I've been around tradgang for a while and really enjoy learning from this genuine group of hunters and archers. I can't understand why the success I see the members of this forum experience doesn't translate into someone creating a television show. It would be wonderful to have something out there that would show the other side of hunting and further the cause that we all so dearly love.
Quite frankly, I've become numb to what's on outdoor television and truly wish for something more.....or actually less!
Somebody needs to step up!
To have a tv show you need the big sponsors. The big archery sponsors generally make you use their top end wheel bows. Easton Bowhunting with Fred Eichler is a notable exception but he does occasionally shoot a compound bow top satisfy Hoyt. Lots of shows feature trad bows occasionally but it is unlikely anybody will focus on our niche.
On the flip side there are a number of high quality dvd's available. Bowhunting Reflections comes to mind. The Wensels have several enjoyable films. The content is just more marketable on home video.
There was Tred Barta, but most that watched it bitched about it, of course then he fell ill... I watch one every now and then called "Sasquatch the mountain Man" (or something close to that) and he uses a longbow now and again.
Probably for the same reason that other pastimes with a relatively small number of participants don't get sponsored TV shows. I have commented on a number of similar posts before and it's all recreation but the lure of watching someone else hunt with traditional archery, compounds, modern/primitive firearms, spears, land mines or strangulation is lost on me.
Marketability.
Follow the money. Most potential trad sponsors just don't have the budget to float a nationally syndicated trad focused tv show. Plus the average viewer needs to be able to identify with what's going on on camera and how it relates to the sponsored products...its one thing to watch some guy nail a deer at 50 yds with a wheelie and know you can go buy that bow and within a short period/ less than a day be shooting just like him VS say a trad show where a guy is shooting a fancy custom bow and the viewer realized he could buy said bow and then would need to practice on an almost daily basis for one to several seasons or more to make a bankable shot...situation like that wouldn't help sell a lot of bows to Joe Blow. You follow? People like the easy way of doing things. A national trad show would be a costly niche program that most average Americans would view as a curiosity, hate to say it. But I am hopeful.
MONEY !
TV is fake. I know a friend of mine who films and a lot is staged. I can't imagine having the pressure of making it up or "recreating". Not cool, not real. I can't watch any hunting shows without a lot of doubt about where they really might be and how much hunting is really done. "Here we are at wonkas deer factory where we cull any deer that won't make X score" or "this ground hasn't been hunted for ten years" etc.
I agree with what's already been said, but I too, feel that their needs to be more focus on hunting. Not just with trad bows, but hunting in general! It seems that all of the shows nowadays, only focus on the kill, and none of the preparation or skill that is involved in a successful hunt.
Sure, I like to see nice bucks, and that in some places, you can actually see or get a shot at one. But I don't need to see three booners killed, with less than perfect shots, in one half hour program.
I would like to see a series that follows a season with a traditional bowhunter. Where they go through the finer details of equipment set up, to stand placement. And I would be more than happy to see a days hunt, crammed into a half hour, even if they didn't harvest a "mature buck". There is so much more to a successful hunt than a kill, and that is one aspect that I believe needs to be better conveyed to everyone.
This is what happens when you are in the minority.
Plus, there would be little advertisement and who would want to watch a hunting show w/ 80% the show and 20% advertisements?
I would think a person like Clay Hayes would be the perfect representative for a traditional tv show... :dunno: Maybe Clay will see this and chime in?
Fred Eichler has a show called "Easton's Bowhunting" or sometimes just "Bowhunting". Can't remember which of the hunting channels it is on but many times he uses his recurve.
It would be cool if Martin or Bear sponsored one for their traditional line of bows.
I think it is about money.
We have 4 or 5 really nice and well attended traditional archery shoots in Michigan every summer and I think most would be shocked to learn that about 75% that attend hang their recurves/longbows up October first.
So maybe a lack of interest in watching. I know I would watch that kind of show but just refused to watch the shows that are on now.
We are not the hunting show demographic. Our people don't tend to jump on the latest bowhunting gadget, which is what the videos are intended to promote. Get the latest and greatest aid that will insure that you get your record-book buck.
When I was making arrow shafts, one famous traditional hunter who is regularly on TV was very interested in my shafts, and I traded him a dozen for one of his books at a show where our booths were adjacent. He told me he couldn't use them in public because Easton is his primary sponsor.
If we want to get on TV, we have to accessorize more. : )
I've wondered the same thing with all these shows popping up about outliers if you will. If Discovery, History Channel, Nat Geo ect did a special on a traditional or primitive bowyer I'll wager it wouold get good ratings. Kinda hard to make a series out of it though. My local newspaper (Spokesman-Review) ran a really cool article on Brackenbury bows last week. It's a large enough paper that upward of 100,000 people read it I would imagine. Stay tuned! With the ever-expanding variety of programming it will be a matter of time.
No money to be made.......Most of us use the same bow, arrows, and broadheads year after year. The same goes for our hunting clothes too. The compound guys if they dont buy a new bow tend to buy new rests, sights, releases, broadheads, arrows and scent block camo based on what they see on TV........
There are many fine sponsors, many here on trad gang, that could help support a trad show. I'm not talking about giving out hundreds of thousands of dollars here, I mean a few hundred bucks and maybe a dozen arrows, or article of clothing. If you get enough of the little guys support, you could at least cover the cost of making the show.
And let's not forget about some of the bigger companies as well. Sitka gear might be interested in a primary sponsorship. One of the big wigs there, is a traditional bowhunter. One of the scent elimination sprays, tree stand manufacturers, optics, etc. There are many products, that all, or most hunters utilize. Advertising is about getting your name out there, and the more it's seen, the more accepting of a product that people are.
And I don't know about the rest of you guys, but the hunting industry gets its fair share of my money every year. Lol
I really don't think it's that crazy of an idea. Traditional bowhunting is becoming more and more popular every year. It would most certainly need the right personality as a host though.
I thought about this forever. A real hunting show with real people. The show wouldn't need to focus on successful hunts but hunts in general. Episodes could include bow and equipment set up, trad archery rondevous, small game hunting, hunting spot set ups, still hunting, target competitions, history, shooting fundamentals, choosing the right bow, build alongs, animal behavior, trad archery shops, bow makers, true blue hunting camps etc. Here is a whole series of shows that most real outdoors people would be glued to. As far as sponsers go, there are many that are not even hunting related but regular necessities. I wrote Bear Archery about this topic but got no response. If I had the money, if my ship ever comes in, this is going to happen.
Not enough T&A or other outrageousness to get the big bucks sponsors.
The old Fred Bear videos were the best and timeless. For example; the one about hunting big bears in Alaska. The show included target practice, crow hunting, digging up clams on the beach, living on a boat as a camp, other wildlife encountered, weather endured in the region and bisic comaroderie with his hunting buddies. It was a silent movie with a narator. If any of you have seen this movie I would bet you couldn't take your eyes off of it. Am I right? You know I am.
I think you guys hit the nail on the head here. Most "hunting" shows today are geared toward being entertaining, and selling the latest and greatest gear available. I watch a few, but I'll tell you, I really miss the old "teaching" videos.
Warning: rant ahead
Very few (and I mean very few) shows today try to teach anything - I can only think of one that goes through the trouble of explaining where the hunt is taking place, the layout, why the deer/elk/moose/bear/whatever are moving in a specific pattern and the technique used.
Years ago, during the summer months, my father and I would rent 6-7 videos from the local archery shop and would binge watch them to avoid doing anything outside while it was hot... :) Anyway, the old videos would explain the hunt from beginning to end - where they were hunting, how, what movement was expected, what was learned, etc., etc., etc. We learned a TON from those videos, and would watch and re-watch them.
Now...forget it. It's all about "smoking" the buck that was on the "hit list" (oh, and you better have a cool name for each one), all while getting every sponsor under the sun mentioned as many times as possible...I swear half of the guys out there give the NASCAR guys a run for their money in getting sponsors mentioned.
All about entertainment, very little about teaching anything. Give me the old videos any day.
Okay, rant over. :)
Wow! Certainly a wide gap as to why, but quite the consensus that a Trad show would be a breath of fresh air.
When I hear the public "faces" of our sport say things like "smoke, shank, or crush" with regards to an animal it makes me cringe. I feel each time something like that is viewed by a person that does not hunt but is not opposed to hunting, it steers them to the other side. Those are the people we can't afford to lose!
Maybe someone will get the big picture and make a change.
Hunting shows are about Marketing, pure and simple...
These sponsors are paying for product placement...
Heck I remember seeing one of the videos running in a loop on the TV in an archery shop where every hunt had the hunter and the equipment used on the hunt...
BOW- XXXXX
Sight- XXXXX
Arrow-XXXXX
treestand- XXXXXX
Camo
Boots
so on and so forth... a list of products you need to buy to be able to hunt deer...
Reminded me of Nascar!!!
I know I see the truck from one of the local Hunting celebrities from GA... Kind of hard to miss it with the full wrap... But there again... Those shows are driven by sponsors looking to showcase their products...
To do a High end TV show, it probably cost upwards of $100K just for all those private ranch fees to hunt those all those unpressured critters...
I would welcome a back to basics hunting show...
It would probably have to be something like out of this forum...
TRADGANG TV - Real Hunts with Real people
I don't know who would fund such a show? I don't think there is $$$ in the industry to finance a production like these marketing shows...Maybe more of a reality type show from one of the big networks... With the skill level of the hunters and the diversity of game...
I think it could be done right... But I don't think there are the $$$ there to be a career in doing it... The consistency of production and the quality of filming would be hard to keep consistent...
Besides... It would be a lot of work... I wouldn't want to do it...I value escaping all that when I hit the woods
With some of the series I've seen make it past a pilot episode onto television's mainstage there should be a way to make it profitable,and not to intolerable for anti-hunters. I meana show about KISS and their fake football team? Come-on!! rat'
Have you noticed that most bow hunting shows on TV have no story line or substance for the adventure? For example where are the guys in camp shooting targets or sharing bow hunting stories. All I see is a bow hunters perched over a very green food plot shooting a deer with a name that was spotted using multiple trail cameras. Before and after the kill then comes the marketing campaign to let you know that you such and such product to be successful. I also like the Fred Bear shows where there was more of a story line than the actual kill footage.
Ron
The amount of work that would go into making a "quality" traditional bowhunting show would likely exceed the benefits. Someone that has plenty of money that isn't looking to get anything back would need to be the financial base of a project like this. Next, a hunter (or group of hunters) would need to donate their time to make something like this work.
So let's assume now we have a financial backing, and guys who will commit to doing this. Are these individuals capable of getting the footage (and type of quality footage) needed for a TV show? Some redneck with a handy cam isn't going to be marketable. I mean the right guy/guys who don't make all of us look pathetic in front of the rest of the world...and creatively filmed, edited, and brought to the public in a way that is nice to watch.
OK...so assuming we find this guy/guys/gal..whatever. Does this person/people even want to be a celebrity? Most Trad hunters are unlike the rest of the hunting public and don't want the attention.
Not trying to be a downer but instead a realist. I've done plenty of filming both solo and with a cameraman, and know how difficult it is to get what we're looking for here. Our effective shot distance greatly reduces out filmability, as well as our success rates.
Then we get to our shows marketability. All of us here would be more than happy to watch a program without a harvest at the end...but... does a TV broadcaster want a show of mostly leisure time with a bow in hand? I dunno!
As far as sponsors...Are there enough wealthy Trad companies to donate the amounts of money needed to produce a TV quality show? If so, be prepared for lots of advertising and commercials! Is there a financial backer who wants nothing in return...and a hunter/hunter that doesn't want compensation for all their time? And...in the end, do we all want a sub-par show as a representation of all of us?
Just some food for thought here....
Ron, you are correct. No substance for the adventure. Also with the Fred Bear films there was no advertising not even for Bear archery equipment. After watching those shows I felt like his hunts were something I could do.
Stickflingers, I don't think we would need a trad company for a sponser as there are so many products out there. What would be needed is someone who knows how to solicit a sponser. As far as getting good footage, I could take you to a place here in Michigan and get you in a position to get all the footage anyone could ask for. The show wouldn't need to be all about a hunt but rather digging deep into traditional archery. Like I said before, the show would consist of a wide scope of the traditional life. Bow fishing, build alongs, deer hunts, small game, archery shoots, bowyers, etc. All with informative structure and like Ron said " substance for adventure".
not enough people in our sport to make anything off advertising, plus we are probably the thriftiest of all sportsman, buying less and building more of our gear than any. So, bottom line..., money.
kill shot...that's exactly what I was saying in terms of a Trad company sponsor....it likely won't happen. And soliciting a sponsor means either promoting and advertising for the person backing you, or a silent investor like I mentioned.
It's all the other things I mentioned....especially the elements of time and quality. Are the camera people, hosts/hunters, editors, and helpers volunteering their time? And...is all this being done in the quality that TV demands nowadays?
Not saying this isn't achievable just provoking thought...
Randy, yes there is.
even with quallity "film in the can" you still need a sponser to buy the "air time" on the outhouse channel. If they dont think that 100,000 people watch every time the episode airs its not worth the money for them................ Just look at e endless hours of total crap on national networks every night.............
It can be done when you consider that Hoyt is in the trad game with the hunting recurves they make. I wouldn't care if they marketed the bows as long as the show was educational and fun to watch.
There are shows about bigfoot, ghosts, monsters, street gangs etc. I think what intrigues people is the adventure in this stuff. When I was a kid I would always watch Scooby Doo for this reason. I think adventure is what draws a crowd.
All good points. But why would you have to limit sponsorship to trad companies, or even the hunting industry for that matter? Red Bull sponsors extreme sports like mountain biking and cliff diving for gosh sakes! Traditional archery certainly has a larger following than cliff diving and is encompassed within the hunting industry which dwarfs anything they sponsor.
As far as someone not wanting to be a celebrity, the hosts of the existing shows edit solely to massage their ego, i.e. the opening of all the shows with the host standing with their arms crossed, face painted with war paint, and the menacing looks on their faces. You could edit more cinematically without all the "face time." That's the draw to the older, Fred Bear style movies, their movies!
Sponsorship can be from anyone...just have to deal with advertising or possible "product pushing". If thats the only financial way to make a show happen then so be it... viewers need to understand that it takes $$$ to make a show. That doesn't mean that there would be plenty of complainers about advertising.
I fully agree about the show being about the art/lifestyle of Trad bowhunting and not about the "face" of a particular hunter.
Pretty sure it's obvious here that everyone is wanting to see the same kinda show...an obvious demand! Hope someone runs with this. I would if I if didn't already have a career, hunting business, and a house full of young kids. Time is my excuse...yours?
truthfully. . . I really don't want someone following me everywhere I go. I like sneaking alone. Although it sounds neat to be a celebrity, I spent my whole life under some sort of deadline :readit: , with people on both sides second guessing what I am doing and why :knothead: :knothead: :banghead: . . Nah, someone else go for it. Besides, I wouldn't know how to handle all the ladies that would be all over me as a celebrity. :laughing:
ChuckC
Personally I wouldn't want to be associated with the hunting video industry these days. Bad company.
I don't know some of those survivor shows are mostly shot with the lil GOPRO cams... one strapped on the bow... another on a hat...
A lil better quality camera for around camp... Or footage for treestand hunts...
Maybe a visit with a bowyer... or a flint knapping episode or making arrows with a plane...or from rivercane...
It could be done... but it wouldn't be easy... Maybe a TradGang youtube channel.... It would be all about hits and views... It would just take a title sequence and an admin to create and admin the channel... take the videos from the Gang..
It could easily be a tech channel with how to's and such...
BEAR Archery would probably have the financial muscle to do it. And, I know Fred would approve.
Haven't watched a bowhunting show for a while so I thought I would try to watch one last week. Can't remember the name of the show but it was pathetic. They had a scene where the wheelie bow shooter put a shot on a buck where you could clearly see the arrow penetrated only about 10 inches cause you could see 2/3's of the arrow hanging out of where the arrow went in with the deer running off. Then after high-fiving everyone, the hunter starts tracking. He goes "here's my arrow! look all covered in blood. Double lung total pass through!" I was like are you kidding me? Do they think we are stupid! Sadly, I think the answer is - yes they do. Probably will be a long time before I try to watch one again - if ever.
Anyway - I am with Slasher. I think the best chance for a real hunting show would be a youtube channel or a webisode or even a podcast.
Steve, I know what you mean. Ever notice the shows where the sun is still high in the sky and when they find the deer it's dark and they say he only went about 30 yards.
I agree with Tom L, and Jon Stewart,It's all about the money, it's a business.
Supply and demand. More people hunt with compound bows, then traditional bows. Because it's easier for the beginner, average person, to,accurately hit a target, with very little effort. A compound, with, 60-85% let off, sights, arrow rest, stabilizer, peep site, etc.
There's a lot of companies making a lot of money, selling these parts. So they go where the money is.
Traditional archery, takes work, and practice, to become efficient. Most can't or don't want to put in the time.
The funny thing is, that after shooting , both, Tradbow and compound, I find that, I need less practice with trad gear, then I did when shooting compounds. I can go a month or more without shooting my bow, then grab it and some arrows, go in the back yard and hit the bullseye at 20yds 1st shot. I find it more natural.
If more people shot tradbows, we'd see more trad hunting shows.
My favorite hunting show now is Meat Eater with Steven Rinella. Not a bowhunting show specifically but I like the viewpoints and his incentive to hunt. He always shows respect for the animals hunted and shares a good bit of natural history. The last episode was a cooking special and he showed five different recipes for the hearts of five different game animals. It is the only show I know of that shows the entire process of the hunt from preparing for the hunt to meat on the dinner table.
I would be willing to bet that if there was a trad archery show there would be eventually more trad archers. Isn't that what we want? Mr moneybags, where are you?
Flingblade - I sent an email to Steven Rinella and asked him to film a traditional archery hunt. He just seems like a guys that enjoys the challenge and I could most certainly see him hunting with a traditional bow. I also enjoy his show.
Ron
it's already been said, but it's the truth. hunting shows are almost exclusively meant to be infomercials, whether the hosts want to admit it or not.
most of us make half our gear ourselves, and then use it forever or duct tape it back together until it literally falls apart. we are not the target demographic.
one show i do love, because it's much more than just kill shots and horn porn, is "Meat Eater" with Steven Rinella. he doesn't hunt with a trad bow (mostly gun), but he concentrates on all aspects of the hunt, including food preparation afterwards. great quality show!
edit - just saw how many of you guys appreciate "Meat Eater" as well. check out his books, too. he's a great writer!
You do see some of the TV hosts shoot trad occasionally.
What amazes me is that none of the "big name"guys make the switch to traditional. It's a market that is sorely under-represented. Especially the guys that could afford to, it's weird that they don't. When I was 4 years old I fished with a worm and bobber and it was fun, not so much at 40 something. The natural progression in bowhunting should be towards traditional, not shooting a wheel bow at deer at 60 yards!
If there can be fly-fishing tv shows(there are several) there can be a traditional bowhunting TV show.
It would take someone with their own money, connections, or a sponsor or two to step up and fund it.
If I win the lottery you'll be seeing my mug all over the TV:)(and no fake/staged hunts for me)
I'm telling you guys, everyone would be willing to watch it. Trad hunting brings out the adventure in everyone. And with todays economy it's a bargain hobby/sport. It will recruit people. You know yourselves it's fun. The camp life, the building of stuff, the preperation. Am I right? You know I am.
I'm now convinced that a Trad bowhunting show is a bad idea:)
A redneck with a handycam? Try to find a hunting show that doesn't have a redneck with a handycam, you'd be hard pressed.
This topic comes up every few months for a reason.
The same arguments for or against are stated(including mine). Most contain valid points.
With all due respect, I'm not sure the argument that it would be difficult is valid. WE LIKE DIFFICULT.
I've filmed over 80 short hunting and fishing videos, never made a dime from it and don't expect to. I do it because it's fun, and adds a new even more challenging element to my hunts.
Being an artist by profession, it's natural for me to document places and moments in time.
I'm not alone.
I know for a fact that people would watch it and we would get new converts to the "sport".
tarponnut, you are correct. Lots of people would watch it. And the ones that don't convert would still watch it. People that only gun hunt would watch it.
I'd rather surf youtube and watch Jim try to kill a rat under a hog feeder than watch another knucklehead kill a "shooter" whitetail. BORING!
A couple friends of mine are doing some filming for Mid West Whitetail. Charlie is going to be hunting with a recurve. You can follow them weekly. Every Friday is a new episode. This episode is about setting up his bow and the importance of a well tuned bow.
http://www.midwestwhitetail.com/gallery/169/media/5712/old-school-new-school.html
Ok guys. I started this thread a few days ago to get a true feel of what the general consensus would be from this group. I value the views and opinions from everyone here and the responses were what I was truly hoping to read.
There was ZERO negative bashing of anyone or anything and that's why I love this group. You guys are the most respectful bunch and I wanted to share a couple of teasers to get feedback from the Tradgang family.
My partner and I are working on a project called Lost Arrow. We are funding this initially out of our own pockets as to maintain the integrity of the project without being influenced by networks, sponsors, etc. Outside our close family and friends, no one has seen this.
I hope it is something that everyone here can get excited about because we are 100% committed to make this a reality.
http://vimeo.com/71052435
https://vimeo.com/100839107
Password is: lostarrow
After seeing tred Barta and what he brought to the game and then seeing Fred going to modern, I dont think I want to see anymore traditional guys on TV. Just leave me unmolested by whatever TV has to offer.
Give me Brothers of the bow on DVD anytime!.
J.B.,
Wow!!!! Amazing videos! Absolutely Fantastic! The production looks first class. I loved all the scenes but that last shot on the Africa video where a shot is put on a Kudu? and you can see the birds in the tree in the background just scatter, was absolutely breath taking! Man!
Keep up the good work!
I guess I'm more of Don's mindset, the hunting shows are nothing but advertising and I can't stand to watch them anymore. If I saw one more guy smile and say good shot after putting an arrow in the liver or gut I was going to be ill.
Your previews look great!
Top shelf! Fantastic. Can't wait to see more.
Awesome videos.....cant wait to see more!!!
Once in a while Remi Warren on Solo Hunter hunts with a recurve. Here is one of my favorites. Killing that size buck with anything is an accomplishment. I give him huge kudos to doing it while filming and with a trad bow.
http://vimeo.com/73790609
QuoteOriginally posted by bushwood:
My partner and I are working on a project called Lost Arrow.
Enjoyed your previews and would definitely be interested in seeing more. Great production values, the image quality alone puts most of the stuff out there to shame. Best of luck with your project.
Thanks guys for your kind words. We are working hard to get everything complete so we can take it to market.
We are currently packing gear and going through equipment tests for a Friday departure to Moose camp. Hopefully the gods of the hunt will smile upon our endeavor.
Thanks again!
Very well made videos! I just watched the first one and it was fantastic! If nothing else comes of it, at least you can release them on DVD yourself. I come from a fly fishing background and a lot of fly fishing films are released that way. I would certainly buy DVD's of your films. Great job and good luck!
Teaser is right! Lol. When do we get to see the full episodes?
Great teasers Bushwood! Can't wait to see the rest. I don't see why that couldn't go straight to network, as is.You really raised the bar!
I also enjoyed the Midwest whitetail episode. For someone new to trad or interested, that would be very helpful.
killinstuff, my shot on the rat rivals anything ever filmed by Fred Bear or others:)
I can hit a rat in the head at 12 yards but miss a 200# hog at 5:)
All well said about it being a money/sponsor issue....but what is very sad to me is that a traditional bowhunting show could actually be a real SHOW, not an infomercial. I was watching the old Fred Bear tapes last night. With modern cinematography and production those would be riveting TODAY.
And the Fred Bear films had sponsors, believe it....Apache Trailer, whatever airlines he flew for that trip...but it wasn't pounded into our faces as necessities of the hunt.
I would think the NRA would sponsor. Does anyone know how to even begin to start this undertakeing. I think it would take a number of people to do this. I couldn't quit my job to do this with no initial income. If I had the money I would have to dig deap to find out how to do this. Yes if I had the cash I would do it. It would take enough to live on until it actually happens. The show itself would have enough topics to keep rolling forever but when you watch one of those hunting shows and see the credits of who does what, dang.
We knew from the start that obtaining sponsors prior to filming would be difficult, if not impossible. With that in mind, we decided that to make this work we would have to do it on our own nickel, do it better, and make it tasteful.
Our mission is to portray the sickness we all suffer from in the same light that we see traditional archery, in its purest form. If we can translate the nostalgia, romance, excitement, etc that we all experience through film, we have done our job.
http://vimeo.com/71052435
https://vimeo.com/100839107
There actually have been several Trad shows but none of them lasted.
Country/Broadway singer Gary Morris had one and it was pretty good. I have one taped on a VHS tape somewhere.
Flip Pallot, saltwater fly fisher had segments where he hunted with his longbow and Byron Ferguson had a show too. It wasn't all traditional but a lot of it was.
Just not enough consumer dollars in it for the sponsors to be interested.
Bushwood. Your teaser looks great. I know its a big Hill but hope you make it to the Top. It looks as if you are doing well getting started up .
I cannot see the second link. asks for a password.
Password is: lostarrow
QuoteOriginally posted by bushwood:
Password is: lostarrow
man, who WOULDN"T want to watch that show?! completely awesome footage!