Whip got me thinking about his recent "Elk in a bind" dilemma. Have 800# on the ground, solo hunt and no way to move to your liking. Of coarse Whip handily did what every veteran bowhunter would have done, REMOVE hot meat fast to cool, trophy cape is way down the priority list and Just another testimonial to his skill as a bowhunter. Could there have been a tool to help?
Now i was thinking........didnt Screaming Eagle use to sell a 3 pully allunimun block and tackle that uses para cord to handle 1000#? the rig was extremely light....anybody remember?
http://www.ezkutproducts.com/products.php
Scroll down a tad.
Believe me, I have thought a lot about what I could have done differently. And a block and tackle set up might have made all the difference.
I actually have the product that Chuck refers to. Mine is an older version apparently, but I sure wish I had it along on the Utah trip. I am leaving for CO on Friday for another adventure, and it is already packed in my bag.
The nice part of this set up is that as a ratchting pulley system you don't need three hands to pull the weight and then tie it off. Pull as far as you can and it locks tight on the rope so you can get another grip on it and pull some more. I really think this would have been a huge help in my case!
Here is my unit:
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y80/Jlasch/Utah%20Elk%202013/RopeRatchet9-17-201311-53-00AM.jpg) (http://s3.photobucket.com/user/Jlasch/media/Utah%20Elk%202013/RopeRatchet9-17-201311-53-00AM.jpg.html)
I weighed mine and it came in at 1# 8 oz. I don't know if I will carry it as standard equipment in my day pack, especially if I am hunting with a partner. But it will always at least be back in camp if needed in the future!
found this out of OZ ....Hitchmaster.....
http://www.****.com/bhp/come-along-winch
why wouldn't something like a come along winch work? I do understand that it would be a little on the heavy side, but with its winching capabilities, it would be worth it(IMO).
http://www.****.com/bhp/come-along-winch
why wouldn't something like a come along winch work? I do understand that it would be a little on the heavy side, but with its winching capabilities, it would be worth it(IMO).
I like the block and tackle, particularly since I'm an old guy and hunt elk solo. I probably should get one like in Whip's picture.
A come along would work, but I wouldn't drag one to the places I hunt elk; too much weight. Sure don't want to add that to a 90 pound hindquarter.
A come along would certainly be the ticket, but like you mentioned, pretty heavy to be packing in to places elk often die.
Joey, that Hitchmaster looks interesting. But seems like it would need a lot of rope to achieve much lift, and it seems like friction might decrease how much power gets transfered. I'd sure like to see it in use.
Joe what is the weight limit on your ratchet.I have some in stock but are not very strong.Good enough to bind something down but not to lift an elk.Kip
Thought same thing Whip,heck i got to go ahead and buy it :goldtooth:
Going to try it with para cord!!..if that doesnt work, i still can use it to lower that 304 hanging from my kids swing set and get my neighbors off my back.
we may have something
Whip. . ever use a rope (or paracord) like a (Spanish) windlass ? Tie a loop from tree to rear leg of critter, put a stick inside loop, start twisting.
ChuckC
http://www.canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=1408474396672949&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442290831&bmUID=1222553259650&assortment=primary&fromSearch=tr ue (http://www.canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=1408474396672949&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442290831&bmUID=1222553259650&assortment=primary&fromSearch=true)
Here's one not real light.
http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-5550-Rope-Hoist/dp/B000NPPBHY#productDetails
Another a little lighter.
Kip, according to the website the limit on that unit is 450#. I don't think I could use it to lift that much straight up by myself, but it sure would have gone a long ways to help roll the beast over. I have used it to pretty easily lift a full grown field dressed whitetail buck with no trouble.
Chuck, no, I had never thought of that. I had plenty of paracord - I wonder if that might have worked??
That first pulley system JB listed would probably be a good one. I like the 1,000 limit and the 7/1 ratio. Weighs about the same as the ratchet one that I have also.
Hey guys - you have some good options here but there may be better ones available. I recall a discussion on the PBS boards about using the small, lightweight rock climbing gear to rig a block and tackle. Petzl pulleys and such. I can not remember the thread title but KD was explaining a pretty well thought out and light rig he had put together. I have a small aluminum pulley and a caribiner that I can rig a lift assist using paracord. Arborist tree gear and climbing gear are good places to look for the strong, light pulleys and 'biners.
Also, I have the Hitchmaster and it works pretty well the few times I've used it. I have not tried it with paracord but the smaller set should be good for that I would think. I just put the two smaller pieces from my set on a scale and they are 4.125 ounces without rope/cord.
Well, this thread got me to thinking, and since I am headed back for some elk seeking tomorrow, I headed down to the local sporting goods store and picked up an el cheapo hoist that I threw in my hunting pack. I figure that something is better than nothing, and if the cheapy does some good, then I can get a better one later on. I hope that i get a chance to find out in the next few days.
Pat,
Hope you get to test out your new purchase. Good hunting.
Joe,
Off to Colorado,too? Good for you and good luck out there. I'll be out there next week also, so let's hope the rain is over for a while.
I'll be hunting with my son, so my "block and tackle" solution is a 26 year old with a strong back!
I read in a bear hunting book about making a tripod to raise the animal and it sounded like it would work.
Cut three poles and tie the three poles together on one end like a tepee and then tie animal leg or head to that. Lay poles on ground next to aniumal and then one at a time raise each pole as far as you can and work each one until the "tepee" is standing upright and animal off the ground.
There use to be a gambrel set yhat was sold and it had a two pully hoist that came with it. It was painted orange. Ii think it would be the ticket also.
Liking the hitchmaster more and more I look at it on youtube
I'll be keeping an eye on this one. I've got a solo elk hunt in December and was thinking about throwing a small ratchet strap in my pack to help with manipulation.
Joebuck....come on all you need is you and Biggie and throw the paracord over a limb make a boatswains chair on the cord both yall sit in it real slow up goes the elk!
QuoteOriginally posted by joebuck:
Thought same thing Whip,heck i got to go ahead and buy it :goldtooth:
Cool! We've got ourselves a product tester!
I wonder how it will be modified? We know that there hasn't been a product invented yet that can't be improved on ;)
Dougie, i wish Biggie would go with me. All he wants to do is watch the Vols lose!
You know me too well Whip! I am thinking 3 hitchmasters and hoist up a tree and hang like deer....dont they make a para cord on steroids?
"dont they make a para cord on steroids?"
yes, its called Rope.
:wavey:
I use what's called a rope ratchet to hang moose quarters, etc in the garage. It looks just like the pic Whip posted, except there is no metal pulley.
Probably no real mechanical advantage but is nice as when you stop pulling the "ratchet" locks the line in place, so you don't have to dog it off.
Cheap, $10 or so. To use it I usually pull up the meat with one hand or bear hug it and raise it up, then take the slack up through the ratchet with the other hand.
Really hadn't considered packing it before, but it's very light and using one or more could help one person get an animal out of a tight spot. Again, it really only helps when by yourself as its function is to save the difficulty of dogging a tight line off when by yourself.
Probably not worth packing around for stuff caribou-size or smaller, unless you wanted to hang a smaller animal.
I used to sail, i would use this setup. total weight is 250grams or 1/2 lb. it gives you ratchet and 4x power. you could add another single block top and bottom and get 6x power.
top (tree) : use these two side by side:
http://www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/product.asp?ProdNo=RF56100
http://www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/product.asp?ProdNo=RF55101
bottom (animal) attach a gambrel to this:
http://www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/product.asp?ProdNo=RF55501
Heres what i found out ..
4 Types of paracord.
type 3 is rated 550# this is most we use and see mostly
type 4 is rated 750#..it can be bought also. just amazon it
2 small Hitchmasters with 60'of Type 4 paracord...very light and powerful set i think.
I'm thinking you are on to something here. Looking forward to the test results and if it works out I will sure follow suit with a set as a standard part of my day pack when hunting out west. Wish I had been more prepared this year, but not too old to learn a new trick.
You could also use carabiners tied together to replace the pulleys on a block and tackle. Pretty light and useful for other things too. The disadvantage is the more carabiners you use the more the friction increases, but a couple would increase your mechanical advantage enough to lift quite a bit. If the para cord is too skinny to pull on just wrap it around a good stout stick and use the stick as a handle to pull on.
In my garage I use 1" webbing tie downs to lift and hold deer. Insert the hooks in the back legs and work the animal up one side at a time. When you lift one side the weight is transferred to the other side a bit and up it goes.
Somebody mentioned a tripod, I think the name for two poles is shear legs and its maybe the most efficient way to lift heavy stuff. The third pole on the tripod would just be used to brace the shear legs until the unit got high enough to overcome the initial heavy part.
Interesting stuff but not necessary if you use the gutless method of butchering.
That Hitchmaster is pretty slick.Check out this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpXxsASs3p0
I have watched now a half dozen times, what the heck is he pulling together, two porch posts?? i keep waiting on him to pull his porch down!!!
I do use the gutless method Tracy, but in this case the bulls legs were wedged under his body and a big deadfall log. Try as I might, and I tried mightily, I couldn't get him rolled over to remove the hind quarters properly. I needed a whole lot more leverage than I was able to supply on my own. The tripod method might work in some cases, but for me he died in such a tangled mess there wasn't much room to move. I really could have used a chain saw!
I've been looking at climbing gear and there are some cool looking lightweight pulleys sold for that purpose. Add a carabiner or two and it could be a nice setup. A little pricy, but top quality gear.
They also sell high quality rope. One 5mm rope (3/16") that I looked at has a recommended working limit of 500# and a tensile or breaking strength of 5,000#. One of the paracord sites I found listed a breaking strength of 550# with a 150# load limit.
Just remember that climbing rope reportedly "stretches" a good bit under tension.
Guys in MT downed an elk in a bottom. Couldn't get to it close enough to use the winch...so one guy had a 100' of climbing rope, attached to winch cable and it reached... wrapped rope around bull and wound in ALL the winch...elk hadn't budged, but the 5/8" dia rope was now pencil thin and played a tune! :eek:
Theres two types of climbing ropes, one that stretches and one that doesn't. Don't know the difference in terminology but just saying. The one that stretches have obvious advantages on falls etc.
Static and dynamic
Yep, definately want static (low stretch) rope for this job. Thge climbing gear places carry some good stuff, but it doesn't come cheap. Waiting to see what joebuck comes up with.
That HitchMaster deal looks like a great ticket. Carry the small set of 'pulleys' and some of that 3/16" rope and off you go.
Here Is something I read about on how moose hunters use to get moose out of the water in the Yukon. This was done by themselves if I'm right. All you need is
rope and to have trees around. A little imaginations helps with my diagram. The longer the lever the easier it will be. It can be done the other way as well,with the wind up log running horizontal.
Love this thread because I've been there. Some great ideas here. Looking forward to see where it goes from here.
Abe
(http://i.imgur.com/fOgVOBu.jpg) (http://imgur.com/fOgVOBu)
Here Is something I read about on how moose hunters use to get moose out of the water in the Yukon. This was done by themselves if I'm right. All you need is
rope and to have trees around. A little imaginations helps with my diagram. The longer the lever the easier it will be. It can be done the other way as well,with the wind up log running horizontal.
Love this thread because I've been there. Some great ideas here. Looking forward to see where it goes from here.
Abe
(http://i.imgur.com/fOgVOBu.jpg) (http://imgur.com/fOgVOBu)
Or you could make camp and get out your knife and fork :)
OK heres my final research
2 Small Hitchmasters
50' of New England Tech 5mm rope!!!!!!!
rope is small( 1mm larger than paracord)5000# rated, NO stretch, poly coated to slide....its the total package...but .........oops $1.10 a foot...so what ,it would be worth $100 afoot in a bind.
https://www.knotandrope.com/store/pc/viewCategories.asp?idCategory=30
Wouldn't a ratchet strap work? Use it like a come-a-long. I was looking at some yesterday and on some of them the working strengh of the rachet and the breaking point of the strap was way more then needed. They come in a lot of different sizes. With a little imagination the handle could be modified for better leverage. Might not be answer to all needs but I think in Whips case it would of helped.
Gilbert
Told you it was called rope.
I have know idea when I would ever need one of them doodads but that hitchmaster is kinda cool.
Did you order from them or did you find a US dealer?
rope?...Its a rope with glitter!!
ordered it from the alaska dealer.
And what glitters is GOLD.(@$1.10/')
Be sure to show us your riggin' when you get it all set up. Please.
CTT
Someone mentioned petal pulleys, using them it is easy to rig mech advantage. 4:1, or better. Make moving a large load easy. W use em in the FD and move some heavy stuff and they are not heavy at all - you can get micros too.
Some one on here uses them to clean kills in the woods - hanging deer in the tree so not to quarter on the ground.
I'm liking it Joebuck. I'd wrap the rope with a stick though. 5 mm is not very much to grab on too and could hurt pulling hard
http://www.dootalk.com/forums/topic/448197-self-rescue-for-wilderness-travel/
This link is for a "Z DRAG" which is also used in the whitewater rescue world for getting stuck boats out of a river current(you tube search z drag).
The snowmachine is obviously the elk and the ice anchor is any strong anchor. With a ramp you can scoot one in your truck easily as well.
Simple,light, safe, and it works when a winch is too heavy.
Lots of Mt. elk have been pulled out of hell holes with Capstan winches as well.
Joebuck any updates
I seen this at an outdoor show and it looked like it worked pretty well.
http://www.akcooltools.com/hitchmaster.html
I guess I miss some of this thread as the hitchmaster was already discussed
Joey - did you get your Hitchmaster yet? Curious how it works for you.
Good thread. Joey, I have one of those gambrel/block & tackle gizmos. Sure does make an easy job skinning deer solo. It has some fairly cheezy paracord on it but with good rope I think you could move some serious mass. It has a friction anti-reverse brake and cost about $12 with the gambrel from Sportsmans Guide I think.
I posted some pics of another option for those that may only have rope. Hope it helps!
-Jeremy :coffee:
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=132161
I didnt read the 4 pages...
but, their is a chainsaw-along deal you can lift a moose!
But honestly who carrys this stuff on a backpack hunt? Why not use the gutless method and get the first 2 quarters and strap off. Its much easier to move around (roll over) at that point and take the other 2 quarters and strap off...now gut and finish getting the flank/ribs, neck (if you havent boned it out already), and loins. Works like a champ with big critters.
I do have a hitchmaster but have yet to use it so I cannot comment on its use for game. I think it would work well, though I really have no use for it other than to assist hanging meat when I'm alone and so far havent had to use it. A simple truckers hitch with 550 cord can lift a nice hunk of meat if needed.
I started out trying to carry all that stuff. Now I just bring two knives an do the gutless method. Much easier and I don't have a pile of bones to get rid of when I get home (I also bone them out).I got it down now to where I don't bring anything home I am not going to eat. I still end up with the same number of packages of meat too. Gary
I was wondering the same thing, Amicus. Carry a couple of long ratchet straps and use them for lots of things.
I got it in Whip.....trying to find some time to test it. I dont have a dead Elk in Mississippi yet but i may hook it to my jeep and see if i can pull it backwards in gear. I bought some thin 5mm 2100# rope.
Joebuck,
what can you tell us about your Hitchmaster?
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