It seems when we talk about bow lengths, maneuverability inevitably is mentioned. Tonight, with nothing better to do I started comparing my bows to see how much difference in manuvetability there was. I have had a few from 48" on up to 68" bows.
Interesting thing at least to me was that when strung my 58" Shrew Samurai is actually longer than my 60" Blacktail recurve.
Depends. AMO specs state that the bow is to be marked 3" longer than the "string master" (steel cable) that puts it at proper brace. So...a recurve with a higher brace can actually be shorter when strung than a lower braced longbow of the same length.
And a lot of bows don't exactly follow AMO specs.
No
It all depends on how the bowyer measures and marks his bows. Some use the amo method, while others measure along the belly of the bow for an actual length. Some also measure string grooves or nock to nock length, while others measure tip to tip. The strung lengths will also vary according to limb curvature. Most recurves at "x" length will have a shorter strung profile than longbows of the same length, with hybrids usually falling somewhere in between. I have 54" and 56" hybrids, with different limb designs, from the same bowyer, that measure less than 1" different when strung.
QuoteOriginally posted by LBR:
And a lot of bows don't exactly follow AMO specs.
x2!
i had a 58" bob lee recurve. i wanted longer limbs so i ordered some 60" limbs for it. when they arrived they were the same length! the same string braced it the same. i had to return them and the made 62" limbs. i had to go from 58" to 62" to gain 2". what the??
Interesting, this is something I guess I never considered.
All of the 60" bows I build are 60"t/t. I measure all my bows t/t.
Please remember that when you get/order a recurve string it is 4 inches shorter 60=56inch string( fast flight can be shorter-less stretch)long bows 3 inches shorter.
Kinda defeats the reason for having an "AMO Standard" doesn't it?
My 60 inch Cari-bow Tuktu EX is what I consider to be a rather radical Static Tip design...overall length of that bow when strung is considerably shorter than any of my working 60 inch recurves and I can swap strings between them with no problem...AMO length is far more about the string length than it is about the length of the bow
DDave
QuoteOriginally posted by Bldtrailer:
Please remember that when you get/order a recurve string it is 4 inches shorter 60=56inch string( fast flight can be shorter-less stretch)long bows 3 inches shorter.
Thomas I hear this a lot but it is actually 3" for both, here is a link to the guide, :)
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CCcQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.texasarchery.org%2FDocuments%2FAMO%2FAMOStandards.pdf&ei=rX0HVeLrEIfHsQT1h4L4Cw&us g=AFQjCNFRQw8ug6hg4sKWS2t916okV50ndQ&sig2=bdYxpbkGAZ_iy4fAwlvx1A&bvm=bv.88198703,d.cWc (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CCcQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.texasarchery.org%2FDocuments%2FAMO%2FAMOStandards.pdf&ei=rX0HVeLrEIfHsQT1h4L4Cw&usg=AFQjCNFRQw8ug6hg4sKWS2t916okV50ndQ&sig2=bdYxpbkGAZ_iy4fAwlvx1A&bvm=bv.88198703,d.cWc)
QuoteOriginally posted by Pat B:
All of the 60" bows I build are 60"t/t. I measure all my bows t/t.
Is that braced or unbraced Pat?
I don't think I've ever bought a bow where the string length is exactly the same as any other bow I have. True, many times you can twist or untwist the string to make it fit, but to have a string exactly the right length for a particular bow requires some experimentation. Experimentation that most bowyers are evidently unwilling to do, based on the number of strings I've gotten with bows, including very expensive bows, that don't quite fit.
QuotePlease remember that when you get/order a recurve string it is 4 inches shorter 60=56inch string( fast flight can be shorter-less stretch)long bows 3 inches shorter.
That's the "Old Rule of Thumb", but it's hit or miss. AMO specs state the bow should be marked 3" longer than the "string master" (steel cable) that puts it at proper brace--recurve or longbow, makes no difference. Also hit or miss.
I've made strings for recurves that varied from 2.5" to 6" shorter than the marked length; for longbows it's been from 1.5" to 4" shorter than the marked length.
Actual string lengths are supposed to be measured under a 100# load, except for very light weights and they are measured under a 50# load. This is to account for the stretch of polyester (Dacron).
Best way to get the right string is to measure the string that puts your bow at the proper brace height and make/order the string by actual length. That eliminates all the guesswork.
Quote...but to have a string exactly the right length for a particular bow requires some experimentation. Experimentation that most bowyers are evidently unwilling to do, based on the number of strings I've gotten with bows, including very expensive bows, that don't quite fit.
Dave, sometimes it will vary a little from bow to bow and/or shooter to shooter. What drives me nuts is seeing a $5 string on any bow, especially one I know cost a grand or better. What in the world are they thinking??? You don't put watered down gas in a new truck, even a "cheap" one and especially not a "high end" (danged expensive) one!
Unbraced, along the back.
AMO is all about the string length to brace it at the recommended brace height. A 60" bow will take a 57" string to brace.
Mike
I came to the conclusion a long time ago that LBR's method works best for me. If I have a bow with no string, I put one on from another bow that should be close. Then I twist or untwist until I get the desired brace height. I measure the string at that point, stretched between two pegs under moderate tension and order that length. It's worked every time for me.
Question for you professional string makers: If I find I need a string 60 5/8" long to get the required brace height, am I dreaming that I am going to get a string that was built to be that length, or will it be a 61" string that has been twisted down to 60 5/8? What makes sense to you guys? Can I order to the nearest 1/2" and get a better designed string than ordering to the full inch?
QuoteIf I find I need a string 60 5/8" long to get the required brace height, am I dreaming that I am going to get a string that was built to be that length, or will it be a 61" string that has been twisted down to 60 5/8? What makes sense to you guys? Can I order to the nearest 1/2" and get a better designed string than ordering to the full inch?
It's just as easy to make a string 60 5/8" as it is 61". I prefer exact measurements myself.
I don't think it's going to hurt a thing if you need to add or remove a few twists, and if someone can shoot the difference in a few twists they should be holding World titles and probably World records...but I still like to get it as close as I can.
Chad
Thanks Chad. That's what I was hoping to hear :notworthy:
My 1966 Browning Explorer (before there was a I or II)is marked as a 62" length but is actually 60" NTN measured along the belly. I had to get a 57" string to obtain a proper brace. A 58" or 59" string would have been much too long.
The later Explorer II's were actually a true 62" AMO. So there's three sizes of Explorers
My 58" thunderhorn longbow takes a 56" string at brace. Taught me a lesson on pre-ordering a string for a new bow without talking to the bowyer first!!!! It would be a 59" amo bow in my opinion.
Reinforces my belief that bowyers would be doing everyone (including themselves) a favor if they would include "ASL" (actual string length) in the markings on the bow. In a perfect world.......
ASL would be great, especially if the bows aren't marked by AMO specs.
I wonder how many bowyers/factories have an actual set of string masters per AMO specs, and use them.
Chad has nailed it. AMO is three inches longer than the proper string. The rule of thumb is just that, a rule of thumb (an approximation). Pat measures his bows his way. Others measure their bows their way. Don't EVER assume that the length number marked on a bow has anything to do with how long the bow measures. Too many opinions and personal choices on how a bow should be measured for you to assume you know what the number marked on the bow means. You can be PRETTY SURE of what string length is recommended however if the marking says AMO xx". If their is just a number and no "AMO", experiment to determine the best string length, then keep track of that number. BTW is you order/buy a string from someone you'd be wise to specify whether the length you are ordering is AMO length or loop-to-loop. Avoids 3" of confusion!
I test drove a great "short" longbow a while back, when I was looking for a turkey blind bow that would work with my longer draw. I couldn't shoot it well, so ended up sending it back and not buying it. But before I did, I stood it up next to my 64" Black Widow recurve. The two bows, both strung and at the right brace height, were only an inch different in length. I would have only gained an inch in clearance in the blind by going with the shorter bow.