I'm interested in trying them after reading the good Doctor Ashby's report. I've read Little Feather's sharp along (great work along!), but I've never messed around with the Grizzlies and I'm wanting to know just how hard are they to get sharp for hunting. I need a broadhead of around 175 grains, so, I'll have to make some up. I just didn't want to spend money on them and then get frustrated when I can't get them up to par. Thanks, Bobby
use the 160's with aluminum inserts then..don't use the 125's, as in my opinion, they are not the quality of steel the bigger heads are.
This is "war". I'm going to do a pictorial on the way I sharpen them, which is partly how Doc showed me he did them, and partly my own method.
It gets them done in about 10 minutes the first time out of the package...2 minutes each after that first time.
Ray, I'm awaiting your command, sir. Thanks, Bobby
I would also like to see that Ray, thanks, Gary
Me Too :saywhat: :thumbsup:
Now that I know of the new KME broadhead sharpening system, the grizzlies will be fun to sharpen :)
i would love to see your system also!!!
I have found a couple of tools that really help to sharpen the Grizzly's.
1. First I need a good articulating vise to hold those rascals. Harbor Freight has an excellent hobby vise that uses a suction cup to stick to my kitchen table. The vise will turn up, down and sideways in more ways than a Yoga master.
2. Next is a nice Color TV, cause many enjoyable evenings are spent sharpening Grizzly's in front of the Discovery Channel.
3. File. Use a nice new file with some type of file handle. Your hands will get pretty sore without the handle. My favorite file is of a triangular shape. The Triangle shape is a stiffer file than a standard 6 or 8 inch flat file. Chalk up the file and only push the file, never drag backward. Smooth easy strokes, removing metal slowly. Lay that file down at a low angle and don't be afraid of taking off metal. Until you get the hang of it expect to shave some off the ferrule. Use a Sharpie marker as Dykem (metal stain) if you're unsure of what you're doing to the edge. Push the file into the edge you're sharpening.
4. Medium India Oil stone and a bit of mineral oil. The opposite side of the bevel edge should have a faint bevel line from the Oil stone. Be gentle on this side, pushing the stone into the edge of the broadhead.
5. One hairy left forearm. About his time of year my left forearm is always shaved off of most of the hair. I know of no better way to test my Grizzly's than the shave the hair off my left forearm (I'm right handed) For you lefties, well you guys have shaved right forearms I guess.
Sharpen the bevel side with the file, turn the broadhead over, place in opposite side of the vise and sharpen the non-bevel side with the Oil stone. The oil stone will actually bring you to the razor edge. Again, I'll keep the braodhead stationary nad move the stone voer the edge, like you're trying to shave off a peice of the stone. Keep some oil on the stone and it won't clog up with metal filings. If you've got an Arkansas Hard Stone use that the take off the burr if you don't like a burr edge.
Grizzly's are quite easy to sharpen, for me the trick is to mount that rascal into a vise that I can adjust for comfortable filing & stoning
I don't like using aluminum broadhead adapters on the Grizzly broadhead, since the aluminum adapter becomes a weak point. Steel Broadhead adapters come in 75, 100 and 125 grain options. JB Weld epoxy works best for me as adhesive. Tough stuff, never had a failure.
I've noticed that shooting properly sharpened Grizzly's into 2 by 4 construction lumber results in the wood splitting due to the rotational force of the bevel. Backs up what Doc Ashby said about the broadhead spinning through animals.
the only tool i use for my 160 grizzleys is a rediedge. after about ten minutes per head i am shaving hair off my arm. i couldn't get the file method right so i tried the rediedge. best $17.00 i've ever spent.
tm
I use a file, ceramic and time.
If starting on new grizzlies then I file at an angle where the file just misses the ferrel. File until you can see and feel all the flats on the edge are gone.
I file many times on the bevel side and then one swipe down the other side to knock the burr off.
Once there is an edge the entire length of the blade then touch up the edge with the ceramic. Again, I run it on the bevel side and one or two swipes down the flat side.
I use the 160s and 190s glued onto wood arrows.
The 190 quickly took down a bull elk this year.
BigArcher
In the wood working business this is called the Scary Sharp sharpening method. It was designed to sharpen woodworking tools like plane blades. As a grizzley has a single bevel it can me sharpened in this way without modification.
You need a 12 X 12 sheet of plate glass, a spray can of temporary adhesive and 10 sheets of met dry automotive sand paper in grits from 650 - 2000
you can use a jug of some sort to keep your angle concise. Draw the broadhead blade edge from the ferrule edge to the ouside edge with medium to light pressure about 15 strokes to a side. Then move up a level in grit and repeat. By the time you get to the 2000 the edge will look mirror shiny. Run the flat side on the edge lightly flat against the sheet of sandpaper just in case there is a bead (or is it beede?_ DO NOT TOUCH this edge. It will be just as the name of the method would indicate. You can use this method to sharpen any broadhead just use common sense in adapting the method to a different broadhead.
can't wait Ray ;)
Ray, may just have an Osceola hunt, pig hunt or maybe even a gator hunt for some hands on training. Ten minutes out of the pack...sign me up.
DonD
no, sorry, wife in the hospital for a couple days..coming home tonight.
will get it done this weekend, fellas. See it here on Monday latest.
Yikes, hope the bride is A-okay.
Hope all is well
well, she is doing better...but not completely. I hereby promise to take photos and upload tonight, guys..sorry its taking so long but Gloria has needed some handholding and assistance and I am doing that now...so that's my only excuse.
Talk to you tonight.
Ray, even as much as I love my hunting, at times there are things even more important. Hope Gloria is doing well, Amigo. You look after her. A good woman who can put up with old codgers like us are mighty hard to find!
Ed
Sounds good Ray ;) Take care of the wife :thumbsup: Hope she is feeling alright.
God bless!
Craig
In my defense,since you now know I did not keep my promise, I had to get the garage cleaned up ...one of those necessary things one must do to keep the peace..as my hunting stuff was leaking over into the other two parking spots and I was parking OUTSIDE!!!!!!!!
I will get it done this evening, though.
Thanks for the thoughts and prayers. She will be better.
....I've seen Ray's garage and basement. This could take a while. You could fit my whole little beach bungalow inside his garage!
All the best to Gloria.
http://aussiebowhunter.com/images/PDFGRIZZLYBROADHEADS.pdf
Here's something I found last night to tide us over until Ray is able to get his pics up ;) I differ slightly from this process but it does work great! Maybe it's just me, but I think that using a stone on the Grizzly (I'm using a set of Arkansas Stones, as opposed to the India Stones in the Article, it works great) makes it slightly sharper as an end result. I use the stone, then leather, then go to my paper wheel mounted on a grinder. Never seen a sharper broadhead ;) It will shave hair, even facial hair, effortlessly.
Craig
Glad you've got it worked out Craig. That link you posted is Cher's article on one of the easier ways to sharpen the Grizzly (without power-assist) - after all, she's a GIRL and if SHE can manage a truly sharp edge on a Grizzly ... (Dang, I can see the hackles rising on Killdeer and Pinecone already!)
Now that you're 'over the hump', I think you'll find the Grizzly one of the easiest high-R hardness BH's to sharpen to a TRULY SHARP edge. Through the years, I've used countless different sharpening methods on them, and all methods will produce a beard-shaving edge. Some are just more time-efficient than others.
Ed
Ed,
Yessir. I will say I believe this is the sharpest head I've ever produced. I was shooting 4 bladed broadheads before the latest single bevel report came out. Very convincing.
Though I lack the personal experience to say so with any level of certainty, I don't see why a broadhead this sharp would leave no bloodtrail. I would THINK (note again this is not even a theory, only a hypothesis) that any hit would leave at least SOME blood to follow. Heck I cut my finger with one this morning and it bled pretty good :D What has your experience been?
With that twisting motion it seemed to me to be the best of both worlds: lots of tissue damage AND great penetration. I'm confident it'll do the job ;)
God bless,
Craig
Craig, I've spent a quarter century and over a quarter-million dollars trying to find the most consistently lethal arrow setup possible, under all hit conditions. To that end, I've tested several hundred different broadheads, on an huge array of arrow setups. If I thought there was ANY broadhead out that that gave me a better chance of turning every single hit I made into a clean kill, or that gave me a higher chance of recovering every animal I hit, you can bet that I'd be using it! I've no ax to grind. I'm just passing along whatever I learn as I go about the testing. What BH folks use isn't going to make me richer or poorer. I don't make or sell any broadheads ... or anything else! Heck, I buy all my equipment at retail, just like everyone else!
Ed
Dr. Ashby,
Agreed. I am the worst "over-anylizer" I know personally :D Just trying to find a happy medium ;) Hard to decide sometimes, but with my whitetail hunt so close, I'm stuck with the Grizzlies and SilverFlames. Grizzlies will probably be first in the quiver :)
For me, arrow and bow choices are a lot easier than the broadhead choice. I'm pretty convinced on the first two, the latter drives me crazy :banghead:
Craig
" The most effective setup is the best arrow I can get, and the cheapest bow that'll work." - Glenn Newell
Not a bad quote!
Ed
I thought you weren't going to tell me which was the best broadhead. Heck, I don't have to look any more. I suppose I'll use some of these four dozen El Grandes I have here. :bigsmyl:
I agree, when you learn to bust the angle and get these babies sharp there's nothing sharper. CK
Hope the wife is doing better Ray! If you need a place to store some hunting stuff I think I have an extra barn that's not in use. :D CK
Oh man, I was going to have Glen build me one of his bows. Maybe I should have him build me some arrows instead. :bigsmyl:
With all due respect, I don't understand why the manufacturer won't sell 'em with the edge already ground???? Seems like buying a car without the tires or a knife without an edge.
I have no problem maintaining an edge, but having to grind and set the thing is something I simply don't want to mess with. Hopefully with the new found marketability of these great heads (thanks to Dr. Ashby), the manufacturer can justify the added step in their process. Although, from what I can tell the Abowyer is not a bad option as a "close second" perhaps.(?)
Jim
Jimmy, I haven't seen the set-up for grinding the broadheads but I used to use a grinder similar to what is generally used. Many times you can only grind to a certain degree of bevel before you loose adjustment. I'm pretty sure the grinder angle is maxed out on his particular grinder. I heard tale things are changing though. CK
Curtis, you'd like Glenn's bows. Cher has one, and it sure shoots good. However, if'n you're a tad worried now, he makes beautiful footed arrows too! Glenn's doing a grip build-up and adding some overlays to a Harry Elburg bow for me right now. I had a bit of albino buffalo horn that going to look real nice, I think.
I think Glenn's considering making another trip to the States sometime next year. I been trying to convince him that he owes it to himself to stop by and see both you and O.L.; so don't fill ALL your spare barn space up storing Ray's excess goodies - just in case! :jumper:
Ed
Doc, Cher called yesterday and I missed her again. I did write her a lengthy email.
Glenn called awhile back and said he wouldn't be dropping by this year but possibly next. He's issued an invite to come stay in his "old" house since he's finished the new one there in Oz. It would be an awesome trip. He won't build me a bow till the house in completely complete. :D
Say, what gives with the angle question above. Can he get any more out of the grinder. I know you've been by the shop. CK
Curtis, as I understand it, the grinder is maxed-out, and the 'new angle' - about 26.5 degrees - is as flat as it will go.
Ed
:readit: Where ya at Ray? LOL :bigsmyl:
I got a question for you "experts". I had a friend present an interesting theory to me today about single bevel broadheads. He said that if the arrow spirals through the animal, it would have to lose momentum and therefore the arrow would look for "the path of least resistance" to follow. So if the arrow was driving straight through to the heart, and was spinning inside the animal, it could, in theory, spiral around the heart and miss it, as it was looking for the path of least resistance. Take, for example a bullet. Bullets will sometimes enter one place and exit somewhere completely different, as they look for the path of least resistance.
I've never heard of such a thing happening with any broadhead. Your thoughts?
Craig
Here's a pic I took in Iowa last winter, after I'd filled my antlerless tag...Magnus 4 blade was still rotating, right along the back edge of a nice fat 6-8 month old doe. 17yds, on the ground, kill zone was right about eye level at the shot! Granted, this doe was not a wide bodied critter, but that arrow was fo sho rotating, while passing thru!
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b147/fireman_3311/IMGP6746.jpg)
Craig, try to wade through some of the study updates. In each of the multitudinous side-by-side test of identical blade-profile single vs. double-bevel BH's; on identical setups, the single bevel has shown a marked increase in outcome penetration when a bone hit is involved. An arrow does not (can not) do that by 'losing its momentum as it spirals through the animal' more rapidly that its comparison arrow. In fact, every result indicates that the rotating single-bevel BH RETAINS more of its useful, penetration-producing momentum longer than the like-profile double-bevel BH's.
Any broadhead can be glanced off a bone when the angle of impact is wrong, and that can deviate the course of an arrow's penetration. A structural-failure in the arrow system; a bent or broken BH, adaptor, insert or shaft; can cause a change in the course of penetration. An animal's body movements can cause a change in the course of an arrow's penetration. All these will deviate the course of arrow penetration. Other than their course of penetration being deviated by an externally occurring event (force), arrow penetration is linear through an animal - whether the BH is single or double-bevel.
The rotation of the single bevel BH's show a constant rate of rotation as they penetrate a given tissue. They do not seek a 'path of least resistance' during penetration. You can put your mind at rest on that one. After dissecting many hundred single-bevel caused wound-channels, I can ABSOLUTELY assure you that your friend's theory is not something you need to be concerned about. I've never seen any results that even remotely suggest such events.
Ed
Brad, I'd speculate that collision of your BH's blade with a bone initiated some rotation of your arrow on that particular hit. Close examination of the ribs would, almost certainly, show evidence of the BH skidding a tiny amount, with the blade being torqued either right or left. With single-blade heads, it's very common for them to skid on a rib's curved surface, slide along the rib and enter at the first available intercostal space. During this process, the single-blade BH - with an astounding degree of frequency - tends to "right itself", with the wound through the intercostal space being parallel to the rib's edge. Of course a multi-blade can't 'right itself', but their wound channels show the same effect; a rotational movement of the broadhead is induced as the head slips along and past the rib.
On 'all soft tissue hits' double-bevel BH rotation stops at the instant of tissue impact. The wound channel will show no rotation until some outside force causes the double-bevel BH to begin a rotational movement; and the most commonly occurring 'outside force' to do this has been bone-collision. It's fairly common for the wound-channel of double-bevel BH's to show some rotation of the BH immediately following a bone impact. However, the spiral is not one sustained for very long. Once whatever torque force was applied to the arrow during its collision with the bone is expended, the double-bevel BH's wound channel ceases to show an arrow rotation.
The big difference is that any rotation of a double bevel BH is dependent of the random occurrence of an outside event. A single-bevel's rotation is induced by tissue pressure against the bevel; which results from the arrow's forward force applied to the tissues. It is constant and consistent.
Ed