Has anyone had an opportunity to shoot/compare both of these forward/mid handled bows? If so, what did you think? If you have any pics you can share, that would be great! Allen usually comes down for the Rancho Neblina Shoot, so I can hopefully try a Classic then, but I rarely see a Berry bow around here.
They both look like fantastic bows!
Thank You!
Stump
I can't speak for the Berry, but Alan makes a great bow! I've shot his classic and it's smooth and a great shooter. And Allen is one of the most under rated longbow builders out there! He's also a great guy :thumbsup:
I agree! I had two Contenders that I sold because a Buddy HAD to have my myrtle one and the other was too heavy for me. I also realized I shoot straight handles better than locators, so I was intrigued when I saw both of these offered in a straight handle.
I still have 2 NM bows on the way, so I don't NEED either one of these, but since when has NEED ever come into play with this addiction?
Can't speak for the Liberty but I can for the Taipan. Buying it was one of the better decisions I have made. Stable, quiet, quick and beautiful. James makes a great bow and has for many years.
I shot a taipan in Jan - two are on order (one for me and one for my grandson). James Berry, IMHO - makes the best D shaped and duoflex (R/D) bows today - period.
I have had the opportunity to shoot a Liberty Classic for awhile. Allen made a few "tweeks" to his design and made a bow to let folks try. Mudd shot it first and then I have had it for a few weeks.
This is the first I have shot this style of bow, but I am impressed. SO VERY QUIET, and smooth. For being the first string follow bow I have shot, along with the "mid" grip, I didn't know what to expect as far as speed. I was pleasantly surprised with how fast it shot. Not a speed demon by any means, but faster than I expected. It is so smooth and quiet, that any critter will never hear the bow.
Don't have any experience with Berry bows, but this Liberty Classic is on my wish list. The test bow is 68" which is longer than I want or I would just buy this one.
Stump Buster- contact Allen and see if you can try out the bow. He asked if I had anyone else to try it out, but my nephew and I are the only ones interested around here. If Allen OK's it, I could send it to you.
I've never shot Liberty, but the Taipan I own is hands down one of the best, if not the best all around bow I have owned/shot . I typically shoot straight limbed longbows. ( all JD BERRY) but I picked up a Taipan a couple months ago that has stolen my heart. Just an easy to shoot , quiet , and good casting bow. I am sold on all things that come out of James shop and the Taipan has struck a cord with me.
With that said I don't believe I have ever heard a bad thing about Allen Boice either.
Thanks Herman! I'll give Allen a Holler and let you know!
Thanks for ALL the replies so far guys!!!
I made a video showing my taipan. Great bow. It is on you tube. I don't have a video on Mr. Boice bows, but I am sure they are great bows as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNZHQqNMEkk
here is another one , it is mostly on the super d, but I do show the Taipan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfgtl3gDr64
Stump
Definitely give Allen a call. I saw the slimmed down version of the Classic this weekend. He took mine and is trimming her down big time.
58
Bob-
Since I have never seen the original version, please fill me in on the differences of the new and old version.
Hermon
The newer version has a slimmer grip profile. The limbs are narrower very close to the two HH Wesley Specials I own. The grip is smaller front to back and sides of the grip are flatter than the original which was more oval on my bow. The back of the grip is rounded and sets into your hand very nicely and the slight bulkiness I felt with the original is not there. The tip overlays are smaller and trimmer. There was nothing wrong with my original bow it shot very well and had the typical Boice craftsmanship. Allen just refined the design into a trimmer package that allows the bow to become more of an extension of the arm as opposed to holding a bow.
Hope this helps. Allen can probably explain it much more clearly. I know he has become fond of the straight grip and string follow design .
58
Thanks. Really liked this bow but was curious in how they differed. Thanks.
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/Classic006_zpsd25779b6.jpg)
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/Classic005_zpsf4af072a.jpg)
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/Classic003_zps60d6bbba.jpg)
I think 58Winters said it best. Here's a few pics of my Classic. I will say that I have been a recurve guy for all my trad. archery days....until Allen put this Classic in my hands and asked if I wanted to shoot it...sneaky guy! haha After one shot I wanted to shoot it more. Then again and again. I couldn't believe how it felt so natural in the hand and the cast of the arrow went right where you were looking. So smooth and quiet. I like the way the grip sits in the hand. It allows for a constant placement in the hand every time. It's a keeper!
A while back,at Western States,I shot Allens Classic.I shot a lot of bows there that weekend and the Classic and a bow by John Strunk,shot the best for me.When i say best,it doesnt mean the fastest,but the most forgiving of operator error,which is a huge seller for a guy like me.
Thanks Guys!!! This group of folks can't be beat!!!
Herman will soon be sending me the "Pass Around" Liberty Classic to try out, so I should have a good idea about how the Classic shoots and feels in a couple of weeks!!!
THANK YOU Herman and Allen!!! I really appreciate the opportunity!!!
Mike
Stumpbuster I have owned a Berry Appollo which is along same lines as Taipan, and around that time I also had Liberty English models, several in fact.
I can guarrantee the Berry has a very smooth feel and Libertys were good also but felt different in hand.
If I had to again I would have Berry hands down.
Had to sell all my longbows following back surgery as they were all 58+ pounds.
Thinking another Berry maybe 51# and forward handle in my future......arrowang-----
Hey Stump Buster- Be on the lookout for the Liberty Classic as it is headed your way.
Hey Stump Buster- Be on the lookout for the Liberty Classic as it is headed your way.
THANK YOU SIR!!! :thumbsup:
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/IMG_1059_zps4dfc96a1.jpg)
Bob, recognize this? She's a beauty. Ebony riser, black limbs...oh yeah! Another Liberty Classic!
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/IMG_1058_zps2729ccd9.jpg)
Don't know who this guy is...he was standing in the parking lot so I asked him if he'd hold your bow while I could took a picture of it.
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u31/snag23/IMG_1060_zps3999f164.jpg)
Skinny fast tips.
It's Midnight Mary!! You guys becareful with my girl. She slimmed down quite nicely. 50# @27 string folow.
Thanks Allen.
QuoteOriginally posted by Brianlocal3:
I picked up a Taipan a couple months ago that has stolen my heart. Just an easy to shoot , quiet , and good casting bow. I am sold on all things that come out of James shop and the Taipan has struck a cord with me.
With that said I don't believe I have ever heard a bad thing about Allen Boice either.
X10
I've ordered my second Taipan from James with full artistic freedom. He says he knows what I like. Three more months.
I bought the wife a Liberty bow and it is a fine bow indeed and a stand up guy in Allen for sure. Just didn't strike a chord like the Taipan.
my .02 cents,
~CB
I used to own a Liberty contender that I thought was a good-shooting bow. I haven't shot Allen's forward handle bow, but I'm sure it is nice.
As for JD Berry, I currently own a North Star that is a beautiful forward-handle bow, and I have a Taipan on order. I think JD Berry builds some of the best-shooting, most beautiful bows for sale today at any price.
Stump Buster, please share your review after shooting the Classic. Do you know the specs on the one you'll be getting? I currently shoot a Liberty English and I'm very interested and want to learn more about the Classic. Thanks!
Butchie:
If you're interested in test driving a Classic sometime let me know and I'll send one your way. The one Stump Buster has is 68" & 45# and will be available after he's done with it. I have one here that I've been shooting for awhile that's 68" & 51#. I also have a 66" 52# Classic in the shop that I could send your way. It's always good to shoot a bow before you buy, especially something totally different than what you're accustomed to. String follow bows aren't for everybody, just like any Hill style bow isn't. However, having said that they're just about the only bow I shoot anymore. For me it's the perfect contemporary traditional bow that keeps me connected with the archery I came to know and love when I first picked up a bow in the sixty's. Wow, where has time gone!
Allen
Thank you Allen! I would really like the opportunity to shoot the Classic. My English is 47# @30" so the 45# Stump Buster has currently would be best. Please PM or email me whenever it might become available.
I'm curious how it compares/differs from the English. Could you give me some specifics since there's no one more qualified to compare.
Thanks again!
Hey Guys,
I got a chance to shoot the bow on the 28th and here are my initial impressions...(Please keep in mind, this was a VERY brief shooting session after a short break in the weather... I hope to shoot it again in the morning with a friend so I can get his take on it as well. I hope to be able to add pictures after tomorrow as well of the bow at full draw and the beautiful lines. Also I typed this up on the evening of the 28th but wanted to shoot it one more time before posting, but haven't had a chance due to work and weather, so it may read weird.)
From the other night...
The Bow: PERFECT construction as always from Allen, just like my two previous Contenders. The wood combos were a little busy for my tastes, but a fantastic example of what is available from Allen's shop and an excellent choice for a pass-around bow. The Yew in the limbs is a nice reddish color that blends well with the black glass. SPECS: 68" #45@28"
The Handle: This handle was a little too rounded/peaked on the belly side for MY tastes. If there weren't the two overlays on the belly of the grip that my palm presses against, I think I would have been more consistent in my shooting. The more I shot the bow, the more I noticed the thin part if the grip on the belly was changing position in my hand. When I spoke to Allen last week, he told me he has changed the grip on the current Classics, but I can't remember what he told me he changed. If I were to order one, I think I'd opt for no overlays to give the handle a more rectangular feel on the belly side. I'll ask him when I talk to him next if this is possible or if this is one of the things he changed in the final design. (UPDATE: Based on the pictures above of the Black Classic, it looks like the grip might be more squared, but it's hard to tell from pictures...maybe Allen can give us the skinny on the changes)
The shooting: My first three arrows were low left, but within an inch of each other at about ten yards. Then as I shot more, the group opened up and the more inconsistent I got. I noticed the string had kind of a "tinny" ping at the shot and there was a little more thump than I was expecting. I was shooting 2016's because I had them handy. It wasn't what I'd call handshock by any means, the bow was just letting you know it had just sent an arrow downrange for you. It did have a lot more thump than my Contenders did and that's probably due to the stringfollow design as opposed to the reflexed limbs of the Contenders. The draw was smooth, but I couldn't really tell the difference of my past Contenders by memory (I wish I still had one of them the test alongside this one). I'm also losing favor with bamboo cored bows. I have a funny feeling if this bow had Yew or Elm cores, it would have had a completely different feel and sound. Funny thing though, it seemed the bow quieted down the more I shot it. Maybe it was the string settling down, but it was noticeably quieter by the end of the short shooting session. Maybe I was getting a cleaner release...I hope to find out tomorrow. I should also include that I was shooting 3-under and didn't have time to play with nock height. I'll shoot a few tomorrow split finger and see how that sounds/feels.
Overall: It's a beautiful bow and another example of Allen's master craftsmanship. I think if this bow had a more square grip, I was able spend more time tuning it/playing with heavier arrows, and I added a couple Hush Puppy's, I believe I could have tamed the little thump and made the bow absolutely dead silent. I'll see what I have for shafts in the shop and try shooting with a heavier arrow shaft and point combo in the morning.
Based on this VERY brief shooting session (similar to being as if I were trying this one out at a Show or 3D shoot) and the way I WAS SHOOTING this bow, if I were to order a bow from Allen today I'd be ordering another one of his Contenders. I've had two already and want another one real bad. I think I'd be more consistent with a straight gripped & reflex limb model that I'M ALREADY FAMILIAR WITH. I do want to try out one of the updated versions of the Classic with different core woods to see if that makes a significant difference IN MY SHOOTING of this particular model, so I hope I catch up with him later this year at the Rancho Neblina Shoot in Petaluma. No matter what, I'll be shaking has hand again and will more than likely be ordering another one of his creations before the year's end.
Allen, I got your message today when I got home from the forest. It was a little scratchy (probably my wet lines) but I'm pretty sure you were giving me the green light to send to bow to Butchie. No Problem, if I can get it packed up tomorrow night , it will be on the way by the end of the week. I wish the weather was better and I had more time to play with it, but I'd rather get it off to the next tester. I can shoot another one if you come down in September. I'll call you tomorrow after I get in from shooting it again.
Butchie, PM me your address and I'll get the tube ready to go.
THANK YOU ALLEN FOR ALLOWING ME TO TRY THIS BABY OUT!!! I REALLY APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY!!!
Mike
PS - That longbow in my avatar is the Contender my buddy just HAD TO have. It's one of two bows I should have never let outta my hands!!!
Mike:
Just a quick follow up before we head out today for your part of the country to spend some time with our son in LA for a few days.
I can modify a grip to the customers specifications, but what I'm currently doing is making them slightly deeper and more oval, not much, just slightly. Leaving the overlays off would achieve the more rounded feel you prefer.
Also, I've been experimenting with handle lengths and have settled on 18" in 68" bows and 16" for 66". The bow you have is 16" and when it eventually makes it back to my shop I plan to cut it down to 66".
The slight thump you're feeling is typical of straight limbed bows. Better strings silencers may help and also keep the brace height at about 6.5". Arrow selection will make a difference too, I generally shoot wood arrows, mostly Wilderness and sometimes CE 150s with weed eater line added inside them to increase the weight. They're all in the 550 ~ 600 grain range which helps tone down any bow design, either RD or straight limb models.
Finally, if I were to build a bow to shoot 3-under I would tiller it differently, which should help improve shooting consistency and quiet the bow down. I generally recommend moving the nock point up about an eight inch for 3-under shooters who are shooting a split finger bow.
Thanks for taking it for a test drive and yes, send it on to Butchie when you're done with it.
No rush, Allen
Thank you for the information Mike (PM sent) and for the opportunity Allen, looking forward to shooting it.
Thanks for the info Allen!
Unfortunately work and heavy rain all day prevented me and my buddy from getting together to shoot this bow again, so I didn't get a chance to try different arrow/point combinations or get the full draw pics I wanted. I really don't think you can take my first review as gospel since we all have different shooting styles I only had a VERY short window to shoot her. I was really looking forward to trying her out with different shafts, but weather and work is going to keep me from doing that anytime soon, so I'd rather get the bow off to Butchie.
I'll try and snap a few indoor pics before packing it up tonight.
Butchie, I got your address, so I'll send her out to you in the morning.
Allen, Have a safe trip and I'll be in touch!!! Do you think you might be down in September?
THANKS AGAIN!!!
Mike
Okay...went outside real quick because the lighting in the house was terrible. I hope these show up okay, they were real quick and dirty in the rain...
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF1_zpsd2bd0909.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF1_zpsd2bd0909.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF6_zps2e907608.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF6_zps2e907608.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF5_zpsf2ae6532.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF5_zpsf2ae6532.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF2_zps167e11ef.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF2_zps167e11ef.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF7_zps1634ddc5.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF7_zps1634ddc5.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff310/StumpBuster/LibertyClassicSF4_zps6aedee9b.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/StumpBuster/media/LibertyClassicSF4_zps6aedee9b.jpg.html)
I drew the bow split finger and the angle might look strange because my wife was standing on the porch (I thought the fact that she's 4'-Nothing would help balance out the fact the porch is about 2' off the ground) :D
I tried to get the true color of the Yew and the excellent overlays on the belly side of the limb tips, but it was just too dark already and I couldn't get the camera to focus right.
I sure hope they show up okay (and I sized them correctly).
Stump Buster- What is your draw length?
With that grip pictured above... 30" right on the money from string to Back of Point.
I'm a 6'-4" knuckledragger (That's why my Anthropology major was a natural fit). I have an honest 32" draw with my recurves if I lock my bow arm straight and use a high wrist.
I try and force myself to bend my elbow when I shoot straight handle longbows and flatbows (actually I'm trying to force myself to bend my elbow all the time just so it becomes habit).
I was just noticing that the string angle was getting close to 90 degrees looks like in the picture. Figured you must be a lot bigger than me.
Ha ha, not quite 90, but the fact the camera was above me and I'm canting the bow, it probably looks more severe than it was.
I should add, that even though I was drawing this bow to 30"...I felt NO Stacking at all. It was very smooth throughout!
I should also add that it's a good thing I started back up on my cardio program...looks like I need to cut down some of my "survival muscle". :D
More good info Mike. I am a fellow 6'4" knuckledragger with 30" draw. :thumbsup:
Of course the clouds parted and the sun broke through to shine on this part of the planet about 5 minutes after I walked out of the post office this morning. Oh well, I wouldn't have had a chance to shoot today anyway.
Butchie, she's on the way to ya buddy, I'll PM you the tracking info. I hope you have the opportunity to spend a little more time shooting her than I did.
Mike
I received a Classic from Allen a couple of weeks ago. I have been a long time fan of Allen's bows. I have six of his English longbows and one Contender. The English has been a top favorite of mine for 12 years or so.
I was very interested to hear about the Classic when Allen first started considering a string follow longbow. I had never shot a string follow fiberglass bow, but I do own several selfbows that have varying degrees of string follow, the result of natural shapes of some wood bows.
Mt first challenge was trying not to compare the Classic to Allen's English. The Classic is a very different bow in all respects than the English. It took me a while to let go of that temptation, but I finally did.
I have shot the Classic for a couple of weeks. My first impressions have changed over those weeks, more than once actually.
First of all, it is a very easy bow to shoot accurately. It is very stable and forgiving of release inconsistencies. The sight window is wide open due to the narrow limb core, which I really appreciate. As others have noted the draw is very smooth and natural feeling. As far as speed goes, the Classic was not intended to be a speed demon, it was intended to make an archer a better archer. Is it fast enough? Absolutely.
The Classic invites confidence. Any bow that can achieve that is a great bow, and oddly, many bows don't. There is a big difference between knowing you are going to hit the mark and hoping you are going to hit the mark. Confidence is important.
On top of all of that it is a beautiful bow, like all of Allen's bows. Mine has really beautiful myrtle veneers and a myrtle handle. I have always preferred a straight grip, and Allen nailed it with the Classic grip.
If you appreciate longbows, the Classic is a bow you should seriously consider. It is one of those bows that you will hold on to, not because it is simply a beautiful longbow but because it may eliminate some of the elements that challenge accuracy and help make you a better hunting archer.
I know this thread is really about the Classic, but I recently bought a Liberty English here, and I couldn't be more impressed with this bow. So smooth it feels 10 lbs lighter, and when I'm on, it just stacks em up. Not to mention, with the black micarta riser, and bamboo under clear glass, one of the best looking bows I've ever seen.
Skunkhound:
If your English has a black riser the wood is probably gaboon ebony or African blackwood. They would be similar in appearance to micarta, but I've never used any in my bows. The English is a nice shooting bow too, enjoy it.
Allen