Here is the graphic of where we are going with this thing.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/30krays.jpg)
Now the update.
It has taken 4 tries for the tool and die maker to build the die for the farrel piece. The blade was no problem. They nailed it on the first try but the farrel die has really been a bear!
A couple of weeks ago I get the call. "We have some new samples for you to come and look at." "I think we have it correct this time."They did.Its correct and making good parts. :jumper:
The die gets loaded into the press to punch out some parts and finally get this thing moving. All goes well with the blade die. Next comes the farrel die. The farrel die punches good parts but it is a nightmare to get the steel to feed.The tool and die makers are trying to sort the feed issues out now. Oh the joys of a new product.
I always expect headaches with anything new. I did not expect to be so far behind on this one though.
WE WILL GET IT SORTED OUT. Its just taking longer than expected.
Bill
Will there be a gluer on?
They will be glue on. The insert in the picture is just for illustration.Notice its an aluminum insert. Maybe the picture should have been left without the insert.
Bill
Good things come to those who wait, Bill! This is going to be a slick broadhead for sure.
Hang in there Bill. As you have found out this is as much art as it is science. Good luck with the rest of the project. I can imagine that the assembly fixtures aren't a piece of cake either.
dats what i'm talkin bout! i love your grizzly single bevel but love the ease of field sharpening a 3 blade.
Looks good and after meeting you this weekend I see your passion for perfection.
I'll be watching these. They are the weight I shoot.
Gosh Bill that looks like a strong design! Looking forward to trying some of those.
Harry
Looking forward too...
Are those the final specs, 175 grain, 1 1/8" diameter?
And what length?
looks to me like the boradhead will fit nicely over the shaft slightly..... very cool
Looks good
Looking good!
Looking forward to seeing the finished product. These look just plain nasty !!! :thumbsup:
Bill
Thanks guys. We will get it. Its just taking longer than I expected. I wanted to keep everyone in the loop on this project and tradgang is the best way I know how to do it. I often get questions about this head.
The over all dimensions will be the same as the Grizzly. 2 3/4"long and 1 1/8" cut.
Bill
The die maker called today. They seem to have the feed issue sorted out. They ran off enough parts for a few hundred heads and seemed to be going well. I CAN NOW MOVE FORWARD WITH FINISHING THE ASSEMBLY FIXTURES AND GRINDERS! :jumper: :jumper: :jumper:
Good news. I can not wait to get my hands on some. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Great news!!
This looks like a home run ball on its way out of the park!
I LOVE the looks of this head - no doubt the frustrations of getting it right will pay off in the long run. It's good you are getting the production bugs ironed out because I think it is going to keep you really busy Bill!
I'm really looking forward to trying some of these heads. Thanks for the updates Bill.
Good, cause I wanted to see what these could do "THIS" fall. :D
Looks very nice - good weight and dimensions.
Who needs an S shaped cut when you can have a 3 blade cut. :archer2:
Put me down for a pack, Bill. :archer2:
Double bevel???
Now that I have some good parts coming off of correct dies. I'm really getting excited about this project again!! It's nice to see that I'm not the only one! :D
Yes, The 3 blade will be double bevel.
Rick,I'm not really ready to start taking orders at this point. Although now that I have quite a few good parts to work out the process on.Hopefully it should not be more than a couple of months now.
I'm really excited to glue a set of these on. It's been very interesting knowing that they are coming and getting the updates. Thanks Bill!
I'll take a dozen. PM with payment details.
:)
Just getting on the list, Bill. You will get them out when you get them right. I figured it would be a while before you were ready to actually begin production and taking orders. I'll be patiently waiting.
They are going together nicely. This one is just spot welded at this point. It is not yet brazed.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/2w65rwx.jpg)
They even look like the drawing now. :D
Looking good my friend !!! :thumbsup:
Bill
Oh! I see my name on that one!! :bigsmyl:
Can't wait!
Benjy
Bill you are one heck of an entrepreneur, inventor and craftsman!
Bill I really like the photos of the broadhead through the process, never saw that before. When u have time could we see more please? After its brazed, ground, and so on. Neat stuff!
I want a dozen glue ins.
No hurry. God bless, Steve
QuoteOriginally posted by Sockrsblur:
Bill I really like the photos of the broadhead through the process, never saw that before. When u have time could we see more please? After its brazed, ground, and so on. Neat stuff!
Its a long process. Usually it takes about 2 months from the time the first piece of steel is put into the punch press until the first actual broadhead is ground.There are some steps that I really dont want to share but most of it is pretty standard stuff. Kind of dull actually. I'll take some pictures along the way.
The next step. The actual brazing is done in an oven that the atmosphere inside is controlled with gas. The whole set up is about 50' long. It is that controlled atmosphere that makes the braze move throughout the entire head.
I'll start making a list of folks who say they want heads. As long as we all understand that this run of broadheads is only 400 and many of them will get scrapped while trying to refine the process.
Bill
Please put me on the list . I already ordered the arrows from Snag. (grin)
God bless,
steve
Sounds great, thank you sir! If your making a list I would love to be on it too...
Gonna have to give these a try, especially if they are 175 wo insert (they will be perfect 300 with 125 steel insert)
Sign me up for a dozen, too!
I think part of the allure for me, and this can be said of much of traditional archery, is that your a real, approachable person making a quality product in the USA. I went looking for you at Denton because for me it was a treat to shake the man's hand that made my bow. Meeting you and your lovely wife adds something to the gear I all ready loved to carry. During my compound days I spent a lot of money on bows and gear without a thought of where or who made it. Everything Traditional simply seems to run a little deeper... to have more meaning and soul to it. I appreciate that.
ill take a dozen!! :readit:
Looking good, hope to try a few out this fall.
How much are they going to be Bill?
"The price? Its hard to know for sure because I dont know just how long it will take to weld or grind these heads. Its likely to fall between $50-$55 for a 6 pack. Far less than any other non vented 3 blade!" Bill from the previous thread.
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=132556;p=2
Put me down for 5 or 7 Bill! :D
I'd be interested in getting a pack of these when they come out. Looks sweet! Bringing any samples to the PBS banquet?
Yea, Shane. I'm planning to bring a few samples to the banquet. Its going to be close but i should be able to have something by then.
I would like a half dozen also, put me on the list please.
Great News Bill!
How will these new heads help with Accuracy ;) :p
QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
Great News Bill!
How will these new heads help with Accuracy ;) :p
:goldtooth:
You Couldn't have answered that any better Bill :laughing:
Looking forward to seeing them and you in Cincinnati.
I think you'd do better competing against other 3 blades if you go to 1" instead of 1 1/8" and black would outsell any other color.
David, Thanks for bringing this thread back up. I do have more updatates. These heads are currently at heat treat. I dropped them off last friday. It usually takes a week or just over for them to get heads heat treated.
I have some pictures to share of the brazing furnace.I just have to get Tracy to move them to photobucket for me.
Making a 1" cut out of these will not be a problem.I'm sure there will be some of them just from getting the grinders set up. If you would like some 1"ers just let me know.
These heads will not be black. I realize black is the most popular color.That is also why they will not be black.The majority of the 3 blades out there are black so ours will not be.
Bill
Glad they won't be black- hell the animals don't care.
brazing furnace
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/brazingfurnace.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/brazingfurnace.jpg.html)
Preheat chamber in furnace
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/brazing.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/brazing.jpg.html)
ready to braze
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/Instinctbrazing.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/Instinctbrazing.jpg.html)
OH I like it. This is going to be a great head I know it
Looking forward to seeing the final product Bill. e see you in Cincy
Cool photos, never saw anything like it!
:campfire:
Looking great Bill !!! Nice pics. :thumbsup:
Bill
Got an elk dying to meet one of these!!!
PaLongshank
There are a lot of animals dying to meet these broadheads!
Geez Bill, I know you put a lot of time and money into this project but that brazing furnace et al seems way over the top. .It will take a lot of broadhead sales to crack that nut. :biglaugh:
Smile.
There sure is some outstanding efforts being put into these heads Bill, well done mate! I hope they'll be ready by June so as to try some out on my BC bear hunt?
ak.
I'm lovin' it!
Super cool! :thumbsup: That brazing furnace is gnarly.
Hope you'll have some at the Baltimore Bowmen shoot. I bought some 2 blades from you and am extremely happy with them. I'd like to try these out - hopefully on a big deer.
Congrats on an excellent idea.
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
David, Thanks for bringing this thread back up. I do have more updatates. These heads are currently at heat treat. I dropped them off last frida
These heads will not be black. I realize black is the most popular color.That is also why they will not be black.The majority of the 3 blades out there are black so ours will not be.
Bill
They aren't going to be pink are they? I'll shoot just about anything but pink :p
Hope to see one up close and personal in Cinci!
re: color, sure the animals won't care. But statistically, bowhunters who buy broadheads do care. And it seems they prefer black probably because of tradition and also because it matches up with whatever shaft and fletch colors one chooses.
I'm a marketer and if I was launching a bh, I'd ask a hundred or more potential buyers - or what size sample one can get - what they prefer, preferably by showing them the actual bh in different colors. I mean who wouldn't go with black if say 50% of potential buyers preferred that colo?. Now if only 5% did, sure it wouldn't matter (much).
I do understand the counter argument of being different, but that said, I'd test and go with with the test results. If a marketer goes against what customers want, he is losing money plain and simple.
That said, very few people in the archery business bother to test. Same goes for price testing, chosing names, etc. There's a science to this and in the long run people go out of business because sales didn't meet expectations. Now think what the causes of failure are...in short, not giving customers what they want.
It amazes me that hardly anyone in the archery business actually asks their customers what they want...and after a sale, "any suggestions for improving our product?" Some entrepreneurs actually get mad when customers make suggestions. My goodness, the big boys spend millions finding out what customers actually want.
That said, the silverish black in the sample pic is nice, IMO, but hey, I'm just one vote, I'd still go with the majority and for that one needs a sufficiently large sample size.
Color is not a factor to me and you will recall that Grizzlies have always been a variety of colors depending on weight. It never has seemed to hold them back.
I do a lot of arrow assembly where I dip, crest and fletch. I try to be color conscious in that work, but I have to say I don't worry if my broadhead "matches" except in weight and flight characteristics.
D.P.
QuoteOriginally posted by TOEJAMMER:
Geez Bill, I know you put a lot of time and money into this project but that brazing furnace et al seems way over the top. .It will take a lot of broadhead sales to crack that nut. :biglaugh:
Smile.
:biglaugh: If you think that is over the top. Wait until you see the steel treat plant I bought just to heat treat these heads. :laughing:
I wish I could say that was my brazing furnace.The one we have is a much less spectacular version and it needs a total rebuild. Thats why i take them to this place to be brazed.
Al, June should not be a problem.
John, I'm not planning to be at Baltimore this year but who knows sometimes things change. :D
You make some very good points, David. Marketing is tricky there is no doubt about that. In this case though I dont think the fact that these heads will be tan (all except Whip's his will be pink :D :p ) and not black will effect the sale. As has been mentioned. Our Grizzlies and many other broadheads vary in color depending on the weight.These 3 blades will as well but there will not be a black one.
I'm always happy to hear what my customers have to say. They have given me some great ideas over the years. For instance the strap on version of our Woodie quiver. The reason the Kodiak's come heavier than 200 grains is also because our customers wanted it and that's just a couple of examples. Please, don't think I'm ignoring your suggestions that is not the case. I have thought about this quite a bit. This time I'm going to steer clear of the crowd and stick with tan.
Bill,
thanks for posting updates. I like seeing the process more than the product, though this product looks pretty amazing!
For you you broadhead wiz's. Does the long ferrule make a broadhead harder or easier to tune?
Also, seeing as the head is so long and not a steep slope, that will also help with penetration correct?
(i'm still learning fellas, be nice :)
QuoteOriginally posted by DanielB89:
For you you broadhead wiz's. Does the long ferrule make a broadhead harder or easier to tune? No
Also, seeing as the head is so long and not a steep slope, that will also help with penetration correct? Absoluetely
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
In this case though I dont think the fact that these heads will be tan (all except Whip's his will be pink :D :p ) and not black will effect the sale.
Well there we go then. That is going to be my excuse if I ever miss. :smileystooges:
QuoteOriginally posted by Whip:
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
In this case though I dont think the fact that these heads will be tan (all except Whip's his will be pink :D :p ) and not black will effect the sale.
Well there we go then. That is going to be my excuse if I ever miss. :smileystooges: [/b]
"if I ever miss" Now that's confidence Joe. I like it! :bigsmyl:
Pink for me too please!!!
I'm liking what I see!
I've actually taken Grizzly broadheads and spray painted them to get them to better match my fletching. It's pain in the arse because the paint covers the bevel/edge. That I was so motivated to do that means I'm probably extremely color sensitive. Am I weird? Well apparently 85% of people make buy decisions based on color.
Try googling "Psychology of Color in Buying Decisions"
Anyway, sure put me down for a half dozen !" diameter and if I like them I'll order several dozen.
Cool pics Bill. :thumbsup:
David, I think color is more important with fungible goods. If people want a 3 blade Grizzly, they will most likely buy it. Green is often associated with Zwickey and Bear broadheads. Also, I'm not a big fan of silver or raw steel, which can glint in the sun, but a lot of broadheads are just that.
Anyway, tan will look cool - especially with blood on it!
Tan works for me ! :thumbsup:
Hmmm, the little ladies are currently using the Green 130 grain Grizzlies with 100 grain steel inserts.
(//%5Burl=http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/shrewshooter/media/PC250061_zpseeba6659.jpg.html%5D%20%5Bimg%5Dhttp://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg617/shrewshooter/PC250061_zpseeba6659.jpg)[/url] [/IMG]
However, if there were a pink version of the 3 blade Grizzly and I get their draw weights up a little, just imagine how good these arrows would look with those pink broadheads in an LaClair/Art Vincent quiver! :shaka:
(//%5Burl=http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/shrewshooter/media/PC250058_zps54fccebf.jpg.html%5D%20%5Bimg%5Dhttp://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg617/shrewshooter/PC250058_zps54fccebf.jpg)[/url] [/IMG]
How's that for market research/input. ;)
i want mine to be pinkish red with small bubbles and a few strands of cut hair. oh yea, and some dirt too.
Tan will do the job just fine...and don't worry David, I've spray painted many a BH too mate!
ak.
Tan will look better with red on it over black. JMHO
I think the countless Kill photos will sell the broadhead pretty good.
I think we would all love to see your ladies have some success, Ray!!They sure look like they are prepared.
The heat treat plant called yesterday. They got the heads heat treated. While I was there picking them up I snapped a couple of pictures of a couple of their ovens.
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/heattreat.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/heattreat.jpg.html)
Hows this for an oven?!?
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/bigheattreat.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/bigheattreat.jpg.html)
Neat stuff Bill, thanks!
:bigsmyl:
If you can make some that glow a kinda blue color and sorta throb in intensity, I for certain will have some ! Who can miss with one of those !
Not quite spent Uranium heads. . . who knew.
Useful against Drones as well.
ChuckC
Bill just picked up the initial bunch from the Teflon coaters.
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2cx7nrc.jpg)
Really liking where this is going!!!!!!!!!!
Hey TJ,THE VERY TIP DOESN't look to be very sharp,new system? LOL. :biglaugh:
Haha Felix, I know I think he needs to start over.
Are the broad heads going to be tan in color?
Yes David.
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/615d2af8-3ae1-498e-9e1b-23975b139d68.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/DUCK_TRAP/media/615d2af8-3ae1-498e-9e1b-23975b139d68.jpg.html)
QuoteOriginally posted by TRAP:
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa277/DUCK_TRAP/615d2af8-3ae1-498e-9e1b-23975b139d68.jpg) (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/DUCK_TRAP/media/615d2af8-3ae1-498e-9e1b-23975b139d68.jpg.html)
:biglaugh:
Me too...
These are gonna be great. You face some stiff competition though with those RAGE 3 blade expandables coming out soon! :rolleyes:
(http://images.imagelinky.com/1395403776.jpg) (http://images.imagelinky.com/1395403776.jpg)
They should have called them "Edward Scissorhands"! :laughing:
I ground this one on one of my sanders. I am waiting on a custom piece for the 3 blade grinder.It shipped yesterday.
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/pyramidfinihedinstict.jpeg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/pyramidfinihedinstict.jpeg.html)
At 1 1/8" cutting diameter they are coming in about 15-20 grains heavier than I expected. The reason is because they took more than twice as much copper as I expected it would to braze them. It took 20 grains of copper to braze these heads. I only expected it to take about 7 grains give or take. Boy was I way off so this initial run will be heavier than 175 grains.
I know how to get them down to 175 grains without changing my dies or the amount of copper it takes to braze them but its to late for this batch. That is why I only did 360 of them for this first run. You never really know what you are going to end up with until you build some.
I would think there are a lot of guys out there who would relish the thought of them coming in at 190 grains or so.
I'm sure they won't last long.
IMO I would leave them in the natural teflon finish. It gives them that "handmade just for me" look. Save you some $$ too, and that's always a good thing. Can't wait to get my hands on some.
I dont understand what you are suggesting, Steve. There has been nothing done by me to the teflon in the above picture.Please help me understand what you mean by "natural teflon finish".
Bill
Looks great Bill. Thanks for taking us through the development a little bit. I think you have a winner.
I would like to get a half dozen of the first batch since they are a little heavier. Will you have them available at the PBS Gathering next weekend?
Thanks again
Duane
Guys,
I know that color is a personal preference for us all for everything, but I just want to let you know that Bill and Tracy have sacrificed a lot in consistently trying to bring new and better products to us all. These new 3 blade heads are no different. This thread was meant to take us all along on what is involved in bringing a broadhead to market. For those of you that do not know Bill personally he really strives to please everyone and it bothers him when he can not. Bill can't make us all happy with what personal color we would each like these heads to be so please if you would like a pink broadhead send him a email or pm and lets try and keep this thread on track.
Personal weight preference also. He can not make every weight someone would like. Fighting medal weight and length of a broadhead keeps a large head like this fairly heavy and making a 100 grain 3/1 ratio head is simply impossible unless the majority of us are willing to pay $20 per head.
These are the first weight option of more to come and they can only be one color and he has chosen that already. As his two blade Grizzly line of heads the other weights will be other colors.
Sorry for the rant but this has been a re-occurring issue here. :deadhorse:
TJ
In reality, 20 grains is practically irrelevant, many arrow sets vary that much. Heavier is fine with me, tho and 190 gr glue on field points are readily available. Not so with 175 gr. Hope to see / buy some at PBS Banquet. See ya there, Bill!
so these will be double bevel heads.... I like that. I would try a set of these for sure....I think a deer or better yet a hog may be perfect to try them...haha Hopefully they stay in the 190-200gr range
Bill...those turned out awesome! You should be proud of that fine product. I know it to a lot of work to produce. I think I just found my new elk head.
That is a great looking head! Of course, the proof will be in performance in the field, and I have no doubt that it will live up to its looks. I like 3 blades, and this design has everything I would like to see in a broadhead with weight, size, and cutting angle. Can't wait to put some to the test!
Bill, just awesome. I for one do not mind a head heavier than 175 so once they are ready I will sure buy some. Will they be on your site? Add a 100gr steel adaptor and they will be perfect for my setup.
Very nice Bill!! Well said TJ :) Can't wait to see these in person!
Those are really nice!
bill I think what the guy means is the color. The dull black/ Teflon grey color.
Great looking head Bill. I'm really looking forward to getting some in my hands. If your going to sell any of the first batch after you get them ground down, I would like a half dozen to start. Cant wait till your up and running with the 175's. I'm thinking turkey with some from the first batch.
Looks great. Bring some with you to the PBS banquet next week. Several of them will head back to Va. with me.
Seriously, those look awesome!
Looking good Bill !!!! :clapper:
looks great!! i'd buy some of the heavier ones.
That looks awesome! Color and all.... I don't care what weight they are what so ever. I like making arrows and will make some that will shoot these heads.
Keep on making quality products :thumbsup:
Thank you everyone for following along with me on this.It has taken a year and many many many many dollars to get to this point.
I ground another dozen by hand today.Well....Holding them by hand on one of my sanders with a 36 grit belt. I wanted to see if the weight was going to hold. All 12 of them were between 190-194 so I'm confident that is about where they are going to stay. I only bloodied 2 fingers while grinding those 12 heads. :biglaugh:
I should have the rest of the custom parts for my grinder by tuesday. I'm sure it will take a week or two to get it all adjusted. There is no doubt that it will need some redesign here and there as it was built from spare parts mostly.
I will have a few of these heads at the PBS banquet.I will not have a booth set up there. If you are going to be there and you want to see them just holler at me. I do plan to donate some for the auction. I'm not sure how many I will have by then to sell other wise. I dont have enough digits to grind too many by hand. :D
Bill that is a great weight it matchs with both glue on and close to screw in feild tips ..I hope all your hard work pays off Thanks Shane
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
I dont understand what you are suggesting, Steve. There has been nothing done by me to the teflon in the above picture.Please help me understand what you mean by "natural teflon finish".
Bill
Sorry, I meant just leave them as it appeared in the picture. Don't paint or otherwise color them. Just my opinion.
Gotcha, Steve. That original color was what we wanted for the head. The color they ended up was the nearest "stock" color of Teflon the coaters could get. They could have matched it to the original rendering.It would have been a custom color and more expensive. So we went with the "stock" color.
Um, yeah. I like that ALOT! I don't care what color or weight they are. I can make em work, and they will all turn red eventually. :saywhat:
I guess its only right that you drew first blood with your new head eh Bill?
I wait patiently.
The weight sounds perfect for my setup, and the color, well
(Two Tracks beat me to it),it doesn't matter, mine all turn red after hunting with them. :bigsmyl:
They are beauties.
It's been a treat to be able to follow your progress through the process. Thank you for all the posts and photos Bill, I have enjoyed them for sure.
Best of luck with all this Bill.. Im sure they will be as good as all your other products mate!
Is there any chance of getting a pic alongside one of your two blades mate for a comparison in size?
ak.
Here you are, Al. Not the best picture but it does give a reference to size.
Grizzly on the top, Instinct in the middle, Kodiak on the bottom
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/all3.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/all3.jpg.html)
Nice job. You have taken ALL of the Griz lines to a new level. Those look like tank strong 3 blade heads!
Looking good Bill :thumbsup:
Cheers for that Bill... again mate standing behind your product ten fold!
I'll be putting in an order for my BC bear hunt in June.
Cheers again,
ak.
Yes the color is secondary as well as few grains more or less,with all the options we have on adapters.
What is important is how easy they are to make them scary sharp,and I am sure Bill worked hard for have this done.
Bill, these look awesome man! I love the Grizzlies, cant wait till I try these. Will you have some sharpening tips on your website?. I have difficulty sharpening 3 blade heads.
Bill I said it earlier and want to repeat so I definitely get on the list. I want a dozen of these heads. the 190 are perfect.
God bless, steve
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e305/zipperbows/KMEStone.jpg) (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/zipperbows/media/KMEStone.jpg.html)
Sharpening could not be easier. All you need is a flat stone. With light pressure just push it back and forth counting each stroke. I started with 25 strokes, flip the head, 25 strokes, flip. Once all 3 sides got 25 strokes I then went to 20 then 15 then 10 then 5. Next was 2 strokes forwad only on each blade then 1 stroke forward on each blade. I repeated the 1 stroke on each blade 3 times. Thats all it took to make the head shaving sharp. To make it hunt ready I pulled it backwards over leather rotating just like before. NOW its ready to hunt!
Your on the list, Steve. As soon as the rest of my custom parts get here to finish the grinder. I'll get this batch ground and start filling the orders of those on the list.
These heads will be sold as a 3 pack. If you want 6 I can get them all in one package for you.They will be $27.50 per 3 pack.
Looking good Bill...that looks like a good head to take on my Moose hunt this year! I like the weight too! Thanks for all the info! :thumbsup:
When can we place an order? Forgive me, if you've also told us.
I too, will place an order as soon as possible. Don't want to be pushy, I will wait if need be. Congrats sir, that looks to be a great head. I would love to support your business
Jake
QuoteOriginally posted by looper:
When can we place an order? Forgive me, if you've also told us.
Not a problem. I do have a list of folks that want to reserve broadheads from this first run. About 1/3 of this first batch are spoken for at this point so we still have plenty available. If you want on that list all I need is for you to say to add you and how many heads you would like.
It take a couple of weeks to get the grinder all sorted out. I'm sure.
Bill
Bill,
I have been following this thread, fascinated with what it takes to get a "new" product to market.
I would like a dozen of these first run 190-194gr broadheads as well.
Chad
Thanks, Chad. I have you on the list.
Bill-
I would take a half dozen of them. Thanks.
Put me down for 6 please........... I like the heavier weight.........
What adapters are recommended for these heads if you don't mind saying? They do look great btw..
Mac
The Ferrel will accept any 11/32" adapters.
John, Glen I got you on the list. Thank you both!
TJ is correct. They like an 11/32 adapter. They will also go on 23/64 wood shafts. The original goal was to make them just 11/32. After 4 attempts at the farrel die and 3 months of extra work. The final die is making beautiful round parts. It is making them at 23/64. After all of the trouble and extra expense I was afraid to try and make them reduce the diameter when it is making such perfect parts. Especially since there is only .015 difference between 11/32 and 23/64. Its so minor its inconsequential . Besides it opens up the opportunity for more wood shooters to use them.
Bill
Great looking heads.
I will take 6 of the heavier first run heads if there are any more available.
Thank You
I got 3 in the mail today, Bill said they were seconds, you will have to be real picky if these bother you. Mounted them on 100 grain BH adapters 295-298 gr.Spin true and sharpen real easy. Looks like I have a new 3 blade to hunt with this year, I'll be playing with it and a new arrow (PTP) to see what it takes to break them.
Bob
I should be getting some soon to Bob. I will put them to the test and then hopefully get them bloody.
Cade got his today as well, thanx again Bill!
Bill, Those turned out Great!!!!
I have my Money on Cade getting the first critter. Come on May first!!! Gobble Gobble!
I saw the heads today and held one in my hand. Bill really knows how to build a great broadhead. The color looks amazing as well. Can't wait to get some real soon.
Put me down for 6m I have plans for them.
6 that is
I'd like to try 6 if you still have some available.
Bill
Id like a dozen of these please in the 190 grain.
Bill, Will you email those of us who requested broadheads your payment and shipping information?
I spoke with Bill a few hours ago. He is tied up at the PBS banquet today. I did hold one of these new heads in my hands and they are a quality build. Definitely going to give them a try.
Bill I understand the first run of heads fell around 190 ish. With future production runs do you think the weight will stay at 190s or be 175 or is this not answerable? Thanks for your thoughts...
Okay gang, got to put these heads on some arrows today and they fly great. I believe these heads are going to be some real killers.
Bill I would definitely like a pack when you get the 175 grain heads running. These look great. As much as I like the Grizzlies, these will probably replace them as my #1 head.
I would like 6 of the first run heads please, if there are any left. :thumbsup: Perhaps a dozen if I can afford that.
Got my heads today Bill, and they are everything I hoped they would be. Awesome job.
I'd like 3 of the first run ones, too, if there's any left. They look great and I definitely need some easy-to-sharpen heads. Thanks!
Well the PBS banquet is over so now its back to the grind stone. Literally!
I believe I have everyone on the list who has asked to be put there.
To the questions about payment. I really do not want anyone to send any money until I have their head ground and ready to ship. It will be easier to keep track of that way.
The 175's. At this point the 175 may or may not be a reality. I can get there with this same set of dies but it will require 2 more steps in the process to reduce the weight of the heads. I WILL try some on the next run of heads.If it is not too hateful to deal with then I will offer the 175.If it is too time consuming then the 175 may get dropped all together.As it is this head is grinding out between 190 and 195 consistently. Once I have recovered the investment in this head.The plan is to have another set of dies made to make a 150 grain version. Unfortunately it will take 2 new dies and dies are not cheap to have made.
We should be able to start punching steel on the next run of heads in the next week or so.
QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
Bill, Those turned out Great!!!!
I have my Money on Cade getting the first critter. Come on May first!!! Gobble Gobble!
I REALLY hope Cade is the first one to run one of these heads through a bird!!He is going to have some stiff competition though.
I want to once again say THANK YOU folks. This has been quite an undertaking for me both in time and money. You guys have shown your support from the start. It has taken over a year for this head to become a reality.Now that it has many of you are ordering heads on blind faith.Many of you have not even seen one of these heads in person yet here are your orders. I can not tell you how much I appreciate that!
Don't think that I have done this 100% by my self. I have had help from some great friends.They have helped with everything from technical drawings, and grinder design, to even writing the trademark applications.
This head was my idea but if it were not for Tom Jenkins. It would still be stuck rattling around in my head taunting me as just another idea. He spent countless hours with me drawing, changing and redrawing this thing in his solid works program. I can not even guess how many versions we put together. Tom also designed all of the graphics and packaging inserts for this head. He has taken great pictures of the actual heads for me as well. I'm sure I am forgetting something he does so much for Zipper and Grizzly. He has skills that I do not and he is always willing to help!
When it came to grinding these 3 blades. Ron Swartz once again pulled my rump from the fire. He designed the grinding fixtures for the Grizzly's. If not for him I would likely still be fighting that dragon. When I told Ron I had an idea for a 3 blade version of the Grizzly. He jumped right in and told me he had an idea for a grinder to grind them. He all ready had all of the basic design sorted out. It was a HUGE step in the right direction. I'm still fine tuning on it so there is no doubt his help will still be needed. The man is an evil genius without the evil part.
Will Huguet is not only writing the trademark application. Which is a huge pain in the a$$! He is also the one who came up with the Grizzly Instinct name.
So there you go. It was not only me that brought this head about. I have had more than a little help!
:thumbsup: I don't know Will or Ron, but if they're anything like Tom (which it sounds like they are) you have quite the super team!! Well done Bill and team!
Bill you have a super team,all great guys,the 3 blade will be a blast.
:thumbsup:
Bringing a product to life - you tha man Bill!
Thanks for the reply. And I scrape some acorns togethe for when those heavy heads are ready. Some good Texas hog medicine I'll bet.
:thumbsup:
Nice looking head, no doubt they will be a good seller for you. Like the desert tan.
You say it's blind faith but after what you did with the Grizzlies it's not THAT FAR of a jump Bill. Men will always respect a well made product at a fair price. The marketing of these things is a cinch. You have some good guys on your team and I have no doubt of your pending success.
BTW, those heads are killer and we thank you for what you do.
Hey Bill:
I got my Grizzly heads yesterday. They look really good and tough. I can't wait to get them on a shaft and in the turkey woods. Congrats on yet another impeccable product!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :clapper:
PBS held its biannual gathering last weekend in Cincinnati not far from Bill and Tracy's home. Saturday morning I loaded up Tippet, Duckbutt, and Kevin Winkler into my car for a visit.
We were treated to a tour of Bill's shop and saw first hand everything that went on to the development of these heads. What an eye opener! The engineering not only in the design of the head itself but in the custom tools and equipment was amazing! In all honesty, with everything that goes into building them it's hard to believe they are priced as low as they are.
I'm going to mount some up on some arrows today and start playing with them. It won't be long and turkey season will be open here. As cool as it would be to see Cade be the first to kill something with them I'm secretly hoping to beat him to it. ;)
The more I shoot these heads the more I love them. I will be testing them on some fresh ribs and possibly a scapula from the butcher very soon.
Bill,
Sounds like you have a great team. and it looks like you have a great product as a result. :thumbsup:
Thanks everyone! Things are starting to move along on this project. I have been working on the grinder most of the day today. It is WORKING and working very well! It will not be long before I will be ready to ship to the rest of the guys that asked for heads.
We punched out 6000 pieces this week. That will be enough to make a run 1000 heads. Once I get the tip reinforcement pieces that is.
The next step will be make up a bunch of the fixtures that go on the grinder. Its kind of slow with only 3 fixtures. I did not want to build a bunch of them until I knew they were going to work.
And work they do. Hurry up Bill I need another two dozen. :D :thumbsup:
Plan to test mine on Texas hog before it gets too terrible hot.
:campfire:
Any updates?
Mine should be headed to Texas after I pay for them on Monday. :thumbsup:
:bigsmyl:
As far as I know Joe Lasch (Whip) was the first to run one of these new heads through a critter. He got a WI turkey yesterday morning at about 9 a.m. I'm sure he will be along to share his story with us.
The rest of the original 370 first run heads have now been ground. I will be contacting the last 10 guys on the list this week to get their heads to them.
As expected I learned a couple of things about building this head. Easy changes to my fixtures to make them even better.
Joe can certainly get it done!
Can't wait for story and pictures
I got mine and they were real nice. Have not mounted and shot them yet but no doubt about them being of the best quality.
God bless. Steve
That tan color on these heads sure looks pretty when you add some streaks of red on it! :goldtooth:
I'm still up at our cabin. Can't seem to figure out photo bucket on my tablet so will have to wait until I get home to get them posted up.
My came in the mail today, will hopefully get them bloody in the next few weeks. IF.... I can find a turkey to cooperate.
Look fantastic, look to be a winner!
Congratulations Joe! Waiting for the pictures.
I am waiting for the snow to melt before trying them on bear.
Got a chance to see these broadheads in person last week. They are the real deal !!! :thumbsup: I can't even imagine how many hours Bill Dunn has into making them a reality. :notworthy: :notworthy: Very impressive work !!!
Bill
Congrats Joe. Looking forward to the pics.
I got mine in and they're shaving sharp! (I've got some smooth legs to prove it! :biglaugh: ) I bought some steel adapters for them and I just need to grind them down a little bit before gluing them in so I can get right at 250gr. I'm pretty excited to use these on some turkeys this spring and deer this fall
What do they weigh and where do you order them. They look like they might be my new choice of heads.
Bill, I'd like a package, please. I think you said you will be selling them in packages of 3. Let me know. Love the Grizzlies and can't wait to see these.
Bill,
I would like to get on the list for a pack of three as well. What is the price?
QuoteOriginally posted by larry f:
What do they weigh and where do you order them. They look like they might be my new choice of heads.
These heads weigh 190 grains. They are $27.50 per 3 pack plus $6 shipping. I can ship up to 12 heads for that $6 shipping. You can order them through Zipper Bows or Grizzly Broadheads. They are not yet on the websites. You can email me zipperbows@gmail.com call 937-444-0904 or just ask to be put on the order list here on this thread.
The first run of Instinct are sold out. We do have a second larger run punched out and they are being spot welded now. Its about a 2 month turn around when making heads so this run should be available in late June or early July.
John, and Doug I have you on the preorder list. When the heads are ready I will contact you. Please do not send any money until your heads are ready for delivery. Thank you for your order!
Bill
Better put me on the list for another half dozen in the next batch Bill. Need to make sure I have enough to get through the fall.
Hey Bill, I saw that you mentioned you're going to try and get some 175s out of this next batch of heads you're running. Is that still on the table? If so, could you put me down for some of those (maybe 6)? If they don't work out I'm not too worried either way. I can make these 190s work!
With a name like "Instinct" might as well put me on the list for 6. :thumbsup:
Can't hardly wait to get mine later this week. Thanks, Bill. :thumbsup:
I am planning to make some 175's to fill the orders of those who requested them. I doubt the 175 will be in the line up permanently. To make a 175 from the 190 will require two more steps in an already time consuming process. What will likely happen is I will leave the 190 alone and build dies to make a 150 grain version for those who require less weight than the 190 grain.
Joe, Shane, and Will I have you guys on the list.Your heads are on the way, Michael.
Bill
150s would be AWESOME Bill,
Would they be non-vented?
Yep...love to get my hands on some of those 150s Bill! :thumbsup:
QuoteOriginally posted by awbowman:
150s would be AWESOME Bill,
Would they be non-vented?
Yes non vented.
This would be great Bill. Keep us updated
I'm game for either 150s or 175s and I'm definitely going to make these 190s work!
Bill, I would like one pack of the 175s, and definitely some of the 150s when they are available. Now the number one question, when do you think the 150s will be ready?
Bill, I would two packs of the 175s if possible, if not I would like the 190s. Thanks.
If there will be 150gr non-vented you can put me on the list for 6 please.
QuoteOriginally posted by snag:
If there will be 150gr non-vented you can put me on the list for 6 please.
Same here, Bill ! :D
The 150 will likely not be available this year. I will have to build 2 more dies to make that head. Dies are VERY EXPENSIVE to have built.
I'm not ready to start a list for the 150's just now. Lets wait until I have the dies in hand.Thanks for the interest though. That is what motivates me to get something like this moving.
Kenny, Jeremy I have you guys on the list for 175's
Bill, please put me on the preorder list for 6.
Thanks, Daryl
Got mine yesterday...thanks Bill! :thumbsup:
The 150's sound great. I'll be watching to see when you start taking orders for them!
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
The 150 will likely not be available this year. I will have to build 2 more dies to make that head. Dies are VERY EXPENSIVE to have built.
I'm not ready to start a list for the 150's just now. Lets wait until I have the dies in hand.Thanks for the interest though. That is what motivates me to get something like this moving.
No problem Bill - I will be waiting though. :thumbsup:
Bill,
I would like to be put on the list for 6.
Thanks
Jeff
I have you on the list Daryl, and Jeff.
Bill
Bill that 2 dozen was serious. just sayin.. :D
Bill;
Heads were in the mailbox when I got home Friday night. Wife had not got the mail, so I made a trip out to check. These look great. Am thinking about a mid-May trip to Granger WMA Texas to try them out on pressured and educated hogs.
:thumbsup:
With any luck they will be pushed by my new Big River 21st Century style longbow John said was ready. His check should be there today.
:pray: :pray: :pray:
cant wait to get notified that I need to pay so I can get mine...haha
Worth the wait, for sure. :thumbsup:
Bill,
I got mine in the mail Saturday. Thank you! They look great! Now I'm just waiting on the local shop to get some 100gn. adapters in and they'll be in my quiver. Might just hafta get some online so I don't hafta wait as long.
I'll be trying my hand at getting them hair-poppin' sharp (per your instructions in this thread) and I'll let ya know how it goes. That will be the ultimate test, cuz if I can get 'em sharp then ANYONE can! Lol. I'll likely be in for another 6, if I can sharpen them well enough....oh, who am I kidding? Just go ahead and put me down, cuz I know I'll end up buying more.
Thanks again for all your hard work on these and your dedication to quality (both in your products and your customer service)!!!
Bill i will take 6 of the 175s when they roll out. I ordered lighter inserts and adapters today to build a new dozen MFX whitetail arrows for the fall. There are a lot of distractions between now and october but I can't wait to chase those deer around! Ha
Bill; exciting stuff here man!
Would you also put me on your list for 6 of the 175's?
I have you on the list, Mike, James, and Barry.
Tony, they sharpen very easy but if you have any problems. You know how to reach me. :thumbsup:
Thanks for letting me know your heads arrived guys!
If things go well this week. I should be able to complete the spot welding on this next run of heads. Then they are off to the brazer.
As some of you may have noticed. These new heads are putting some nice critters in the freezer.Unfortunately it is not my freezer! The turkeys are showing me no respect this year.
I received mine a few weeks back, and I love them! they are very, very well built and fly true!
Bill;
Please put me down for a six pack of 175s.
Regards,
Jamie
Got ya, Jamie.
Thank you all for the feed back. Over all it looks like this head will be a winner!
Bill
Testing results and game taken with these new heads.They are getting it done! This is my way of once again saying THANK YOU guys for putting these heads to the test.
Joe's testing
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=136766;p=1
Joe's turkey. First critter taken with the Instinct.
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=137084;p=1#000000
Mike's turkey.
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=137091;p=1
Scott's 287# boar
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=137156;p=1
Cade's first turkey
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=137194;p=1
Jeff's turkeys
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=137197
Bill, Can I get a six pack of the 175's as well. Thanks, Fred
Been checking the mail, hopefully any day now mine will be here :pray:
They should have been there by now, Rick! I'll see what I can find out tomorrow. If they do not show up tomorrow call me and I'll send you replacements. Then try to find the ones that were sent.
I have you on the list, Fred.
Thanks
Bill
QuoteOriginally posted by zipper bowss:
They should have been there by now, Rick! I'll see what I can find out tomorrow. If they do not show up tomorrow call me and I'll send you replacements. Then try to find the ones that were sent.
I have you on the list, Fred.
Thanks
Bill
Bill, I just checked outside the back door now to see if I had missed them. They are not here. If you want to track them first to see if they are in transit before you send replacements. Let me know what you find out.
Ill send you more heads then worry about finding those.I'm sure you have a turkey that needs to be introduced to these new heads. :D
Resend me your address so I know I have it correct.
Bill,
PM sent
Looking forward to trying these heads out this fall.