I am new to bow hunting all-together. I went and got my Dad's old recurve down from storage to see if it was usable.
Here are the pics:
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104524_zpsegedkfuz.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104509_zpsrzv6iekz.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104518_zpshe72hw4f.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104551_zpsnqpxwg0t.jpg)
Sorry for the poor focus...
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104556_zpsitfg3dwp.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104620_zpsmoouz36i.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104625_zps09xqbsp2.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20140930_104645_zpszozurhui.jpg)
So, what do you guys think?
Thanks in advance,
MT
On all wood one piece bows (self bows) it has been written that longitudal cracks will not affect the safety or performance of a bow. With all those laminates under the cracked fiberglass I would suspect that it will hold up if used carefully. I would not pull it to full draw right away but slowly, over time pull the limbs a little at a time over days to see how it accepts the movement. Any clicking or creaking sounds and its a wall hanger.
was it, by chance, stored in an attic or very hot area? That would make me more suspect of it. Then the cracks could be running all the way through the the wood lams underneath, too.
My question is. . why did it do that ? I suspect high heat / cold and drying out / shrinking. I myself would not string that bow.
ChuckC
QuoteOriginally posted by ChristopherO:
was it, by chance, stored in an attic or very hot area? That would make me more suspect of it. Then the cracks could be running all the way through the the wood lams underneath, too.
It has been stored for the past 10-15 years in the upstairs of an un-conditioned two-story garage. I'd say it didn't get as hot as an attic or in the rafters of a regular garage. This two-story garage is nestled in between some rather large willows, and doesn't get much direct sun....maybe reaches 90°F in the summer inside there.
Any idea what string this bow takes?
Thanks,
B50 62" I'd say. The bow may be ok, but it also may not be. The classafied section has really good bows for not a lot of money. Samick also makes good, affordable, entry level bows (and with a take down you can build up weight while keeping the same riser). Of course, I could understand wanting to shoot that one. Just offering hope in case it doesn't work out. Either way, welcome to traditional archery, this site is a great tool for you to learn the right way, every step of the way.
Longitudinal cracks are pretty common with older glass bows and generally not an issue. Check the front of the riser and see if that glass crack goes into the wood. Loctite 420 is a common remedy. Check over in the collecting forum.
QuoteOriginally posted by Cavscout9753:
B50 62" I'd say. The bow may be ok, but it also may not be. The classafied section has really good bows for not a lot of money. Samick also makes good, affordable, entry level bows (and with a take down you can build up weight while keeping the same riser). Of course, I could understand wanting to shoot that one. Just offering hope in case it doesn't work out. Either way, welcome to traditional archery, this site is a great tool for you to learn the right way, every step of the way.
Thanks, I'll try to find a string and take it easy.
I was looking at a Samick Sage in the 25-30# range for just backyard shooting and to work on my form.....but, right now, wifey ain't gonna let me open the wallet for a while...just stuck $2k into tires and alignment crap on my truck. :banghead: I do all my own wrenching, but there's just some things a guy is gonna have to pay to have done.
(they accidentally cut a brake line that needed replacing, so at least I got that for free. :) )
I have built and worked with a lot of bows and I would not string or shoot it . If it has sentimental value to you clean it up and hang it up with some good looking wood arrows .
May life's simplest things bring you the greatest pleasures !!!!
Is there a reference somewhere that has the brace height range for this model?
The cracks are way too long for me to think that it is safe to shoot.
really there is only one way to find out and that's shoot it lol the only thing I would be afraid of is it cracking into the site window and twisting the top limb off but most of the time a failure does not explode anyway so I would think you could shoot it but at some point it will probably fail.
i've always heard that longitudinal cracks along the sight window are caused by dry firing. May have been dry fired years ago, then the cracks were brought out by the heat.
If you'll be heartbroken if it breaks into 4 pieces, don't shoot it. If not, get a string for it and like Nathan said - shoot it. There is, of course, some risk involved in shooting it. The limbs could fail and hit you in the face, riser could break apart at full draw - so be careful.
Wear a baseball helmet or something, just be careful. :D
I agree with Fletcher-- longitudinal cracks in the fiberglass (even pretty long ones) are fairly common with older fiberglass laminated bows. Using Loctite 420 to bond/seal the stress cracks is a good suggestion-- I've done it on several older recurves, and they're all fine shooters. Loctite 420 can be hard to find in stores-- I ended up buying it off the big auction site. The reason you want something like Loctite 420 is because it's thinner than regular super-glue; it's thin enough to work deep into the cracks.
I think a reasonable substitute for the Loctite 420 might be "Hot Stuff" CA glue (available at Woodcraft stores). It's a woodworker's quality CA (cyanoacrylate-- like super-glue) glue that's available in 3 different viscosities-- you want the thinnest (watery-est) one. I haven't used Hot Stuff on bows, but I don't see why it wouldn't work the same as Loctite 420.
I think the bow's length (66") and draw weight (42#) make it more likely that the bow is salvageable; the long length and relatively low draw weight make for relatively lower stresses on the bow (as compared to a 56"-58" 55# hunting recurve).
Before proceeding, make sure there are no signs of delamination. I'm assuming the stress lines/cracks in the fiberglass (in your pics) are the only visible structural flaws.
If you decide to give it a go, be sure to use a bow stringer to string/unstring the bow, and definitely wear safety glasses at least until you've shot the bow 50-100 times with no issues.
Like Christopher posted above, you want to ease the bow back into use. Before trying to string the bow, look for excessive limb twist. WEARING SAFETY GLASSES, using the stringer, flex the limbs a few inches (listening for any bad sounds), then string the bow. With it strung, look for limb twist. Assuming the bow is pretty straight, I'd let it sit strung for at least an hour. Then gradually draw the bow slightly and let it down several times. Continue drawing the bow in stages-- a little further each time, several times at each stage. Once you've exercised the bow to full draw, go shoot some arrows. Hopefully she's a shooter.
I'll look closer at it tonight or tomorrow, and get some better pics. I didn't notice any cracks in the wood portions under the fiberglass....I grabbed it this morning from my parent's house and took the pics in my car at work after a quick once over.
I'll read up on the Loctite. It really doesn't have much sentimental value to me or my dad. My Dad bought it a long time ago, and never could get close enough to deer to use it....so it's never been used much. He never was big into hunting, just went out a few years before he had us kids running around. when I was a kid, I remember throwing around the arrows that I found with it, but I've never seen the bow until today. (also had an unmarked green fiberglass bow laying there too).
Thanks, I'll keep you guys posted.
Miles, did he by chance have any arrows with broadheads left over ?
ChuckC
There was one orange shaft arrow attached to the clamp-on arrow mount thingy. The feather fletchings were chewed or otherwise torn off.
Broadhead was a tad rusty, but still looked sharp as heck.
I'll take a pic of that too. Is there something I should be looking for on that?
wear safety glasses maybe a hardhat and let em fly theres only one real way to find out,,, or just ask a buddy to try it thats what buddys are for..
I've had a number of bows that have looked like that and you couldn't wear them out.
Post a picture of the broadhead when you have time and the crew can tell you some history on it, if it is a common head or if it is more collectible.
ChuckC
I have a Bear Alaskan with longitudinal cracks in the glass just like that. It already had them when I got it in 1977 and it has always shot just fine. Not afraid to string it and shoot it right now. My bow has black glass so it is not as dramatic looking as with the white glass. I think it is Ok to shoot as long as all other laminations look OK.
Yes, older bows with glass fibers running in one direction can develop cracks. However, because the bow was stored in an unheated space, it may have absorbed moisture through the old finish, or exposed to high heat. I would suggest contacting the Bow Hospital, or Rich Lopez (droptine) as both may be able to help.
I've worked on plenty of bows with cracks like that. Not a problem at all and I wouldn't hesitate to use it just like it is. But as Hud suggested, a complete refinish would bring some beauty back to that bow. A great old bow with a personal history to boot - that is a keeper! Those old Hoyts are gorgeous!
QuoteOriginally posted by jhk1:
I agree with Fletcher-- longitudinal cracks in the fiberglass (even pretty long ones) are fairly common with older fiberglass laminated bows. Using Loctite 420 to bond/seal the stress cracks is a good suggestion-- I've done it on several older recurves, and they're all fine shooters. Loctite 420 can be hard to find in stores-- I ended up buying it off the big auction site. The reason you want something like Loctite 420 is because it's thinner than regular super-glue; it's thin enough to work deep into the cracks.
I think a reasonable substitute for the Loctite 420 might be "Hot Stuff" CA glue (available at Woodcraft stores). It's a woodworker's quality CA (cyanoacrylate-- like super-glue) glue that's available in 3 different viscosities-- you want the thinnest (watery-est) one. I haven't used Hot Stuff on bows, but I don't see why it wouldn't work the same as Loctite 420.
I think the bow's length (66") and draw weight (42#) make it more likely that the bow is salvageable; the long length and relatively low draw weight make for relatively lower stresses on the bow (as compared to a 56"-58" 55# hunting recurve).
Before proceeding, make sure there are no signs of delamination. I'm assuming the stress lines/cracks in the fiberglass (in your pics) are the only visible structural flaws.
If you decide to give it a go, be sure to use a bow stringer to string/unstring the bow, and definitely wear safety glasses at least until you've shot the bow 50-100 times with no issues.
Like Christopher posted above, you want to ease the bow back into use. Before trying to string the bow, look for excessive limb twist. WEARING SAFETY GLASSES, using the stringer, flex the limbs a few inches (listening for any bad sounds), then string the bow. With it strung, look for limb twist. Assuming the bow is pretty straight, I'd let it sit strung for at least an hour. Then gradually draw the bow slightly and let it down several times. Continue drawing the bow in stages-- a little further each time, several times at each stage. Once you've exercised the bow to full draw, go shoot some arrows. Hopefully she's a shooter.
This is good info..... 2X to the letter
That bow will more than likely shoot forever.Longitudinal cracks like that are very common as was mentioned. I've shot many that were way worse than that.The dirt that accumulates in the cracks makes them look worse than they are. I have a friend that refinishes bows like that. he cleans out the cracks, fills them with 420 and refinishes them. They look and shoot great.
Is it worth finding out it was not safe ?
Thanks for all the responses.
I didn't have much time last night (had to keg a bunch of homebrew for Grouse Camp next week :) )
I did spend just a couple minutes looking more closely at the bow on my bench. The cracks seem to only be in the fiberglass. I can trace most of them to the end of the glass, and see clearly that none of those have the crack continuing into the wood.
I also noticed that on the tips, in a few small spots, the clear coat is sorta rubbed off to the wood lams. The wood looks just like unfinished wood (no obvious deterioration), but I'm not sure if that would be a problem.
I have a pretty mechanical-oriented brain, and to me, nothing stands out as a deal-breaker. The wood all the way around is sound, and there are no areas where anything is trying to de-laminate.
I'll get some better light set up and get pictures soon.
Thanks again,
Many of us who shoot old and collector bows have used way worse for years. Go with what Fletcher said. I'd put some finish on all the areas where wood is exposed.
I got a few better pictures yesterday afternoon (the overcast lighting makes the bow more reddish than the brown that it is).
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1743362_zpskx1gdqlv.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1743162_zpsnmezkaar.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1744132_zps6gbzoogi.jpg)
Hard to see, but the tips show no use wear at all.
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1744282_zpsmxo8uj7h.jpg)
This shows the crack in just the glass overlay.
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1745542_zpsntqscuhj.jpg)
Finish crackling...
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1747372_zpsvioacsgx.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1748242_zpsmog1zwkn.jpg)
And this one you can really see, but the finish on the wood laminates is cracked and rubbed off some (bare wood is exposed).
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_1749262_zpseinnnkr4.jpg)
And one of the whole shebang...
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141001_174259012_zps2ltoy4wg.jpg)
Here is that broadhead.
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141002_193032_zps4yis0iyf.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141002_193026_zpsw8vmhhs0.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141002_193022_zps1a6vbb1c.jpg)
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20141002_193017_zpses19qidb.jpg)
Wow, she's a beauty! I love the riser. Besides the cracking finish, it looks great. If everyone here seems to think it's ok to shoot, once you slowly break it in, I would definitely shoot it, and someday when you have some extra cash, send it off to be refinished, and it'll be a practically brand new bow.
QuoteOriginally posted by Wandering Archer:
Wow, she's a beauty! I love the riser. Besides the cracking finish, it looks great. If everyone here seems to think it's ok to shoot, once you slowly break it in, I would definitely shoot it, and someday when you have some extra cash, send it off to be refinished, and it'll be a practically brand new bow.
Thanks. I got the scoop from my dad about the bow. The story is, when he was a kid growing up in Waupaca County, wi, there was a guy from Illinois that would come up to the farm every year to hunt. When my dad was 10 (1963), before the guy left he gave my dad this bow (and the green fiberglass one).
Use eye and head protection if you string it and shoot it.
That is a beauty! The light cracks in the finish are just that- only in the finish and don't affect the structural integrity at all. The longitudinal cracks are very normal in the older bows. Those really are not bad ones from what I can see.
Any bow can fail at any time, including modern bows. Be careful at first of course, but I wouldn't worry a bit about using that bow regularly. It will most likely out live you. A complete refinish would be a great idea not only to make it look like new again but also to keep moisture from being able to penetrate into the wood below.
Well, it's been a long time coming....but I finally got out and shot this bow.
After getting a string last year for it, and slowly working it in (bow never even creeked)...and then leaving is strung for most of the winter and drawing it several times a day....I finally got some arrows made for it by Steve at Simply Traditional and they arrived last week.
Had a mild day yesterday so my Father-in-law and I got out to shoot (ha has a 60's Bear Kodiak).
This thing shoots awfully dang smooth! I didn't get any other pictures (too much fun shooting)...but here is after about 100 shots, after I called "OK, last two the black one is getting it."
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/20160306_142429_zpsetahkdd4.jpg)
This was 20 yds. Not bad for not having shot a bow since high school 15 years ago (and only joking around at that time anyway). We had another bigger foam target we were shooting mostly, not all were this close. But it's a start and I know that I can at least do it.
I think you did the right thing by not retiring the bow as I've had a number of them with cracks like that and I keep on shootin.
I agree with Possum. I bet that old gal felt good stretching her muscles and working again.
Looks like you are shooting it well also.
Congrats on your bow and hopefully great memories of your father.
Also as Whip stated earlier, if you really like the bow, it may be wise to have a refinish done. even if you wish to do it yourself. it will prevent moisture from getting into the wood.
QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
I agree with Possum. I bet that old gal felt good stretching her muscles and working again.
Looks like you are shooting it well also.
Congrats on your bow and hopefully great memories of your father.
Also as Whip stated earlier, if you really like the bow, it may be wise to have a refinish done. even if you wish to do it yourself. it will prevent moisture from getting into the wood.
I've been keeping a good layer of beeswax/mineral oil rub on her, and won't take her out in anything bu nice weather for now.
I'm working on a longbow build right now, so maybe when I'm ready to finish that on I'll sand this one down and spray both of them together.
Thanks.
p.s. - not all my shots were that close, but those felt really nice, especially as my official last 2 after getting whacked good on the forearm a couple shots beforehand! :D
Its not just taking them out in wet weather that will allow moisture. Humidity can do it too.
You should be ok with bees wax and oil rub.
QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
Its not just taking them out in wet weather that will allow moisture. Humidity can do it too.
You should be ok with bees wax and oil rub.
I was thinking about that last night while shooting. We are coming into our most humid time of year around here. Since we have a few days of poor rainy weather ahead, I sanded some of the worst chipping parts down a bit, hit it all with steel wool and then the first layer of tru-oil.
Not a permanent fix, but won't wear off as much as the beeswax/oil. Plan to put 3-4 coats on by the end of the weekend. Then still keep some beeswax/oil on it (habit I guess).
Worked out the brace height last night. Most consistent was at 7.3", but quietest and least felt vibration was at 7.125". What should I do with that? I dropped it back to 7.125" and shot about 60 arrows... Sure helped eliminate the arm slap too!
My son had fun "chootin' the box".
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj56/mlsthmpsn/Hunting/IMG_20160308_190154_zpswh4nsv3z.jpg)
I tend to get Arm slap with low brace heights. I would twist it up to where it shoots the best. Dont be afraid to go up into the 8's. Then work with silencers to quiet it down. Sometimes a change of string will help also. In that department it wouldnt hurt to talk with some of the string makers here.
Great Pictures of your son!
Glad it worked out for you. Have fun shooting it!
Bisch