Head to Head Trad Bow Speed Testing Results

[Sixby]

So much hinges on how a bow is designed and how it is built. I made up my mind a long time ago to not follow or buy into what so many consider to be established concepts. Many of which hit the brakes of progress and limit forward movement.

God bless, Steve

[Stixbowdrew]

I find it interesting that when comparing my glass model selway. Which is the same limb design as the dark matter I'm only drawing .5" longer than you and shooting a slightly heavier arrow around the same poundage and my glass limbed bow is only a few fps slower.... Makes you wonder really how much limb material matters over limb design... Makes one really consider that extra few hundred bucks..... Just something to ponder

[Sixby]

Kirk and I have pondered the carbon vs glass thing many times. I basically decided to let the customer decide. Honestly at stickbow hunting ranges it makes some difference at extreme yardage or with heavy arrows but when you have a great limb design , it is marginal and I highly doubt makes enough difference to really matter. I have built and seen some really quick glass bows. When they reach a high enough efficiency level its hard to gain a lot with carbon. This is more true with the recurves than with the longbows because the recurves are light in stack and in weight to start with. I suspect (actually know)that the real speed in carbon is what amounts to a faster recovery time equating to lighter physical weight of the entire limb. This also eliminates some shock and gains some efficiency as the energy is more efficiently imparted to the arrow instead of lost in excess vibration.
I do see greater gains in the longbow designs with carbon than with my recurves.

God bless, Steve

[jonsimoneau]

I'm not a speed guy.  I've got limbs with carbon in them and limbs without it.  I mentioned on another post that I know that when carbon is properly utilized in a limb that there is an increase in speed, but honestly, I don't notice it all that much compared to a limb made of good bamboo.  But what I do notice is the "deadness" in the hand.  The feel is different upon release and it is pleasing to me.  We all have what we like and do not like in a bow.  For me aside from inaccuracy, it is hand shock.  One of my weaknesses as a shooter is that hand shock distracts me and often causes a slight movement/reflex at release that affects my accuracy.  I know its different for everyone but that is the effect for me.  I LOVE a bow that is dead in the hand. Carbon seems to help with that.  Speed is just icing on the cake.  Please forgive my ignorance guys, as I am not a bowyer.  These are just observations that I have made.  Please feel free to correct me.

[Sixby]

JOn: I agree with everything you said. That deadness is caused by the extremely quick recovery of carbon. It wants to return to its original structure instead of bouncing around and losing energy like glass does. To me that is actually more important than the increase in speed is. Just as you have stated.

God bless, steve

[duncan idaho]

Thanks to all for a very interesting thread, I have learned a lot.

Steve,
      Thanks for all the "bowyer" input, keep it up. Really enjoy reading yours and Kirks posts.

[pamike]

Couple questions on Tip RC. If people think numbers are slow my thought would be that my RC is 56". Most likely not Dave's Perf size.

[cacciatore]

Thanks Mike for your report!

[pamike]

You guys are welcome - this was fun!!!

[tzolk]

Mike, what was the length of the lynx? Did you find the shorter bows to be faster than the longer?

[tzolk]

Also the lynx is a take down R/D bow. You stated it was a straight limbed longbow. I'd be happy with any of your bows tested. All very fast! Thanks for the research!

[Orion]

Interesting results.  Given that there's only a few fps difference between several of the fastest bows, it's very possible that string type -- material, strand count, etc. -- is what separated them.

[Cyclic-Rivers]

Can they go faster????    

Curious to see what the old widows or bears would measure??

[pamike]

Lynx is 64"

Bow length was not a big factor since all the high speed bows were 62 or 64"

Yes - I am sure if I took the 4 wool silencers off the Habu's they would have broke the 200 barrier. Centaur only had one set of cat whiskers. Habu was not quiet with cat whiskers so had to add more. Again - key is the equalizer was must be quiet!

Mike

[ozzyshane]

Hey Mike did you check the weight of each bow this may be the prob with the two habu bows Thnaks Shane

[pamike]

I did not put them on my bow scale - I checked Chris's before and they were right on.  I will check that just to be sure.

[Sixby]

One thing Mike,. If you did not actually take the poundage there is the possibility of bowyer error. Including Mine. Then plus of minus two gr. could be 4 gr. which can be a couple fps. So when you have that many bows so close you could find under even your quietness parameters , which I believe to be a great idea, You could have the fastest being the slowest and the slowest being the fastest when human error. Bowyer and your fingers error include, is removed. Of course an instrument which would take each bow to the same decibel level would have to be employed but that is entirely within the rhelm of possibility.
Just some of my thoughts on this entire thing.

Thanks though for the results. I did kind of expect that instead of just speed that you would comment on the entire bow of each of those. That would be very interesting especially now that you have established such a parity in speed.

That is asking a lot though and I understand the time that would be involved.

God bless you and have a great day, Steve

[pamike]

Steve - I can do that. Maybe have to do a couple at a time or keep it pretty high level.

[tzolk]

Guys. Did a chrono shoot today with my two bows. a Toelke Super Static recurve 64" 50@28 and a Toelke Super D (Hill Style bow) 66" 54@28. Arrows were shot with good back tension at release.

 

[TxAg]

Thanks for adding tzolk