Hello all, got an elk hunt planned for CO in sept. hunt is up around 10,000ft. I've been training regularly and am in excellent condition. but...
aside from the usual issues due to thinner air has anyone had adverse complications or problems with existing medical conditions like athsma, allergies, arthritis, high blood pressure, etc? in other words, does the lack of oxygen make preexisting conditions better or worse or no real effect? I know its an odd question but Ive never been that high and altitude effects everyone differently.
Thanks
Last summer I went up to Grasshopper Ridge, where Howard Hill filmed iced up grasshoppers. I had to breath in a lot more than breath out. My knees and back hurt a lot,I got a headache, and I developed a problem with my inner ear,the world felt tilted. It is quite possible that blood pressure will increased with less oxygen.
Everyone is different.....I have high BP, arthritis, and coronary issues. I camped at 9,000 feet a few years ago, and hunted at 10,000 + with no issues. I kept hydrated and paced myself. Very important to get the best rest you can get every night. Pre hunt prep in very important as well. The only thing that changed was that I lost 10 pounds in a week on the hunt!......have fun!
I find flat landers at that altitude do not drink as much as they should. They do not feel thirty, but really need to drink a lot more than they think. Watch your urine-if it does not run clear, you need to drink more. Serously! If you are running and doing real cardio work you are ok on that end. Hidden defects are always a possibility so handle the knowns.
I live at 5800 and hunt at 8000, and I can tell the difference in how fast I tire (66 years old). It will take a guy in very good shape about two days to acclimate. Do not push too hard for the first day or two, drink a bunch, and if you feel dizzy sit down.
You, Sir, are in for a treat. Dawn at 10K is spectacular-every single day....
I find that electrolites are at least as important at 10k as they are here in the summer. Be sure to drink some as well as your water.
MAP
The only thing that my TX group experienced was a headache for a day or two.... If you are riding horses I highly recommend spending some time in the saddle before the trip. This will get your backside acclimated, and help to keep your mind in the middle on those steep trials.
Good advice already. If possible, try to acclimate a day or so at lower elevation, say 5,000 to 7,000 feet. It will cut down on headaches the first few days.
Can't overemphasize what Roadkill says about hydration. Dehydration sneaks up on you in the high country. Altitude alone causes dehydration and the dry air whisks away your perspiration quickly so that you do not realise how much you are losing. If you are a big coffee drinker (like me), start cutting back a couple weeks before you depart. The caffeine dehydrates you quickly. Don't go cold turkey when you get here, you will then have withdrawal headaches!
I can't speak to the preexisting conditions, etc.
A longtime hunting companion wears hearing aids. He has found that his batteries only last a few days at high elevations.
I live at 5600 and hunt from 8500 up to 10500 and it gets harder every year! Set a pace based on your a heart rate. A rate that is elevated, but one you are able to maintain for long periods. If you go by your breath rate, you will usually end up in oxygen debt before you realize it. A pace too fast will increase your dehydration rate and require more rest stops.
Had a similar situation some years back. Two buddies and I went to Colorado to hunt elk with muzzleloaders at 10,000 ft. We trained our butts off all summer and were in great shape. Still took several days to get acclimated. Lots of headaches and nose bleeds. The next time we went I had an ophthalmologist friend prescribe Diamox 125 mg to relieve pressure. It helped. Have fun and enjoy. Those Colorado night skys are like nothing we see in the east.
QuoteOriginally posted by md126:
... I've been training regularly and am in excellent condition. but...
Thanks
How old are you?
My advice is plan your hunts so that at the end of the day you are camping lower than you are hunting.
Not a big deal? This one little detail can make a huge difference in how fast you acclimate and helps avoid lots of problems that build up over several days when you camp same elevation or higher than you hunt. The night in camp at lower elevation gives your body time to adjust and rest from its new challenge.
Fit or not, you will be taxed at 10,000+ feet if you are covering ground, hunting hard physically just because of the altitude difference.
Plan your hunt to have hard days with easier days in between. You will be glad you did and in the end may even see more elk because it forces you to see a bigger hunt picture.
Joshua
I hunted between 9k and 10k in Colorado twice with very little adverse effects. I live at 2600' and could train up to 6200' so that probably helped some. I did have a shortness of breath but I just walked slow(when I walked) and took a break whenever I felt out of breath.
Drink lots of water, LOTS!
Spend some time on the stair climber and take it easy the first three days of the hunt and you should be good. If you feel flu like symptoms get to lower elevation.
Mike
Take Rolaids when you go up. It's in the kit of every high altitude search and rescue team and they give it to lost flatlanders for altitude sickness. I live at 9000 about (Florissant Co.) 1/2 the year and it helps with the headaches.
Running stairs is about as good an exercise as you can do. I get up to 30 min by the time I hit the woods hunting.
QuoteOriginally posted by nleroux2:
Take Rolaids when you go up. It's in the kit of every high altitude search and rescue team and they give it to lost flatlanders for altitude sickness. I live at 9000 about (Florissant Co.) 1/2 the year and it helps with the headaches.
Running stairs is about as good an exercise as you can do. I get up to 30 min by the time I hit the woods hunting.
What do the Rolaids do? Just curious as I've never heard of this before.
Hunted with my Dad and brothers at 9000-10000' several years ago. Dad has high BP and asthma and takes meds and was sure to bring his inhaler. His daily walks all year round proved beneficial and he had no issues. We spent the first day in camp basically just loafing around the immediate area to begin to acclimate, something we always do when heading to CO for skiing.
I kept the pace slow and steady during the week. If our lungs started to burn, we stopped for a few moments. I kept reminding him, "The turtle won the race."
I also carried two hydration bladders in my pack, one for me, one for him and we sipped regularly all day. Being from Wisconsin, we also like our beer, but rationed it to one a night! Alcohol and elk hunting don't mix and I can't think of a better way to put yourself in a world of hurt at elevation.
use to get terrible headaches started taking Diamox a few days before we go to Colorado elk hunting haven't had one since while hunting
I do use Diamox when I hunt above 7k. Most issue I have is with me surgically repaired knee side hilling. Push it too hard and can get a lot of swelling in the knee. Love hunting the mountains with the stick bow.
Can't agree more with Roadkill. Ditto on Rolaids.
Also. Being in shape and training below 5000 feet (or even AT 5000 feet) means you are NOT in shape "around 10,000". Get up to 10,000 at least 3-4 days early and stay there. Try...just try... to do your normal daily workout without passing out. Even jogging 3 strides across the road to avoid an oncoming car will put you out of breath!
I live at 1,000 feet above sea level but have hunted a good bit between 10,000 and up to 12,000 ft. While not an issue at home I have noticed that I get indigestion at altitude, so I typically carry an over the counter antacid to counteract that issue. Other than that, I train a lot and have also had good luck with Altitude Advantage on the past half dozen trips out west. While it might be that I train a lot harder now for climbing the mountains I have noticed a lot less soreness on my hunts after taking that herbal concoction.
If there is anyway you can swing it, go a few days early and stay at a higher elevation of 6,000 to 7,000 feet above MSL and go on several short walks or hikes each day to help get acclimated. I know it is extra vacation time if you are still working so may not be an option.
Also, I found that deep breathing exercises when I crawl into the tent at night seems to help lower my heart rate that first few nights. If you have any trouble with allergies, take a small bottle of your favorite nose spray to keep nasal passages open at night so you will breathe easier.
Ive had some gusher nosebleeds hunting elk from being dried out, I now take vicks and lightly coat the inside of my nose at night and it not only keeps nasal passages open but moist also, has really helped me. Also take your time as has been stated the first couple days to get acclimated, Im going into my 18th year hunting colorado and find (easing) into the hunt is the way to go, maybe spend the first morning glassing or in alot of cases ares where there are no other hunters.Dont forget the blister kit
It can be a lot drier air that high depending on the weather so sinuses can be problematic but that usually isn't an issue till later in the winter. An aspirin a day is a good idea, Tred Barta said that would of kept him from having the stroke he had which was caused by a blood clot.
A saline nasal spray is worth it's weight in gold! Single digit humidity comes as a hell of a shock if you're not used to it. Nosebleeds can be easily avoided with a nosey-huffer of salt water.
Drink water NOW. Start to hydrate yourself at a rate of at least 3 liters a day as soon as you can, well before you set off. It's much easier to stay hydrated than get hydrated.
There's an excellent article on Rokslide right now that goes into detail about this.
As has been mentioned, Diamox makes life so much more bearable above 7k!
Electrolytes are important, so take drink powders in your daypack. I have a 3 liter bladder + a 32oz Nalgene bottle. The bottle is for drink mixes, the bladder purely for water. You seriously cannot drink too much at that altitude.
I've spent a few weeks at over 10k & the first week of every trip is still miserable.
The one thing no-one has mentioned yet is sleep. The first few nights will suck, unless you're well prepared. Again, hydration & Diamox help a lot. You want to be waking up a couple of times to pee. If you're not, you'll be waking up every 2 hours trying to breathe & get back to sleep with a splitting headache.
Salt is also your friend. There's a reason that Mountain House use a ton of sodium ;) You will lose a tremendous amount through sweating & exhaling & it needs to be replaced. Eating salty snacks (with a LOT of water) will replace this. If you don't, it can lead to muscle cramps & headaches again.
I know I'm making it sound like it all sucks, all the time, but it really is amazing being up that high. You just need to be well prepared.
As far as pre-existing conditions go: I suffer from osteo-arthritis & I've found it actually improves when I've been out West. Whether it's the altitude or the excercise, I don't know but it hurts noticeably less. Allergies are a pig for me though. Different pollens & grasses than you're used to can affect you more than the stuff at home.
I spent alot of time snowmobiling at 12k-14k as a flat lander in michigan going out west for week trips (usually 5-6 times a year).
As mentioned hydration is huge. you must drink alot of water. watch your pee, if it has any color drink more water. Motrin helps with the head aches (not many of us got bad head aches).
Sleeping at 10k and up is hard with the thin air. a little shot of nyquil helped when needed.
Also keep in mind a good rule is all excursion is doubled. Travel time when walking is doubled, time to skin and qtr doubled, etc. Everything takes longer as you have to move slower.
Also keep in mind storms build instantly that high up and have little warning. make sure you have all your preps and gear in order. The terrain is tough, the air is thin, and everything is harder.
That being said you will have the time of your life. I've probably done 20-25 trips from mich to rockies in the last 5 years with all of them being over 10k the whole time. Some of the most amazing scenery and views I have ever seen.
I am 75 years old & have hunted colorado all my life.I noticed now that it takes my body 4 days to start feeling better.And I drink gatoraid non stop while i'm there!
Thanks for the info and replies. real great stuff. im 44 & put off a trip like this for a long time. we're prepping as best we can and really looking forward to it.
A lot of great info here. The posts about staying hydrated and acclimating yourself at an altitude a few thousand feet lower than your hunting elevation are very important. I have seen 3 cases of altitude sickness and believe me it can be very serious. If you are too sick to hunt, get yourself to a lower elevation in a hurry. I have a fiend that lives at 7000 feet. He vacationed a couple weeks at low altitude and went snowmobiling up to 12,000 feet when he returned home. He got altitude sickness and spent the next 3 weeks in the hospital and most of that time in intensive care. He was 26 years old and in great shape so it can happen to anybody.
For 20 years I lived at 1,000' and hunted elk between 10,000 &12,000. I have read that it takes 3 days to acclimate to 7,500' and then you can acclimate 1,500' per day. That's probably a military study done on 18 year olds. I have also read that it takes around 60 days to athletically acclimate meaning, being able to preform at a high altitude as well as you can at your home altitude. Being in the best cardio shape will help you but, it takes time for your body to acclimate. For me the most important thing is leg strength. Get those leg muscles in condition! Get in the best shape you can without hurting yourself! Drink lots of water. I use a camelback and sip all day. I tend to leave a water bottle in my pack and not drink but, a camelback is easy. I now live at 7,000' and still notice that it takes 24 to 48 hours to acclimate to 10,000'. Had an Air Force fighter pilot get altitude sickness a few years ago. It can happen to anyone and it's serious.
So if all the flatlanders have a problem with thin air in higher altitudes, does than mean the guys that live higher blow up like balloons when they come to the flatlands? LOL
No, stack - it's the opposite... the flatlanders are the ones that risk blowing up when they reach the high altitudes! You should see the bags of snacks in the grocery stores that were made in the lower elevations and shipped here to Colorado... they look like balloons ready to pop!
Some people are much more affected than others. I would try to adjust to the altitude for a couple of days at least before exerting yourself. "They" say it actually takes a couple of months to get completely acclimated... your body makes more red blood cells to compensate for the lack of oxygen. A little over a year ago, I moved from 300 ft. in PA to 7,000 ft here in CO (and I'm on the plains!). I'm 60 years old and I can go up to 12,000 now and not feel much of an affect, but over 12k - then I feel it if I exert myself or even bend over!
As said by others, keeping hydrated is the best advice. Just because you don't think you're sweating (you actually are, but it evaporates instantly) and you may not feel thirsty, you need water. Carrying a bottle of water with you is a way of life here.
Enjoy your hunt! Colorado is beautiful!
There is another aspect I forgot to mention. Foot wear. A narrow toebox tends to give really sore feet-no matter how well broken in the boot was, because of the downhills. The weight of the pack and the constant "down" pushes toes into contorted shapes causing blisters. and worse. Side hills are hard onall joints, especially with a pack. Boots twist and the resulting torque causes blisters on the side of the feet. At the Marine Corps Mountain Warfare Training Center we monitored thousands of students in the various courses. I checked our hospital daily to determine the casuality count and the most frequent admissions were dehydration and infected feet.
there are some serious suggestions on this thread.