Many famous Bowhunters have not had Broadheads today's expensive and yet they were very successful in the hunt. Even today one of the most successful bowhunters Terry Green uses cheap-broadheads Zwickey . What you say ?
german-kinetics Original SilverFlame Broadheads 3pack 210grain €64,95= $86.55
Zwickey 4 blade Delta 135 gr. Glue on 6 pk $27.99
alaskabowhunting Silver Flame® Broadheads XXL Sold by the 3-pack $109.95
Tusker Concorde screw in 250 Right single bevel 3 pack - $22.99
VPA Penetrator 2 Blade 3pk $45.95
TuffHead Broadhead 3-pack $56.50
I don't NEED a $50k truck either but I got one
Haha Biggie, this is true. I didn't need to buy another widow but it sure makes me feel better
I think it is all about confidence building. Some folks think the more expensive then the better.
I agree and depend on good performance, and if that happens to be cheap; then better yet.
All jokes aside, I have been in manufacturing my whole life and can appreciate the high cost of tooling and materials on some heads. Those are fine with me although they don't kill a critter any deader than the cheaper ones.
A broadhead is a tool, so is money.
I think its great that there are so many options out there. BUT you will never ever ever find me shooting a broadhead that cost 100 bucks for 3!
The broadheads that are now considered "cheap" or less expensive have a time tested proven track record, work flawlessly, sharpen great, fly true, tough as nails, etc. so they are all i use and plan to ever use. But like everything else in the world its good to have options. Like rick above stated confidence is everything and it having an expensive broadhead on the end of thier arrow makes them feel like they have a better chance of harvesting game, then its worth it everytime.
Need is one thing, want is another. You could take a butter knife, a file and some JB weld, attach it to the end of an arrow and I can guarantee you if you do your part you can kill a deer with it.
look at the Indians what did they use. say no more :thumbsup:
Yeah Jeff, but they switched to steel as soon as they could 8-)
Abowyer brown bears are around 50.00 for a three pack; and they are shaving sharp out of the package. Sure I can buy BH's for less and sharpen them but it is nice to have the choice.
Short answer--No, not needed. I don't drive a $50K truck either--don't need it, couldn't afford it if I wanted one. :rolleyes:
Biggie posted: 'A broadhead is a tool, so is money' absolutely right on! Money is a tool!
I don't NEED a Habu either, LOL. Amazingly right now my go-to heads are Snuffers, and I was thinking about picking up some Magnus Stingers or Buzzcuts too...is it wrong to shoot cheap heads out of your Habu?? LOL. Some seem worth the price tag to me. Like German Kinetics Silverflames..excellent craftsmanship and will shave the skin off a gnat, I'll pay a premium for high quality. 100% voluntary and unnecessary. A $100 hickory selfbow and some Zwickey Eskimos will do the job just fine. But like driving a Benz, if I can use the Habu why not????
QuoteOriginally posted by JEFF B:
look at the Indians what did they use. say no more :thumbsup:
As soon as they got guns and horses they used them.
All of the expensive broadheads out there are a result of the manufacturing processes that are used. They do make great heads and you have to have a new "gimick" to get into the market today. If there is a demand, if it makes you feel better to shoot them, then go for it. Nothing against them. But don't be fooled, if Jack Zwickey was starting from scratch today his heads wouldn't be $27/6, try double that. They are that inexpensive because the tooling is paid off, low overhead and the process had been around for years not because they are cheap heads. Dean
Cost is relative, I have a VPA 3 blade that has been thru 3 deer and a coyote and I plan to put it through at least a few more. They are a good solid head and last a long time, unless I hit a rock or heavy bone and bend or break one. Just like guys say I cannot justify the cost of a dozen carbon arrows at 100 bucks a dozen, I can buy aluminum for half that, yeah but a dozen carbons will out last a dozen aluminum by a long ways ecspecially the type of shooting I do, so which is really cheaper. I just bought a dozen VPA's, they cost me $165 but I may have enough to last me say 6-8 years, do the math, not that expensive in the long run. Shawn
If you can or want to -- DO; If you can't or don't want to -- DON'T!
That's why there is a Cadillac and Chevy; Lincoln or Ford; etc.
What's the big deal??
Arne
I use a 2 blade VPA Penetrator, I thought maybe exaggerating because there are cheaper that do the job perfectly
Last time I was hunting in africa (2011) I had a chat with our ph about broad heads , he liked all the wheel shooters to use rage heads but us trad shooters he liked us to use things like woodsman's .
He then told me about a client he was planning to take on a cape buff hunt ( compound shooter) who had been asking advice about a broad head for the buff , benito ( our ph ) recomended silver flames (gk 's ) & the guy said " but they cost £56 for 3 heads !!!!!!!". Benito said " & your buff £ 6000 !
Isn't it worth it ?"
Probably if I got to hunt every week, I would use whatever broadheads would do the job. Since I only get to hunt once or twice a year, I will use Silver Flames. Even if I ended up losing 1 or 2 of them a year (which I haven't) it really doesn't amount to that much, spread over time.
I would venture to say that indians dropped the bows for the Winchester pretty fast.
Need?? The TV said I NEED a rage head or I cant kill anything.
Really though what we need is quality that flys true and gets sharp.
QuoteOriginally posted by McDave:
Probably if I got to hunt every week, I would use whatever broadheads would do the job. Since I only get to hunt once or twice a year, I will use Silver Flames. Even if I ended up losing 1 or 2 of them a year (which I haven't) it really doesn't amount to that much, spread over time.
in this statement makes sense and common sense
I think it is a lot in confidence in your setup. I shoot GK Silverflames. When I first started shooting them I was worried as heck that I might lose one. I do lose one every once in a while.....but not without a good fight on my part to find it. :thumbsup:
The GK's are the only "expensive" head I have ever used. I have used a ton of different heads over my lifetime of hunting, and IMHO, there is not a better head out there than the Silverflame. I can also tell you that this no other broadhead that is sharper out of the box. These heads are scary sharp when new.
There are plenty of other heads that will do a fine job, for way less money. There are a few that are pretty much junk.
People ask me all the time if the Silverflames are "worth the money that they cost". I always tell them that to me they are but to you they may not be.
Bisch
I also think some of the extra cost is having the broad heads hunting sharp right out of the package. Now you are paying for the sharpping service. I would want at least $5 a broad head if I was going to get them shaving sharp. Some folks just have a hard time with sharpping and I think it is great that they are willing to pay more to hunt with a properly sharpened broad head.
When I have a Woodsman or an Eskimo on the end of my arrow I have all the confidence I need. Having a Silver Flame may make me think about what is going to happen when I shoot through and hit a rock LOL.
God bless, Steve
Like Shawn said, those VPA at $15ea. will last a looooong time, I don't think you can hurt them so just don't loose them and your good for a long while.
Eric
I've got 90-95 grizzlies I paid 4 bucks a head or less- I think I'm good for life
QuoteOriginally posted by Biggie Hoffman:
I don't NEED a $50k truck either but I got one
:thumbsup:
I think one of the most important decisions a person has to make with a broadhead is how easy is it to resharpen. It is really nice to have a head come out of the box scary sharp. but sooner rather than later its going to need to be sharpened. even just pulling in and out of a quiver a dozen times or so will dull them down. among the million other ways they get dull. So whatever broadhead a person chooses they need to have a plan to get them sharp and keep them sharp. Also we should be practicing with the broadheads we are going to hunt with atleast a few dozen shots so good to buy a couple extras for practice and/or know how to resharpen them scary sharp.
I saw those silverflames in person at jays sporting goods here in michigan and i can say they are a awesome broadhead and very sharp. not the broadhead for me and my situations but a wicked broadhead any way you cut it!
I have a 3 blade vpa that I shot one little 100 pound sow with that is bent.... None of em are indestructible..
I really don't mind the sharpening process, its
kind of a labor of love. I've loaded up with Woodsmans a while ago, and I'm going to use Magnus 2 blades this year as well. Are there better broadheads out there?? yes, but these are what work for me. I may try others in the future.
I was at a midwest hardware/sporting goods store about 20 years ago. They had some archery stuff from years back. He had file drawer 3/4 full of the smaller Deadheads and a file drawer that was a little more than 3/4 filled with the bigger Deadheads. He complained that he only sold just a few of them and I could have the whole works for $25. Did that make them cheap enough? What irked me, I was on my motor cycle, 500 miles from home and I did not have enough cash on me to buy them. A few months later, I got back to that town the hardware store was gone and no one knew anything about the stock that was left or where the old gentleman, that had owned it for so many years, went.
By all means buy the more expensive broadheads. Just remember the law of diminishing returns. At a certain point the more expensive broadhead just doesn't give you anymore bang for your buck. You have to decide where that point is for you.
And in some cases, you're paying for the hype instead of the broadhead.
To me, no, there not worth MY money( not saying the quality doesn't justify the cost) I've never shot anything much over 200 pounds, so that might be different. For deer and hogs, Magnus 1's and Snuffers have never let me down.
Shoot what you like, and have confidence in. However, by no means do you have to feel like you are handicapped, if you use a Zwickey, or similar "old school" head that has stood the test of time.
are you hunting whitetail?
or asiatic water buffalo >1500lbs ?
I have killed big game with Bear Razorheads, Zwickeys, Magnus, you name it. But the extreme high quality are interesting to me. Last year I started using the Tuff Heads from vintage archery. I have never messed with such a precise head. Even though they are of similiar design, they are 10x the quality of any Grizzly head i have used.
Does that quality difference matter? Not to the perfect lung shot big game animal. MIGHT it matter? Hopefully i will never find out.....but i revel in the comfort of knowing that i am using arguably the best head available. And hell, its my money :-)
Buy what you want and can afford.
For me, a magnus or zwickey will shoot better than I can shoot them and I can't blame a miss or a bad hit on my broadheads.
No, they aren't needed to kill something but the improvements in quality over the cheapest stuff make it worth the cost of admission to enough folks that they are still being made.
I'll cut you a check for $30 for the entire lot.
Actually indians dropped the bow in favor of a gun because it was something that was new to them. A gun made it thunder with no clouds in the sky and killed a man at a great distance with an unseen force.To them it was powerfull medicine(magic). Well now we know it wasnt really magic but still today we see advertizments of new fangled broadheads and bows that are said to do great thing, i saw one broadhead comercial on tv where it even showed cavemen killing a T-REX with one of those new broadheads so they must be big magic,lol.
No, we don't need them to be able to take game, but if you like 'em and can afford 'em, then, by all means, go for it. That wide choice of goodies is part of the fun of bow hunting. Since I can't afford the new advanced heads, I will stay with the tried and true Magnus and Zwickie and not feel under equipped, but I readily admit I would like to give them a try.
Here is the funny thing if it was someone like Mickey Lotz asking the question he would say the Zwickey and Snuffers were the expensive ones cause he shoots flint so the answer in defintely no we don't need them but there is alway a butt ya know. We than would all be shooting osage or hickory selfbows, with cane arrows and self nocks and flint heads. It really is not about what ya shoot it is the guys ability to get close and make the shot, Terry, RC, Curt and many others myself included could kill stuff with a simple stick and string with a whittled hickory branch with a nail stuck in the end. Shawn
Most of those big expensive heads are designed for BIG tough animals. If you can swing going to Alaska or Africa for Moose,Grizz,Buff,etc I don't think a couple hundred $$$$ for broadheads is going to sink you.If you can afford them and want to use them squirrel hunting,have at it and be happy. Me,I have SilverFlame dreams on a Snuffer budget! :D
I just don't get the shaving sharp out of the package deal for me. Really don't you test shoot ALL your broadheads before you hunt with them? I guess the old saying a fool and his money are quick parted goes with this thread. JHMO your mileage may vary.
What does the killing?
QuoteOriginally posted by LC:
I just don't get the shaving sharp out of the package deal for me. Really don't you test shoot ALL your broadheads before you hunt with them? I guess the old saying a fool and his money are quick parted goes with this thread. JHMO your mileage may vary.
I do not know if this is directed toward the claims I made but I can assure you (if it was) my set up is VERY well tuned. I can put just about any 150gr head out there on the end of my arrow and it will fly true and to its mark.....unless I flub something formwise.
I love the fact that my heads are ready to hunt out of the package. I know my heads are going to fly right because I have done a lot of work to get everything right and have been shooting these heads for a long time.
And no, I do not test shoot ALL my broadheads. The GK heads I shoot are top quality and are all the same. I pay a premium for that when I buy them.
Bisch
What bothers me about the expensive heads is I am always losing my arrows. Sometimes after passing through an animal. I guess I'm cheap. I just like the zwickeys, grizzlies, and tuskers. I can get them very sharp and I have had great success with them. If I lost a 30 dollar tip and arrow I would probably spend hours looking for it. Gary
QuoteOriginally posted by sagebrush:
What bothers me about the expensive heads is I am always losing my arrows. Sometimes after passing through an animal. I guess I'm cheap. I just like the zwickeys, grizzlies, and tuskers. I can get them very sharp and I have had great success with them. If I lost a 30 dollar tip and arrow I would probably spend hours looking for it. Gary
I have spent a considerable amount of time looking for the few I have lost. Way more time than it took to find the critter!
Bisch
Joey gave me a silverflame a few years back. It was so sharp I was afraid of it. I shot a hog down at Marty's camp in south Florida. The arrow zipped thru, then kicked up and went 40 yards beyond and landed in the palmettoes. Marty came to pick me up. I saw the hog go down so we went right to it and loaded it up. It was probably 100 degees and 90% humidity. We'd killed a big rattlesnake earlier in the day.
We spent some time looking for that $80 arrow and broadhead. After 10 minutes or so Marty realized he'd lost his peepers. We looked for them and the arrow for 10 more minutes. He finally said to heck with it, I have another pair of glasses in my truck, I said we can leave without your glasses but I'm not leaving without that head.
Never used it again.
I have used some of the more expensive heads ie the VPA 3 blades $15 a head and can honestly say the quality of the heads is truthfully no better then the quality of a Zwickey or the original woodsman. They are a little tougher than the original woodsman because of them being machined from one piece of steel though. However since the prices of the VPA's seems to keep going up (when I first started buying them they were $35 dollars for a 3 pack) and I am on a budget I feel my money is now better spent on heads like Zwickeys where I can pay $30 for 6 heads and honestly they will last me as long as the VPA's have probably.
No. For most applications, Ace or similar heads work very well.
Currently I hunt with what I can afford. A used longbow, wood shafts, and Ace broad heads. I can appreciate all of the aspects of high end equipment, from $1200 bows, to $30 broad heads. And if I were a wealthier man, you bet your butt I'd be giving them a try. I love that our free market affords us so many options and price points, and I'm also impressed that guys continue to improve on what's out there, and are able to carve out a living with new products for us to try.
David.
I shot a coyote with a Silver flame one time it was pretty impressive.
For me it's Grizzlys or Zwickeys ....
Way cheaper to buy meat at the grocery store if money is a big concern. I do this for fun and buy the products that make me happy. I once thought I could make my own bows cheap after spending $1500 on my last custom rig. I was right, I can make em now for about $80. But that first one I built cost north of $5k in power tools.
Bonner
I'm firmly in the camp of shoot what you like, money is a tool and you sure aren't taking any of it with you when you check out. Thankful there are more than 3 choices so everyone can be satisfied.
I like that, "money is a tool"....
I try to make responsible decisions regarding my tools, lol... Just funnin'
A lost arrow with broadhead is of no consequence to me when I take a shot at big game.
Sure, I look for the arrow and like to find them. I even backtrack a couple times if the arrow isn't a pass through or still in the animal when I recover it. The animal/experience is worth far more than the cost of the arrow and broadhead.
I use what I think will be effective for me.
I have Silver Flames that I paid full price for. Great looking head. However, I hunt with a friends broadhead that I didn't pay a dime for.
Just curious and I have no opinion either way, what are the advantages of a silver flame or a tuffhead to an identically shaped standard head like an Ace or a Zwickey or whatever if they are both equally sharp. I have only ever seen them on the computer. i read that it is a choice made with money, that is fine, but I would like more particulars.
It would be different if they only disclosed the price after payment was made. Don't want to pay the price...don't buy!
The constant complaining I see about the cost of archery goods gets real old. Don't like what is available or the price of what is available, make them yourself. See how long it takes you. Multiply your hourly pay by that, add materials and see what is too expensive.
BigJim
I've been using Woodsman Elites the last couple of years (original Wensel Woodsmans before that) and I wish they were cheaper but I pay the price.
I figure compared to what my bows, clothing, binoculars, and ACC arrows cost the broadheads are not outlandishly expensive.
QuoteOriginally posted by pavan:
Just curious and I have no opinion either way, what are the advantages of a silver flame or a tuffhead to an identically shaped standard head like an Ace or a Zwickey or whatever if they are both equally sharp. I have only ever seen them on the computer. i read that it is a choice made with money, that is fine, but I would like more particulars.
I don't think you can get them equally sharp. That leads to the question; how sharp is sharp enough and when is the point of diminishing return?
Of course there are going to be two camps on this topic... heck on most topics...
I guess I'm kinda in the middle... I've used Magnus 1's and Snuffers for years... but I tinker and like to try new stuff. I've used a lot of different heads on one hunt or another including the Silver Flame DS which is the for runner to the XXL...
I've settled into the VPA Terminator heads as I like the design... 250 grain 1 1/4" heads and the 300 grain Big Jim Big-3 are the only heads I own right now other then the pile of parts and bent heads that have accumulated over the years...
To each their own, use what you like to use and have confidence in getting the job done.
I was able to snag some Silver Flames pretty cheap off the classifieds, I probably wouldn't by them at full cost. But, having used them, I have to say they are one wicked head, and about as sharp as you can get something. I like 'em!
Yes. You should also be using a $3,000 bow, $800 arrows, $300 pants, and $100 drawers. Bring a spare set of drawers for times when you lose an arrow, drop your bow, or crap your pants.
I have no problem with what anybody buys. I don't like to buy something thinking it's top quality because it's expensive and then find that it's not. I'm usually in the middle,but I just ordered some Badgers. I got them on special for a little over thirteen dollars a piece. Most expensive ones i've ever bought,but if I like them and they are high quality I would not have a problem buying them again.
Hard to imagine a better broadhead than a Grizzly, 6@$30
Maybe a little different angle here - Broadheads are for hitting live animals and making them die. I believe the approach before money should be are "you" confident that what you are using will accomplish that (killing) in a way you are satified with and fits within the criteria of ethical for you- given that your shot hits the kill zone of course.
I have put some heads on the front of my arrows and then removed them and bought something else because I thought I could put something better on the killing end of my arrow - for the sake of a quick clean kill and for my conscious. Sometimes that had to do with my inability to get those particular broadheads sharp enough and other times with their lack of strength in case I hit bone. I will pay what I can to not feel the remorse of an animal suffering any longer than is necessary if I can control it.
It means , that we've reached that Zwickey can not sharpen well as the Silver Flame ? --- nonsense!
Self-confidence comes only with expensive equipment? - Nonsense !!
Confidence comes with plenty of exercise, high-quality exercise with your bow .
Confidence comes when you make a good setup.
The only thing I can respect and understand the attitude of "I have money and I want expensive" and that's it.
And you know very well that Zwickey overthrow any animal on the planet if it is well sharpened and hit where it should.
:archer2:
I personally don't care what broadhead anyone uses as long as the outcome is a clean humane kill.
Do you use the least expensive bow there is, or the least expensive arrow, or string, etc.? A $30 dollar garage sale bow can kill just as well as a $1500 custom bow.
If someone wants to use an expensive broadhead (or bow, or arrow) and their family is not lacking in any respect and they can afford it, that is their choice.
I choose to shoot Tuffheads with titanium inserts attached to Easton ACC shafts out of and ACS bow...
why... very simple....."Because I can"...and as I heard someone say " it only costs a little more to go first class"
QuoteOriginally posted by gringol:
Yes. You should also be using a $3,000 bow, $800 arrows, $300 pants, and $100 drawers. Bring a spare set of drawers for times when you lose an arrow, drop your bow, or crap your pants.
You sound like an angry young man for some reason.
I have a $1500 bow does that make me a bad capitalist?
QuoteOriginally posted by bowfanatik:
It means , that we've reached that Zwickey can not sharpen well as the Silver Flame ? --- nonsense!
:archer2:
I PROMISE you can't get a zwickey as sharp as a silver flame. It's metalurogically impossible.
I always wonder if the anti-expensive broadhead crowd carry the philosophy throughout all the other facets of their life.
- garage sale bow, custom bow?
- Tahoe, Yugo? (both go from point A to B)
- Dinette Set, Folding table and chairs?
- Tent, fifth wheel?
One day I was trying to head off a nice 8 pointer. I had a top of line Schulz longbow, the best Easton shafts with shaving sharp and spendy Jerry Hill broadheads. I took a chance and changed positions as the buck approached. It saw the movement and busted right into a fellow with a used 45 pound Kodiak Bear, with Bear wood arrows with Bear broadheads. He made a perfect shot, the buck went down within 100 yards. His heads were only file sharpened, but they got the job done. It hurt, but I offered to help with the deer. He said, it was his first deer and would like a field dressing lesson. Which I did and helped him drag his deer out. He accused me of being really nice and high classed. The next weekend I came out and he was waiting by my car to see if I needed help with a deer. I did not. The next weekend I hunted there again and came out to see him again waiting by my car. He asked if I needed help and showed him my bloody arrow. He said "Great, I got my buddy's cart in the back, I can pull your deer out for you." Now talk about your first class. I hope that those with lots and lots of money to spend do not look down their noses too long at those that are shooting modest weight used recurves and lowly Zwickey and Bear broadheads. It could make one crossed eyed and a bit short sighted.
And this will end this discussion.
Maybe we should all go hunting and come back with some good stories to tell.