Trad Gang

Anybody live near Jeff of Allegheny Mountain Bows?  I gave him my bow last summer at Standing Stone to copy and make me, my brother, and WRV a bow.  I would like to get my bow returned along with my money and WRVs money.  Can anybody help?

In case you are wondering, I have been in limited contact with Jeff.  An email every month or so.  But it's always the same....I am busy but will mail the bow on Monday and the money is soon to follow.  I am not making bows anymore.

I didnt want it to get to this.  I have been very patient since the bows were to be  finished last fall.  Maybe somebody could stop in and get my bow for me.  Thanks.  PM me with any questions.

That sucks man, hope you get your bow and cash.

what a kick in the labanza.
one of my favorite bows is a 56" longbow he made -it is almost totally silent upon release.  guess I won't be having him do any work on it.
bill

It's bad situation all the way around.  It sucks Allegheny Mountain is now out of business.  It really sucks that Keith and WRV are not only out of money, but also a bow that was to be used as a model.

Keith really has been patient through all of this.

Good luck Keith, and hopefully you don't need to resort to legal action.

What a shame. Allegheny Mountain Bows  was a great design.I believe they even spawned the design for Mon River. I was happy when I heard Jeff worked with Bill and eventually bought and started building the Bow Line.I actually started a friend in Trad and this was the bow he chose to buy,have built, and shoot. Jeff isn't the first bowyer and won't be the last to "hit the wall".    :nono:   He actually lives near Whittingham where we had a Trad shoot this weekend. We were wondering why he wasn't there. He only lives one town over from there.

This is the only transaction/purchase/trade I have made that has not been 100 percent positice. Hope he makes things right for Keith and myself soon......

I got an email today from Jeff saying he mailed the bow and money is soon to follow.  I hope so.  Stay tuned...

Glad to hear that Keith   :thumbsup:

Hope all works out Keith. Hopefully you'll get it resolved soon. God bless.

Anyone can fall on hard times, but you must still be honorable at all cost to your wallet. Sorry to here about your situation and let us hope this gentleman does the right thing, for himself as well as you.

I heard he was at Whittingham and he had to close up because of finacial reasons and will be making bows again in the near future. The buisness will be under a different name. He had made a bow that was raffled off for a fundraser. He sounds like a man that will make things right.

I hope so Craig.  But he keeps saying he mailed it and nothing.  And why is he building a bow for a fundraiser when my bow was paid for in full and has been late by 6 mos or so?  Just saying.  I only posted to see if someone was close to his shop they could drop by and grab it.  It would save some time waiting for him to mail it.

Keith I would be taking a drive  to his place.
Do a Google Earth and it will show you his home.
P.O. Box 2
7 Sussex St.
Stanhope, NJ    07874

Thanks Craig.  I got another email on Monday saying the bow was returned and money to follow.  I will wait out the week and see if it arrives.

Got my bow today.  Packed well and insured in excellant condition.  I hope Jeff starts building bows again and he can recover from the storm.

Glad to hear it!

I don't remember the old gent's name who originally owned and built those bows, but he was a character   :D   ...

I met the new gent in question at Standing Stone.  They seemed to be still well built bows!

I've seen more than one bowyer, as another has stated, that fell by the wayside over the years. Tough business and they all have their tales of getting scalded by people who were customers and did bad things, too.

All that fiberglass grinding, spray booth stuff, and grinding caustic woods wears on a person I'm sure not to mention the missed weights and limbs that go unsold up over time.

Tough business.  When you find a good bowyer, do your part to support them and appreciate them!

Congrats on getting the bow returned...now for the other deposits to flow!

Best wishes for the bowyer to come back full bore!

Well said Doc Nock! I was glad to hear that your bow was returned in good shape as well.

Bill Kerner built them.  I have a couple of his bows.  Great shooters.  Jeff builds a great bow too.  I hope he can put his shop back together and build again.

Glad to hear you your bow arrived.

Glad to hear it Keith!!

Keith, ever hear anything from AM about refunding our money?? Glad you got your bow back
brother......Randy

I tried sending an email asking about the status.  Came back undeliverable.   He must have discontinued his email.  I will have to start calling.  $700 is a lot of money.  So is ur $400.

Sure hate it bud. For $700 smacks, a ride to New Jersey would be in order. At the least you could file a report locally and go from there. If you do, have a voice recorder stashed in your pocket.....

Froggy

I can understand Jeff has fallen on hard times with the bow business, but he should at least be making some attempt to pay back Keith and Randy.  Even making payments just to show he's trying.

Just found out he owes WRV $800!  Dang!

Yes, Dang! or worse.....

Is this all the same as Allegheny Mountain Arrow Woods?

No.  Allegheny Mountain Bows is different than AM Arrows.

QuoteOriginally posted by Keith Zimmerman:
No.  Allegheny Mountain Bows is different than AM Arrows.

Thanks for the info!

Wow ... just stumbled on this because a friend of a friend got one of his bows from a shop that closed down.

This is not very good ... for that kind of money I would probably be taking him to court. I also tend not to have a lot of patience ... but 6mo with $1500 in other peoples money ... any one else would be charging interest because thats a sizeable loan.

WRV and I did get a payment from Jeff.   So he is making an effort.  I hope we can get this taken care of and move on.  If he decides to build recurves again I will get one......but will pay after the bow is finished and in my hands:)

I think we are about due for another check real soon too....

Just an update.  Ive gotten inquiries if I have received any more money towards my refund.  I have not.  I sent a letter and never heard anything.  Any suggestions guys short of violence and legal action?  I have an elk hunting buddy who is a lawyer who lives in NJ.  I dont want to have to get him involved.  He said he would but Im hoping thats not necessary.  Ive been more than patient but this is ridiculous.

Anybody in Jersey who is friends with Jeff can talk to him.  Maybe mention that it's not forgotten  $450 is a lot of money to me.  Not to mention what he owes WRV.  If I don't have it by the end of Feb I will get a lawyer involved.

Why wait. If it aint happened by now, its surely not going to by the end of the month,  unfortunately. Get the lawyer friend rolling. Hate it for you bud !!

Lanier

This situation just continues to suck.  I was with Keith when he placed the original order with Jeff - OVER A YEAR AND A HALF AGO.

His bows were good.  It's a shame.

I hate to read about this kind of thing, it sure leaves a bad taste. Keith, your right, $450.00 is a lot of money. I think Froggy is right,...Why wait till spring,...DO IT NOW. Best of luck,...Lloyd

I with them buddy do it know its been long enough

Good luck man I hope it works out

I kept quiet...but here's my dealings with this guy. A year before I closed the shop, I wanted to handle a few of his bows. I liked the Kerner design and shot a few of Bill's bows.

I called him...got "curt" with me...said he was busy, call him back. Two nights later, called around 7pm...he got very upset with me because I interrupted dinner with friends. Made no bones about it...

So...I didn't hold back either. Told him what he could do with his bows...plus a few other choice words I had....I wouldn't trust this guy with anything. Doesn't surprise me....

Keith, did you ever get the rest of the money he owed you?

I did a Google search on the name.  Looks like Jeff is back in business given the "2014" date on his website.

http://alleghenymtbow.com/home

Just remember do it to me once shame on you do it to me twice....

I have not Terry.  Neither has WRV.

"We have no specific hours of operation.

 Please call and leave a message, we will try to return your call as soon as possible."


Yeah, right.

I saw the web site up also, that's why I looked for this thread.  
He won't do much business until he cleans up his old business.

I just sent him an e mail saying he needs to take care of old business before new.  
Maybe he needs a few more e mails.  ???

I sent a couple already:)  Maybe he needs lots more!

My best friend won the Allegheny Mountain Bow this year that is raffled off at the Hawkeye Bowmen shoot. He had the choice to take the bow that was there, or have Jeff custom make him one...I warned him about what has been said and advised he should maybe take the bow that was there, but he decided to have him custom make one.

Jeff kept telling him "It'll be in the mail tomorrow", and "It's coming out of final sanding now, it'll be in the mail next week" for quite a while, but he eventually did send it to him, albeit a few months after his expected delivery date.

Although the customer service may have left a little to be desired, he did eventually receive the bow - so he definitely is back in business.

Alex

Sorry to hear about your continued troubles. Bad business and reputations are hard to lose.

Thanks C-R.  I sent another email.

I think if everybody on Tradgang sent an e mail he would get the message and clear this up.

I think if everyone on trad gang stopped buying anything from the guy it would also stop the problem.

QuoteOriginally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
Bad business and reputations are hard to lose.

this is very true Charlie!--but even more so if you do not make an attempt!!

 PAY THE MAN!!!JEFF!!!

Bro, it is time for you and Randy to get a lawyer involved and get the cops involved and file charges. This guy needs to know there are consequences to his bad business and outright lies.

Ditto what Danny said.  If any of it was through the mail, the US Postal inspectors are also very helpful.

Keith, You are a saint to have waited this long but now is the time to get with this guy. If he does it to you and WRV, nothing will stop him from screwing other good folks.
Don't hold back, it is time for both barrels!

Just got an email from him saying that he is going to pay us in a couple weeks.  We shall see...

Dude wheres  this guy at I'll go along with you for support!

Big Ed, wouldnt you rather go with me to Montana and get the $600 a guy owes me for a Morrison?  Nicer country:)

I don't know you Keith or WRV, but I sure wouldn't want an angry Big Ed knocking at my door   :scared:

Yahoo!  Glad this thing is coming to an end. Probably buy another Bighorn I dont really need   :knothead:

You could always send him a picture of Big Jim and mention you traded the bow he owes ya to Jim and Jim will over soon to collect. That would scare me.   :D

Pray for them. A fella that will take money from folks is surely on hard times and if not is of low character and needs prayer. RC

:pray:

Over the years here, I've seen way too many of these bad deals from poor folks who hit a wall, took money to exist and couldn't/wouldn't make good!

when you're up to your swizzle string in alligators, its hard, as they say, to remember you were there to drain the swamp.

As I stated back at the beginning, I met the big guy who took over for the character of a gent who started the biz...he built super bows, but there was something even then that didn't ring "true".

I found a good bowyer, thank my stars for that and have a bow and a buying experience that was head and shoulders above many others.  

I echo RC's comments...this guy might be a low life, but it sounds like he's trying and it sounds like our compadres have given him every benefit of the doubt!

Sell blood, whatever...but pay your debts! Easy biz to get into...tough biz to make good in!

he is, glad you got your bow back. people who run into tough patches of road I do not believe have any particular malice towards anybody. I really do not believe he was intending in any way shape or form to hoodwink you. if he is going through hard times sometimes they have to get this resolved first. I only ever met the guy once or twice but I do not believe him to be dishonest. sorry you had to deal in that you did but hopefully all will be well soon. none of us know what's going on in somebody else's life. I'd be amazed if he does not make this a hundred percent right with you. take care buddy.....

glad you got your bow back. people who run into tough patches of road I do not believe have any particular malice towards anybody. I really do not believe he was intending in any way shape or form to hoodwink you. if he is going through hard times sometimes they have to get this resolved first. I only ever met the guy once or twice but I do not believe him to be dishonest. sorry you had to deal in that you did but hopefully all will be well soon. none of us know what's going on in somebody else's life. I'd be amazed if he does not make this a hundred percent right with you. take care buddy.....

Go ahead pray for him RC.  He could use the help.  Its been since summer of 2012.  We shall see in the next couple weeks.  Got my fingers crossed.

I was at the Baltimore shoot a few years ago and a guy was going to kick a turd out of bill kernel for taking his money.

Saw Big Ed at Denton...think that would persuade this guy to give your money back. About the email saying the money is on the way, you should reply too late. Go see him. Good luck!

jax, its not Bill Kerner.  Its Jeff Strauss.  Lets not put the blame on somebody else.

I rec'd a Money Order from Jeff yesterday to square us up.  It took awhile but he made it right.  Hopefully WRV will have his money tomorrow.  He has been out of town at his cabin.

Thanks Jeff!  I hope things are better for you.  You make a great bow.

Glad to to the this come to a close.  What bow you going to use the money on Keith?

Good for you Keith!

I do hope Jeff's business succeeds because both his recurves and longbows are great designs.

I'm glad to hear that. I had a feeling he would now that he's back making bows.

Congrats Keith Glad to hear!  :clapper:

I'm happy for Kieth, but more glad for the bowyer to be able to come out from under at least one of his bad deals.

John said it better than I, but lots of these guys hit a wall... fall on hard times, it's a tough, tough biz!  Then life gets in the way.

So glad he's made something of a recovery... and hopefully, he'll see daylight down the road and be able to carry on the fine tradition of the original owner.

Glad it worked out well for you.  You are a heck of a gentleman!  I would not have been as nice.

I know you are talking about someone else but Bill Kerner did the same thing. A guy was going to take him apart. I know Bill Kerner and was there when it happened. Don't know the new owner. Some guys only understand a knot on the head.

Im glad be got it squared away with you even though it took a while.

I have one of his bows. It's great but just from this thread I'd never order from him.

Glad to hear it. Keith what part of Pa. do you live in?

Glad everything was resolved. Hope things work out OK for the bowyer.

Thanks letting us know things have been satisfied.

Thanks guys.  I live between Carlisle and Gettysburg next to Pine Grove State Park/Michaux State Forest.