Which type stand do you prefer with your trad gear?
I have found my climbers are tough to shoot out of.
Maybe most of us prefer hang-ons....Thought I would ask.
If you have a favorite brand and model please let us know too.
Thanks, Skychief.
Climber, Timbertall. I can be in a different spot everytime I hunt.
both but i love my climber. very versatile and comfortable. no problem shooting out of it vs a hang on. i just plan accordingly and put the seat a little lower.
for brand i prefer the Summit. best climber i've ever used..
Before I was using a Summit and a Millenium, not anymore. Check this out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7IAgwDkTc0&feature=plcp
Lone Wolf hang on with climbing sticks. It's the only way to go on public land.
I use the Lone Wolf Assault with the Lone Wolf sticks. I put it up and take it down on almost every hunt. Although it does give me the option of leaving it in place if I plan to hunt the same place again. I can put it in trees with limbs which really helps to be hid better. And with practice it is quieter to put up than climbers. It is rock solid and quiet when put up. With that said if purchasing a stand now I would take a close look at the Muddy Outdoors hang on and sticks.
Lock on!!!
screaming eagle chain on stands for me , strong and silent!!
ladder stands for me,hang ons,and climbers,depends where im hunting....
I put a thead up on a different site about this same thing. What I am fixing to tell you is liable to make you think I am dingy but all I can say is if you try this you will never use another stand but a wrap around climber like the Summit Viper. I know it is marketed as not the best for bowhunting, but it is if you do this. the only shot yoou do not have is the one directly below the stand of your bow arm side. Were talking a 3 square yard area. No bigger than any other stands blind spot.
A climber with a bar aound it is the best tool for the trad hunter for several reasons. First you are far safer, far more comfortabel, can use it as a gun rest when rifle hunting and the bar is your best friend, not your nemesis as most think
First get rid of the stock fold up back rest seat. Buy you a Muddy Outdoors seat. Then adjust the seat so that when you are seated the rail is 4 inches or so above hte seat causing you to be enclosed in the climbing bar. This allows you to lock the climbing (top) part of the stand about waist level and still be comfortable when you set.
That bar at wiast level allows you to lean on it and get angles you cannot achieve with a barless stand. At waist level where you are to bend it allows for you to lean on it and puts the whole shot process 10 inches or more out from the stand. So instead of trying to tuck that long lower limb in above the platform, you are way out past it safe and secure to shoot tyour big toe of if you want to.
it works the same way on any angle or dise of the stand except your bow are side. But the area that is unobtainable to your bow arm side out of ths climber is so small. Smaller than any other stand even due to that bar and being able to utiliae it instead of staying away from. The only way to routinely not hit your cables on your lock on's or the climbing aid is get it tucked up close to you instead of trying to stay away from it. even on shots faarther away from the tree it acts as a very good stabalization thing making the shot that more rock solid.
i know this goes against conventinal wisdom but it really iis far superior to anything i have used. And I have owned a bunch of them, most bowhuntiing models that worked ok but you had limited access in alot of areas to because you had to stay on the platform solid instead of being able to lean out real far for fear of falling out.
The bar also acts as a great safety cathc when set up this way allows you to have a great arm rest when looking thru bino's, or just setting like at a desk. it also offers you the ability to catch a little shut eye with no fear of falling out. it really is the bombdidgity.
So before you buy anything touted as a an open faced bowhunter, I implore you to try this. It has been the best thing ever for everyone that i have shown it too. If you try it you will see. God BLess
Sounds good awpforester. Do you have any pics of your set up?
we use chippewa wedgloc hang on stands and their climbing sticks for Blackbeard - we use Lone Wolf climbers - both types we have zero problems with stykbows.
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Hang on. But I use my lone wolf hand climber most. As I move around allot. You can shoot out of it easily.
Lone wolf hand climber and millenium lock ons.
QuoteOriginally posted by AWPForester:
I put a thead up on a different site about this same thing. What I am fixing to tell you is liable to make you think I am dingy but all I can say is if you try this you will never use another stand but a wrap around climber like the Summit Viper. I know it is marketed as not the best for bowhunting, but it is if you do this. the only shot yoou do not have is the one directly below the stand of your bow arm side. Were talking a 3 square yard area. No bigger than any other stands blind spot.
A climber with a bar aound it is the best tool for the trad hunter for several reasons. First you are far safer, far more comfortabel, can use it as a gun rest when rifle hunting and the bar is your best friend, not your nemesis as most think
First get rid of the stock fold up back rest seat. Buy you a Muddy Outdoors seat. Then adjust the seat so that when you are seated the rail is 4 inches or so above hte seat causing you to be enclosed in the climbing bar. This allows you to lock the climbing (top) part of the stand about waist level and still be comfortable when you set.
That bar at wiast level allows you to lean on it and get angles you cannot achieve with a barless stand. At waist level where you are to bend it allows for you to lean on it and puts the whole shot process 10 inches or more out from the stand. So instead of trying to tuck that long lower limb in above the platform, you are way out past it safe and secure to shoot tyour big toe of if you want to.
it works the same way on any angle or dise of the stand except your bow are side. But the area that is unobtainable to your bow arm side out of ths climber is so small. Smaller than any other stand even due to that bar and being able to utiliae it instead of staying away from. The only way to routinely not hit your cables on your lock on's or the climbing aid is get it tucked up close to you instead of trying to stay away from it. even on shots faarther away from the tree it acts as a very good stabalization thing making the shot that more rock solid.
i know this goes against conventinal wisdom but it really iis far superior to anything i have used. And I have owned a bunch of them, most bowhuntiing models that worked ok but you had limited access in alot of areas to because you had to stay on the platform solid instead of being able to lean out real far for fear of falling out.
The bar also acts as a great safety cathc when set up this way allows you to have a great arm rest when looking thru bino's, or just setting like at a desk. it also offers you the ability to catch a little shut eye with no fear of falling out. it really is the bombdidgity.
So before you buy anything touted as a an open faced bowhunter, I implore you to try this. It has been the best thing ever for everyone that i have shown it too. If you try it you will see. God BLess
Sounds interesting. Do you have any pictures of this setup?
Are you saying that you put the Muddy seat so that you are facing the tree Suspended by the "climbing bar"?
Thanks!
I have to second the summit. I never really liked them until this year. I got access to a large track of land and have used mine alot this season. hands down the most comfortable stand ive sat in. I find myself gettting up to stretch and look at my watch and it's 11 or 12. I never could sit that long in a loc on. Got a lonewolf that works good for 2 4 hr sits. and just got a guido web. I'm gonna have my sticks in place at predetermined spots for next season and use this alot. good luck
I have both a Lone Wolf hand climber and hang on with sticks. I also like the two Leverage ladder stands I have.
I picked up a Summit Razor SD (sit and climb) at the end of last year and like it so far. It has the bar to rest on while you're climbing, but then it folds down and out of the way when you get all set up. I tried a Summit Open Shot (hand climber) before this one and had some trouble getting up and down the tree comfortably, especially with a lot of cold weather gear on. I made it up the tree, but the sit and climbs are so much easier to climb with.
I also use a few lock ons, but if I could only choose one, it would be a climber.
I like LocOns. The Windwalker and a few screw in steps is the lightest way I've found to hunt on the go and is comfortable.
Justin great information. I agree with this - I had a large summit with a wrap around bar and it never held me back from shooting and it was VERY comfortable. At the time I set trees within 20 yards of my boat using water entry so it was a snap. I bought a lone wolf and love it now but had excellent results like you say.
Like the info using summit viper I have been thinking that would work. I have been doing all of my practice in the yard from a ladder stand with a rail and have have found that by leaning against rail I can get more clear shots than from my old summit cobra with open front. I have a summit clear shot it is perfect for shooting but hard to get platform level has to be perfect for seat to be right.
I also still use my old climax stands and screw in steps for hang on stands. Really like to fold seat completely out of way. Open front climbers still have side bars in the way.
I like cheap hang ons for two reasons. 1. i make no noise trying to set it up(already in the tree prior to the season) not any extra weight to carry. 2. if it gets stolen im only out $30-40 bucks. And a tether rope or strap along with your safety harness will allow you to lean away from the tree with ease.
That Guido's Web seems interesting but just doesn't seem practical to me but i've never tried one and could be mistaken.
I've used "cheap" hang ons in the past as i had a couple of expensive Screaming Eagle stands stolen. However, i've come to realize that buying a cheap hang-on is like buying a cheap parachute. i'd rather have a stand stolen than risk using one after some bad experiences. i'd rather save $$$ on other equipment.
just my 2 cents.....
I use a lone wolf sit and climb with the seat modified with an older summit climber seat with a reenforced seat and back.The most comfortable stand I've ever used.
I also have a dozen or so bear river hang ons that I have set in a few very good spots.
That being said I just got back from a morning hunt and was in a ladder stand.
I guess I'm not biased.
What lpcjon2 said above X 10 !!! when it comes to hang ons. I actually like the little 20" X 24" now that I am used to leaning out against my Summit SOP harness and tether. That itty bitty stand disappears under your feet and you can shoot almsot any angle or spot with nothing in the way and the harness actually allows you to keep yor upper body in the perfect " T " shape so you do not shoot hight due to not bending at the waist. Almsot like shooting out of a TreeSaddle or Guidos Web.
We also hunt out of our Summit Vipers so AWP please post how you cinch up your top part of the Viper securely to the trre so we can take advantage of that set up too please.... :help:
I have three diff setups with now. Lone wolf Sit n climb, $40 hang on stands with 16' climbing rails, and $40 hang on stands with Leverage steps!
I use the climbing rails and hang on ONLY on posted private property in spots I do not believe they'll grow legs.
I'm using the lone wolf in new spots or when I haven't decided where the best stand location is...
and using (and really digging the $40 hang on stands and the leverage steps for three reasons. 1) I can set up in multi trunk or branching trees (where a climber can't go), 2) I can be up in a tree in just a little longer than it takes me to be up in my climber and 3) gives me the option to leave the stand there and only take the steps out with me. very sweet!
I don't have any problem shooting out of any of the setups and have taken game out of all.
Allright guys, my stand is hanging in the woods right now and will be until next week. But maybe this will clear some of it up until I can get some pics up after pulling it. This is intended to face away from the tree and you sinch the top section to the tree with the provided strap you sinch the stand together with. Know that I use an API linemans belt harness.
The Summit Viper is the best stand I have ever used for this. Not that the API Grand Slam will not work, but it is a lot heavier. Loggy Bayou's and the Ole Man Stands are good as well, but they adjust to the tree by the size. Meaning if you are hanging in a small diameter tree, they collapse tighter, making hanging low inside the wrap around hard, ecspecialy with a lot of clothes. So make what you got work, but know the Viper is the best.
First thing you gotts do is get rid of the fold up seat with the back rest. It is not needed like this because you are so snuggled in and the backrest is just more bulk to carry and makes getting the seat pushed back outta the way harder. It also will not adjust as low as the Muddy Outdoors. Plus the Muddy seat is designed to be smaller which is adequate to be plenty comfy, but gets totally out of the way to not cause interference.
The seat I am currently using is actually an older API cordura seat that I swaped the Summit seat for. I will be replacing it wiith the Mudy seat in time as it is superior for comfort vs just the material. Whatever seat you choose, just make sure it will adjust low enough to allow the top climbimg aide to be strapped on between waist and belly button level, while allowing you to maintain a comfortable seat. If you can't do that you are just limiting yourself and waisting your time.
Once you get the seat adjusted this way, you will notice that it is so much more comfortable. You are enclosed when setting, alot of your movements are hidden, and you don't have to worry abot falling out iif you nod off. You will also notice that when standing and strectching or just to get upp, you will be so comfortable you will inadvertantly lean against the bar instead of staying all scrunched up because the bar is knee level which causes a real ballance issue. You could pass out and not fall out of the stand.
But the most important thing is the bar is right against your gut when you get on the end of the platform, ensuring the string angle at full draw is beyond the bar because you are out against it instead of back 12-15 inches. And the lower limb clears everything because you are ut that far. On shots close to the tree which is the ardest for ant trad archer, you simpy bend over, the bar acts as a pendaluim, to hold you up and out, making it literally ppoisible to shoot the end of the stand you are standing on.
There simply is not but one very small spot that you cannot shoot and that is the base of the tree directly under the stand on your bow arm side when facing away from the tree. But it is an area that is not oobtainable from any other stand either. So you are not losing anything, only gaing a lot more angles that other stands can't offer due to cables or climbing aids marketed as out of the way.
I have owned a bunch of climbers, open faced and wrap arounds. And the wrap arounds, ecspecially the summit or API, offers the bowhunter so many more shot angles than the others if you use the bar like this. It is common thought to set it like they show you and outfit the stand, but the seat adjustment and that bar is your biggest friend here if yu get high above your thighs and above your lower limb. Look at it this way, instead of trying to get the bow low enough when drawn, your bow is out from the stand 20 inches or so, at least. It is a no lose. You can't hit anything with that lower limb but air, cause that is all that is there.
One more tip, sometimes I adjust the climber section once I get to hunting height one notch higher to tip the front of the stand up if I mis guessed the right adjusment. You'll find out in time that guessing to high on the feet section is worse than low and the climbing section can be adjusted if you guessed it to lose. It won't wear you out like a non bar climber that you are constantly leaning to stay on the platform. Nothing will wear you out quicker than an open faced climber you have had to stay on edge to keep from falling out because the platform is tilted forward. This really is the bombdigity.
I have sopent my life growing up on roofs, walking walls framing and setting truses as my whole familly was/is carpenters, but this is the easiest, safiest, most comfortable way that it dooesn't require any special fondness or skill. The only offset is the added weight of the bar. But with one of the simple sling type seats, your Summit Viper willl tip in aout 17 pounds. all the positives are worth the extra pound. Plus, doing it like this gets the bar higher for using as a gun rest, sleeping bar, or the most comfortable set by leaning forard on it like you would a desk. And it is well above your knees and thighs which eliminates balance issues, while providing you the support and safety to lean 90 degress to shoot your toes off. You can't shoot directly below the stand with anything but a br climber for this reason. Just get the right seat, fool with it for a couple minuutes and you will see.
I'll revisit this thread next week when I'l post pics after pulling the stand. God Bless
Thanks Justin. It's getting through my thick head I believe now!
Look forward to seeing the pics. My son-in-law has a Viper and wont use it with his longbow. Perhaps once I grasp an understanding of how you modified the seat I can show him. You sound passionate about your discovery and I'll learn from anyone. I currently am an Ole Man Vision user and I use it footrest down. And I do the opposite from you and keep my footrest and seat portion close together to maximize limb clearance when standing. Thanks
I have a goliath and have always used the strap to scinch the top o the tree. I will be trying the Muddy seat. Thanks for sharing your idea.
AWPForester speaks the truth. The Summit Viper is THE SAFEST stand available. It's also the easiest to set up, the most comfortable, and the most versatile climber. I have bought and sold 3 Lone Wolf climbers. Although they were great stands they lacked the safety and comfort of the Viper. The Viper will also go on larger diameter trees than the LW. If you strap the top section on the viper you can use the bar to your advantage.
use a summit specialist its light doesn't seem to hinder bow position
AWP,
Thanks for the very detailed explanation on using your Viper and securing the top half to the tree with the strap that is used to pack them together during transport. I will experiment in the yard with mine and make sure I get it secure enough to lean on the bar and not have it shift on the tree. I will also wear my SOP harness and be tethered to the tree of course as a fail safe.
I switched out my stock Viper seat last year to the Hazmore net seat and LOVE it !!! Makes setup and pack up much faster and hassle free. Shaved another few pounds off too. When I stand all I got to do to get the seat out of my way is push my leg against it and presto... it is totally out of the way and NO noise. Wished I knew about this years ago and found out about this seat right here on the "Gang" . Not sure if I am allowed to post the link to the Hazmore seat but in case others wanted one here it is.....
http://hazmore.net/cart/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=2
Just trying to help others with their Vipers too..... :campfire:
I love Loc on, chippewa is great too, but going out of buisness
NoCams, how does it slide over the angled uprights?
Possum,
The net seat fits around the horizontal rails only, it is not around the angled uprights.... Good pics on the link above.... :coffee:
I have killed 3 doe this season with a 60" recurve. 1 out of a loggy and 2 out of a summit viper. It can be done out of the viper you just have to put the seat low
Thanks for the response I sent you a pm.
I also have the net seat on one of my Vipers from hazmore. It's the best for bow hunting. I left the stock seat on my other viper and will use that to shoot the slug gun out of for now. It'll proly get replaced eventually.
No cams, I like that seat, how far does it stretch down when you set in it? God Bless