same 53# Zipper recurve, just about the same shot on same size whitetails ......... a 700 gr total weight arrow with a Steel Force 225 single bevel on the first two, complete pass through

my KS buck this year, 550 gr total weight, 175 gr Zwickey Delta double bevels, full penetration, didn't pass through

Was it the weight total, the single vs double bevel, the shot (although they were all 10-12 yard shots from stands about the same height etc)

Thoughts?

Did you hit bone on either of the two different weight arrows?

Way to many variables in my eyes to compare only two scenarios. Arrow flight,deer movement, bone or organ impacts are just a few.
Shoot what gives you confidence and with either you will have dead deer at the end of your bloodtrails.

Yeah, you can't make a valid comparison based on only three shots. That being said, a 700 grain arrow will have more momentum than the 550 grain arrow when shot out of the same bow. Whether or not that's of practical benefit on whitetails is debatable. I'd opt for whichever one was the quietest out of my bow. At hunting ranges (20 yards or less), you won't notice any appreciable differences in trajectory.

QuoteOriginally posted by Canyon:
Way to many variables in my eyes to compare only two scenarios. Arrow flight,deer movement, bone or organ impacts are just a few.
Shoot what gives you confidence and with either you will have dead deer at the end of your bloodtrails.

Well said!

I would guess the overall weight and width of broadheads would be the only thing that stands out.

What Canyon said!! I shot a good sized 6pt.(2.5yr. old northern deer)this year with a 470 grain arrow and it went thru his front shoulder and excited a bit lower in offshoulder and broke his leg in two on the off side 125 grain Snuffer(50 grain brass insert). Shot was 43 yards. I than shot a medium sized doe 90#s dressed at 12 yards broadside with the exact same set-up, hit her perfect about an inch behind the crease in shoulder 6"s from the bottom, centered the lungs. The arrow only stuck out the far side about 6"s. Go figure, just the way she tensed at the shot, hit 4 ribs that was all, 2 going in and 2 coming out. Go figure. Shawn

Brad,

I shoot 550 gns out of my recurve, 55 lbs...the old 10 grains per pound rule.

On elk, most of the time I get complete pass thrus.  If the broadhead is hanging out the other side it really does not concern me.

Either set-up will work great for you.  Hard to say why it didn't go all the way through...different arrow shaft?

Best of luck to you!

Bob

I'm sure there is no correlation between any of the shots. positive or negative. Both weights have the potential for pass thru. no 2 shots are the same.

I'm always considering my setup etc  .... was surprised I didn't get passthrough this shot. I didn't plan to go down in total weight, these new CX heritage shafts liked 175 only up front, that's what I stayed with, no brass insert.

always thinking ...... and right now I'm thinking I want to go back to my single bevel Steel Force 225's, no disrespect to the Zwickey at all!

once the broadhead is poking out the other side, it's done it's job.  Why are guys upset if the arrow doesn't stick in the ground on the other side?  Did you mean no pass through as in...arrow didn't fall out the other side? or the broadhead never punched through the far side? big difference

Ok I'm going to stick my neck out there and say I feel the extra weight helped penetration. The same bow with a heavier arrow that arrow is going to make better use of the bows energy . Drew

Based in the laws of physics and your results posted originally.  Yes there was a distinct though moderate difference in your results.  The problem is that the same number of identical shots would give different results than the last shots did.  An extra 150 grains to 200 grains never hurts penetration.

150-200 never hurts penetration unless your BH is not sharp or the wind was blowing or ya plucked the string, as said way to many factors as to why the different results. I for one like a lighter 9gpp for trajectory and it is all that is ever needed for whitetail. Jason Westbrook has always said it best, a 500 grain arrow out of a 60# bow will penetrate better than a 500 grain arrow out of a 50# bow, one is a tad over 8gpp. and the other 10gpp. so what is the fuss about grains per pound. My 470 grain arrow can be the so called magical 10gpp. out of a 47# bow, what is so magical about that? It shoots flatter and hits harder out of my 52# bow! Shawn

QuoteOriginally posted by Shawn Leonard:
150-200 never hurts penetration unless your BH is not sharp or the wind was blowing or ya plucked the string, as said way to many factors as to why the different results. I for one like a lighter 9gpp for trajectory and it is all that is ever needed for whitetail. Jason Westbrook has always said it best, a 500 grain arrow out of a 60# bow will penetrate better than a 500 grain arrow out of a 50# bow, one is a tad over 8gpp. and the other 10gpp. so what is the fuss about grains per pound. My 470 grain arrow can be the so called magical 10gpp. out of a 47# bow, what is so magical about that? It shoots flatter and hits harder out of my 52# bow! Shawn

Absolutely agree.  

QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Wilson:
 

QuoteOriginally posted by Shawn Leonard:
150-200 never hurts penetration unless your BH is not sharp or the wind was blowing or ya plucked the string, as said way to many factors as to why the different results. I for one like a lighter 9gpp for trajectory and it is all that is ever needed for whitetail. Jason Westbrook has always said it best, a 500 grain arrow out of a 60# bow will penetrate better than a 500 grain arrow out of a 50# bow, one is a tad over 8gpp. and the other 10gpp. so what is the fuss about grains per pound. My 470 grain arrow can be the so called magical 10gpp. out of a 47# bow, what is so magical about that? It shoots flatter and hits harder out of my 52# bow! Shawn

Absolutely agree.      [/b]

Yep.      

I'm a fan of heavy arrows, i.e. 12 gpi. Feel that if the shot isn't perfect due to animal movement, my own mistake (most likely), etc. and I get into bone the extra measure for penetration is a little extra insurance. Also, I favor SB broadheads for the same reasons.

imo, ain't gonna matter for deer.  what matters to me is how well the arrow mates to the bow and me.  that might be 9gpp or 12gpp or somewhere in between.  if yer shots are mostly taken at 20yds and under, 550 or 700 ain't gonna matter much at all.  i'd rather go with a heavier arra for hogs, too.  if the shot distances will be longer, like on antelope, i'd drop down to 9gpp to ease up the trajectory and still have the same sight picture at 30yds as i would have at 20yds.  to each their own, it's really all good stuff and not much to get anal over.

QuoteOriginally posted by Canyon:
Way to many variables in my eyes to compare only two scenarios. Arrow flight,deer movement, bone or organ impacts are just a few.
Shoot what gives you confidence and with either you will have dead deer at the end of your bloodtrails.

Absolutely agree. This is definitely not ballistic putty.  A heavier arrow will have more kinetic energy, do you need it for whitetails? Probably not, but why not if it works for you out of that bow?  Either sounds like the job was done just fine.

Since shots at living tissue, bone and fat are rarely perfect I tend to err on the heavy side of the arrow weight equation. My arrow combination while matched to the bow for the best flight I can possibly obtain at my skill level is also matched to the animals I might want to shoot on "this" hunt. Because I shoot a minimum of 46 lbs and a maximum of 50 lbs I don't use 2" cut broadheads, I usually build an arrow of between 550 and 600 grains (all my bows seem to love this weight) varying the cutting width on my BH depending on the bow and the quarry..  The tougher the hide, bone and the thicker the fat the smaller, longer my BH.. For most of the deer family a 1 5/16" to 1 ½" BH is going to work for me with the 50 lb bow and a 580-625 grain arrow weight..  But for my 46 lb stalking bow I'll stick to no more than an 1 3/16" cut with a long taper and 550-575 total weight...  ironically this works out to very little difference in sight picture between the two bows..
If I were hunting in an area where my average shot was greater than 25 yards I might build a different setup, just as I would if I were hunting coastal brownies... but I'm not.. I'm hunting eating size hogs, and deer up to elk size at ranges of 25 yards or less (most shot are under 20 yards) and I want two holes and the arrow stuck in the ground on the other side of the animal.. We kill by hemorrhage not by shock so there is no advantage to the arrow expending all its energy in the animal... save that for bullets..

If I were still able to comfortably shoot 60, 70 or even the 85 lbs I shot in my youth... I'd still be shooting arrows in the 11 ½ to 12 ½ GPP range.. just with a bigger cut on the BH...