I wanted to see if anyone with a short drawlength (25") , has any experience with the static tip recurves? I have been reading all the posts I can to find on advantages and disadvantages of the static tips since I have never shot one. I read alot about how longer drawlengths gain an advantage reducing string angle. Obviously that isn't an issue with my short draw.
I have spoken to Kirk at Bigfoot and he was more than helpful answering questions and very personable!
I have been shooting a hybrid longbow for years that I build. trying to decide if it is worth it to spend the money on a custom bow or not? I am happy with what I am shooting. .. But only drawing 25 and shooting 42 to 45 lb I am looking for any increase in performance I could gain.
I can't decide if I want someone to persuade me to buy or not to buy one? Lol
so let's hear from all you draw challenged people out there. Or at least the ones who are honest about their drawlength!
I have a 25.5-26" draw and have shot and still do static limb bows. I love them. Very quiet and if I aim well they do the job. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them.
shoot bows that are no longer than 60inches and I would recommend a 58" to 56" bow....I would also use a reflex deflex longbow....or a recurve..get maximum performance from a bow if your draw length is short...I am 26 " or so and have alot of bows mostly 60 inch to 62 inch but I shoot heavier weight bows..if I was going lighter weight I shoot shorter bows ...also if hunting use as heavy an arrow you can that is tuned properly to your bow and draw....good luck
i shot a doe this year with a 60 inch Quartermoon recurve with Static tips...it was 52 # at 26 " and using a 630 grain arrow that went through the doe and kept going...love the bow...I have a photo of it in the Alberta thread with the doe under the 2013 hunting thread...
Here is a link to a comparison S2 Bowstrings did between a static tip recurve and a std recurve. From memory he draws about 26"
I don't think you will find a better or more comprehensive comparison out there.
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=122464#000009
I shoot bows under 50". Love static tips -- whether static recurves or horsebow siyahs. Both give you that extra oomph.
A static tip recurve isn't going to give you much, if any, performance increase over a proper length severe r/d hybrid, or a standard recurve, for that matter.
At a short draw length, you could actually lose performance with a static limb bow because you may not fully open the tips at full draw.
Matching bow length to draw length, i.e., shorter bow for shorter draw length, will yield a little more performance regardless of design type. Of course, a low strand count high performance string will also bump up the performance of any bow.
Other design features also come into play. A bow with a lot of early load will probably work best for you, regardless of the shape of the tips. Good luck in your search.
"Matching bow length to draw length, i.e., shorter bow for shorter draw length, will yield a little more performance regardless of design type."
I disagree. Most short bows have a long brace height, 8"+, to accommodate draws of 28" or better. Look for short bows w/ a short brace, under 7", for best performance w/ a short draw. I draw 26" and get my best performance from low brace bows.
Ryan Sanpei should be here shortly :)
Replied to your PM
I have a 26 inch draw and own a set of Max1 Static limbs and I DO believe they make a difference over other designs.
Prairie: A low brace height on a short bow, usually means a lot of early load. That's what I suggested in my last paragraph above.
Not really a static recurve but please look at my Toelke Kestral listed on the Classifieds. It would suit you perfectly. A smoother and harder hitting low poundage recurve you will not find, I promise. PM me if you have any questions or call me @ 409-880-5563.
Rick Richard, aren't Morrison's max1's a semi static like the border hex5 and hex6?
The max1's are very good recurve limbs imo.
Warden, you won't be disappointed with a bow from Kirk at bigfoot bows, extremely well balanced a timed limbs in a very efficient design. I am anxiously awaiting my ss build now to try his static.
QuoteOriginally posted by Orion:
Prairie: A low brace height on a short bow, usually means a lot of early load. That's what I suggested in my last paragraph above.
Gotcha :thumbsup:
I have a 24 3/4" draw. Im shooting static limbs on my Dryad Orion. It works great for my short draw.
Thanks for all the replies
QuoteOriginally posted by Orion:
A static tip recurve isn't going to give you much, if any, performance increase over a proper length severe r/d hybrid, or a standard recurve, for that matter.
At a short draw length, you could actually lose performance with a static limb bow because you may not fully open the tips at full draw.
Matching bow length to draw length, i.e., shorter bow for shorter draw length, will yield a little more performance regardless of design type. Of course, a low strand count high performance string will also bump up the performance of any bow.
Other design features also come into play. A bow with a lot of early load will probably work best for you, regardless of the shape of the tips. Good luck in your search.
What he said. :thumbsup:
Frank Eicholtz used to make a static recurve. He told me that they were draw length specific, but great shooters. I would bet with some modern design advances that if one was designed to match the shooter, it could very well be a very quick bow.
Orion gives good information. Some bowyers are known to modify there bow during build to maximize performance for the individuals draw length, 'custom' as pavan alluded to. (You have already talked with one warden415). Not just with a shorter bow but with limb layup and riser modifications. This can give what Orion refers to as early load and a shorter working limb for short draw archers.
I did the static tip thing too. Had one from a guy that has been building them for over 50 years. Another from one that's no longer w/ us and even today, was arguably the best static ever built.
I found there are several appealing qualities w/ STs but also found them more sensitive to my shooting style. I'm one that if I can't shoot bare shafts consistently w/ a bow, I move on to something else.
Hey Steve,
It was good talking to you on the phone the other day. In Orions post above he mentions that sometime a short draw length doesn't get the most out of a static tip RC. I have to agree with that statement in general.... but as i was saying on the phone i have laid the pad angles back for short draw shooters and adjusted the pre-load to shoot a low brace height with a forward placed grip on these Static tip limbs before, and got excellent performance at lower draw lengths....
but the thing to remember is once you have a custom bow build draw length specific... you have to becareful with long armed buddies drawing your bow or she vwon't last long....
Here is another option.... A static tip long bow...
These are still my best selling rigs because i can build them to high performance standards from 25" -32" draw lengths all in a 60" bow. I do build a 58" in this model too.
check out the tips at 27" draw. they haven't opened up a bit.
(http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u301/kirkll/Drawings/SasLblimbmovement.jpg) (http://s171.photobucket.com/user/kirkll/media/Drawings/SasLblimbmovement.jpg.html)
I build a lot of self bow static recurves from various woods. My thoughts on statics are this. I believe the string should be in contact with the belly of the bow for at least 3-4" at brace. I also believe that a true static tip should be at no less than 60 degrees to the back of the bow. Also, regardless of a persons draw length the string needs to leave the belly of the bow at about 50-60% draw, otherwise the statics aren't working as designed, they are just shortening the working limbs. I believe this translates to glass bows all the same. Basically a shorter draw length needs a shorter static, not a shorter bow necessarily.
I have seen bows that were designed to be great bows at 30", perform rather poorly for those with less than 27" draws. I have shot long draw custom recurves that at my my draw barely picked the string off of the limb. Those bows seemed touchy to me, there was something going on in the limb when my release was not perfect. I think that a bow that is optimized for a shorter draw will actually end being more forgiving and accurate for that short draw shooter than a comparable bow that would be optimized for a longer draw and it may even have better arrow speed. Regardless, forgiveness and accuracy has to be a primary consideration.
I build draw specific for short draw bow and they will perform better than a bow that is identical but built non draw specific.
All of my bows are static tip recurves and I also do as Kirk in stiffening the tips of the longbows and d and r longbows I build.
I know that Kirk and I both build draw specific static bows. I do not know who else does but would imagine some bowyers do.
Several guys that are regulars on Trad gang have purchased draw specific bows and they will probably comment if they read this thread. Some even have bought draw specific from both Me and Kirk.
God bless, Steve
Thank you, gentlemen. This has been an extremely informative thread. I have a 26" draw, and you folks have really started some wheels turning...
I must have two dozen books about archery and bowhunting and I don't think I have ever read a more cogent discussion of this issue. Man! I learn a lot from this forum!
I agree, very informative ! I an trying to gain as much knowledge as I can before I put the money down on the bow I decide. I have had several customs in the past but never one designed spec for a short draw. Always just got one that was kinda designed for a longer draw and I just drew it less. Maybe a shorter OAL than a long draw guy woukd get but basically the same bow.
Truth be told and im NOT a betting man but I would put $ down that there are a lot more short draw guys out there than will admit or even know they are! I know in my circle of friends there WERE a bunch of 28" or 29" draw guys until we actually put a arrow on with measurement on it and watched(well didn't watch lol) them draw. When they weren't over drawing and were just pulling correct. They soon found out they were 25 maybe 26"!
QuoteOriginally posted by PEARL DRUMS:
I build a lot of self bow static recurves from various woods. My thoughts on statics are this. I believe the string should be in contact with the belly of the bow for at least 3-4" at brace. I also believe that a true static tip should be at no less than 60 degrees to the back of the bow. Also, regardless of a persons draw length the string needs to leave the belly of the bow at about 50-60% draw, otherwise the statics aren't working as designed, they are just shortening the working limbs. I believe this translates to glass bows all the same. Basically a shorter draw length needs a shorter static, not a shorter bow necessarily.
I'm not sure i agree with this classifcation of a true static tip bow or not. But it's quite obvious you've been building these awhile. The difference between how this translates to a composite bow over a bow built from natural material is rather large.IMO The mechanics of the lever and how it effects the length of the working portion of the limb is identical. But where the difference lies is the materials of a composite bow will withstand a lot more compression and tension using half of the mass weight in the limb. Not only that, the composite limbs recover much quicker to their original shape without energy loss over time.
Composite limbs can also be built with a much more aggressive hook and still remain stable. There are a lot of true static tip limbs out there with very aggressive hooks that the string doesn't lift off the limb completely until almost the end of the draw..... this in fact makes a incredibly smooth drawing bow that can produce excellent performance if the pre load is still good and it's stopping the limbs dead without too much limb bulge.
The point you've made is excellent about how a static tip bow for a shorter draw length would benefit having the limb pad angles laid back more so the levers on the tip can do their job to their fullest. This could be done by moving the tip notches out further on the curl to mitigate pre-load loss of laying the pads back, as long as your brace height didn't increase too much.
I too am gravity challenged and have been pondering the same issue. Just chrono'd my Stalker Wolverine with Static limbs 58" 45# @26. My string is 14 strands of 8125. Arrow is a Easton Axis Traditional 600 spine about 490 gr total (250 up front). I'm getting on avg about 160 fps. Just got some Beman Centershots too which are actually lighter gpi so I should be getting a slight but in speed. Will post when I get a chance to tune those arrows.
I also have a PSE Talon that is also 58" and last time I checked weight/dl where within a lb. When I get a chance I'll shoot that through the chrono because that one has Dynamic recurve limbs. Kinda curious how it'll fair against the Stalker. Should be interesting.
(https://scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q77/s320x320/1531623_10100851139895816_735376882_n.jpg) (https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1493346_10100851139895816_735376882_o.jpg)