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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: ranger 3 on January 11, 2013, 09:19:00 AM

Title: shoot where you look
Post by: ranger 3 on January 11, 2013, 09:19:00 AM
This is a common saying that I just don't understand, this bow shoots where where you look. Does this mean that anyone could pick up this bow and shoot where you are looking are just for that person? I don't mean to start a debate, it's just don't understand.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: maineac on January 11, 2013, 09:31:00 AM
I have always tried to understand that as well.  My bows all shoot where I look if my form is correct, and somewhere else if it is not.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Phrogdrvr on January 11, 2013, 09:35:00 AM
I have numerous bows in the "stable".  Some of them I can pick up and naturally hit where I am aiming, others don't seem to come so naturally, and I have to adjust my shooting to hit where I'm aiming.  Maybe that's what the expression refers to?  Or perhaps not all my bows are set up properly  :dunno:
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Manitoba Stickflinger on January 11, 2013, 09:39:00 AM
I think it is a common term for those who shoot instinctively. (not gappers, point of aim, etc.) It means that the bow is center cut  so when the particular shooter shoots it for the 1st time there are no right/left issues. There is no compensation or learning curve to eventually be hitting dead on.

Different bows I've owned have required me to build out the shelf or take time to adjust to. A bow that "shoots where I look" is on target from the 1st shot.

Hope this helps...I could be wrong but that's always been my interpretation.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Don Batten on January 11, 2013, 09:41:00 AM
If you are constantly hitting high, low, left or right, you can tweek your bow to shoot where you are looking to a certain degree. You shouldn't have to change your form to compensate. side plate material and thickness, nock pt location, brace hight all affect pt of impact.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Terry Green on January 11, 2013, 09:43:00 AM
Yes...most bows I pic up shoot where I'm looking....I have two that needed the shelf built out but both were given to me...so I MADE them shoot where I look.

Now, if I shoot too light a spine, they fly left....out of any of them.

So, yes, some do shoot where you look....from the 1st shot....if the arrow is right.

This is NOT uncommon for folks with good form.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: nineworlds9 on January 11, 2013, 09:48:00 AM
For me this describes a bow that has a shelf that is well shaped and places the arrow very close to the hand, so that you naturally point with your hand/arrow at where you want to hit, and has a grip shape that allows good repeatability of hand position, also a bow that is well balanced so that you can keep a steady hand without to much effort, also a bow that has a design/tiller that is forgiving to small form errors aka "stable" if you will.  This will vary by person, it's honestly very subjective for the most part.  Some people call Hill style bows 'shoot where you look', but to me they don't do that, not until you learn the hand position/form required, as most Hills are not centershot and also the handgrip places the arrow further away from your natural hand pointing alignment, a typical cut close to center r/d longbow with a locator type grip probably better qualifies as a 'shoot where you look' type of bow.  Now that I'm starting to get the hang of Hill bows they feel more like 'shoot where you look to me', but it takes practice practice.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: ddauler on January 11, 2013, 10:00:00 AM
X2 when I teach someone to shoot instinctive I tell them to point at something with the trigger finger of bow hand. Explain to them that they didn't have to conciously aim at it. Then shoot a few arrows up close by still pointing at the spot with that finger. Later you do the same without pointing the finger. I learned shooting selfbows to aim the arrow not the bow. I shoot them with elbow bent bow canted and can shoot danng near any arrow out of them. It's when shooting target style upright straight arm etc that trouble seems to sneak in. Bow canted arrow on knuckle any bow shoots where I am looking for me. Good form like Terry say's on top of this and you be a critter killin machine!
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: hunt it on January 11, 2013, 10:25:00 AM
For me this means the bow works for me. All my bows shoot where I look. I have had 2 over the years that did not shoot where I looked - instinctive shooting and one was taken back by bowyer and the other sold fast.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: GRINCH on January 11, 2013, 10:29:00 AM
I totally agree with nine words comments.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: SportHunter on January 11, 2013, 11:17:00 AM
If the bow, arrow, and string are tuned (right arrow spine for that bow, brace height and nock point) and the archer does a good job on form shooting where you look is much easier.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Stumpkiller on January 11, 2013, 01:09:00 PM
The bows I keep are the ones that shoot where I am looking.    ;)  

I "gun barrel" and look down the arrow like a I do a shotgun or a musket.  With both I focus on the center of the target and let my peripheral vison tell my bow arm where it needs to be.  Sometimes I have to thin the pad or build out the riser plate and try different spines, but they will shoot where I look when tuned.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: hvyhitter on January 11, 2013, 04:53:00 PM
The way the riser is cut and how it fits my hand makes a big difference for me. The ones that fit I can pick up once a year and the first arrow is dead on. Others, like Widows, I have to find the sweet spot on how it lays into my palm for it to hit where I look.........
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: ranger 3 on January 11, 2013, 04:56:00 PM
Thanks everyone
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: KSdan on January 11, 2013, 05:20:00 PM
Like to hear from those who have taken lessons from Welch.  I have heard that this is one of the first things he does with his students:  Make sure the bow is shooting where they are looking.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Bowwild on January 11, 2013, 06:52:00 PM
Occasionally I look where I don't want the arrow to go....you know the result.  The eyes are slave to your mind.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: S.C. Hunter on January 11, 2013, 07:08:00 PM
For me I pick a spot and let the arrow go. So for me it means I should not have to adapt to the bow by trying to find a way to aim. I have picked up a few bows that I seem to struggle a little to hit where I look. I have picked up others and picked a spot and hit my mark on the first arrow. I think these bows also give you more confidence when you shoot. If you believe you can you can. If you believe you can't your probably right.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: jess stuart on January 11, 2013, 07:10:00 PM
If it doesn't shoot where you look probably not set up correctly or improperly spined arrows.  Unfortunately I to often look at the antlers.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: screamin on January 11, 2013, 09:44:00 PM
I don't think I've ever owned a bow that didn't shoot were I look after I got it tuned.  :dunno:    But I was definitely more accurate with some verses others.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: jsweka on January 11, 2013, 11:04:00 PM
I never had a bow that didn't shoot where I look as long as I did everything else right.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: KentuckyTJ on January 12, 2013, 10:42:00 AM
QuoteOriginally posted by Manitoba Stickflinger:
I think it is a common term for those who shoot instinctively. (not gappers, point of aim, etc.) It means that the bow is center cut  so when the particular shooter shoots it for the 1st time there are no right/left issues. There is no compensation or learning curve to eventually be hitting dead on.

Different bows I've owned have required me to build out the shelf or take time to adjust to. A bow that "shoots where I look" is on target from the 1st shot.

Hope this helps...I could be wrong but that's always been my interpretation.
This is what I mean when I use the term. I shoot instinctive and if I can pick a bow up and it hits center horizontally I use the term "Hits where I look". Has noting to do with vertical. That is an issue with an instinctive shooters mind through repetition to compensate with any given bow.

For me it is actually dependent on what I have become used to in the past. So the term actually has no meaning to anyone else for reference on a given bow.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: JimGoza on January 30, 2013, 02:53:00 PM
I follow Stumpkiller's method. Doesn't everybody sight down their arrow in one fashion or another?  Even though this works for me and I can shoot accurately, the idea of aiming still seems just an individual trial and error process to find what works. Which leads me to ask:    Archers, is there a 'best' way to aim?
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Bowwild on January 30, 2013, 03:11:00 PM
The best way is what works good enough for your objective. Pie plate accuracy at 10 yards is good enough for some. Others might want to extend that to 15 or 20.  Still others want to shoot groups that put fletching together at distances they considerable reasonable in the field or on the course.

Of course there are some who poo-poo the group altogether.

For me, I want to stack arrows at 25 yards. I'm not there yet.

I have ZERO doubt that I could put a sight on my curve and reduce my group size by a very significant amount. In fact, I've done it for a few minutes. Then I quickly put that bow up so I won't give up shooting barebow.

I thought I shot instinctive when I was a teenager and before 1975. I believe I was really a gap shooter. Now I'm a string-wallking point-of-aim shooter.

One thing that is pretty true for a lot of folks, if you are using an aiming point (sight pin or point of the arrow) and try to force that point to be still on the spot you want to hit while aiming, you are in a counter productive battle. Movement is a good thing.

Also, if you insist on practicing one of archery's myths that the bow arm should stay up an still until the arrow hits the target, you are failing to allow natural follow-through of the bow arm.

I also realize some believe I've written at least 12 too many lines about aiming and have over-complicated the process.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: BDann on January 30, 2013, 03:52:00 PM
Shooting where you look is pretty important, but don't forget about "hitting hard" and "smoking an arrow."    :biglaugh:
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: on January 30, 2013, 03:59:00 PM
Almost any bow will shoot where you look, if you shoot it long enough.  However, looking where you want to shoot is completely different.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Bjorn on January 30, 2013, 04:00:00 PM
8 in pie plate at 20 yds works for me, if you have perfect form and use a reference, and practice daily there is likely no limit. I shot with a world class stringwalker and she hits tennis ball sized targets at amazing distances.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: mcgroundstalker on January 30, 2013, 04:14:00 PM
"You Lookin' At Me?!"   :mad:   "You Lookin' At Me?!"   :mad:   "Yea, I Mean You!"   :mad:  

... mike ...   :D
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: njloco on January 30, 2013, 05:29:00 PM
The way I interpret this saying is, since we are all built a little different from each other, it's how easily one gets their usual site window, with some bows it's more easily recognizable more easily attainable. With some bows one has to search a little for it because of the contours of their body and the bow.
Which means, if a bow shoots where one person looks might not shoot shoot where another person looks.

Thats my take on it.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: Jeff Strubberg on January 30, 2013, 11:54:00 PM
I've always used that phrase to point out that misses are my fault, not the bows fault.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: pruiter on January 31, 2013, 02:09:00 AM
Baseball goes where your looking, Arrow no diffrent, We over think shoting way to much. Shoting must have been easyer 500 years ago. No media to sell us the latest best.  I had over spined arrows for long time, After shooting them a 1000s times, they hit where I was looking. It simple, we make it hard.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: pruiter on January 31, 2013, 02:49:00 AM
need to complete that story

Did not know my arrows where over spined, bought Arrows at a yard sale. Not untill 2 years later, met a guy with a spine tester and tested the arrows 10 pds to heavy spine. did not have a problem untill I knew to much.
Title: Re: shoot where you look
Post by: TRADSTYK on February 03, 2013, 03:25:00 PM
I focus on one small spot, then the entire sequence of the shot is second nature. Never really look at the shaft. Follow through is cricial. Hit where I am looking...most of the time. Large antlers can be a problem!