Has anyone tried it?
He says many like it for shorter bows. I'm going to send for his tab kit with instructions for 2 under, just looking for a few comments before I talk with Dan.
I have tried it (I think), or a modified version. I'd draw with a deep hook(split) and then once I reached full draw, I'd drop the top finger to literally point parallel to the arrow resting my cheeck bone against the side of my forefinger. Releases were very smooth and shooting was very consistent. In other words, you start the draw cycle with all three fingers (split) and then after dropping the top finger, it becomes a two finger under version with about 70% of the pressure in the middle finger and 30% pressure in the ring finger. I'm also curious about the results that other shooters have had with this method.
Tradcat
Dan taught it to me a few years ago. What I learned was to draw middle and ring finger under with DEEP hooks. My index finger rests lightly on top the shaft. The rest may vary with hand shape and size but I put firm pressure with the pad of my thumb on the back of the middle digit of my little finger and anchor the tip of my middle finger in the corner of my mouth, the knuckle of my thumb at the rear point of my jaw. Very clean, consistent release.
Learned it a long time ago when I lived near the Toelke's. I actually lay my index finger on the string without pressuring it up. Didn't effect the tune of my bow but sure gave me a more consistent release.
So you use your middle and ring finger under the arrow like you normally would with a typical split three finger draw, but don't use the top index finger. After reading about it on Dan's web site, I gave it a try, but I assumed you used your index and middle finger under the arrow like a three under draw, but with the lower ring finger removed. So, what two fingers does Dan's method use?
Anyone ever try one finger above and below the arrow?
I shoot this way; stumbled on it years ago, came back to it more recently, and then came across this being recommended by Dan. My technique is sort of a blend of the previous three posts, but I don't point the top finger. I begin the draw with regular 3 finger split, and my index finger just settles to lightly rest on the arrow, relaxed. I do find it's helped with my consistency.
It's done with the regular 3 fingers split. It's not just a two finger under configuration. That doesn't work for me at all.
Yes I've shot it for a couple years now since talking to Dan. I can't picture ever going back. I like the strength my two deep hooks have compared to 3 finger tips.
QuoteOriginally posted by Hopewell Tom:
Has anyone tried it?
He says many like it for shorter bows. I'm going to send for his tab kit with instructions for 2 under, just looking for a few comments before I talk with Dan.
check this guy out... https://youtu.be/ayjgY6jxYIY
Contemplated shooting this way before but have not done it yet. tagging for future interest
My wife has been shooting this way for 15 years. She does great with it!
I shoot two under also, I originally shot true split finger but noticed that my top finger kept being less engaged so just dropped it all together. Seems like my consistency increased when I did. It also forces me to use a deeper hook which I think helps.
Been using this for a couple of years now, better smoother release, and it added a bit of length to my short draw!
Thanks,
QuoteOriginally posted by Kirkll:
QuoteOriginally posted by Hopewell Tom:
Has anyone tried it?
He says many like it for shorter bows. I'm going to send for his tab kit with instructions for 2 under, just looking for a few comments before I talk with Dan.
check this guy out... https://youtu.be/ayjgY6jxYIY [/b]
Appears to be using his index and middle finger. Looks like there are different versions of the two-under technique
I stumbled on to this technique also....
I started doing this on a shorter bow that was tight on my top finger when I was shooting and became uncomfortable to shoot. When my finger was sore I started shooting with it slipped off to side of string ...I guess just touching it. I liked it so much that I do it with my longer bows now. I find it to be very consistent.
I've been using Dan's technique for probably 5 or 6 years nows, for all my bows, regardless of length. Dan taught me while I was picking up a new bow I had bought. Deep hook with middle and ring fingers and index finger resting on the arrow shaft. For me, it makes for a very consistent release. It seems so natural now, I can't ever imagine any other technique.
:archer2:
Pretty positive throughout.
Thanks for the comments, I'm getting me a new tab!
Helpful information. Going to order one to try as well.
Thanks folks.
QuoteOriginally posted by Jim Wright:
Dan taught it to me a few years ago. What I learned was to draw middle and ring finger under with DEEP hooks. My index finger rests lightly on top the shaft. The rest may vary with hand shape and size but I put firm pressure with the pad of my thumb on the back of the middle digit of my little finger and anchor the tip of my middle finger in the corner of my mouth, the knuckle of my thumb at the rear point of my jaw. Very clean, consistent release.
Dan taught me this as well. What I do exactly.
I am interested in trying this method. Is there anyway someone could post a picture of how this looks. I am sure there are others that would like to see it as well.
Thanks, Jeff
I shot three under and strained a ligament in my ring finger at work about two years ago. I couldn't shoot three under any more so i switched to two under, pointer and middle, temporarily till my finger got better. My finger feels fine but i never switch back
Not sure if this a true toelke technique but its what my three under has evolved into.
(http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/GeorgiaLST/IMG_20150824_173737963_zpscwumflq1.jpg) (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/GeorgiaLST/media/IMG_20150824_173737963_zpscwumflq1.jpg.html)
(http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/GeorgiaLST/IMG_20150824_173717874_zpsone0tefw.jpg) (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/GeorgiaLST/media/IMG_20150824_173717874_zpsone0tefw.jpg.html)
(http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/GeorgiaLST/IMG_20150824_173609811_zps7sio5n77.jpg) (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/GeorgiaLST/media/IMG_20150824_173609811_zps7sio5n77.jpg.html)
That's exactly how I did it, worked wonderful for me, I went back to 3u though but still shoot that way on occasion
I shot 2 under for 7 years then developed arthritis in my middle finger from pulling on the string with mainly that finger, so went back to 3 under.
I've been playing with something very similar recently but didn't know it was already a thing. Sacrificed a tab tonight and I really like it on my 58" chinook. Haven't been shooting it much as it's pretty tight shooting split at my draw length, but the two under was very nice. Might bring the old girl back into the rotation!
I've been trying this as well after I ordered a bow from Dan. I bought both his 2 under and 3 under tabs. Give Dan a call and he'll talk you through it. VERY nice and knowledgeable man. I asked him if Jared would film him but haven't gotten anything yet. The instructions with tab are very good.
Tim Finley above makes some really fine Kota Bows!
I gave it a shot when I got home from work last night. It's something new and felt different at first, but I have to say I really liked it. Was hitting my mark pretty darn good and it began to feel real natural. I'm going to keep tinkering with it.
I was taught a similar technique by Mike Fedora. I'm pretty sure Dan Toelke learned a bit of bow building from Mike Fedora, so it seems he may have adapted his shooting technique as well. My accuracy has improved immensely after using the 2 under technique.
Up front, I haven't tried the technique but after nearly 30 years of teaching LE firearms I would suspect that in the heat of the moment it wouldn't be any different than delivering a firearms shot - separating the action of 1 finger from the rest of the hand is very difficult. Those who consistently hunt successfully with the method, I tip my hat to them.
Got my tab from Dan today (amazing service as always) and just shot it a bit. Didn't mess with nocking point changes or anything and I perceived the bow shooting a bit more loudly than my normal split finger tab. Anyone else have this experience? Is it like shooting 3 under where moving the nock point up a bit can help compensate for that?
Feels strange of course after only shooting a couple dozen arrows but I'm definitely going to give it a fair chance. I can see where if the muscle memory becomes ingrained that it would be a very solid holding technique.
I read this thread a couple days ago and was kinda curious, so I decided to give it a try today. I was hesitant to try something new this close to deer season, but what the heck. I'm wondering now why this style isn't more popular. I'm shooting a 64" bow so finger pinch wasn't really an issue, but it still seemed to feel more comfortable. It even made aiming feel more natural. Sounds strange since it's just one finger that's changed, but when I volunteered with 4h shooting sports several years back, one of the experienced shotgun instructors taught new shooters to point their off hand pointer finger straight down the underside of the forend toward the end of the barrel and the clay bird. He said that even though you can't see your finger, we're so used to pointing our fingers at things that just the feel of it pointing will make you more accurate. I saw quite a few kids improve quickly with that technique. I think I'll stick with it for a week or so and see how it works out. I shoot with a glove and I also like the idea of keeping my pointer finger out of the glove. Makes it easier to do fine detailed, important tasks.......like nose picking.
Thanks for sharing,
Matt
Dave, be sure and employ deep hooks. Every once in a while I blow the release and let my fingers unfurl a bit initially. It always seems loud.
Thanks Jim. Will definitely pay attention to that. The notes Dan includes with the tab kit shows he recommends a really deep hook and that may be it. I'm used to split shooting in the big crease between first and second pads. Looks like he recommends right into the meat of the second pad.
I tried Dan's method as described on this thread the best I could, sure wished someone who knows for sure would do a short video.
I found that my Centaur Chimera shot quieter and my accuracy was better.
I had to change up my anchor point to keep my arrow close to my eye since I normally shoot 3 under with the index finger in the corner of my mouth and thumb knuckle on back of jaw/ear.
With Dan's method I placed the index finger just under my cheek bone and thumb knuckle on back of jaw/ear.
It seamed to give me a better sight picture and I was in the 10's more frequent than before.
Of course this is all anecdotal at this point, but I was encouraged by the results.
After reading this thread,I'am also trying to shoot this way with the split finger tab that I have, I think I'am going to like it so I ordered the Toelke 2 under Tab.
Sam
One more thing that resulted was a 1/2" gain in draw length due to the change in anchor point.
Still trying to make this automatic, but since it still is new my first reaction is to draw to my usual anchor. This will change with more time at it I'm sure.
Tried it tonight and bow was quieter for sure.
I used to shoot almost exclusively two under...it just makes sense to have the least contact with the string possible...these days I am shooting 3 finger and 2 finger split
DDave
It's the same concept as using a mechanical release with a compound, except with our fingers obviously.
The less pressure and influence on the string the better.
Thank you very much for this post!!! After reading I gave it a try -- fantastic thanks for adding to my shooting pleasure, Jerry.