I didn't want to hi-jack TX-Ag's thread on using sights on traditional bows. But I still wanted to ask y'all some questions.
I think I've just about peaked accuracy wise for now, but I don't feel that I'm accurate enough to hunt with. I have been considering adding a simple pin sight to my bow to use as a training aid. Do you think that would help or hurt me?
Also, I would like to hear your thoughts on 3Rivers\\' Single Pin sight. (http://www.3riversarchery.com/single+pin+screw-on+tape-on+bow+sight_i5702_baseitem.html) It seems simple enough, and I can mount it using tape instead of screws. Which would be good as I don't want to put holes in my 1958 Bear Polar, and do you think it would work on my bow? I'm a bit worried about it not fitting because of the grip. However, I probably could use it as a reference point to get a consistent grip.
It will work fine. I had a Cobra sight holder taped to my Bear Alaskan (many moons ago) which has a similar shaped riser. The old Cobra holder is similar to the one 3 Rivers offers. I used one pin and killed deer with that setup.
I first started bowhunting in 1967 with a Bear Kodiak Magnum that had a pin sight on it. Worked for me back in those days.
You could probably also use Velcro.
Good Shooting,
Craig
I shot for years shooting gap. Use the tip of the arrow and point it at the target. Or mostly under it. Now most people want not to look at arrow but only the spot on the target. With gap or pin sight you will have to judge yardage. I think that is why so many people want just to let their brains and experience shoot the arrow without sights.
You need to do what is best for you.
Many don't even try to adapt, keep trying different things until you find your way. And then adapt some more!
Your hunting will change, your quarry will change, your bow AND your body will change.
It never ends, and that keeps it interesting and challenging.
Sights were so so common back in the 50's and 60's. I killed many deer using them. They are great for teaching you good form.
The thing about using sights vs instinctive style is with a sight pin you are thinking about yardage and placing the sight pin accordingly to the distance to the animal.
With instinctive style you practice a lot more and let your subconscious mind judge distance and adjust for elevation. All you do is concentrate on the spot you want to hit & "Use the force Luke".
It takes time to learn to trust your subconscious mind. Lots of practice shooting at different yardages will imbed itself in your mind, but if you start thinking about it too much it will screw you up.
you bet.... using a sight pin will help you in your shooting consistency, but it's very different than shooting instinctively. Sights is like a rifle... shooting instinctively is like wing shooting with a shot gun.... You just do it... You don't aim...
Thank you Kirk!
IMO, using a sight will set one back even further if shooting instinctive is their goal. If one is having problems w/ accuracy shooting a bare bow, it's usually something in their shooting form.
I would suggest some coaching from an accomplished bare bow archer or go to a compound and set it up to shoot bare bow off the self.
An Olympic coach/traditional bowhunter provided me this insight.
If someone has been used to using sights (compound coverters) and then goes without them "traditional", it is common to shoot high (for another reason). While the sightless shooter may do fine in practice just looking at the spot when the pressure of a animal shot occurs the archer will often look at the point of the arrow without knowing it.
These shots are high because almost all shots are taken much closer (less than 20 yards) than the point on distance of the bow/arrow combination (>30 yards).
I agree that lots of practice at various yardages are key for many to shoot well instinctively. I did this in my mid-teens to early 20's and it was amazing the accuracy one could attain (hit a penny at 33 yards -- the length of my subdivision backyard 45 years ago).
Then maybe 34 years of sights on compounds and I suppose I didn't have the patience to get back to that competence. That's why I string walk. I don't stare at the point of the arrow because that would be as damaging to accuracy as a sight user staring at the pin. You simply know the yardage (not a problem after 45+ years of bowhunting)put the fingers in that spot under the arrow (3 under) and look at the spot you want to hit.
Hmm....so it'd probably hold me back for learning instinctive. That does make sense. I don't have money to pay a coach. If I did, I would have done that a long time ago. Unfortunately, I'm stuck having to fix me. I'll go back to my light bow and work on form for a while and see if that helps. My ultimate goal is to be hunting accurate while shooting instinctive. So I guess I'll forgo the sight for now and focus solely on instinctive.
It'd be nice if I could finally figure out how to tune my arrows. lol. For some reason I just can't wrap my head around it. That could be my problem as well. I got lucky with my 60# Polar, I'm shooting 32" 7595 GT Traditionals with 225gn points on 11.5gn inserts. This combo has been fairly accurate for me, but I don't know how to fine tune. And I can't seem to get consistently within an 8" circle at 20yrds. I can get within 10" but I still get quite a few fliers that drive me crazy.I've read several different techniques and know what to do, but I just can't seem to do it. I'd rather not cut on my arrows, so I've been trying to tune by point weight. 225gn is close but I'm not consistent enough to fine tune.
Good thing I'm stubborn and want to figure this out. Otherwise, I'd be a bit disheartened.
I think using a sight may help you in the long run. Just like any other style of shooting, you must have consistent form to shoot accurately and using a sight will help make sure your form is the same every time. I have thought about doing this myself actually. As cheap as the one you mentioned is, it can't hurt to try it for a few weeks and then take it off and see if it helped.....or sets you back.
If you are having trouble w/ tuning carbons? Then try aluminums. They are far easier to work w/. IMO, tuning your bow and shooting form go hand in hand. Look, I had major flaws in my shooting form for 15+ years. I got a 2 hour session w/ Mike Fedora and some of his field archer buddies from the 60's and 70's. I got 10x more out of those 2 hrs than the 15 years of reading books and watching videos.
A sight can be a great training aid. It will help you find flaws in your shooting form and release.
Bow wild, Roy I agree totally with your last paragraph. Upon returning to recurves after 40 years of compound/sight/release shooting I had lost my instinct. Since my last competitive shooting was stringwalking, it became my preferred method for hunting/3D.
QuoteOriginally posted by PaulDeadringer29:
I think using a sight may help you in the long run. Just like any other style of shooting, you must have consistent form to shoot accurately and using a sight will help make sure your form is the same every time. I have thought about doing this myself actually. As cheap as the one you mentioned is, it can't hurt to try it for a few weeks and then take it off and see if it helped.....or sets you back.
I may go ahead and do that. I'll order one next time I'm getting something from them. Not like it's breaking the bank. If I don't like it. I can always pass it along to someone who wants it.
QuoteOriginally posted by overbo:
If you are having trouble w/ tuning carbons? Then try aluminums. They are far easier to work w/. IMO, tuning your bow and shooting form go hand in hand. Look, I had major flaws in my shooting form for 15+ years. I got a 2 hour session w/ Mike Fedora and some of his field archer buddies from the 60's and 70's. I got 10x more out of those 2 hrs than the 15 years of reading books and watching videos.
I would love to get a session with a good coach. I just can't afford one right now. All my money is tied up in medical bills at the moment. I don't think many coaches come near where I live though. So I'd have to travel to find a good one.
I think I'll hit up some of the lumber yards and see if they have some wood I can get cheaply. Maybe hanging a paper target and tuning that way would help. I've just been going off of where my arrows hit verses where I was aiming. I have them close but not where I want them. That might help some.
Didn't cost me a dime for that session. I met him at a shoot and we started talking. Are you near Mike Palmer?
Just so you guys know, I passed along an article written by Jack Howard about using a sight and his method for aiming with one. Anyone interested in using a sight or just likes vintage articles can find it posted on the How To section.
QuoteOriginally posted by overbo:
Didn't cost me a dime for that session. I met him at a shoot and we started talking. Are you near Mike Palmer?
I don't know Mike Palmer. Where is he out of?
QuoteOriginally posted by bigbadjon:
Just so you guys know, I passed along an article written by Jack Howard about using a sight and his method for aiming with one. Anyone interested in using a sight or just likes vintage articles can find it posted on the How To section.
This one??
HUNTING WITH A BOW SIGHT BY JACK HOWARD (http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=000141)
It's a good article. I just skimmed through it. I'll be reading it a lot closer later on. Thanks!
Palmer bows out of Texas, Mike has been building bows for many years and was an accomplished tournament archer.
QuoteOriginally posted by overbo:
Palmer bows out of Texas, Mike has been building bows for many years and was an accomplished tournament archer.
I looked him up and it says on his website that he's out of Aguilar, Colorado but he's from Texas. Are we talking about the same person?
Palmer Bows (http://www.palmerbows.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=4&Itemid=123)
QuoteOriginally posted by Dorado:
QuoteOriginally posted by overbo:
Palmer bows out of Texas, Mike has been building bows for many years and was an accomplished tournament archer.
I looked him up and it says on his website that he's out of Aguilar, Colorado but he's from Texas. Are we talking about the same person?
Palmer Bows (http://www.palmerbows.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=4&Itemid=123) [/b]
Same guy! He does not live in TX anymore.
Bisch
QuoteOriginally posted by Bisch:
Same guy! He does not live in TX anymore.
Bisch [/QB][/QUOTE]
Shame, If he was close by I wouldn't mind talking to him and maybe get a little coaching.
I remember reading an article (or may have even been a post on here) a long time ago...where then hunter was out west with a barebow....when a trophy animal presented itself with a shot at a distance beyond what little cover would allow him to sneak in....so he sort of strapped a wooden strike anywhere match to his riser with a rubber band to use as a site pin. he'd practiced with the setup before and knew where to place it on the riser for proper elevation, how far out for proper windage, etc....
might be worth a shot to see if it works for you before investing in a system.
QuoteOriginally posted by hickstick:
I remember reading an article (or may have even been a post on here) a long time ago...where then hunter was out west with a barebow....when a trophy animal presented itself with a shot at a distance beyond what little cover would allow him to sneak in....so he sort of strapped a wooden strike anywhere match to his riser with a rubber band to use as a site pin. he'd practiced with the setup before and knew where to place it on the riser for proper elevation, how far out for proper windage, etc....
might be worth a shot to see if it works for you before investing in a system.
I remember hearing something like that. A match and a rubber band would make for a cheap site to play with. I'll do that along with my usual practice. Thanks for reminding me about that. I had completely forgotten about it.
You don't have to spend a lot to try a sight. Go to an auction site and see if you can find an old Cobra pin site or something like it. Pin sights generally cost less than $15. I bought an Eagle sight from 3rivers to for the pins for $5ish.
Sight is fine; it's good that you are aware of your limitations and willing to do something about them, rather than just flinging and hoping for the best. If you can find someone who is a certified coach of the Oly style, that would help you more than anything. If you get the form down cold, everything gets easier and more predictable. If your anchor, position of the string relative to your eye, and draw length are varying from shot to shot, and you are recruiting the wrong muscles to draw and shoot, you will find it very hard to consistently hit anything with any aiming style. If you get a pin, you must have your eye in the same relative position at anchor to the pin every time in order for it to work properly. On a compound, the peep does that, of course.
My buddy uses two zip ties on his riser...one for 20yd and the other for 30yd. He cut the tip of the zip tie at an angle for a fine tip for accurate placement of the pin. Kinda unsightly but he's really accurate with it.