So here's the situation. My neighbor gave me access to his property. 140 acres of beautiful wooded land, creeks, ravines, oaks, pines, trails. I have not been more excited in years. During my many hikes I keep running into other nearby property owners who are using it pretty much every day for walking dogs, horseback riding. They did not have permission but they were not really hurting anything and I did not think it was my place to kick them off. I posted for the property owner but they ignored it. Come deer season I am seeing sign everywhere but no deer. I'm thinking the deer are on constant high alert with all the activity. A couple days ago I asked them if they could keep off for awhile during the rut. I said I would let them know when I got my deer. At first they said yes but then contacted the property owner who is a super nice old guy and he gave them permission to use the property. So now they are ignoring my request saying we can "share the property". My question is is it unreasonable to ask for a couple weeks a year for deer season and how does their activity affect deer movement.
Dealing with people is not my strong point. Thanks for any help
The property owner is the only one who has the right to say who comes and goes on his property. So I think you're overstepping your bounds to ask people to stay away during deer season.
FWIW, animals do become accustomed to people. We sometimes have to shoo turkeys away from our targets at our range. Sacramento has 30+ miles of riverfront parkway that is the home of all the wildlife indigenous to the area, and the playground of thousands of people with their dogs and horses. I pass within 20 yards of deer there just about every day. Nobody harasses them, so they become habituated to humans.
When I lived in TN years ago, I encountered similar situations, just gave up, and found another secluded area. That's probably not what you want to do, but sure feel your pain.
First of all, the deer have most likely turned all nocturnal because of the activity during the day. If you do hunt it, I'd suggest getting into your spot an hour before first light and just stay until the "walkers" arrive. BTW, these folks may even push animals to you location enroute to their bedding area.
just remind them for safety's sake to wear orange and make sure the horses are marked as well so there's no accidents, not as a threat but lets all enjoy this together.
with that being said if they have permission and you have permission then there's nothing you can do except utilize them for success,, the deer will adjust and have a second run more into the thickets or back of the pieces where these people are walking you need to figure out what the deer are doing now.
your essentially hunting urban/metro style where there's public access in hunting areas and where will the deer be when these people come around,, where will the people push them?
you can use these people to your advantage trust me. as far as nocturnal there's truth to that but the deer are surely moving before the sun comes up and after the sun goes down "the harvest hours" you just need to be set up in the right spot and ready then its tag after tag after tag.
All sorts of things affect deer movement...when I want to sort it out I spend more time in the field, often in the middle of the day when many believe deer are not moving...in general I find I want fewer deer around because too many eyes, ears and noses tends to not work in my favour...get in there and hunt hard for that one deer
DDave
140 acres and there on all of it find the spot there not using or find another place to hunt I had permission years ago to hunt a mouintain bike path it was a big place and they used all of it but I found a spot and killed a number of does and a 135 inch buck out of there
I think it is asking too much since the landowner gave everyone permission to use it. Hopefully you will figure out the property well enough to find a spot thats relatively unaffected by the other people.
We had similar situation in PA on Game Lands... What we learned over years of observation was that the deer held back till after the "dog walkers" toured the perimeter just at dusk and only came out on the private land we had access to after Dark!
The area was so wide open, we were NEVER able to back track deer far enough to find an ambush spot.
That and that Game Land was surrounded by posted private ground and the bedding apparently was off the Game Lands...
From that experience, I would say that deer DO INDEED tend to shy away from where people are WHEN the people are there... I'm guessing here, but "especially"(?) when dogs are involved.
Your desire isn't unreasonable, but it appears that it's a loose-loose situation and if you push the issue, you'll only create bad feelings.
Sometimes, hunting a place to hunt is the bigger challenge then hunting the deer!
Thanks everyone
I thought it was a simple request but maybe they took it as more than that. The property is managed by a father/son team. The son game me permission the father gave them. I was looking forward to a people free zone. Its out of my hands at any rate. Deer trails are everywhere. Tough to lock in on one spot. Other sign is pretty scattered. Guess I'll try heading in deep.
Thanks again
Answer is yes it is unreasonable to ask others who have equal access. 140 acres is nice sized. This is one of the reasons we usually just say thanks and do not hunt most of the properties we are invited too. It would take years to control the others if you leased it. People walking dogs disrupts deer in a big way in NC. If they off the leash forget about it. Horseback riders have been less of a problem for us. Deer don't seem to mind the horseback riders and they usually stay to specific trails. We have TONS of illegal horseback riders in our area but have not seen a negative impact.
Cory<><
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
I think it is asking too much since the landowner gave everyone permission to use it. Hopefully you will figure out the property well enough to find a spot thats relatively unaffected by the other people.
Yup. If others have permission. You have no say.
Here's the plus. 140 acres is really not a "small" piece of land. And chances are the others using it are always using the same places and trails. And aren't going to just roam around aimlessly. My guess is the property is "new to you" as well. Therefore you just have some homework to do and figure out where the deer are and the people won't be! The animals will adapt to the traffic.ive seen BIG bull elk cross heavily used hiking trails. Complete with screaming kids and horses alike.
Thanks again
They did not have permission when I asked but I believe they have it now. So they can do their thing and I will do mine. You are right they stick to the main trails and this is my first year out there. I do feel a bit overwhelmed trying to figure out where the deer are. It is pretty thick in areas with so many trails. I know they are there just not when I am. I am resisting getting a trail cam. Old School. I'm pretty much sitting along trails where rubs are at this point. Finding that perfect 40 yard circle is tougher than I thought it would be.
Stick with it, keep scouting and learning. You'll figure it out, it just takes a while. It's you're first year in there, so there's lots to learn. Good luck and watch the wind.
Study the deer instead of hunting for awhile. Not here's a spot somewhere on that land that will be golden you've just gotta find it.
Forget about controlling everybody else and just hunt. There have been too many times on county / state parks which allow limited bowhunting here and Illinois and Tennessee where I have seen (and shot) deer, in spite of others coming and going.
You need to put in your time, and that includes good scouting. Pretend that you are out walking your dog and scout it good. There are places that others don't frequent that may turn out glory holes.
ChuckC
It could work into your favor. It may take time, but the deer could become accustomed to human movement and might not spook as easily...
You have every right in the world to ask; your request is far from unreasonable. So what if it isn't your property, I'd ask a dog walker to leash their dogs during hunting season on public land, and that land belongs to everyone. Asking is NOT taking an authoritative stance by any means, it's just being polite.
When I lived in Michigan deer season was treated with reverence. In off season we all roamed each others land. During season we stayed on our side of the fence unless you were tracking. Then we all pitched in. Everyone around me hunted, school was cancelled on opening day of rifle. It was like a holiday. Not the same here in NC. I sure miss those days.
With others having the same permission to use the land, you have no leverage. I would hunt elsewhere. You may be able to find a spot or two that is not completely overrun by others, but I wouldn't count on it.
If not of these other people are hunting, I would think you could do ok and maybe even use them to your advantage. I'm sure they probably stick to same trails and such, so just pattern yourself and the deer around them.
here's how I read the post---
"They did not have permission but they were not really hurting anything and I did not think it was my place to kick them off. I posted for the property owner but they ignored it."
--seems the neighbors ARE taking advantage---I say the landowner stance IS no trespassing-[posted!]--but up to him how to deal with the pushy neighbors!!
maybe you should ask the neighbors if you can hunt their land--seeing how its a NO border community!
To me it's not your land so that says it all.
"Asking is not an authoritative stance by any means, it is just being polite"
I thought this is what I did. I just asked for a few days during the early rut. I think they took it as if I did have some right to tell them to stay off even though I told them frequently they needed to contact the owner. They did not want to and told me "I would rather ask forgiveness than ask permission and be told no". (No they are not a 5 year old.) I am sorry I ever asked. My new motto is "I ain't asken nobody for nothin if I can't get it on my own".
"pattern yourself and the deer around them"
This is what I am going to do. Stay away from the trails and them.
Thanks for everyone input. Lesson learned on this one. I think that is enough of this soap opera.
I would not necessarily give up on it.
This fall I was hunting about two hundred yards from my cousins buildings. All afternoon I heard hammering, sawing and laughing. In that same time I had multiple deer going by me. The only problem occurred was when a doe got downwind of ME."
Food for thought....
Years ago, I was sitting in a tree stand. About a couple hours before dark, a woman walked down a trail with a Golden Retriever. About 20mins later... Back she comes headed back to the house. About a half hour later, I see a deer cross an opening on the trail, heading in the same direction as the woman & her dog..... I counted 14 Does & Fawns, all walking down the same trail the woman & her dog followed about a half hour earlier!!!