I have been looking everywhere for such an arrow, as I have a 25" draw and the weight is between 40-45 at 28". I am shooting a eglish logbow so need a gpi of 8 gpi or greater.
The heaviest I have found is Easton apollo at
spine gpi
670 7.7
610 8.1
560 8.4
I am trying all three and would like to hear of other possible models worth trying.
I have also ordered Beman Hunter Junior, which also seem heavy, but there are conflicting reports on the actually spine... Its either 500 or 650 spine.
I am sick of my wooden arrows breakig so easy so wish to give carbon a go. I know that this sounds stupid for someone shooting an english longbow, but patience has goe with wooden arrows
Thanks for your suggestions.
Alex
Try to locate some Beman MFX classic 600s. They've been discontinued but sometimes they can be found. Can't remember what gpi but also look at Beman Centershot 600s.
Have you tried Surewood Douglas Fir? Tough wood with heavier weight.
You can also use weight tubes. Yes Doug fir is good stuff.
QuoteOriginally posted by dragonheart:
Have you tried Surewood Douglas Fir? Tough wood with heavier weight.
No, I haven't. I have tried cedar and spruce(I think). Cedar were a bit tougher...
I would like to give carbon a go... If these break, then maybe I should improve my shooting.. :)
Cheers
Alex
You can always use weight tubes to add up to 8gpi to any carbon arrow without affecting spine. Get them from 3 Rivers.
QuoteOriginally posted by nineworlds9:
Try to locate some Beman MFX classic 600s. They've been discontinued but sometimes they can be found. Can't remember what gpi but also look at Beman Centershot 600s.
I will look into those two. Thanks for the advice.
The selection of carbo bows is so wide. I tried GT Trads 1535, but even these were too stiff whilst bare shafting. I don't understand that, but such is life...
Cheers
Alex
ALex
QuoteOriginally posted by nineworlds9:
You can also use weight tubes. Yes Doug fir is good stuff.
Weight tubes ???Never heard of them, but the again I have oly been shooting for a few months... I will google these. I am pleased that they do not change the spine of the arrow. this is very importnat for my low draw weight.
Cheers
Alex
I'm a little confused, do you mean 8 grs per pound of bow weight(gpp)?
Carbon express heritage 90's weigh 9.7gpi and spine .598
hello, i have a similar situation, i only draw 24" and shoot a 45#@24" elb, i ended up using gt traditional 15/35 with 100g brass inserts and 125g points cut to 27 1/2", they fly very nice and weight about 470g,
The good thing about the Gold tip arrows is the brass weights that you can screw in to the back of the inserts. I use the 50 gr. ones and just keep adding till the arrow is spined right for the bow....that is if they start out to stiff, adds a ton of weight over all, and puts it where you want it, up front!
QuoteOriginally posted by Prairie Drifter:
I'm a little confused, do you mean 8 grs per pound of bow weight(gpp)?
I mean 8 grains per inch (gpi). They come in 3, 5, and 8 gpi. Check out the video:
weight tubes (http://www.3riversarchery.com/3Rivers+Arrow+Weight+Tubes_i6731X_baseitem.html)
X 2 for Carbon Express Heritage. They seem to have the heaviest gpi, which means you don't need all of your weight up front.
CX Heritage 90 or 75 heaviest GPI in that low of a shaft spine I've come across. Though I don't find them to be much stronger to impacts (mushrooming the front end) than when I shot cedar arrows. A much tougher arrow to look at is the Arrow Dynamic Trad extra light. I don't know it's spine but I bet it would work for you, based on the fact that I can use either trads or trad lights on my 60 lb bows.
Seems to me a 1916 aluminum would be worth considering...carbon is not your only other choice
DDave
QuoteOriginally posted by Paul_R:
QuoteOriginally posted by Prairie Drifter:
I'm a little confused, do you mean 8 grs per pound of bow weight(gpp)?
I mean 8 grains per inch (gpi). They come in 3, 5, and 8 gpi. Check out the video:
weight tubes (http://www.3riversarchery.com/3Rivers+Arrow+Weight+Tubes_i6731X_baseitem.html) [/b]
Paul, I was referring to the OP. I know about the tubes, I use them.
Oh sorry PD I wasn't sure.
QuoteOriginally posted by Prairie Drifter:
[qb] I'm a little confused, do you mean 8 grs per pound of bow weight(gpp)?
Sorry, I did not make myself clear. I meant gpi. Using the 8 grains per pound of draw weight, I need about 320 grains total weight. Which minus 80 grains for tip is 250 grains. For an arrow at 26", this works out at about 9 grns per inch of arrow. this is not possible to find in the higher spines (eg 600), but I would like something near.
Thanks
ALex
Well, your shooting less than 35 pounds at your draw. There is no way a .600 spine arrow at 26" w/ only a 80gr point will spine correctly. That arrow will be way stiff. I can shoot a .600 spine at 27" for up to 50lbs and need at minimum 150grs of tip weight. This is from bows with the shelf cut just before center.
Thanks PD,
I don't mind getting 150 grain tips.
What spine arrow would you suggest, keeping in mind the required weight.
Thanks
ALex
As previously mentioned Carbon Express Heritage 75 are the heaviest carbon shaft in the 600 spine area and will shoot very well if left at 28" long or longer.
I think you'll have to leave the arrows longer than 26". It's still gonna be tough, getting the weight you want. Lighter spined shafts can only use nib points, which leaves the arrows too light, and heavier spined arrows get way above the weight you want when paired w/ points heavy enough to make them spine right for your bow.
Thank you...
So it seems that my requirements are not reasonable...Atleast for carbons. I have ordered them now and will see how they bare shaft.
I guess the reality is to keep using wood in 30/25 spine and learn how to fix them... :)
In my next order I shall try Carbon Express Heritage 75
Thanks everyone for your advice.... I thought I was being a fool with the trouble I was having... It seems not..
Alex
Alex, I may not understand your requirement correctly, but if you need "max grains per inch" on a fairly light bow, why not just use an appropriately spined shaft of ash or hickory? They are a LOT harder to break than cedar or spruce, give you a plenty-heavy finished arrow, and you are probably already all set up to make wooden arrows, anyway....
I apologize if I've completely missed the point of your post.
Dear Owlmagnet,
Thank you for your considered reply.
I basically lost my patiece with woode arrows after buying another 6 wooden arrows (30-35 spine)and breaking 5 in two weeks. This was the final straw and I was determined to buy some carbon arrows which are wood replacements. The main problem has been finding any with both the high weight and a soft enough spine.
My Beman Hunter Junior arrived today and they seem a good starting point.
However, the Easton Apollo arrived too and these are definitely not a wood replacement arrow. They are incredibly thin. This is a shame, as I had high hopes for them.
I have only beign doiig archery for 6 months and do not have any arrow making or fixing equipmet. I was hoping to avoid that, but it looks like I might have to go back to wood, becuase of the light draw weight ad short draw that I have.
I shall look at Ash and Hickory, as spruce and cedar were not great.
Thanks
ALex
"However, the Easton Apollo arrived too and these are definitely not a wood replacement arrow. They are incredibly thin. This is a shame, as I had high hopes for them."
I don't see why this is automatically a bad thing. Being of smaller diameter, they will rest closer to center, allowing a slightly stiffer dynamic spine for the same bow. I think if you want to try carbons, you will have to throw away all of your wood arrow conceptions and learn to "think carbon".
Carbons are far more sensitive to length than woodies and if you leave them a little longer than you would normally, I think you will find them quite adaptable without going to boat anchor weight points. The closer to center; the less sensitive they will be.
The Beman hunter Junior come with Vanes....
They hurt abit, shooting off hand or is it just me?
Try easton 1820s that they use for schools.........592 deflection and about 350gr for 29" shaft. Also pretty inexpensive compared to carbons...............
Alex, my thanks for your gracious reply. I don't know very much about carbon and aluminum shafts, although I have used them from time to time. That said, you really have to remove the plastic vanes off your arrows and fletch them with feathers if you are going to shoot them off of your hand. No, it isnt just you! That would hurt anyone.... Most traditional archers would not shoot plastic vanes off of an arrow shelf, either. A raised arrow rest, perhaps, but not the shelf, or hand.
I have shot a lot of spruce and cedar--and I can be pretty tough on shafts, as well. I shoot a lot of ash. They are heavier, but they are much more difficult to destroy. Since your bow is very light, the earlier suggestion to try Douglas Fir is a good one. They tend to be a bit lighter than ash, and generally require less effort to keep them straight.
I noticed that you live in Germany. Have you tried a European wood like "Norway Pine"? I've had pretty good luck with that wood, and noticed it was quite popular at some 3-D shoots I attended in your country, (back when I was the "token American" member of the Sindelfingen Feldsbogen Scheutzen, many years ago).
Good luck to you. Don't get discouraged. It will all sort out. Weidmann's heil! (Bob Wilson)
Hey Bob, your talking about my old stomping grounds too. Couple of the many places I lived in Germany were Weil im Schoenbuch and Boeblingen. Was a member of the Weil im Schoenbuch Scheutzenverein for many years, but shot pistol back then instead of bow. Got my first German hunting license back in 1971 :)
Did you work at Patch Barracks by any chance?
Ron
QuoteOriginally posted by Prairie Drifter:
Carbon express heritage 90's weigh 9.7gpi and spine .598
Agreed on the CE 90's.
I shoot them and they are fantastic from my 50lb bows. Mine are 29" long.
QuoteOriginally posted by Owlmagnet:
Alex, my thanks for your gracious reply. I don't know very much about carbon and aluminum shafts, although I have used them from time to time. That said, you really have to remove the plastic vanes off your arrows and fletch them with feathers if you are going to shoot them off of your hand. No, it isnt just you! That would hurt anyone.... Most traditional archers would not shoot plastic vanes off of an arrow shelf, either. A raised arrow rest, perhaps, but not the shelf, or hand.
I have shot a lot of spruce and cedar--and I can be pretty tough on shafts, as well. I shoot a lot of ash. They are heavier, but they are much more difficult to destroy. Since your bow is very light, the earlier suggestion to try Douglas Fir is a good one. They tend to be a bit lighter than ash, and generally require less effort to keep them straight.
I noticed that you live in Germany. Have you tried a European wood like "Norway Pine"? I've had pretty good luck with that wood, and noticed it was quite popular at some 3-D shoots I attended in your country, (back when I was the "token American" member of the Sindelfingen Feldsbogen Scheutzen, many years ago).
Good luck to you. Don't get discouraged. It will all sort out. Weidmann's heil! (Bob Wilson)
Dear Bob,
Thank you, there is lots of information there!
I think I must remove the rubber vanes so will have to buy a fletcher. The EZ fletcher looks to be a good match to my attention span. :) Though having trouble finding any in Europe. Since I will the have a fletcher, I guess I may aswell start making my own arrows.
On your suggestion, I have tried looking for Ash here, but no real luck. I will try Douglas Fir and the Norway spruce.
It is interesting to hear that you have been in Germany. However,I don't think you will have been stationed where I live, unless you worked for the other sides. :) I am not far from Point Alpha.
Cheers
Alex
Alex, I promise you will seldom regret the ability to craft your own arrows. I think you will like the Norway spruce.
No, I doubt that I was ever in your part of the country, but I doubt, also, that I was the only American who was deeply moved, the day the wall came down....
I never tried the EZ fletcher. I am still using a bitzenberger I purchased in 1973. (I doubt I will ever wear it out. If you ever get one, I recommend you take it apart for cleaning and lubrication at LEAST once, every 25 years!)
Do you have friends who are traditional archers? If you can find some, I would not be surprised if one would not be happy to help you get started making your own arrows. Someday, you will teach a newcomer to the sport, the same thing. That is how it works!
Best of luck,
Bob
I had an EZ Fletch and hated it, flimsy and sloppy. And it's nearly impossible to do just one fletch as is sometimes required, especially when you're first learning.
Bladepeek, Yup! I lived at Patch and shot a ton of arrows on a course just outside Panzer Kaserne. My German archery buddies were hardcore archers, if not hunters. When one asked me if bows and arrows were "really" effective on game, I took'em home and we watched, "Bowhunting October Whitetails", among others. Man, did they get pumped! (One guy put down his compound and ordered a Black Widow!)
I got my hunting license in the mid-90's and was fortunate enough to enjoy quite a bit of hunting, (with a rifle, of course). Customs and traditions were different, but it was taken very seriously, and I respected their approach--particularly about the way they deeply repected the animal, itself. Hunting "correctly" was not a means to an end, it was an end in itself. At the end of my first season, I was inducted into an eight-hundred year-old Guild of Hunters, another amazing cultural ritual I was deeply honored to be a part of.
Thanks for evoking some fond memories....
Owlmagnet, my pleasure. It took me back through some fond memories too. I don't want to hijack this thread too badly, so I will e-mail you some pics that may bring back some more memories.
Ron
QuoteOriginally posted by Bladepeek:
Owlmagnet, my pleasure. It took me back through some fond memories too. I don't want to hijack this thread too badly, so I will e-mail you some pics that may bring back some more memories.
Ron
Its no problem, I have all the answers I need from the thread and its now taken an interesting direction..Post them here by all means
Cheers
Alex