs) completely pass thru a bull (spike) at about 12 yds and stick in the dirt behind (2 blade broadhead) (shot was lethal and the bull went 50 yds)

Both arrows shot well from each setup both arrows were placed for double lung hits and neither centered a rib going in.  The first bow setup mentioned could have had better arrow flight...it was not what I would call perfect "spinning ball of feathers" flight but it was not bad either.

Some of the things I can think of that would have hindered the first setup was the arrow flight, how close the bull was (arrow may not have fully straightened out by impact) and the bull was tense and in "spring loaded ready to bolt" mode...actually started to leave the scene quickly as the bow went off.  Muscles on an elk being tensed and exploding at impact can certainly hurt penetration.  

The second elk was far more calm at the shot.

As stated above...get the best formula you can with your setup...well tuned, sharp head and put it where it needs to be!

That is a very good post. Thanks.

Randy,

It was my buddy Brett's shot.  The bull was about 15 yards. It was about 6 seasons ago.  

He was shooting a 55# Hill style longbow at the time.  I was calling and saw the shot, but from a distance and at an angle.  It looked almost perfect from my viewpoint.  However, Brett said it was forward and in the shoulder V.  We figured he hit the junction knuckle or the base of the scapula. Almost no penetration and a layed over eclipse BH.  It was pretty interesting.

Regarding the angle the animal was broadside at the shot, but wheeling away by the time the arrow got there.  As you know they can flat get out when they jump.  Oh, and it was the double bevel teflon eclipse if that matters.  

Jeff

Theory vs practice,  thanks for a great post and some reasoned responses.  Maturely handled....

This comes to mind            

Love your posts Randy, keep them up.

Admittedly, I shoot a 75+# bow.  But that's mostly just cause I want to.  I shot several bulls for a few years in a row, awhile ago, with a 55# RD home made job, which more than did the trick.  I actually just prefer Monster treessharks and maybe snuffers, as well as the satisfying draw of a heavier pull while hunting.  Works for me.  

Thanks again for your post.  

Just to answer the point of the post, this is an elk arrow:

   

but then again, so is this...

     

I'd say whatever route you take that gets you to this point is the right one.  Shoot straight and sharp!

Right on Dan

I know this may be a little off topic; it seems many believe that because they are Elk and because it is in the West that longer shots are in order. Compared to deer Elk are easier to stalk and there is no need to take shots that are less than ideal. Once you find 'em you can get amongst 'em.

This needs to come back to the top. A lot of us are preparing right now. Great insight by a great elk hunter  

QuoteOriginally posted by Bjorn:
... Compared to deer Elk are easier to stalk...

Some elk are maybe- when they are full rut and standing around watching other elk go nuts. I have hunted more than a few that were just as difficult to stalk as the whitetails I hunted back in Maine.
Just sayin, so some neophite doesn't get the idea elk success is somehow always easier.

Joshua

Randy,

Great advice. Thanks for your insights.

Dennis

Great topic.  
It brought a smile to see what has been working for you.  I have been playing with different arrow/weight/broadhead combinations over the past year.  I settled on the exact arrow set up you described.
I hope to see how it performs on an elk this year.

QuoteOriginally posted by jhg:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by Bjorn:
... Compared to deer Elk are easier to stalk...

Some elk are maybe- when they are full rut and standing around watching other elk go nuts. I have hunted more than a few that were just as difficult to stalk as the whitetails I hunted back in Maine.
Just sayin, so some neophite doesn't get the idea elk success is somehow always easier.

Joshua [/b]

I call BS, i saw it on TV, you just walk a few yards from your UTV, blow a bugle and here comes a dandy to shoot at. It's easy as pie

TTT - for one of my fav Trad Gang threads....

Enjoy!

Keep the wind in your face!

Shoot straight, Shinken

 

I remember seeing this thread when it started and never opened it because I was thinking "o another will this arrow kill an elk thread". Got bored tonight and am really glad i read it. One of the best threads I think. I shoot doug fir shafts with stos BH at about 11 gr/lb. Havent killed an elk yet but I have confidence.

Seems like with the ease of getting information these days you can overload on the options. Threads like this one make you realize that there are lots of ways but the main thing is to use common sense and to do your part the best you can (ie sharpening and shooting). Thanks for bringing this up.

Brandon