Haven't been on a lot lately due to 50-60 hours a week at work since Jan., and farm and home responsibilities. Have not been shooting much either, for 2-3 weeks at a time, hardly get to touch a bow. Tonight just before dark, got one of my old faithful Quinn stallions out, still set up for hunting, and walked out and shot 10 shots between 15-30 yds. Surprisingly all were in the kill zone on the el cheapo small deer 3 D target I have. I then pulled 2 broadhead tipped arrows out and in nearly pitch dark shot both of the touching each other in the center of the group! I had been shooting much more in the spring, and struggling with some errors, but just really worked my way thru each shot, did not overthink it, and made me think that after we have sufficient muscle memory, we may overdo it in our head sometimes, at least for me. Any of you guys have similar experiences?
Yep.....one of the reasons I now only shoot one or two arrows at a time and keep my sessions short.
I don't know if going that long would be desirable for me, but I think what you are talking about is why me and my wife do so much better when we go stumping than when we go to the 3d course, less shooting and also less familiar shots I believe, slows us down
I used to shoot 50 to 100 arrows a day religiously but after a few years of that I found myself getting sloppy. Then I went to a dozen or two shots a day to keep my eye and muscles tuned but a month before hunting season I would shoot one arrow a day, sometimes morning and sometimes evening. I concentrated on that shot and let my brain and body take over.
I haven't hunted much in the last few years and over the last year haven't even shot much but when I do shoot those first few are right on target. I get a bit sloppy after that but that is because my archery muscles are out of shape.
I make myself practice with a single arrow so that I have to walk and retrieve my arrow each. I guess in a way it helps erase the memory of the previous shot. How many times can you remember where the first shot of the day was perfect? It happens that way more often than not for me.
No, we dont shoot too much for hunting practice.
I go through, what I like to call a "after hunting season lull". That's when I hardly shoot at all because I'm usually preparing for the upcoming trout season, (fly-fishing), or the weather to cold outside. But when the weather starts to break, I start shooting daily. The first several sessions I push myself by shooting a lot of arrows,(60-70 arrows a day if work doesn't get in the way 2-3 arrows a round), starting at 25yrds and finishing at about 10yrds. I do this to build up my muscle memory, muscle tone, and eye focus. Starting about the middle of June I start backing down my shooting significantly ,(30-40 arrows a day, 15-20 in the morning and 15-20 in the evening), and start working on my form. After a month or so I start shooting outside my comfort zone, shooting around trees, straight down shots from a stand, low light conditions, etc. etc. etc.. By time the hunting season gets here I am only shooting 10 arrows a day, one arrow at a time. I never shoot the same distance twice during those 10 arrow a day sessions. It helps my eyes judge distance better for when I'm in the woods. I am lucky to shoot 3-4 arrows a day after the season starts to keep my muscle tone and memory in shape. This is what works for me,,, :archer2:
In 2010, my hand was in a cast for 5 months, the day after I had it removed I was in Maine on a bear hunt. (Had a flintlock rifle just in case)I shot a few arrows and I was back on, however, I don't think that you can shoot too much, and I'd never go that long if I can help it. I try not to go more than a day or two with out shooting at least 10 arrows. I also shoot because its a great stress reliever.
I normally shoot daily 6-dozens of arrows daily all year long. However, my work (which is ironically archery) got me out of sinc about mid-April.
I took the curve to 30 and 40 yards yesterday afternoon for the first time in weeks. I can't say I was any better than when I laid of in April but I was pleased to not be any worse.
Any shot taken without being in the proper frame of mind (process vs result oriented)risks damage to the shooting psyche. Of course such wrong-thinking shots are impossible for most not to occasionally make.
The cure for a shot that needs improvement is to "Reflect" on how the shot felt and what will I do next shot to improve. If my mind races to something I did wrong (wrong-thinking) I immediately counter that negative thought with what I WILL do next.
Not shooting doesn't fix anything for me.
I am a firm believer in practicing "too far" to develop super confidence in bow range (20 and under for me).
I will spend 9 days hunting from the ground this coming October. So, I'm going to be practicing more from the ground as that hunt approaches.
As deer season approaches I normally shoot almost entirely from an elevated (my 17' high deck) position. That practice begins about 2 weeks out. I will shoot 1-2 arrows each at 3D deer targets placed about at 10, 15, and 20 yards from this elevated position.
This is the age old quantity vs quality debate. I think a handful of quality shots few times a week is better than hundreds of sloppy shots a day. If you're practice gets sloppy you are only learning bad habits. That said, if you could keep your form a focus through 100 shots, it would probably be good for your shooting. I can't come close to that so I don't try.
I believe that compelling arguments can be made for both view points. A lot of the shot happens in your brain and everyone has a different approach to it.
If a few arrows work best for you...Great! If you feel better by shooting a lot of arrows everyday...Keep at it. Quality and purposful practice helps with shot quality and confidence.
A lot of us love to shoot and it is an enjoyable part of our daily lives. Just keep the enjoyment in it. Realize you will have good and bad days and roll with it.
Hunt hard, take shots that you feel confident in, and shoot your bow when you want to. Smile and repeat!
Sam: I am one of those who finds that I do best in a hunting situation or where conditions are changing and not static. It seems to me that having shot for so many years that it doesn't take too long to get back on the horse and do well....unless I am shooting a border line too heavy bow. I find that stumping and shooting at small game keeps me where I need to be to be confident.
Once we kinda figure out how to shoot trad archery, I think there is a balance between too much and too little practice. Too much tends to cause lapses in concentration and enthusiasm. This allows bad habits to take hold. Too little cause this perishable skill to wane, likewise leading to a loss of conditioning and more bad habits to take hold. I try to shoot enough to be effective but little enough that full concentration can be given to each shot.
It's not possible to shoot too much - except physically.
When success happens in a hunting situation it's because of muscle memory - that's why you hear so many say " I don't remember drawing or releasing" - because their learned behavior from doing it thousands of times kicked in and took care of it for them.
Hunting practice - I recommend stump shooting with one arrow.
If I'm a deer I'm a lot more worried about the guy who shoots 300 arrows a week than the guy who shoots three.
Besides- its FUN!!!!
Having been forced into "longer than I'd like" shooting layoffs, due work or surgery, I've found that my first shooting session after a layoff is a good one. I figure that my mind is focused entirely on executing the shot and things happen the way they're supposed to!
This spring, I worked a stretch of 12.5 hr. days for 10.5 weeks, only having Easter Sunday off. Had an an additional hour on the road to and from the job, so I was leaving around 5:30 a.m. and getting home around 8:00 p.m. Spent the first 2 weeks after the job was finished catching up on work around the house. Finally got out the bow and shot as well as I have in years.
Having not shot at all for 3 months, I was so focused on my form that it all just "clicked". Not saying that a layoff is a good thing, but that focus and concentration are the keys to consistent shooting. I've found that I can "over practice" and in turn I start to over think my shot. Hard to explain and probably came off as confusing!
Mike
Old woodchucker, is one VERY superstitious Indian!!!!!
Many will not agree... But, it works for me!!! LOL
The boys and I usualy practice every day,as much as we can,all summer long. Starting in September, we only take 1 arrow out to practice with. We take our time, and shoot 1 arrow at the target. "you only get 1 shot" mentality... Usualy by hunting season in October, we're as good as we're going to get!
Once hunting season starts... We do NOT practice at all!!!!! (except for carrying a Judo, for the occational stump or squirrel)
The personal reason behind this, is that I DO NOT, want a bad practice session to shake our confidence!!!!!
Just one old woodchucker's oppinion.....
Hill shot 100+ arrows daily for years and he seemed to do alright when hunting.
When I shoot multiple arrows it is because I am working on some sort of form or learning a distance. I found I get to critical of myself and my shooting drops off. So when I take a quiver full of arrows out I only work on some sort of form.
What I do to practice for hunting is shoot one and only one arrow. I go out and look at my target. I literally close my eyes and imagine how the shot would be if it were a real animal in front of me. I "watch" it walk. In my head the animal always stops where I want it to and always presents a shot. The kicker is I only shoot once. I would do this every 30-45 minutes through the day/night and not every night. It keeps it different for me so I don't get bored. I also don't stop at certain distances. I just stop in random places.
Shoot as much as you want, when you want. But stop when it becomes sloppy. If you can stop before it becomes sloppy, that is ideal.
IMO, concentration and physical skills are apples and oranges. When they come together....you're gold.
Fellers I can relate, I do much better hunting than I do 3D, or do better stump shooting, probably because I am shooting within my comfort zone. I am way more serious about hunting, and the last 4 weeks before season, shoot mostly broad heads, which shoot the same as my field tips for me, but amps up my confidence! I will be shooting more shortly, lots of overtime about over and farming chores getting put by for the season. I like to shoot 30-40 shots a day, no more close to season, so as not to pick up sloppy shooting habits. Usually in the spring and early summer, I am playing around with different bows, different techniques, but have stopped that, just anchor, focus and pull thru, has worked for me since I was 10 years old shooting a Bear solid fiberglass#25 bow.
Some may shoot to much if they get sloppy and in bad form but keep firing away. Sometimes I shoot a few arrows sometimes shoot for quite a while depends on how I feel and how its going. If I am working on a form issue then lots of arrows into the bale at close range to drive it home as long as focus is maintained.
A few years back I used to shoot for hours at a time because well its fun, however I have realized it was counterproductive to improvement. Now much shorter intense sessions yield better results.
I see where you are going, and ill answer with what works for you is the answer.
Now my commentary is this, I just like to shoot arrows. If I can help it I don't like to miss a day of shooting. Here lately it's been tough with everything going on so I may get 10 arrow here and a few days later a few more. But what I like to do is if I'm outside (usually am) then I have a bow and some arrows out there and I may just pick it up and shot a few and continue on with my work. So by the end of the day I may have shot 100 or so arrows just a couple at a time.
But I LOVE to shoot, so a lot of times ill focus on good quality shooting for a couple rounds but then I move to rolling soccer balls, thrown discs, swinging whiffle balls etc. just for the joy.
I'm also a slingshot addict and usually have one on me at all times. I work in St. Louis and I still shoot my slingshots daily at lunch. I just like projectiles!!!LOL
I don't think you can ever practice too much but you can practice poorly. When a lot of us try to shoot too much at once, I think it's common to kind of zone out and just go through the motions. I try (try, I don't always succeed) to shoot about 3 dozen arrows at a time, max. That keeps me in it and keeps me from zoning out.
Normally, I shoot ten months a year. Between small game and winter roving after the January season closes in Jersey.
I then take 2 months off and start again in April preparing for Spring Turkey in May. Once fishing season hits for Bass/Walleye, I shoot roughly 3 days a week, 25 arrows per session in my back yard at small pieces of foam or whatever at unknown distances.
From September on, I shoot as much as I can and never stop practicing even when hunting season arrives. That's one problem I notice from younger hunters...they hunt...but forget to keep practicing during the season.
I shoot a little and I shoot a lot and it is all good...the main thing is that I only shoot when I want to, and when I want to shoot well...if I am shooting badly I quickly forget about it and call it a conditioning session, just to keep in shape...the idea that shooting poorly will lead to bad habits is way too simplistic for me...as long as we have the ability to think and reason, and are willing to put in some effort, it is amazing the things we can fix...often when I go hunting I will shoot one arrow at a target and according to how that arrow feels and the result, I will set my maximum effective distance for that particular hunt...sometimes it is only going to be 15 yards...and sometimes it is going to be lot closer to 30 yards
DDave
QuoteOriginally posted by Brianlocal3:
I see where you are going, and ill answer with what works for you is the answer.
Now my commentary is this, I just like to shoot arrows. If I can help it I don't like to miss a day of shooting. Here lately it's been tough with everything going on so I may get 10 arrow here and a few days later a few more. But what I like to do is if I'm outside (usually am) then I have a bow and some arrows out there and I may just pick it up and shot a few and continue on with my work. So by the end of the day I may have shot 100 or so arrows just a couple at a time.
But I LOVE to shoot, so a lot of times ill focus on good quality shooting for a couple rounds but then I move to rolling soccer balls, thrown discs, swinging whiffle balls etc. just for the joy.
I'm also a slingshot addict and usually have one on me at all times. I work in St. Louis and I still shoot my slingshots daily at lunch. I just like projectiles!!!LOL
Okay so I got a little ahead of myself there...we all need to remember back, on occasion, to when we first learned to like projectiles...and remind ourselves that flinging projectiles is what keeps us young...thanks for reminding me...it is dark out here right now so I am just gonna go fling a few arrows in my basement and be thankful that I can
DDave
Dave Wallace 7 time world longbow champion told me, he shoots once a week.
Yep,
I usually shoot real well after giving it a break.
But I don't intentionally go for very long because I enjoy shooting.
It is a personal thing.
If my practice is repetitive, like in the backyard, yes, I can shoot too much and get sloppy.
Something that is always changing, like stumping? Nope. I can't shoot enough. Last year in Idaho I bet I shot 100 arrows a day, just wandering around. And I was never better. I shot at the knothole in this board probably 500 times in that 10 days.
(http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h227/rnorris/IMG_0124.jpg) (http://s65.photobucket.com/user/rnorris/media/IMG_0124.jpg.html)
It looks like most of us are quite the same. I love to just shoot. My main hunting bow is a 65 pound pull, so the arm gets tired if I shoot too many. So I got myself a 45 pound bow that I can literally hundreds of arrows per session. I know some people say to stop when you get sloppy, but I tend to want to end on a good note. So if I do get sloppy, I try to get back on track before ending the day. The only time I quit early is if I find myself getting frustrated or not enjoying it. If I can't have fun, then I just don't shoot.
As for hunting, about two months out I only shoot the bow I am going to hunt. About a month out, I really start shooting no more than 3 arrows per target at the 30 target course near my house. Two weeks out is when I go down to one arrow per target and always through brush, behind trees, or any other life like situation. The final week I do the same, but with broad heads only. I haven't missed a shot hunting in a long time. Now if only I could manage to get more opportunities to get shots off I would be golden.
I try to shoot most days, and usually do. I also love to shoot, and love how it helps get my mind right when things are stressing me out. I have been shooting stickbows off and on since childhood, but am at a point where I am really trying to move up to another level of accuracy, form refinement, and mental discipline. Consequently, when I shoot these days the goal is form refinement, and not the results down range. However, when the form is solid, the results down range show it. My less structured 'fun shooting' is roving with a judo.
Visualization of a hunting scenario is part of every shot. I may stand for a moment and imagine the deer coming in, then draw slowly just as with hunting. Whatever the mind game, every shot is a hunting shot. I shoot at night, dusk and in daylight.
I almost always only shoot one arrow, and the most important shot is the first shot. There are no 'warm up' shots. Everything after that tends to be considered training for the muscle memory aspects of good form that I am working on.
Do I shoot too much? Some days, but only if I push myself too hard. I usually allot myself 10 shots, then go do something else, then come back later. Sometimes it's 20 arrows.
I try to also remember that archery is a physical sport, and make sure to not over train. A light day or rest day is good for me after shooting more than usual.
I don't think I shoot too much for hunting practice because of my personal mind set while shooting. Thanks for a good topic to ponder.
TgE