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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: DanielB89 on June 18, 2014, 03:36:00 PM

Title: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: DanielB89 on June 18, 2014, 03:36:00 PM
I got a new batch of woodies in, all spined from to 64-67.  I shot 2 of two bareshafts that had 125 grain tips on them and both of them cracked on the second shot.  One looks like banana now.

Anyone have any idea why this would have happened?
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Zradix on June 18, 2014, 03:58:00 PM
maybe way under or over spined.

if they hit at quite an angle in the target they can break.

possible they could be crappy shafts too.
what type are they?

Did ya orient the grain correctly to the nock?
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Biathlonman on June 18, 2014, 04:10:00 PM
Put feathers on them and shoot field points and broadheads to tune.  I've mostly had similar results with bare shafting wood.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: darin putman on June 18, 2014, 04:11:00 PM
Bareshafting woodies can be tough, broke a lot of them trying to tune. They can handle a little cant going into target but not a lot. They tend to snap if entry angle is too sharp, seems as though spine must be kind of close to start with. Problem didn't seem to be as bad once I found surewood shafts, they too will snap but not as easily as what I started off with. On a side note I also warped a lot of aluminum arrows doing the same thing.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Prairie Drifter on June 18, 2014, 04:11:00 PM
It happens. That's why you don't bareshaft wood.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Bud B. on June 18, 2014, 04:16:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by Prairie Drifter:
It happens. That's why you don't bareshaft wood.
My conclusions too. Fletch and tune with feathers on.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: gringol on June 18, 2014, 04:18:00 PM
What are you shooting?

Sounds like under spined to me.  Don't bareshaft wood if you aren't prepared to lose a few.  Personally, I don't like bareshaftingwood at all.  I prefer just comparing field points to bhs.  It isn't the only way, but it works for me.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Bjorn on June 18, 2014, 05:12:00 PM
I only shoot wood. Wood generally breaks when bareshafting because you are underspined by 15# or more. I'm sure it could happen severely overspined too; but I have never had that.
There is a formula that I use and it works every time-then I bareshaft just because I love to see what is going on.
The formula can be found on the 'net-Morrison and A&H may still have it on their sites and it has been posted and discussed here many times-do a search if you are interested. At the cost of good wood there is no need to waste shafts for no return.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: JRY309 on June 18, 2014, 05:32:00 PM
When I shot wood only when I first started I bareshafted them all the time.I only broke a couple when I was way underspined.I started bareshafting wood after I shot a 3D course in the rain when the feathers got matted down.You could see then how good your spine was.So I started to bareshaft them to get closer in spine.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: jackdaw on June 18, 2014, 09:22:00 PM
Not trying to hijack this thread, but what would spibe do you guys like? I try to go 10 to 15 grains over the weight of my bow...i.e. ....60#-65# spine arrow in my 47#-50# bows.I generally shoot 125-150 bh's and field points. Works good every time..
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Slickhead on June 18, 2014, 09:38:00 PM
when bareshaft wood start close
Work back a little at a time

Learned this the hard way!
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: rraming on June 18, 2014, 09:56:00 PM
Start close to the target and then more back, don't start over 13 yards.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: DanielB89 on June 18, 2014, 11:44:00 PM
I am shoot a longbow I made that is 66" and 51@28. These are POC shafts that are all slimed from 64-67. They were showing very weak. And I'm ticked they cracked. Had no idea that would have happened or I wouldn't have done it
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: gringol on June 19, 2014, 06:49:00 AM
Daniel, I have a 56# longbow that like 85# woodies.  I'm guessing you are probably in the same range.  If i forgo the bareshafting, I can get away with 70-75 and I'm not good enough to shoot the difference...
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: BAK on June 19, 2014, 09:02:00 AM
I used to shoot a lot more woods than I do now.  I did bare shaft them but you must start close up if you are not in the ballpark.  As you zero in you can move back.  I had shafts that flew true out to 50 yards doing this.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: SCATTERSHOT on June 19, 2014, 10:07:00 AM
A longbow by nature is not center cut like a recurve. My guess is that those shafts a re way overspined for your bow. If you do indeed draw 28" (measure it to be sure) try a couple of shafts spined 40-45#.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: DanielB89 on June 19, 2014, 11:43:00 AM
These arrows were way under spined according to the bare shaft tuning.  My longbow is cut back to center but now past.    

The first time I had ever shot wood arrows was a couple months ago at an archery shoot that I actually managed to win(341/400).  All the arrows I shot were around #65 spined(the guy had written each arrows spine on the arrow).
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Todd Cook on June 19, 2014, 11:58:00 AM
I don't bare shaft wood. I run the calculations to try and start close to the correct spine. Then, shoot fletched arrows to tune, then broadheads to fine tune. A broadhead usually won't fly if it's far off.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: Fletcher on June 19, 2014, 01:00:00 PM
That's why I paper tune fletched arrows with my woods.  It is easy to see just what the arrow is doing and doesn't seem to be quite as sensitive to form /release issues as bareshafting.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: SELFBOW19953 on June 19, 2014, 01:17:00 PM
If I'm not mistaken, wood shafts are spined for a 125 gr point, heavier points need higher spines.  You're shooting a 125 gr point out of a 51# bow, so maybe 50-55 would be closer to the proper spine for you, or maybe 55-60 depending on their length.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: gringol on June 19, 2014, 01:24:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by DanielB89:
These arrows were way under spined according to the bare shaft tuning.  My longbow is cut back to center but now past.    

The first time I had ever shot wood arrows was a couple months ago at an archery shoot that I actually managed to win(341/400).  All the arrows I shot were around #65 spined(the guy had written each arrows spine on the arrow).
If those arrows group together with field points and bhs, you are already tuned.  Just copy those arrows.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: on June 19, 2014, 01:25:00 PM
I saw this thread and got curious, so I picked two bare 50 pound spine shafts,cut them to 27" bop, 145 point, loaded up two 51 pound Robertsons, my yew and my  Morningstar.  Both tapered cedars flew out of all four bows at 18 yards at my 26" draw, they had a little bit of action when I stretched to 27".  What am I looking for?
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: highPlains on June 19, 2014, 02:37:00 PM
You can absolutely bare shaft wood arrows. Most of the time they crack because they hit the target at too great of an angle. Be sure to shoot into something soft, like an old pillow or a loosely filled burlap sack. The closer you are to the correct spine the less chance you'll have of breaking an arrow, but shooting into a hard target with an arrow at even a slight angle is a little risky.

Good luck!
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: on June 19, 2014, 04:51:00 PM
So then Tom, since my tapered cedars flew pretty much straight, they must be the correct spine and my four bows must be pretty much tuned to them.  I just tried a bare 65-70 with 160 up front out of one of those bows, there was no need to try a second shot
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: arrow flynn on June 22, 2014, 07:07:00 PM
49 lb Morningstar 50 55 woods cut to 28.5 draw length 27.5 160 gr upfront fly great.
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: on June 22, 2014, 08:43:00 PM
I can fix your problem with wood arrows Daniel............Oh nevermind, if your are mad about breaking two them, then I am pretty sure you will not like my solution (it involves fire)!    :campfire:  

Bisch
Title: Re: Bare shafting woodies.. ran into problem
Post by: AkDan on June 23, 2014, 04:05:00 AM
I agree with BAK....start close!  hard targets can also reak havoc.   but once you're on you can move back.  Best I could pull off was 30, they shot well and consistent.   There's bow tuning and shooter tuning, when those meet you'll be pinging bare shafts well!  So to say those were crap shafts?  possible but way down the list of likely's.

You mentioned arrows that flew well were marked...did you by chance change ANYTHING!  diameter, paint, tapered vs un tapered? strings? anything in your shooting?

It sounds like you shoot well enough you should be able to zero in on this pretty fast.

Forgot to add...

early on when I started building arrows for others...I found (along with bowyers and scales being off), not all spine testors were created equal.  It reaked havoc for awhile with a couple of guys. I ended up buying my own spine tester and testing everything myself, both what they brought in, and what I was sending out.  There's just no way to get consistent without it, OR you buy arrows from one person and no one else!  So what was thought to be X spine turned out to be something else!  just something to ponder.   It should not be this way...but I can garuntee you it is!