Can't fix nock high

Mitch Edwards · August 09, 2016, 09:19:00 PM

Ok so after many hours of research over the years and trying many of the supposed fixes I still cannot eliminate nock high. The only thing I have not changed is the rest. The reason I haven't went to an elevated rest is #1 it happens on all my bows and I don't wanna change them all and #2 I just like shooting off the shelf. I've shot 3 under for years and have switched to split and the problem is still there. Besides nock point way to low or to high what causes this. And yes I have a lower nock point under the arrow. Look forward to the cure. Thanks

rwbowman · August 09, 2016, 09:34:00 PM

I'm in the same boat with one of my bows right now. Hate to go into the season with less than perfect arrow flight.

Al Dean · August 09, 2016, 09:40:00 PM

Lower your nocking point until you can see a definite arrow bounce or kick off the shelf. Should knock the fletching up instantly and visibly. Then start going up 1/16 at a time until arrow flies good.

old_goat2 · August 09, 2016, 09:44:00 PM

Bare shaft or fletched? I set my nocks to 5/8" inch and don't worry about nock high bare shafting, some of my bows shoot nock high bare shaft no matter what. Then once bare shaft shows good spine, I shoot fletched arrow looking for porpoising and if there is none, I try broadhead flight.

Blackhawk · August 09, 2016, 09:49:00 PM

Sometimes it's just the bow and not the shooter. I had a Kodiak magnum with terrible flight and noise no matter what I tried. After finding another of the same model and weight, it worked out just fine.

Let someone else try to work out the problem.

TKO · August 09, 2016, 10:13:00 PM

Are you canting the bow? I have noticed a shaft with a weak spine will show knock high/left if my bow is canted much. I make sure to tune arrows with the bow perfectly vertical.

BWallace10327 · August 09, 2016, 10:42:00 PM

Maybe you're getting a little finger pinch. That can add a some pressure to the arrow before you release. I have a bow that is almost too short for me to shoot due due minor finger pinch I get nock high.

Mitch Edwards · August 10, 2016, 12:37:00 AM

I have tried nock point from square to 3/4" and 1/2" seems to be about the best. It's on a 60# at 28" super kodiak drawn to 28.5" so I don't think finger pinch is it but I'm pretty new to split finger so I could be all wrong there. I see nock high on bare shafts. This bow with a ff string is hard to see the arrows clearly enough to get a good picture of what's happening on fletched arrows. I'm in the middle of figuring out carbons so I'm fighting 2 problems at once. Spine and nock high. While tuning I try to keep my bow vertical so I don't mess with my results but I cant my bows slightly when practicing or hunting just enough to clear my vision and keep the arrow on the shelf. I have 2 vintage bear kodiak magnums a bw kb this super kodiak and a bodnik slick stick and I seem to have the same problem on all of them. I have all the masters of the barebow volumes and I've seen where ken beck talks about putting pressure on the shaft but I've recently made sure my index finger only just touches the top of the nock at full draw so I can't see as how that would flex the arrow as he says and I had the same problem shooting 3 under which should put no pressure on the arrow. It could be that I'm just to picky but like rwbowman said I just can't got hunting with an arrow that ain't flying as good as it should. I have to much respect for animals to just fling any arrow at them just because I can.

slowbowjoe · August 10, 2016, 07:02:00 AM

I often see that with my bow. Try shooting cock feather in; that may well make a difference .

Marc B. · August 10, 2016, 07:21:00 AM

Bare shafting is good way to be driven crazy. Get it flying right with fletched shafts and forget about it.

I gave up bare shafting years ago.

Rick Richard · August 10, 2016, 07:55:00 AM

Have you tried shooting it through paper to make sure you are actually seeing nock high?

August 10, 2016, 08:00:00 AM

QuoteOriginally posted by Marc B.:
Bare shafting is good way to be driven crazy. Get it flying right with fletched shafts and forget about it....

There's some truth to that, especially if you worry about nock high, left, right, up/down.

OP didn't mention tip weight. High FOC bare shafts will always fly nock high.

I ALWAYS bare shaft group tune. It's worked for me for years. I try to get bare shafts grouping with arrows.

I first set nocking point at 1/2" high. I shoot two bare shafts and two arrows at about 10 yards. Group tuning will give you immediate feedback. I make adjustments, do it again, then, move back a few yards and do it again. By the time I get to 25 yards, the arrows will fly better than I can shoot them.

jamesh76 · August 10, 2016, 08:32:00 AM

You may want to consider the target, target material and angle you are shooting. I am referring to nock high like in this link and the angle of the shaft.

http://www.acsbows.com/bareshaftplaning.html

Target type can give you a funny read sometimes.

ranger 3 · August 10, 2016, 08:34:00 AM

Jim, if your bare shafts are not flying good how do you compare them to fletch arrows?

BenBow · August 10, 2016, 08:42:00 AM

If you put a lot of pressure low on the grip you can put more pressure on the lower limb which can pull the nock down when you release. This will cause the arrow to bounce off the shelf.

August 10, 2016, 09:20:00 AM

QuoteOriginally posted by ranger 3:
Jim, if your bare shafts are not flying good how do you compare them to fletch arrows?

That's the whole purpose of bare shaft and arrow grouping. Getting the bare shafts to fly to the same place as arrows. This method will give you immediate feedback about what's going on.

First step is to get your proper nock height: If bare shafts are low, lower nocking point; if they're high, raise nocking point. Once that's established, go to next step.

(For right handed shooter) If your bare shafts impact right, they're weak; if they impact left, they're stiff. Make adjustments and do it again. Back up a few yards and do it again.

Like I said, by the time I get to 25 yards, all is well.

If you can't make determinations by this simple method, then you've got more issues going on: form, release, arrows waaaay out of spine, or something.....

As a side note: From my experience, for some reason, most "trad" guys are shooting arrows that are way too stiff. That will usually be confirmed by arrow/bare shaft group tuning.

August 10, 2016, 09:22:00 AM

Sorry, somehow double posted.

jamesh76 · August 10, 2016, 09:45:00 AM

I don't know what your shooting into, how your target is set etc. Only reason, I mention target is because it seems a lot of different things have been tried as far as nock height, arrows etc and same results from different bows.

I feel like I have had bad/false readings from targets for the following reasons over the years-
- Not shooting on a flat surface- or target being sat on ground and not at a level where you get a flatter trajectory, if you shoot downhill, you can get nock high.
-Seems like on the layered targets, your arrow wants to enter straight and between the layers
-Bag targets, depending what they are stuffed with creates an angle if not filled or void if not stuffed tight etc.
-Solid Deer Targets with the solid replacement vitals- If shot a lot, creates holes and arrows can deflect off stiffer/newer material creating a false read as it enters worn spots.

I have had better luck with the thick condensed foam like couch cushions, and sometimes hay bales.

You say your fighting 2 issues- spine and nock high. How your fletched and bareshafts hitting? are they together? Just nock High?

Doc Nock · August 10, 2016, 10:24:00 AM

Lots of good advice here in...

Too many possibles. Sometimes a high string nock will do it, sometimes, low kicking off back of shelf... sometimes grip,...sometimes target that's been shot a lot has all those "channels" from prior penetration and the arrow takes that "path of least resistance" and drive you whacky.

I never believed in bare shafting until I set the new foam block up on a board atop of saw horses at eye level...then FINALLY, things started to work... prior, arrows would come to rest pointed in whatever direction they wanted plowing into old "channels" and it drove me bonkers...course, that isn't much of a drive, more like a short putt! :rolleyes:

Mitch Edwards · August 10, 2016, 11:28:00 AM

As far as point weight I'm shooting 125-200gr points and 100gr insert on a 340 test shaft right now. I'll trim and see what it does but ultimately I want 300 up front so that could be it as someone said. The pressure low in the grip is something I have not thought of. I'll be sure to pay close attention to that to see if that's the problem. I'm shooting into hay bales but I don't really look at shaft orientation once in the bale so much as just how it comes off the bow. It's minimal enough that fletching corrects it in a short distance but paper tuning would probably show it at close range. I think that will be my next step along with group tuning. Thanks everyone for the ideas. I'll be sure to test them and see if I can get this figured out