Hey all,
I've been thinking lately of treating myself to a bow that I have always wanted. Unfortunately there are several of them and I just can't decide, but the main ones are a Hill style, a Bear TD and an ACS 3 piece TD.
I know how expensive the first 2 are and I thought the ACS would be kinda close to the Bear TD. Boy was I flat out WRONG! I just checked and found out that a new ACS 3 piece TD is priced at $1325!
I don't know about you guys, but for me that is SERIOUS MONEY! Sadly I'll never be able to own one of those bows now cause I just can't pay that kind of money. I don't begrudge those that can, congrats to you.
It just seems like every time I check prices of a NEW bow they are $1,000 or MORE. Hell I was fretting about the possibility of dropping $650 and now I see that that wouldn't buy me a RISER.
It's just about to the point where the only bows I can afford are SAMICK, the ILF Bows and a few longbows. Every other bow I look at STARTS at $750 or more. Sadly that $650 I was prepping to spend just doesn't buy much.
Anyone find these prices disheartening? I never thought I'd see the time when it would take near $2,000 to get started in the TRAD archery world with a nice custom bow and gear, but that's just about what it is. When I used to talk to my friends and try to get them to switch to TRAD the very first thing they would ask is "HOW MUCH?" When I would tell them, they would laugh and say "NO WAY." That's back when prices were no where near what they are now. I can only imagine what those same friends would say now if I told them about a great looking and shooting bow for $1400!
Looks like my treat will be a USED bow from here on out. My "LIST" has lines drawn all through it now.
Those of you that can afford to spend the enormous amounts on a bow, my hat's off to ya. I really am glad that we have a country where builders can demand that kind of money for their bows and there are those that gladly pay it. I'm just not one of them, and don't think I'll ever be.
Nalajr
In my opinion there is absolutely nothing wrong with a used bow except you don't get to choose the wood and your name isn't on it. Buying used also has the advantage of being reversible, if it's not what you expected you should be able to resell it for what you paid, or very close. Unless you have spent some time with a certain model bow buying a new one is a bit of a crap shoot, there's lots of nice bows out there but they are all a little different.
It's fun buying new but I went for over 40 years on used bows and don't think I missed a thing. I also knew exactly what I wanted when I finally did order a new one.
Seriously? If you think a good bow starts at $1000 or more you are giving up on 90% of the bows on the market and 100% of the bows that the rest of us buy. My last custom bow was $525 and that was 13 months ago. The one before that (two years ago) was $500. You might want to take a look at the alternatives, you may well be pleasantly surprised.
The latest and greatest thing from Hoyt or Matthews with training wheels will cost about the same as the prices you're complaining about and a year later will be worth half as much. It was also built by machines. Most of the high dollar bows you speak of are still built by hand and can take a whole week of long days to build and test...say 1300 bucks divided by 40 hours build time, that's 32.50 per hour covering materials, electricity, any overhead and a meager wage. It's not that much money for a precision beautiful handmade weapon that can last a lifetime. The Samicks and what not you speak of are made in a factory. Comparing them to the high dollar bows isn't fair and doesn't hold much water. Like you said, buy used or just save your money. Many of us on here save for months or even years to commission a new custom bow. You're not going to get much sympathy. After materials and overhead many bowyers, who generally work out of tiny shops are lucky to make $10/hour for their efforts. They are artists and do it because they love it, not to become millionaires or sell stock.
Nalajr, Get the best you can and go have fun. People are at different places in life financially and you just do what you can wherever you are. I think $750 is a great price for a custom bow when you think about the work and talent it takes to do it notwithstanding the equipment necessary. Custom bowyers are a very special breed and we are fortunate to have so many talented ones around. Check out the classifieds and you might just find something that would surprise you.
Where in my post did I say a "GOOD" bow is $1,000 or more?
If you took $700 and started shopping for a NEW TD Recruve, your list of possible bows would be MUCH SHORTER, by a MILE, than those that were OVER than amount.
Like I said, if YOU want to pay $1,400 for a new bow, I'm glad you have the ability to do just that.
Nalajr
There seems to be a ton of bows that usually go for very high prices on the classifieds that are going for half of what they get new,and they are hardly used.
The good thing about the classifieds is there's no wait. Just trying to be positive :)
I've bought some very good bows half what they cost new in the classifieds. I'm very happy with a used bow.
I dunno. I read the initial post again and I simply and emphatically disagree. Buy some used customs and shoot them and compare them to the Samicks and then come back with a report. You can't say what custom bows ought to be worth having never owned any. This whole thing is like a 'no fair no fair' type of deal. I'm not rich by a long shot but rather planned my moves and tried a lot of used bows before choosing my preferred bowyers, all of which produce a product that is to me and prolly many others worth every dime and then some. Switch over to collecting guns. You have any idea how much some custom rifles cost?
I bought a real nice Hoots recurve off from the classifieds for just over $400. I couldn't be happier! Look for one of the bows from your list on there and you may just get a heck of a deal on a gently used bow like I did.
if you are open to a couple you mentioned, post a Want Ad (WTB), you might get lucky. I have bought more used bows than new, and have been happy with most.
Well you mentioned a Bear T/D. I just checked 3R archery and there Bear T/Ds are $819 to $840 that's less than a thousand unless my math is wrong... FYI.. I never thought I would ever be able to own a Black Widow T/D, after selling a couple other bows I got a 2012 model PCH in my poundage for less than half price, OHH and it looks and shoots like brand new.
I get used bows and my wife gets new ones, difference is, there's always used ones coming on the market in weights I can shoot, and for the wife, not so much, she needs the latest and greatest to even up the elk hunting playing field. Buy a used bow , you will be happy, in fact I know where you can get a smoking hot Chastain Wapiti! www.rmsgear.com (http://www.rmsgear.com) look for the one with birdseye maple and purple heartwood, it's an experienced killer!
i know this may be a touchy area (as are all areas that include the different living/lifestyles of everyone) but i do not even have 500 to drop on ANY bow yet a lone 300. i have a wife and a kid on the way so my finances are strapped to say the least; no i am not complaining, i actually feel quite blessed with my life, and i am not begrudging those who have a ton of money. but i have shot bear bows and wheelie bows but my go to bow is a samick sage..a bow that i paid about 150 if you include the kwikee kwiver and ff string, that my wife bought me as a surprise bday gift. sure it was made in a factory and doesnt look custom but when the time counts, i can and easily and have put my life in the hands of this bow. sure its not a black widow or bob lee but it is still a bow none the less. and it still does its job which is to deliver an arrow to a target to provide meat for my family or a paper target to prepare for hunting season. it is a smooth shooter and is pretty quick even tho it is not a bob lee or black widow. but then again back way back when these bows were made by hand and each was his own so long as it did as required. this is a sport for gathering around campfires and telling stories and providing for ones family-not one for judging who has the best...lets leave that to the wheelie guys who seem to have have the latest greatest and fastest every year :knothead:
Ive had lots of bows and purchased over a dozen in one year paying up to 1700.00 for one. But I bought my Dad a samick sage as he was switching from 40yrs yrs of left handed to right handed handed shooting because of shoulder issues and it was the best 130.00 ive ever spent on archery gear. The bow is a 40lbs but they come as high as 60lbs, we have had alot of fun with it and does its job as well as any bow ive owned, it makes its owner happy.
I would love to drive Ferrari and have a whole collection of Rolex but have you seen the prices on them things? Thats life, I should of been a surgeon or opened a Dunkin Donuts chain instead of being a cop. Some purchases are just not the right ones for an individuals budget, so we just dont buy them and move on, all we can do. :dunno:
I agree,,, a lot of bows are over priced, especially the more popular name brands. As long as people are willing to pay these high prices, they will prevail. There are some more reasonably priced bows out there. Over the past few years I have owned 3 recurves and 1 longbow that I purchased from Tim Finley of Kota Bows. All were priced between $550 and $650, all beautifully made, all custom built and all shoot great. I had Tim replace one of them that came in under weight but that was done at no charge. I doubt that I will ever part with any of them.
Most Bows today are built by a machine, cnc risers are The norm! That sais there are a lot of bows that can be had For $650-750, RER, Timberghost,Hill Bows, BIG Jim, Kanati, tons of them! I agree you can get s usec Bow that was 11 to 1400 For 700 and under! I just sae a Caibow that was easily 1200 New and it sold For 600 or so and it was only 4 months old! Shop around a bit, lots to be haf For $650! Shawn
"Snipershot 317"
I love your attitude!
It's all relative.
I once knew a guy who had next to nothing for money. He showed up one day with a very custom Paul Schafer Silvertip...a real beauty back in the day. This guy was making 40% of what an average blue collar guy earns, and he bought a Schafer! I saw him many weeks later, and he told me he was deer hunting 6 days a week. I asked him about his job, and this is what he said:
"Oh I quit that a few weeks ago. I got an expensive recurve and now all I'm gonna do is hunt"!
In 1979 I thought paying 100$ for a bow was alot, now WoW.
A little over a year ago I bought my 1st recurve and since then I've picked up older and newer bears at reasonable prices, thinking I wanted to collect and shoot these bows. But I always found myself looking at custom bow websites wanting one. So I've decided to sale most of my bows until I have the money for THE BOW I want. I also think the prices are justifiable as long as the work is top notch, as I am also in business where I name my price and sometimes people think I'm expensive, but those that pay for my services never complain afterwards. I'd think custom bowyers are the same way.
Take a look at Big Foot Bows Nala. i can build something that fits you to a Tee for $650- $750.. Kirk
Nala
I see a lot of folks that are truly in love with their bows and shoot them as if they were an extension of themselves. I guess in many ways they are, since these bows were made by them.
Check out the Bowyers Bench forum here and you'll see exactly what I'm talking about.
Selfbows can be very much works of art that shoot as well as any bow on the market or look more like the ones I used to build....a stick and a string. My stick and string got the job done.
The cost in dollars was way less but the personal invest was higher.
Please don't miss understand, if you want a custom bow..then find it and "go for it" but if it's something else that's driving you.. figure it out, then make a plan that'll get you where you want to be.
Good luck in your search!!
God bless,Mudd
I think snypershot is on the right track. Shoot what you have and apprieciate what you've got. If I'm having fun I don't feel the need to look at the sticker. I got into Tead to avoid the whole "I gotta have the latest most flashy things" attitude.
I don't begrudge anyone with a nicer, more expensive bow than me. Nor do I feel embarassed to shoot with guys that do. Cool thing about trad, I've never felt snubbed by the guys with far better equipment and / or skills than me (unlike my compound days). We all have our own paths, we should just enjoy them I think.
I've got a fantastic one piece 50's style custom recurve on the classified for $475.00 (60" and 47# @ 28"). It is in brand new condition and I will guarantee it's quality and shootability.
Welcome to the wonderful world of inflation, also known as "I want a raise every year, too!".
I sat at a stoplight yesterday with a Ford pickup that still had the dealer sticker on the window. The sale price at the bottom was $61,000. For a pickup. A white pickup. I didn't pay that for my first few houses.
I have a custom bow, for which I paid $400 (from a friend) about 8 years ago. Well worth the money. But these days I'm making meat with a used Bear off the classifieds that I got for $150. The feel of this bow is so perfect I just keep shooting it and leave my "good" bow on the pegs.
Nala,
If you like Hill bows, check the classified section. I just sold my almost new HH Big 5 to a Tradganger for $400 shipped.
I guarantee you that you couldn't tell the difference between my old bow and a new one from HH.
I guess my point is there are a lot of bows for sale here that even though its used, looks like brand new.
Btw, I bought a new ACS 3 piece TD and sold it here for a lot less than $1300.
So keep your eyes open and you'll find some really nice bows at very reasonable prices.
Good luck!
Trust me you do not need to spend 1500 on a Hill bow. Not even close. I bought this year a new Northern Mist Retro Classic longbow that was half that price. Is it an ACS, nope, but it is everything i would want in a Hill bow. You need to consider how much effort and the material costs included, also the presicion they are made with. Everyones costs have gone way up, and those costs need to be covered in order for the business to continue. You might also ask if they have demo models at lower prices. And if you really have done your homework you must of overlooked Dan Toelke and what he offers.
These price threads appear regularly.
There are custom bows out there in the $1200. and up range, and they are selling. If someone has the means, and wants one, so be it.
There is no doubt that with the work that goes into these bows, that the bowyers are not getting rich.
There are many great bows that are more in the range of half of that amount brand new also.
A less expensive bow will shoot and kill just as good as a more expensive bow, therefore it is simply a matter of choice for those who can afford it.
Shoot what you have or want and be greatful for the time you can spend in the woods. Isn't that what it is all about?
Brand new bows from Howard Hill Archery start around $575. The last one I got was a t/d Cheetah, and I think it was $725 brand new, to my specs.
Bows like that no longer cost $200, but this isn't the 1980s, either. As has been stated, there are lots of really nice bows here on the classifieds for a lot less than $1000. Plenty of real bargains there if you can find bows that fit your specs and desires.
Hi On the lighter side I have two quotes.
1. "This is America, you can have anything you want, just not everything you want."
2. A friend bought a new Mercedes and I said, "I'd love to have one of those." And he said "You can, you just can't have anything else."
Now I know these quotes want lower the prices of the newest bows but.... once you've decided you gotta have something you will find a way.
Joe
ps. 7 days, 21 hours until elk season
if your attitude is you will never be able to afford a 1K bow you likely never will.
everyone starts somewhere-and with education/training one can get a better paying job.
lots of info out there on higher income careers-and what it takes to qualify for one.
The Bear bows in my view represent an excellent value for the dollar and shoot very well. Plus if you see a bow you like-you can save-or get a 2nd job to help pay for it. As well, a number of bowyers have waits-and you can make installments.
And if you think bows or guns expensive-try watches!
ones I like are not cheap.
Those things we want to do, we find a way. Those things we don't want to do, we find an excuse.
Are they expensive, maybe, all depends on your perspective. I have paid $1,300 for a bow but there is no way I will pay $150 for a pair of jeans, just seems ridiculous to me for jeans to cost that much. Other people probably say it's stupid to pay that for a bow when I could have bought several pair of those jeans with that money. It's all relative.
True happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.
got a good buddy who builds bows, and he says he could never buy a custom bow now (his bows are very nice). i, myself, haven't been bitten by the building bug, but i've gotten some good deals in the classifieds. i've also dropped some big coin on new ones.
i think used is the best value out there. i have seen some REALLY nice bows go for close to half-price on the classifieds.
I love my custom recurve. If I could do it all over again, I wouldn't have paid full price. I would have bought used.
That said, I purchased a great northern critter gitter special jackknife in mint cond for 500.
I have heard people say they could never afford to go to Africa. Nonsense. Those same people drive expensive vehicles by expensive coffee etc. If you want it bad enough 20 bucks in a coffee can adds up. I have a few more years but I'm going to Africa.
QuoteOriginally posted by Kirkll:
Take a look at Big Foot Bows Nala. i can build something that fits you to a Tee for $650- $750.. Kirk
There ya go! :thumbsup:
There are many bowyers who are not that expensive. Howard Hill is a good example.
I bought two custom bows who are more expensive. The fancy woods, checkered grips, exotic veneers, antler options, multiple wood risers does not make it better bows, they just make your hearth sing every time you grap them for a shoot.
Every time I see my expensive custom made for me Peregrine, my hearth is filled with joy, the same for my Phoenix. Craftmanship is something you have to pay for and mostly it are the options that make a bow more expensive.
I made the choice for custom bows and have to save hard for it. But I think it is money well spend, the feeling I get when I shoot them and see them can't be expressed in money!
Amen to that!
PS: RER bows are great shooters and they start at 650. Kirk made you a great offer too.
I bought a nice, single wood, custom made, 3 piece hybrid longbow by RER at one of the Wisconsin Deer and Turkey shows about 3 years ago.
I paid $650.
I bought another custom made, 3 piece, charcoal actionwood, chechan, and black glass, static tip recurve by RER about a year ago.
I paid $650.
Both these bows were new.
Both these bows are custom made by two fine people, Kevin and Sue TerrMatt.
They care more about whether you are happy with their product than whether or not they make a lot of money building them.
Both these bows are of the finest build quality you will find in the market.
Both these bows shoot very, very well.
Like many other custom bowyers...Kevin and Sue also will build you a bow for $1200 or more if you like.
I think they will tell you the same thing I will tell you...their $1200 plus bows don't shoot any better than their $650 ones.
I could go on and on...but my point is this...
Even if you want new, YOU have a lot to say about how much you spend.
If you, like I, don't need four kinds of exotic, woods with the fancy overlays etc. that are time consuming to build, you, like I, can buy a custom, fine quality, new, great shooting bow for 1/2 of the $1300 you are complaining about.
There are many other bowyers like RER who offer Hunter models.
Check Zipper, or Stalker or some of the other makers already listed here.
Or, as has been suggested, you can spend some time looking, and go used.
The choice is yours and good luck!
Irv Eichorst
www.truesouthadventures.com (http://www.truesouthadventures.com)
I don't make a lot of money, but I can buy whatever bow I want.
Just not "right now".
It can't be an impulse purchase. I would have to save $20 from 50 paychecks to pay $1,000 for a bow. That's what I did when I bought my Black Widow longbow. I saved for a long time, then sold something that I really didn't want to sell... but now I have a bow that I enjoy more today than I did when it came in 2 years ago.
I've also bought 2 or 3 bows on Craigslist, which were the best deals I've gotten on bows. If you keep your eyes open, there are fantastic deals out there. I know a guy who recently bought an as-new ACS 3-piece longbow for $500. There was a virtually new Black Widow PSA at Compton for sale for $600.
If you do your homework, and are a person with the self-control to squirrel away a few dollars on a regular basis, and can get by with something basic while saving for the "big one", you can probably get whatever bow you want.
QuoteOriginally posted by Archie:
I don't make a lot of money, but I can buy whatever bow I want.
Just not "right now".
It can't be an impulse purchase. I would have to save $20 from 50 paychecks to pay $1,000 for a bow. That's what I did when I bought my Black Widow longbow. I saved for a long time, then sold something that I really didn't want to sell... but now I have a bow that I enjoy more today than I did when it came in 2 years ago.
If you do your homework, and are a person with the self-control to squirrel away a few dollars on a regular basis, and can get by with something basic while saving for the "big one", you can probably get whatever bow you want.
^^^^^This exactly^^^^^.
If someone can save $300, they can save $1500. They can deliver pizzas on weekends...or they can have a garage sale...or they can give up smokes and lotto tickets..... There's a million ways to get it done. There are 15 bazillion excuses as to why you "can't".
Don't settle for what you don't want. Figure out what you want...then find a way to get it done.
There are times I wish we had a like button like Facebook...lol
Otto quote: "Don't settle for what you don't want. Figure out what you want...then find a way to get it done."
I love your way of thinking Otto!!
God bless,Mudd
PS: I am a product of the 50's and as the result I see everything as over priced...lol
I agree with MUDD, something else is going on here and Nala has to figure out what is best for Nala.
I set my limits as to what I am willing to spend on any item and move on from there. If someone else spends more, that their business. it's not for me to be judge and jury.
I seriously doubt you will find any millionaire bowyers out there. They make beautifully crafted bows and make an honest living.
I just got my Hoyt Desperado in the mail today...you will not find much information on a Hoyt Desperado because Hoyt only made them for one year in 1996...it is not a custom bow exactly but I am sure that they were made with great care and attention to detail...that is obvious from just a quick examination of the bow...I bought that bow from the classifieds and yes it is used...very gently used...I have seen shop worn bows that looked a lot worse...did I mention I paid 300 dollars for that bow...and another 300 for a great looking and shooting Pilgrim longbow that also arrived in the mail today...so with your 650 buck limit I would have two amazing bows and 50 bucks left over...never been a better time in history to own some really nice used bows
DDave
QuoteOriginally posted by LYONEL:
"Snipershot 317"
I love your attitude!
+1! Just loved out hunting guys with my bargain basement Ruger with Tasco scope. Heck I would trade my custom rig for that old rifle combo if my young lungs and legs were thrown in the deal to boot lol.
Some said to post a "want to buy add", I fully agree. I wanted a Black Widow, I posted an add with what I was looking for and in about 2 1/2 weeks I got a PM from a fella that had what I was looking for at a fantastic price. The bow was only 6 weeks old and I got it for just over 1/2 price. It can be done!!
I completely agree that if you want it, you can figure out how to get it. I am in graduate school which is meager pay at best and have purchased two black widows that were used from here and were worth every penny. Just have to figure out a way (besides selling drugs or something haha)
i wasnt trying to stir the pot or aggravate anyone, its just my way of thinking. even as a younger generation i remember shopping with my parents and still deem everything as overpriced and cheaper quality..but thats besides the point. :p there are things that i would love to do like an out of state hunt (anywhere for anything) cause i think it would be fun, go after an axis deer with my recurve or smoke pole (been a child hood dream since i saw the pictures at neighbors house and thought that it was a very graceful animal and hear their stories), or one that requires no money-just being able to be a good enough shot to be able to shoot a 4in group at 25 yards :knothead: ...May God bless and shoot straight and remember to have fun. its why i dropped the wheelie for a stick in the first place ;)
ps: if your looking for good deals check the classifieds, craigslist, and never overlook ****..found my quivers and other archery stuff there for cheap with sometimes free shipping :D
Just got my new TBM today--nice article on this very thing. The author talks about shooting his $339 Bear Grizzly and his $1000+ custom longbow. No spoilers here--just look forward to the article.
Up above on this thread somebody mentioned Rolex watches.....allow me to share my thoughts. I would NEVER, EVER spend $5000 on a wrist watch. But, a couple in the church from which I retired as pastor a few years ago, who were financially plenty able to do so, gifted my wife and me both with Rolex watches near the end of my tenure there. The gift sort of took my breath due to the extremely generous nature of it and the long relationship I had with those fine folks. I knew what those watches cost. But, Rolex watches have to be one of the most over-hyped things in the world! Having had it now for a few years I can say that it does not keep any better time than the Timex watches I have been used to buying for myself. All this watch does is give me the time of day and day of the month--that's it. I don't need a $5000 instrument to do that. I think it's a lot like the bow discussion. I have a lot of bows on my rack that I have come by over the years and recently scored a prized Schulz Trophy Hunter to go with my Hills, Northern Mists, and some less expensive but well constructed bows. There is essentially no difference in how they shoot. In fact, one of the least known bowyer's work on my rack may well be the best shooter of the bunch. I love the Schulz and it has no doubt a permanent spot on my rack, but I have yet to pick up any bow by any maker--and I have been at this game a looooong time--that just blew me out of the water and made me think somebody had discovered the holy grail of bows. They are all made from the same stuff--various sorts of boards cut into lams and sandwiched between fiberglass or carbon with epoxy. There is only so much that can be done with them--it ain't rocket science. If you like and can afford a Rolex and want to spend your money that way--have at it. If you want a bow that costs $1500--do it. You live in America (or most of us here do)--you can do that!
Have to agree with the Flying D you can buy an RER with say a Chechen riser and red elm limbs in the Arroyo or Retro for $600 and they are phenominal performers. Kirk can make you a very nice bow as well. Lots of choices and Kirks bows are great shooters too!! Used is a very good way to go as well! Shawn
If you don't want to spend $1,000 for a bow, then don't. There are plenty of bowyers making great bows for quite a bit less. I don't really know what all the fuss is about.
No matter how much is in my bank account I will always be a bargain hunter. I have bought used except on two occasions. One new bow was a heavier lefty the bowyer had trouble selling so I got a steal at $625. The other, my first "custom" I picked a solid riser and basic limb veneer for $525. Most of the other bows that past through my hands cost under $100.00
On affording the new bows: I drive older paid for vehicles, don't have credit cards or borrow money, live in a smaller home, etc. To qoute Dave Ramsey, I "lived like no one else so that latef I could live like no one else."
A good friend is a very gifted bowyer who works tirelessly in his shop. He does side work when he can. And struggles to make ends meet. Ever work on something for a week and have a customer not satisfied so you have to work another week to make it right? They miss weight, have material failures, deal with customers with unreal expectations about the consistency in color and patern of natural products. ....
If you think about it money and trad bows both actually grow on trees. ;)
Rob
Good one Rob! :laughing: My 50# Kingwood was a 7 year growth tree!
QuoteOriginally posted by Rob W.:
If you think about it money and trad bows both actually grow on trees. ;)
Rob
American paper currency is actually made from cotton, but you still made me chuckle :)
QuoteWhat's With the SKY HIGH Prices??
Take a look around Dude! It aint just bows...Been shopping for anything lately??
The folks that build the bows live in the same overpriced world we do.
For anyone interested: There is a very pretty Windauer Schafer TD Recurve listed on a certain auction site. The starting bid is $600, and they haven't received one bid on it yet.
I just got my latest issue of Traditional Bowhunter today. There's a short article towards the end by Doug Humphreys discussing this exact topic. His point is that you don't need that $1000 bow and one for a few hundred will shoot just as well. I totally agree with him.
Having said that, I can certainly understand why custom bowyers charge what they do. It's simple math...cost of materials (exotic woods are expensive), equipment, the 11% federal excise tax (which is a good thin for wildlife conservation), advertising costs, cost to travel to shows, liability insurance, cost for their own health insurance if they aren't covered by a spouse, etc., etc. There sure aren't any rich bowyers out there and I honestly don't know how they can make a living at it without a spouse with a decent income or a pension from a previous career.
I build my own and will NEVER buy another bow. I'd love to do it for a living, but my kids would starve, so I think I'll keep my day job.
Just buy what you can afford or are willing to spend on a bow, enjoy it, and be proud of it. Besides, you have to be one heck of a shot to be able to really say a $300 bow is not letting you shoot as well as you could.
SO VERY TRUE WESTBROOK..!!
I have bought and traded about 30 bows the last 4 years.All were used and most I sold for about what I paid for them. Have 3 bows that I bought limbs pretty cheap[Hummingbird, Robertson, Dye] and made risers for these limbs. The bows shoot great and I do not mind checkering the grips on my risers. The real magic in bow making is the limbs. The riser is just a handle. Had a original riser for a model on each project. Each has been fun and beats paying 650.00 for a new riser. Just a few options for not paying a fortune for a bow. Also most bowyers make a working mans bow that does not have expensive woods-and shoot the same at much less cost. One opinion, Thanks, Roy
Steve Turay told me that a bow maker once told him that he had discovered how to make a small fortune in the bow making business....first you begin with a large fortune.... :saywhat:
I think bowyers work hard for what they get, especially making them 1 at a time to your specs. It isn't a CNC compound bow where 10s of thousands are spit out. They have shops, inventory, equipment, shipping, electricity, insurance, shows, advertisement, dealing with returns, and the list goes on (as with any business), all for how many bows a year?
The market is efficient. There actually seem to be more and more great new bows in the $500 to $1000 range.
In almost any hobby (or product), the mid and upper midlevel stuff is usually reasonable and worth the extra money over the cheap stuff (if you can afford it), but usually that little extra custom or top of the line stuff is gonna cost you, and there is a market for it.
If you want that expensive bow, save, sell stuff, be patient, and buy it, or just buy a used one now.
Funny as I was reading this post I was thinking of Kirk. This man builds a world class bow. If he built you a bow you would be more than thrilled I guarantee it.
I shoot one of his bows. Love it. It is by far the fastest, flattest shooting bow I have seen. It's not just my opinion I can go to any shoot and be stopped at least three times by guys wanting to know who made the bow.
Give Kirk a call I know you will be surprised.
PS warning if Kirk gets you on the phone you will get information overload. He not only makes a good looking bow he test the heck out of them.
Just my 2 cents... The best money that I have ever spent in traditional archery was not for any bow. The best bang for my buck was learning how to shoot any bow properly, thanks Mr Jenkins!
Thanks for all the suggestions.
All of the bows I own or have owned in the last 5 years have all been bought USED from the Classifieds. Right now I own a Barta LB and a 1971 Grizzly. The Barta was found here and the Grizzly was from **** as it was a gift from my family for XMAS.
I am in no way against or opposed to too good to buy a USED bow. I look in the Classifieds all the time.
I'd still like to have a Bear TD and I'll get one someday. I also want a Hill style and I know there are LOADS of great choices for $500 or so, NEW.
Some of the other bows I thought I would love to have are probably going to fall by the wayside in favor of others that are less expensive. I would rather buy 2 really nice USED bows that I want than 1 brand new one.
Just something about that Bear TD that pulls me in. I've wanted one for a long time, probably over 10 years. I got my first TRAD bow in the mid 1990's, it was a Great Northern Critter Getter. It was my one and only bow I bought new from the maker. It was one he had on the shelf, not custom made for me.
After that I went into a tiny shop in my hometown that the owner only was open as a hobby. It was a rats nest, he only sold a few bows a year and Bear was one of his lines. He only sold compound stuff but when I was there I seen a catalog for Bear TRAD stuff and secretly swooped in on it and took it. I nearly wore the pages out of that thing looking at the bows, especially the TD. From then on I have wanted one.
I know there are MANY fine bowyers out there that put out terrific bows for much less money than what I was talking about. I'm gonna start checking a lot of them out and see what they have. I also love the Bigfoot bows.
So, I would reckon that my next bow will also be a USED bow or a Hill style BLANK from 7 Lakes. Who knows though. I may see something for sale here that I can't live without or it's a great deal and I have to have it.
Right now the only bow I had on my list that I STILL really want is a BEAR TD. USED or NEW, I'll figure out a way to get one....someday.
Nalajr
I'm looking forward to my first truly custom bow...don't know what it will be yet. Every time I think I've decided how to spend that money, I see / shoot something else that piques my interest. When I finally decide, I'll spend what it costs to get it, one way or another. However, I had someone tell me many years ago, "it has less to do with the bow, and more to do with the Indian behind it". I've found these words to be very true time and time again and not just in archery.
QuoteOriginally posted by Nala:
........He only sold compound stuff but when I was there I seen a catalog for Bear TRAD stuff and secretly swooped in on it and took it......
Took it, as in stole it??
:eek: :saywhat: :dunno:
Its all in 'what you want to spend" on anything, I love coffee plain black, but I see people spend $9.00 for basically coffee with a bunch stuff in it! Same with motorcycles if you want a new Harley its gonna cost you, but there are many other less expensive options for bikes! same can be said for anything, BMW cars are nice but my Civic (paid off) gets me where I want to go! As stated there are many great bow builders who have reasonable prices and many great used ones, any bow is great if you learn to shoot it well. Its all about how much $$$$ you want to spend! Have fun its only money!
You have to stop shopping for Mazzaratis, ferraris, jaguars and such when all you can afford is a Honda.
Nothing wrong with a Honda, still will get you where you need to go. 95% of us do not drive fancy cars. just food for thought anyhow.
I've got 5 old custom made bows. Will likely never buy another one. Too expensive. Tired of getting robbed. Make my own bows now. They work for me. Takes time. To each their own.
justin
I'm thankful everyday there are companies and individual bowyers making high end bows! Aren't we lucky? The bows they make are worth every cent and I can assure you they are not making a killing either.
Having said that, I mostly buy used custom bows anymore...but that is still creating a market. I have ordered my fair share of new custom bows and know the excitement associated with that. Now I prefer seeing and shooting the bow I choose to buy.
Re: your dilemma, I own two ACS 3 piece longbows and didn't pay more than $650 for either of them. Peruse the Used Bow forum right here on TG. You can get into a very nice ACS CX LB for same or better.
Ultimately I would like to be "man enough" to shoot my selfbows exclusively. I was re-reading (100th time) my Bowyers Bibles books last night and always find a deep connection with the words and pics on those pages, especially anything written by Tim Baker. That's where it's at IMO!
Aside from that, I'd happily use any "garage sale" recurve to shoot the fattest buck WI has to offer!
Good luck with your your acquisitions!
Kris
One of the best bows I've ever bought was a two-houndred dollar bryan furgasson bow used from another trad-gang member here and you can still buy the same bow from his son Zack coustom built for your hand for around 550$. And they are some of thee best bows. Just look in the right places with the right people. A fellow Texan
One of the best bows I've ever bought was a two-houndred dollar bryan furgasson bow used from another trad-gang member here and you can still buy the same bow from his son Zack coustom built for your hand for around 550$. And they are some of thee best bows. Just look in the right places with the right people. A fellow Texan
I have no disposable income at all (being on fixed income) but I bartered for the bow being made for me. I craft powder horns, and one customized for its owner made by a tribally recognized Seminole was apparently a good swap for a custom bow. All American woods (which suits me just fine, red dirt runs in my veins I swear) instead of super-expensive exotics but the important thing to me is that I used what I had available to me to get it-I don't have $100 to spend on a bow, but I'm really good with my hands and I have a lot of time to work with my heart messed up. I also make some of my own bows-even if I'm not as good as some of the pros on here, I did it myself to fit me and there's no feeling like that.
Broke? I'm there with you, but I'm not gonna get upset about it, I'm gonna work smarter. I thank God that I can still work a little like this to keep me in equipment for the winter. And I thank Him equally for people who still barter because they make sure I can still participate in trad archery because it is extremely expensive for fixed income otherwise.
I built custom bespoke computers for various purposes for years. I cost a lot of money, but I cost less than ordering it from a big box company. I did what the market forced me to do, and these bowyers do as well. If I ever get the chance to have another made I'll take it, but as I can't do it now I pray they have enough business to keep them doing it until I have a chance to get one.
Being broke is no fun, but it just means you have to get creative.
Check out Legends bows from California. Great bows, exceptional people to deal with. You will thank yourself!
QuoteOriginally posted by curlis:
Check out Legends bows from California. Great bows, exceptional people to deal with. You will thank yourself!
He has a good looking bow on the sponsors classifieds,and it's not expensive. Bubinga and Zebra and it's only $600.
What's with the high prices on everything! I have an 870 that I've shot tons of doves and ducks with, do I want a high dollar shotgun, heck ya!! But I can't afford one, no, but I will save up and get one because I want one. I have two young children and a stay at home wife so things are tight!!!! It took a while but I worked and saved up and got me a new Blackwidow kbx, is it any better than the cheaper bows, maybe, maybe not. But it's what I want and prefer, I also have a custom longbow that I paid $715 for. I am lucky enough to be friends with the bowyer and he let me watch him along the way of the building of the bow. And when I seen what goes in to making these wonderful works of art I felt like I should have needed to give him more. He recently told me that he has to go up on his prices because the prices on the woods are going up as well, is that the bowyers fault, no but they can't give these bows away. You shoot what you want, if you want a expensive custom bow then save up and get it, even if it takes a year. You will appreciate it more when you finally get it.
Nala, I've been retired for 6 years and work a part time job that pays for my gas money and mad money so I'm not rolling in dough so to speak. I met Kirk this year, did a little shooting with him and he makes a fine bow. Unfortunately I didn't get to shoot his bow that day.
I always wanted a Wes Wallace Mentor but couldn't afford a new one but one fell into my lap a couple of months ago in the form of a trade for a rifle with a friend who had the bow made a year ago for him.
So don't lament not being able to buy top shelf new. Most of us can't either but we make do.
I used to think like this until I started building self bows and realized how LONG it actually takes to make a bow and how much work and precision it requires. I could never afford a bow over $500 with a young family.
Fortunately for me, I shoot longbows and there are a ton of options in that range.
Also, most bowyers are willing to work with you on payment if you call them. I've never encountered one that wasn't.
I bet most custom bowyers that sell bows for north of $1000 bring home no more money than you. They love what they do but it ain't a get rich quick kinda business. Your best bet would be to find a local bowyer who has a day job and will build a custom rig for you for $500-$600. Look up Roland Jenkins in Huntsville.
Bonner
You might want to take a look at the bow testing reports from folks like Pete Ward and Blacky Swartz.
I've done this several times over the years and I'm always surprised.
Regardless of the type of traditional bow, just write down speed and cost.
I'm not trying to say speed is the key or only performance variable, just the one easiest to measure.
What will you find is there is very little correlation between price and speed.
The ACS bows are right at the top at around 200fps when shooting arrows weighing 9 grains per pound of peak bow weight.
There are a whole bunch shooting in the 180-195 range. And a small group in the 170's.
For folks who shoot instinctive I don't think a difference in arrow speed of 25-30 fps is going to be noticeable in terms of point of impact.
You will see bows from Predator($700) shooting in the low 190's ahead of Widows. Do you want to pay an additional $600 to get the 5-7fps advantage of the ACS?
So I'd recommend you set your budget and whether new or used, get the bow you shoot best. If there is a close call between a few, let aesthetics or other issues come in.
Sky high prices for the absolute top end has been the reality for many items, forever I guess. You could always get a Rolls Royce or a Ferrari for 10 or 20 times the price of a good automobile, and I suppose before that you could always pay 10 or 20 times the price of a good horse for a "great" horse, if you wanted to and had the money.
I think our compound brethren anticipated this trend before we did. I'll bet you could have sunk $2,000 into a compound bow with all the high end bells and whistles attached 10 years ago, long before anybody tried to break the $1,000 mark with a traditional bow.
$700 hunting jackets and backpacks? They're out there. $600 handheld GPS units and other fancy gadgets? They're out there too. I even buy underwear on sale at an outlet that originally sold for $50 a pair or more (or were at least priced that high anyway, whether anybody actually bought a pair for that price or not, I don't know).
The good thing is that all the stuff is still available at more reasonable prices too. Sometimes paying twice the price means you get 5-10% more in quality; sometimes, all you get is a different name and look.
Let's not forget to thank the owner for the Classifieds either. They are a blessing to most of us. Thanks Terry.
I`ve bought a few new bows. I always end up trading them for something used.....RC
Dont give up hope, I finally got my "dream bow" on **** last month, she was a little beat up and in desperate need of some TLC, but I saved $500.00 buying her used...
My latest bow was funded by me selling two bows. Didn't get what I thought either was worth, but got enough to get what I wanted.
And, the boss lady didn't say a word.
Custom bow prices are dirt cheap compared to custom rifles, or double rifles, or even a custom stock.
I just visited Bob Lee Archery. They tell me that they have about 30 hrs hands on with a bow. Then you got cost of materials, and the upkeep of the shop.
really I don't have a problem with the prices of custom bows.
one can save-its not really that much money.
The last custom bow I bought was a Black Widow. Sold it for almost half what I paid for it. I bought a Firefly from Braveheart 4 years ago and still have it. All my other bows I have bought used except one that I won. Used bows are better values.
I started making my own gear a long time ago...I ws a carpenter w/ three kids...and for me it ws the only way I could get into what I desired...
I worked pt at sporting goods stores, archery shops and fly fishing shops from age 16 into my 40's just to get the goodies I couldnt afford...
when you think of the amount of work in a nice traditional bow( usually 30-40 hours minimum), they are really quite reasonble...@15 bucks an hour plus materials...its easy to get way over 6-700 easily...most bowyers are in it for the love...not to get wealthy...at least I never met one that was...
save, get a pt job...if its something you really want there is a way...
I haven't ever owned a custom bow, but I have shot a few, and my experience has been that there is very little performance difference between a "factory" bow and a "custom" bow. I currently shoot an early 60s model 53# Red Wing Hunter. A good friend of mine shoots a early 2000s (03-06 roughly) Bob Lee 52# TD Recurve. We have shot together quite a bit and while I'm sure a chrono might give his a little of an edge, there is no noticable difference in speed between the two. No major difference in noise either. The difference is that mine was built on an assembly line and looks just like all the other ones that were built along with it and his was built by hand exactly the way he wanted it. A used RWH can be bought for a little over $100 last time I looked at them on various auction sites while his was around $1100. I build custom knives and understand the amount of work that goes into a handmade item, so I believe his is worth every penny he paid for the work that went in to it, but I realize that it isn't necessary to hunt with. Find a cheap used plain jane bow that shoots good to hunt with, then start saving for what you really want. Right now I've got my eyes set on an Acadian Woods TD LB and will gladly pay the $1200 it costs if I am ever able to afford it. I keep hoping a custom bowyer will be interested in working out a trade, or at least a discount, for a knife, but so far no takers. :(
Matt
As I'm typing this, I'm looking at several pages in a magazine describing a $300 bottle of Vodka, an $850 bottle of tequila, a $30,000 (no, there is no mistake in the number of zeros) bottle of single malt scotch that will be sold for $3,700 for a 2-shot taste at Mastro's Steak House in Beverly Hills (not a sponsor here :) .
I think it is the same with cars, fly rods, bows, guns .....
There are the mass produced and marketed items that are probably good value for the $, but not a lot of fun. Then we have the good quality stuff that is priced according to the amount and quality of time and materials that go into the product. 6 months of work by a shade tree mechanic is usually not worth as much as a week of work by someone who really knows his trade and has the artistic talent to make his product exceptional.
I know what I can afford and am willing to save for months or years if necessary if I want something really out of the ordinary. Or, I find something that is good but within my budget and live happily with it.
Then we have the $30,000 scotch!
See - something for everybody :)
QuoteOriginally posted by tomsm44:
I haven't ever owned a custom bow, but I have shot a few, and my experience has been that there is very little performance difference between a "factory" bow and a "custom" bow.
There's really not much of a price difference either though. A new bear recurve starts at $450. Nice custom bows can be found for $525. The reason for owning a custom bow isn't all about performance. A custom bow that you know was handmade just for you can be a prized possession. The finish is almost always better, and they just seem to shoot better, even if not technically better performing.
I agree Giff. That's the point I was trying to make. Not sure if I made that clear. I was just giving an extreme example of a $100 older used bow vs a $1000+ custom rig that I was able to personally compare and that give similar performance. When I went trad, $200 for an entry level Bear or Martin was more than I could afford, not to mention $450 for a top end Bear. I got lucky during my search for a used bow and had my Red Wing Hunter given to me by an older man who doesn't hunt anymore and doesn't have a son interested in it, and who refused any kind of payment. :thumbsup:
Matt
Now there's the ultimate value per dollar!
I got a Cooper .22LR rifle the same way and I prize it more than all my others. Unfortunately, my friend gave it to me as he was dying of cancer. Would much rather have had him keep it and let me shoot it once in a while :)
Tomm44, your bow is as custom as your friends as far as the amount of hand work that went in to it, propbably a bit more in fact. CNC machines are used by most bowyers today. That Red Wing you have is a smoker for sure I have owned several and still own one and it will shoot right up there with a lot of so called modern recurves shooting FF and skinny strings. Great bows and Bob Lee new what he was doing than as well as now!! Shawn
Next year after I buy my wife a new car I'm ordering me a Black Tail. I'm looking forward to being one year older just for that bow. I'm going all out, will spare no expense. Man do they make some pretty bows. Do they shoot as good as they look?
Snypershot, I understand your point. Great bows are a luxury and something that some people want. I'd love a great custom bow one day, but I love my Bear as well. It cost me $300+ and works great. I think the most important thing is to have fun and enjoy the outdoors, be it with a beautiful custom or a store bought less expensive bow. That being said, given the choice I will always try and support artisans if I'm able. Sometimes , however, it's not financially viable.
Snypershot, I understand your point. Great bows are a luxury and something that some people want. I'd love a great custom bow one day, but I love my Bear as well. It cost me $300+ and works great. I think the most important thing is to have fun and enjoy the outdoors, be it with a beautiful custom or a store bought less expensive bow. That being said, given the choice I will always try and support artisans if I'm able. Sometimes , however, it's not financially viable.
I found out years ago that I like the best. Discovered that when I met my wife. First rifle I bought was a Sako Vixen .222 RemMag. First car was a 57 2 dr hardtop Chevy with a built 283, 2 4bbls and 4 on the floor. It was so fast I could not even get a race.
First custom bow was a Marriah and then a Morrison with copperheads.
Then I went through some hard times along with millions of other folks , Sold all my bows and guns and everything else to survive .
I wanted a great bow so bad I just started building them. I figured that with the money it would take me to buy one I could build one and so I did.
I was really happy with that bow so I built another and now I have built so many I don'tknow how many. But , when I want the best I will build it or buy one from Kirk, Bob or RER or some of the other great bowyers .
I will tell you all this. If you had an opportunity to build bows for a living for six months or work at your job for 6 months, If you have a job I would bet that at the end of that six months you would be doing your regular job. Especially if the wife didn't have money to buy groceries .
Bow building is pretty much this,. A labor of love or a manufacturing business . One bowyer shops are doing this for the love of it.
If the bows cost a lot it is generally because the bowyer is putting a lot into the bow. If the bow is cheap then its usually because the bowyer is not accurately assessing his cost and time structure or its because he is cutting some corners in either time or materials.
All this said most custom bowyers sell bow without the super fancy woods ect that are very competitive with the better factory bows.
God bless you all, Steve
times change
broadheads can be $25 each
arrows are $10-15 each
a single KS tag is $400
elk are $650 now?
fuel to my hunting spot $3.50 a gallon
feathers to fletch with aint cheap
my taxidermist is on the high side - $650 a mount .... but its premium work he's doing
I buy used .... wish I could order a decked out Zipper :(
Can't help but think the poor guy from TX probably wishes he wouldn't have started this thread, but it's really good the way everyone has come up with suggestions as to how he COULD get the bow he wants.
Lots of good used bows to get a guy started at budget prices, and then save for the dream rig.
Whether that takes a long time with the cookie jar, or a second job, or giving up something else...there is a way.
Last week, I pulled up to a stoplight and sat beside a brand new Ford pickup. Extended cab, diesel, still had the window sticker on it.
The MSRP on the sticker was $61,000.
I read that sticker while sitting in my $4500 Chevy pickup with 179,000 miles on the clock. Still runs like a top, gets about the same fuel mileage as that $60k pickup and has no car payment attached to it.
I suppose things are worth what people pay for them, but it's incredible the things that we as a society throw away in order to chase the Next Big Thing. I don't think archery equipment is any different.
Well said Jeff. Sometimes we get so caught up in acquiring things we lose track of their real value.
The price of something is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. It's value is whatever the owner perceives it to be.
But I am a sucker for nice wood ;)
It is disheartening, but I don't begrudge a bowyer for charging that much or more(I know you don't either). I think used bows are great, I've bought 100 or more and have yet to be cheated or even disappointed with one.
The wheel bows are made on an assembly line mostly by machines and somehow cost $1000+?
I recently bought a great custom recurve bow for $650 shipped.
I would shop around some for a new custom, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
This being a free market economy, bowyers will charge what they want and should.
I bought the last bow I will buy 3 years ago an ILF recurve $189 FOR THE RISER, $219 for the limbs and it is a sweet shooter. Like many others I have put out some good money for custom bows but those days are behind me.
These days EVERYTHING cost too dang much
I had the privelege of visiting Bob Lee's shop about a year ago. Got to meet Rob and JJ, but Bob had taken the day off to play golf the day I stopped by. (He's earned it at I believe 82 at the time with 60+ years of building bows, and what with being one of the true pioneers of our sport and all :thumbsup: ) I would love to have one of his custom rigs to go with my RWH, but for now, i've decided to try to save for an Acadian because I like the way they look better, and I wanted to support another Louisiana craftsman. :) Whatever I buy, I plan to keep my RWH and will likely still hunt with it from time to time.
Mike,
You are right about that and I'm glad you chimed in. I don't know if anybody has mentioned it on this thread yet, but if you want a true hand crafted bow for a stupid low price, you guys need to check Mike out if you haven't already. I haven't personally shot any of his bows, but I have yet to hear a single negative comment about them from the guys that have. He also makes some great looking youth bows that are dirt cheap. I hope to get a couple of them for my son and daughter over the next year or two.
Matt
As long as guys continue to pay the higher prices the prices will continue to increase. If guys stop paying the higher prices, the prices will reduce or the bowmaker will have to close up shop. They can not survive without profit, they don't get profit if they don't get sales. Price is one reason you see an increase in ILF sales, especially for stuff made outside USA.
Partially because bows containing every wood known to man, plus antler and bone, don't come cheap.
It is unreasonable to think that a custom bow with exotic woods and cosmetic features not found on production bows will cost the same or close. That's like going into a BMW dealer and trying to tell him he should be charging Ford prices. I know quite a few bowyers and most are far from being considered well off so I am uncertain what is happening to all these buckets of money they allegedly are making.
$1000 is a lot harder to come by than it is to spend.
The other day, I took my wife grocery shopping. We turn it into a "date" because sometimes things are too busy to fit it all in.
We needed a lot of things for the house, like laundry detergent, and cleaners...as well as restocking the house with GOOD food and vegetables. We bought very little meat. Groceries totaled almost $260.00 dollars. Add to that a lunch at a small Mexican restaurant, and a $70.00 fillup at a gas station and you have some serious coin. And neither the groceries nor the gas will last very long.
I HATE to say it, but $1000.00 dollars is not that much money anymore...a bow is a bargain.
I have a buddy. BIG time Bass tourney guy. Spent 50K on a Bass boat. Hauled it to the launch in a rusty $1,500 Chevy pick-up. YEAH BABY! that's how we roll!! :bigsmyl: rat'
BoneBuster hit the nail on the head... $1,000 is NOT that much money anymore. And as previously mentioned, $20 here and there, tucked away, adds up. Pay yourself first, no matter how much you earn.
When I think back to how much money I wasted as a youth on "wine, women and song", it makes me cringe. I could have, SHOULD have, went west and visited with Jack Howard and had him make me a GameMaster. But I didn't. I spent my money as many of you guys did on Friday and Saturday nights. :)
Yes, as Bonebuster stated, "A bow is a Bargain".
Buy a good quality one and it will last for years.
Nothing wrong with owning some stuff. Make sure, though, that your stuff doesn't own you. If I have to have the best of everything, or if I can't let go of anything in order to get something I really do want, I take that as a sign.
nala you think its expensive up there man you ought to try and get a Bow into this country it real expensive being the last bit of dirt before the south pole :biglaugh:
I'm so sick of seeing this thread at the top. Custom bows are expensive like any precision equipment, good rods and reels for offshore fishing and guns cost even more, so whatever. Buy a Samick Sage and get over it. Pay to play. Most bowyers do it on the side and the overhead eats up the sticker price. This is handmade functional art on a good day. If used for a lifetime its cheap.
If we are talking money and spending there are many ways to view the situation. One can see the bow builder as a working man trying to earn a profit and stay in business. Some see it as maybe the bow makers being too proud of their work and asking too much. Unless we are the guys doing the work, the sanding, gluing etc, our opinion only counts as the customer. The bow builders do the work and they set the price. We can only pay the price or shop elsewhere.
The third side of the situation might ask, is the person going in debt to buy these expensive toys? That can lead us to this very ugly truth, the USA is $17 trillion in debt, but those in charge keep spending and we keep voting them back into office. Some might say wasting money comes natural to us. Most of us see it as enjoying the fruits of our efforts but if we are overspending and going into debt then it is a mistake.
Archery is part of our heritage, so is overspending. I am as guilty of overspending as anyone so I guess I should not complain.
I have two excellent longbows from a local bowyer who happens to be a friend of mine that perform as well as bows costing hundreds more. His current base price is $450 and for that you get a bow that performs. Fast, quiet, and accurate. They look good, too. What more could I want? I have bows that cost more, but I wind up shooting my best shooters and those are the bows my friend builds.