Hey guys I am really considering buying a KME knife sharpener with my Christmas money. I just wanted to know your opinions on which stones to buy, either the diamond stones or the ceramic/Arkansas stones. I will be using it to work over my hunting knives along with my simmons sharks and zwickys. I will also be purchasing one of their leather strops with their 4,000 grit finishing polish to get my edges to a mirror finish. Thanks for any suggestions, SS
I know Ron advised me to go with the Arkansas stones when I bought mine. I tried them and then went to the diamond stones and like them a lot more. I am a very sharpening challenged individual, so I may not be the best to give advice.
I can tell you this, though, whatever you do, get the kangaroo leather strop and the 4 micron stopping emulsion. I just got mine for Christmas and it really makes the blades SHARP, SHARP, SHARP!!!!!!
Bisch
Hi Taylor, this is the BEST KNIFE sharpener you can buy IMHO. Be sure to get the "Diamond" stones. I've had mine for 3 years and have sharpened ALOT of knives and broadheads...NO wear on the "stones" at all so far and all you need is a little water { the water applicator is included}. Be sure to also purchase the Pedistal hand holder base, this is a big plus. I'm not sure if you can sharpen "concave" surfaces like the Simmons Sharks with this system, I think you can purchase a "stone" to sharpen them with it though. I have sharpened MANY convex and replaceable blade broadheads with my Diamond set. In my opinion, you don't need any strops etc to get a mirror finnish on a blade if you buy the Diamond "stones". My blades come out mirror finnish and HAIR popping sharp. I'm telling you .....this is the best sharpener you can buy.... Lloyd
I have the KME broad head sharpener with the Arkansas stones, and it does a very good job. I also have used diamond stones (not part of the set) also with good success. I think you will be just fine whichever you choose. Clean up may be a bit easier with the diamond stone since water is easier to clean up than honing oil. I started getting much better results when I used very light pressure when using the fine stone.
If you have D2 steel knives or other steels over Rockwell 60 you'll need the diamond or lots of patience. Otherwise, the stones are sufficient. I have both for my KME and that's the best of all worlds.
We have been playing with the diamond stones lately and have made this finding. It does get anything sharp and works well on harder steels. However we believe that it leaves a toothy edge that is inferior to a highly polished edge that is attainable with a stone. On softer metal like most broadheads it is even more noticeable. The buffing compound is good for a finishing polish with eitther type of stone but all diamond sharpened edges will have that toothy edge even after polishing.
I've had the KME system(s) (BH and Knife) for a few years.
Lately, Ron found an incredible RED stone for his BH sharpener. Then even MORE recently, a new supplier for his diamond stones for both systems.
I tried to change the bevel on some hard BH's and wore myself and my knife diamonds out! These new ones are the bomb!
I don't particularly like the smell of honing oil, so tend to use the 3 grit diamond stones with water. Ron did tell me I could use plane vegetable oil on regular stones...
There is also a diamond wide stone for the BH Sharpener now. SWEET!
I'd say if you're trying to "set" (or re-set) the bevel angle, get diamond. For regular touch up and super sharpening of normal steel or keeping the bevel edge you have, his regular stones are quite excellent!
Could I just use a file to set the bevel than finish the edge with the stones as opposed to getting the diamond stones ? I'm really torn on what to do. My main concern is to get my blades extremely sharp and most of my work will be touch ups on my broadheads and knives. I do use zwickys though which do need some serious work before I am happy with them which I assume the diamond stones would do alot better. I just don't know which to choose. Thanks for the advice , SS
The course ceramic stone is the way to do your serious work on the Zwickys. You can follow with either the lighter stones or diamond.
I like the ceramic stones all the way on my knives and two blade heads.
Mike
Diamonds cut faster, but you said you want to use them on your knives as well as broadheads. Most knife blades are harder than broadheads and there is a tendency to "bear down" just a bit more on the knife. If you do that, you will probably shave the diamonds off the base. At least I did it on a couple of Lansky diamond tools putting the initial edge on my ATS-34 knives I was making.
The key is light pressure. Then either stones or diamonds will work fine. I quite often use a file on BH's to set the initial bevel, but you have to be careful to set it to the same angle as your KME sharpener will set, or you won't save much time. I think you will be happy with the KME regardless of which stones you decide on.
I purchased the coarse diamond stone along with the real stones when I bought mine. I use my diamond stone more than the others.
Yes, it leaves tool marks, but it is coarse, I expect that. That is why I have (and use) the progression of real stones and finally a cloth wheel.
I feel the diamond stone (coarse or extra coarse) is great for the first shaping of the blade, then you need to polish it up and get it real sharp.
Chuckc
I hear ron has new diamond stones from extra course out to something in the thousands--
I was testing [abusing]one and have not been able to see ANY wear!--not only that the grit seems very consistent-leaving a very uniform grind--
I was a stone guy --but now swear by the diamonds--followed by a stropping!!
ron should chime in soon!!
You have been given tons of great advice so far..... don't ya love the gang here !
Here is my .02 cents.... Number one the KME knife sharpener is the greatest tool ever devised hands down on this planet ! Number two I have a complete set of diamonds, ceramic, and arkansas stones thanks to Ron and IMHO the xtra coarse diamond and medium arkansas are the best two stones to have, then strop on leather. The number one issue some folks have that are new to a KME is getting the bevel set on a blade ALL the way down to the edge and forming a burr FIRST. Once that is done then you can polish an edge to your heart's content going thru as many grits as you prefer. I just cannot say enough good about a KME.
On all my kitchen knives I simply use the X coarse diamond and sharpen to a burr, flip and sharpen to a burr on that side, then flip back and forth a few times lightly taking the burr off and good enough for a month of kitchen duties usually. Dishwasher, banging around on each other in the drawer, and a wife and daughter who like to cut cornbread with them instead of a steak knife right on a hard plate.... well you get the picture. Hell on a nice KME edge so I do not spend lots of time on them getting them to a polished razor's edge.
On my broadheads or hunting knives I do go from X coarse diamond to a med arkansas, then fine, then leather. Makes a huge diff and as others have said above, " gets rid of the toothy edge", that you get from the x coarse diamond. However, even though your edge may not feel as "sharp" and grabby, rest assured it is and will last longer and cut you before you know it ! Nothing like a true razor edge. We normally gut 4-6 deer a year off a KME razor edged Buck 110 folder that you can buy at Walmart for $30-40. You can still shave with it and we gut our deer all the way to the brisket, cutting thru the cartilage that connects the ribs to the sternum too. I can only imagine what a great knife would do with a KME edge. Before KME I always loathed trying to sharpen a Buck or Case knife due to their high hardness and not being able to hold and keep a consistent bevel. Now that hardness only means a longer lasting edge thanks to a KME. JMHO fellas....... :coffee:
I use both. I start with the course diamond stones and then when I have the desired burr I switch to the natural stones all the way down to the extra fine stone and then stropped on leather.
Silent Sniper..... almost forgot to tell you a few more things that others have mentioned too. If you do get the diamond stones do like Bladepeek says.... do not bear down on them or you will pull the diamonds out of the electroplating that holds them to the base metal of the stone !!! Diamonds do not need pressure to cut the steel, they are so much harder they will "eat " the steel for breakfast ! Use a sharpie to mark up your edge first and you will see how fast the diamonds remove metal. The sharpie will also help you see when you are almost down to the edge and have formed a complete bevel. Once the sharpie is gone as it appears to your eye start using your fingernail to feel for a full blade length burr from the opposite side. Once you have that you are ready to flip to Side 2 and repeat. I am with Doc Noc above too..... hate the honing oil smell so switched to olive oil, works fine.
Just placed an order for the CBN 4 micron honing oil and leather. I CANNOT wait to try this out on the new Mora Fillet Knife I have on order with Two Tracks....... :readit:
No, I repeat, no wasted backstrap meat as we will use this super sharp fillet knife to trim up and cut off the silver skin on our backstraps ! I told Ron @ KME that we will be able to read the newspaper thru the silver skin and trimmings off our backstraps now.
Jimmy,
What I found using cooking oil was it turned rancid in storage and when used again, the stink of that almost superseded that of honing oil! I scrubbed my stones (not a bad idea periodically) and rinsed in hot water and got the grit out of them and they're back to pristine.
That black marker on the actual cutting edge is key too, along with raising a burr the whole length before quitting with coarsest whatever.
Many trying to change a bevel (knife or BH) THINK they got it nailed, but the marker often is key. That, and it allows you to keep adjusting the degree of the knife sharpener for each knife or BH so that you KNOW what bevel you have/had, and can mark it down to repeat rather than re-shaping the bevel---which can take time!
My best success on Zwickey No Mercy was with the coarse diamond. I have both types. The initial grind on the No Mercy left much to be desired.
58
Question: Opinions on THE Best Place to Aquire this Whoop-Butt Knife Sharpener? Its on my List to Aquire, because I am also Sharpening Deficient. :help:
Shakes. Call KME direct. Ron will fix you up and answer all your questions.
58
alright guys from the general consensus I believe I am going to order the set of diamond stones. I am going to get the set of coarse, fine, x-fine diamond stones along with the leather strop and the 4 micron abrasive. I hope with these I will be able to get my broad heads and knives scary scary sharp, that is my goal. I know the deer will never notice how sharp my broad heads are but for me the sharper the better! Thanks again for all the suggestions and any additional input is much appreciated! Thanks SS.
Shakes....yes, call Ron. Best SOB you'll ever talk to and no BS! Guaranteed!
Snipe,
Ron swears by regular corrugated cardboard, but have at the leather strop... I got a leather strop used across my butt more'n I care to remember as a youngster... but cardboard, across the ripples has worked super for me adn is CHEAP...
Be sure to get that burr along the edge all the length and then flip and do so on the other side before smoothing it out... You'll have SHARP.
I was the founder and CEO of Can't Sharpen Shix, Int'l for years, till Ron hooked me up!
Thanks to everyone for the well informed replies and all the kind words. ... and thanks for the heads-up on this Doc!
Diamonds (especially the very coarse ones) are superior for changing the shape of a cutting edge from rounded over dull back to V shaped and sharp. Ceramics and Arkansas stones can then refine and polish that edge, but don't ask a ceramic or Arkansas stone to do much in the way of stock removal.
Even a XXC 60 grit ceramic is not in the same league as a 140 grit diamond when it comes to stock removal. (think out of the pack Zwickies, older Grizzlies, and very dull knives). Diamond is just a far more aggressive cutting material.
That said, the 140 grit diamond hone will also produce a true hair shaving edge. It'll be coarse and toothy, similar in feel and appearance to a file sharpened edge but it will plow the hair right off your arm. This is the most critical step in sharpening anything... getting the blade very, very sharp right at the start, using only the coarsest stone you have. ...and when in doubt, go coarser. There are lots of ways to get from sharp to broken glass sharp BUT going from dead dull to sharp requires the coarsest, most aggressive stone, file, or sometimes even belt grinder you have.
Once the blade shaves, it's now very easy to refine the edge with finer grit stones to any level of sharpness you may be looking for because each successive grit stone only needs to remove the scratches left by the previous grit. At this point you can refine the edge using either finer grit diamond hones or ceramic/Arkansas stones. Both work very well and we're really getting into the area of personal preference now.
One more "but" though... Diamonds are great for taking a blade from dead blunt to hair plowing sharp in no time BUT... there's a limit on how fine of an edge you can create using only diamond hones. Used with a very light touch, an XF-1500 grit diamond hone will produce an incredibly sharp edge... way sharper than an out of the pack utility knife blade but not nearly as refined as a 1000 grit ceramic or Arkansas can and not "polished" in any real sense of the word. This is where ceramics, black and translucent Arkansas and stropping are far more efficient than diamonds.
So, it's really not a question of which type is "better", it's more a question of what do you want the stone to do.
Questions?
Thanks!
Ron
That is so right Ron..... they are VERY sharp when they come off even a X coarse diamond, plough hair like crazy. As a matter of fact most folks have never had a knife or BH even this sharp due to not being able to hold a consistent angle. I remember being so frustrated by getting my long bladed hunting knives either almost sharp or shaving sharp only the partial length of the blade. Never again !!!
On my hunting knives or someone else's knife that I want to show how well the KME knife sharpener works I will go thru the steps of X coarse, then medium arkansas, then fine arkansas, then stropped on leather. The difference is felt when you shave your arm or leg..... with just the X coarse diamond the hair will "pop" off and you feel a little, "pull" from the edge. After going thru full polishing and stropping the hair simply falls off and no pull at all from the edge. Also you can shave even the thickest patch of hair in one smooth swipe and skin is totally hairless and slick. Just like a brand new razor is for shaving your face. And remember.... a factory razor is VERY thin and VERY small, fragile edge angle compared to a hunting knife so it has a huge advantage for just shaving hair.
By the way..... a trick to save you $$$ on razor blades. I take a 4 pack of Mach III's and get 3-4 months shaving off them and I have a very stiff, coarse beard and shave 4-5 days a week for work. Every morning I strop my blade by pushing it backwards up my forearm about 8-10 times and a few times during shaving. Your skin is leather ! Keep your blade and arm as dry as you can during stropping by patting dry on a towel.
QuoteOriginally posted by Doc Nock:
I was the founder and CEO of Can't Sharpen Shix, Int'l for years, till Ron hooked me up!
Doc, why are you claiming to be the founder and CEO of MY company? :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
Bisch
Doc and Bisch. I got a good laugh out of that one, but I felt the same until I got the KME.