I'm pulling on a Martin Hatfield take down with 60lb limbs. I've got 125 gr points on the gold tip traditional carbons in 55/75. My total arrow weight is 428 gr. is my set up too light ? Should I be using more tip weight ? I'm planning on small game and also whitetail hunting. I just want to make sure I'm getting the most efficient transfer of energy from my equipment. Thanks
Yup, thats light. Thats only 7 grains per pound, to minimize risk of harming the bow you should be at 8 gpp (480g) or higher. As far as most efficient transfer of energy I would go for 10-11 gpp.
Eric
I would say that's to light
Arrows that light in relation to your poundage tend to be hard on the bow and commonly noisy. With all due respect, forget about "transfer of energy". Broadheads cause death by hemmoraging. A properly spined arrow, weighing from 9 to 1 to 11 to 1 (540-660 grains) with a sharp cut on contact broadhead out of your bow is sufficient for anything in North America.
So do I just get heavier tips to shoot ? How many grains broadheads ? Can I just keep the same arrows ? I just paid good money for six of the 55/75 gold tips and I'd hate to know they're worthless. How would you suggest I beef up my arrow weight ?????
Lots of things you can do, but all of them have a chance at changing the way the system works. . . . that is not necessarily a bad thing.
You can add weight tubes, they come in different weights (grain / inch), you can stuff anything else inside, like string, etc all the way up to solder, to raise the weight of the arrow in general. You can replace the arrow insert with a heavier brass insert, you can use heavier broadheads or, if they are of the glue on type, replace the current broadhead insert with a heavier one.
Lotsa ways are available.
And. . transfer of energy is not only regarding arrow to deer. You first transfer the bow's energy to the arrow, and it appears to be common thought that 8-10 grains of arrow per pound of bow weight is good.
Below that the arrow is light and could possibly lead to bow damage due to not enough of the bows energy being transferred to the arrow. Going the other way, with too heavy an arrow is not so much a problem and generally leads to a quieter system, although there a top end to that before your arrow is just too heavy to fly well.
Experiment !
ChuckC
I would go to heavier head.Also you could go to brass inserts to add weight as well.You should be up around 600 grains.Buy some field tips of say 200 -300 grains and see what will tune good.You can find good tuneing info by doing search on here or the Internet.by haveing a lot of weight on the end a lot of good things mhappen. Also ask here for similar setups to yours,ie,bow weight,draw length arrow length etc. you can get close to what you need and then do the tuneing and experimenting to see what works best for you.
What about a few small metal washers placed on the threads of the broadhead, then screwed into to insert ?
As far as the sliding material inside the shaft option, so I'd weigh out enough lets say string, like 100 grains and just stuff it down the shaft ? Wouldn't it be sliding around on the inside when you release the arrow and when it hits the target ? Would that affect flight performance ?
I've already had these arrows cut to length and inserts glued in so I'm searching ways to bring up arrow weight after the fact, and still be able to shoot the 125gr broadheads I just paid 40 bucks for :) funny how money matters seems to lurk just under the surface of most things in life :)
QuoteOriginally posted by Stringpuller#1:
What about a few small metal washers placed on the threads of the broadhead, then screwed into to insert ?
If you are talking 5 to 10 grains that would work but you cant get any more than that and still have enough thread left on the point to screw in.
Pull the nock out and put in some heavy weed eater line, yo can shove just about any thing in the arrow but you just dont want it sliding back and forth
I don't understand how at 430 grains total arrow weight for a 35-40 pound recurve will work but for a 60 pounder its not heavy enough ? If an arrow has enough spine to launch properly off a heavier weight bow, it seems less weight would mean faster flatter shooting trajectory. Isn't there a ratio of like speed vs weight vs penetration ?
your right, it will be faster and flatter. but its like shooting the bow without an arrow on the string, its not good for the bow. most bowmakers recomend 8 gpp. so the bow doesent blow apart.(dryfirering)
QuoteOriginally posted by Stringpuller#1:
I don't understand how at 430 grains total arrow weight for a 35-40 pound recurve will work but for a 60 pounder its not heavy enough ? If an arrow has enough spine to launch properly off a heavier weight bow, it seems less weight would mean faster flatter shooting trajectory. Isn't there a ratio of like speed vs weight vs penetration ?
A 430 grain arrow will kill a deer just as quickly off the 60 pound bow as it would the 35-40 pound bow. That is not the problem. The problem lies in that shooting that light of an arrow off a bow 7gpp has been known to harm the bows because a lot more of the bows energy is not utilized in the arrow so it goes back into the limbs.
Oh ok. So basically at this point my best option to increase arrow weight since my nocks and inserts are already in is to get some heavy broadheads............way heavier than the 125's I just bought :(
What would you recommend for a proper grain weight broadhead ?
So I think I may need like a 250 gr tip , but won't that make my arrows too front heavy ?
Use glue on broad heads and 125 grain steel adapters. I shoot this set up from 59# 21'st Century Longbow and 56# Black Widow SA111 shoot perfect. I have also shot same bows with 100 grain brass inserts, 125 steel adapters and 125 glue on snuffer still shot perfect. Carbons like weight up front IMO.
QuoteOriginally posted by Stringpuller#1:
So do I just get heavier tips to shoot ? How many grains broadheads ? Can I just keep the same arrows ? I just paid good money for six of the 55/75 gold tips and I'd hate to know they're worthless. How would you suggest I beef up my arrow weight ?????
If the shafts you have now are tuned good, then you will have to make them shorter and add point/insert weight to keep them in tune. You can also use weight tubes in the shafts to add overall weight. The heavier points/inserts result in a higher FOC which is always better!
Bisch
You could buy new broad heads, but an extra 100 grains will probably change the spine too much to get them flying right. Do you have any room to cut them down an inch or so? You may be able to cut them down and add the grains.
THere have been a lot of discussions of heavy arrows over the years if you search, which get into KE v. momentum, physics, and stuff beyond my grasp.
As you may have learned, don't use epoxy to glue arrows in and if you can cut your own arrows. I mess around a lot with a test arrow with no fletchings until I like the flight, then cut and glue. Trial and error.