I have a doz surewood doug firs soaking. They started at 474-495 range. I have them in a 1.5" PVC tube. I want to add 125ish grains to each shaft.
Anyone soaked shafts in the WATCO before and what were your results?
After removing from the tube, how long was the dry time?
After drying I'll likely dip a few more times to get the weights nearer to each other with the end result being 590-600 range before adding nock, fletch, and point.
If you have used Watco before, any tips would be appreciated. I may crown dip and crest, but time will be the dictator. I need these finished and some range time behind them to be ready for a hunt in early Dec.
I have never even heard of doing this, but I am interested!
L.R.
Check out these threads:
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=078639#000004
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=073866#000000
Still looking for clear final dip compatibility. Any help is appreciated.
Poly u works with about everything.
I used it years ago, but it was POC not DF. I was not able to gain anywhere near that kind of weight, but it did add some. Wipe on poly worked fine over it.
I now "point load" my wood arrow set ups instead to gain weight, which works well.
Like Tim, I find going up in point weight to be the best method for me. 200 gr is now my standard point weight and I'll go higher if I want more total weight.
Soaking works, but 125 gr is quite a bit and it tends to be inconsistent. Give the oil at least a week to dry, maybe more. Oil base poly will work as a finish.
I do this routinely....I use surewood doug firs and soak them for about 5 days in 3 inch pvc tubes, about a dozen in each tube...
so far my shafts have gained around 80 grains or so each, and that's about the average.
the issue is drying time. I hang them off of clothespins in the garage and leave them for about 10 days...it takes a while for all that deep soaked in oil to really dry...more time in rainy season obviously.
Then I use the minwax wipe on polyurethane to put a final finish on them.
My arrows end up weighing just over 800 grains with a 200 grain Ace hatchet on the tip.
They hit the target like a 300 win mag.
And do they ever make the longbow quiet....
I'm not sure you can get 125 grains, but you'll get close.
another idea is call Surewood Steve and ask him to sort the heaviest arrows in your preferred spine and start out with the heaviest ones you can find...then do the soak.
Good luck!
i soak mine in linseed oil,no finish needed.
oh yeah...another plus is you can lose that arrow in the yard for two years, find it, refletch it, and shoot it cause it is SO sealed it'll last a long time...
Thanks Russ. I did get the heaviest Steve had on hand and an extra 5lb in spine for heavier head use. Looking for a 720gr or thereabouts finished arrow. Heavier is OK.
QuoteOriginally posted by ironmike:
i soak mine in linseed oil,no finish needed.
ok, I have NEVER heard of this!
last time I used linseed oil was to soften up a baseball glove in elementary school!
L.R.
QuoteOriginally posted by Lone Ranger:
QuoteOriginally posted by ironmike:
i soak mine in linseed oil,no finish needed.
ok, I have NEVER heard of this!
last time I used linseed oil was to soften up a baseball glove in elementary school!
L.R. [/b]
I soak/wipe down wooden garden tool handles and hammer/axe handles in boiled linseed oil. It's a great way to preserve those wooden tools. Never considered it for arrows.
Tru oil is made with linseed oil. Linseed oil is one of the original wood finishes.
I've soaked them for about a week and let dry for another week an never put any type of sealer over them..The oil has kept the moisture out once dried and I lost several and a year being outside the feathers faded and the points were rusty but the shaft never swelled and still good as the day I soaked them...If you want to crest them go to a Hobby shop and bye some model railroad paint called "Floquil" I believe and it leaves a flat finish which I prefer...I used Duco cement for fletching the feathers on...
Thanks Keefer :)
Bud,
Something I meant to mention... It seemed to me that any shafts that had a tighter or more grain lines in it looking at the ends before tapering the more grain lines didn't soak as much..In other words if the shaft is whiter or loose grain it soaked more oil...I did a chart and weighed them before and after but cann't remember what it was...Just remember if you were to saok an ash shaft compared to a port orford ceder you will see the ceder may pick up more weight then the ash did....I'm no expert but I think the softer woods soak more and the less grain lines or tighter lines do as well...
One more thing you will notice is when you cut the excess off a shaft and the soaking was done correctly you will notice it went through the whole shaft...The longer the soaking is probally better .
Really makes a nice dull looking arrow that resists water and a great way to add weight..
Also use Duco on the nocks!
Keefers <")))><
Keefer is right about the entire shaft really soaking the oil totally into the whole shaft...and I think this makes the arrow tougher overall...once all that oil dries and hardens up the arrow is just harder....
I've bounced some into and off of rocks while shooting around the yard and thought the arrow was bound to be torn up...but when I got to it and picked it up it was okay....
the oil soak kinda bulletproofs 'em....
Thanks guys. I was just about to post a status report when I read the last two posts.
Spot on...
I took the shafts out and let them hang to drip-dry and then weighed them. I also checked for straightness and straightened where needed. I marked each shaft with the grain weight before soaking. So far these are gaining 15-25gr and I did notice the tighter grains gained the lesser. All the shafts are now above 500gr but if allowed to dry I'm sure they'd drop. I banded them together tightly with rubber bands and back into the Watco they went. I might let these soak until the first week in Nov (maybe 11/4) and then call it. I need to have these dry and made up before Dec 6th and with time to shoot them for tune.
If I can get them up to 530-550 I'll be happy. I think I'll need a 145 or 160 head after making the arrows so that'll put me at or over the 720gr finished arrow weight range I'm looking for.
I am curious now about cedar and soaking them. And also about poplar.
Thanks for the input.
When I get these dry and get a finish on them I'll update the thread for future reference for others so any continued input from you Watco experienced guys and gals is appreciated... :)
A side note....I used the natural Watco so these shafts are already reeeeeal purty :thumbsup:
I soaked my loosely in a 3 inch pvc tube so all the arrows could evenly soak on all sides...
I wonder how yours will evenly soak when they're banded together..?
You think you might have some spots that dont get oil...or will it soak in completely anyway...?
I would think Poplar, being wide ringed, would soak up the most oil. Hope you get a chance to test that.
Mine are in a 1.5" PVC tube and they were banded when initially put in the tube. Preliminary indications are they are getting a good all around soak. I have thought of warming the oil to aid penetration but o far all seems well. A doz 11/32 shafts fit nicely in the tube and one pint completely submerged them. I have an old pill bottle sitting between the cap and shafts forcing the shafts downward to stay submerged.
QuoteOriginally posted by Green:
I would think Poplar, being wide ringed, would soak up the most oil. Hope you get a chance to test that.
Let me get past Christmas and magnus will be getting a PM. ;)
Hey Bud, rather than warming the oil, you might use a heat gun on the arrows to open the pores of the wood just before dipping/soaking. My brother is a custom pipe maker, and he uses heat to allow stains to penetrate deeper into the briar wood. This may cause issues with straightness though, I wouldn't know as I've never made wood arrows.
There was an article in TBM a few years back where the guy used as I recall poplar soaked in Watco. I started doing that with 1/4" kids arrows of poplar. He said that the evergreen type woods don't soak up the oil like hard woods do because of the resin in them. Poplar is a soft hardwood that really soaks up the oil.
Bud,
If you have a 2x4x8 laying around the shop or any long board and have some cloths pins that have that spring clamp(modern style) and some hot melt glue and a glue gun you can lay the board horizontaly and glue cloths pins horizontal as well so you will have a jig to clamp the shafts to drip dry in a shop,garage,or anywhere you like...Just put some newspaper or whaever you got to catch any drips under the shafts and prop the 2x4x8 jig between two step ladders,two work benchs,trashcans,sawhorses or whatever you can rig up unless you already have a drying rack of some sort...I use my jig ll the time when dipping wood etc..
:thumbsup:
Just an update.
Danish oil soak was about two weeks worth. The shafts have been out of the oil for nearly three weeks now. They are still not dry. I have used an ACE roller straightener to check and straighten them as they dry. In using the roller it squeezes out undried oil from the wood fibers. Thought I'd post the update in case others contemplated trying this....the dry time seems loooong.
Bud,
The Dry time can take a good week to dry if in a cool climate..If you have a heated garage,or even a boiler room that would speed up the drying time..Those perfect 70 degree days are pretty much over here in the North East so drying time will take longer unless in a heated room with air circulating..
Now when you taper the shaft for the point make sure you use a good glue like "Ferltite" if I remember correctly and duco in the green tube for the nocks and the feathers...If you deside to use wraps then Bohning fletch tite will be o.k. cause the duco I just use on some wraps recently fell off next day..You may just want to leave the shaft all natural with just the danish oil and to me it's more "Traditional" looking!
I made my arrows in the summer and let them dry on the porch in the sun. They didn't take too long to dry that way.
alright guys a few questions ; what do the shafts look like after being soaked ; do you straighten them before or after being soaked ; can they be cap dipped and crested .
These have been downstairs in the kitchen area. Now they are upstairs where circulation is nil (last three days). I will wait it out. I can hang them over the heat duct vent if needed.
WOW! Thank y'all for this info! I use to use Watco on canoe paddles. I should've thought about it for shafts. BTW: kudos to Surewood Shafts - I recently discovered them thanks to TG and Sure do like their Wood! Now, I wonder if it will work ok with footed shafts (Surewood shafts, footed by Great Basin (both sponsors, btw)?
I shoot Surewood Doug Fir arrows....havent had to straighten one ever.
Ever.
Probably not the info you are after, but I made a dozen Ash arrows some years ago and with a regualar finish job and point weight they came in over 850 grains. Might be something to consider if you cant get where you need to be using this technique.
C
QuoteOriginally posted by Russ Clagett:
I shoot Surewood Doug Fir arrows....havent had to straighten one ever.
Ever.
Wish I could say the same but they straighten very easily with the Ace roller. Great quality but I have had some that needed attention.
FAV52,
"Floquil" Which can be found at a model train hobby shop will work for the cresting an comes in some little 2 or 4 oz. bottles...I bought the flat finish which made them look really dull and not shine but I do believe they have a gloss finish as well..As far as dipping you can check the hobby shop to see if they carry a spray paint made by "Floquil" for those little choo choo trains I know my crest which was just a thin couple of lines I preferred din't peel off so to speak cause someone else wrote an article about this paint in some Traditional magazine about 10 years ago or more...I will try to see if I can locate that article...I just remember it took well with the danish oil cause some paints won't bond well unless surface is prep. correctly...
Hey thanks Keefer ; might give it a try ; going back to wood shafts that's for sure !