not thinking of legalitys here but what would you guys consider the bare mininum draw weight to hunt bear and deer with a 2 blade head assuming you have 10gpp arrow of what ever draw bow it is
this is ethical draw weight also
I know Oregon is 40# minimum on the legal side but personally I would prefer 50# or more but it also depends on the size of the bear. I've not taken a bear with traditional tackle only rifles and compounds and I've been amazed at just how tough they can be.
also ill answer
in my mind ethical bear rigs start at 55#
dont chastise me
QuoteOriginally posted by ericmerg:
also ill answer
in my mind ethical bear rigs start at 55#
dont chastise me
Eric, whats the lowest bow weight you've killed bears with? Personally I don't get hung up on a number, there's just too many variables other than a simple number. I would put a well tuned arrow and brodhead sharpness first on the list.
I would hunt black bear with my Grizzly. It's #50 @ 28.
Never bear hunted though.
Not sure this thread will last long. :banghead:
This set-up passed thru every deer I have shot with it (6).
here we go yet again.
look, aside from the gear legalities of yer hunting location, shoot the heaviest bow you can consistently, accurately handle and then check yer hunting ethics. you wanna hunt bear with 40# or 45#, that's yer business, but you better know what yer doing or you might end up as bear supper. :D
how long will this thread last .... ?
I would not chastise anyone for hunting black bear with 40#.
Lots of posts on bear and deer kills here. If you took and Calculated the average recovery yardage on both I would bet you'd find white tailed deer are very tough critters and bears don't last so long with holes in their lungs.
Rob makes a good point though, although rare on both, the instances of deer charging when wounded are far more rare than bear.
What bow?
What draw length?
There is no magic one only number.
QuoteOriginally posted by ceme24:
I would not chastise anyone for hunting black bear with 40#. ...
neither would i. depends on the archer/hunter's credentials and mental status.
all of this stuff is VASTLY subjective, and each of us know what's right or wrong ... for each of us. there is NO one, simple, perfect answer to the op's question. which makes threads like this reasonably meaningless. ymmv.
QUOTE]Originally posted by ericmerg:
also ill answer
in my mind ethical bear rigs start at 55#[/QUOTE]
QuoteOriginally posted by Brad Arnett:
Eric, whats the lowest bow weight you've killed bears with?
On those two notes....how many big game animals have you killed with a trad bow Eric?
in maryland its 30 lbs BUT I would never shoot that weight.check your local game laws.an shoot as much as you can. 40-45 will take deer just fine.but for bear I would want more
Numbers on the bow is kind of abstract at best. I have a recurve that is 45 at my 27" draw that will shoot a 520 grain arrow faster than my friends longbow that is more than 10 pounds heavier. Even that comparison is pointless if the arrow is optimal. How much one deflates with buck fever or bear panic is a big one. A strong confident shot with a 45 pound bow is always deadlier than a struggled shot with a heavy bow. I heard of a young guy that thought he should go up in weight for elk, he practiced hard, just to find that he could not draw a 65 pound longbow back when shooting at an elk. His 52 pound bow did just fine for him three days later. For bear accuracy and a good arrow reign supreme. I have been close to many black bear over the years, I hit one on the nose that was trying to sniff through the wall of my canvas tent, I never got the impression that any of those were planning on eating me. Anyway, when watching bear that were mere feet away, while they were pretending that I did not see them and they weren't planning on trying to grab our food pack, two things I considered when judging them to be a target for an arrow. 1. Hair, it varies from bear to bear, some have a gnarly mass of it right where the arrow should go. That would explain some of the failures I have heard from hits with mechanical broadheads, where the simple file sharpened Hills seemed to be so devastating. 2. Fat, some bears look like they are on a pancake, gravy and bacon cheeseburger with fries diet. With a real fatso bear would my single bevel Hill get lost in the fat and would I be better off with a Delta or a Deadhead? Then comes the poundage issue, how much will that Deadhead require over the single bevel Hill? Don't know that one.
With my 30" draw length, I have no hesitations when it comes to bowhunting deer with a 35# bow and black bear with a 42# bow.
This is why both of my two recurves are low poundage bows. My bowhunting experience spans 48 years......and counting. ;)
Moj, I have a 26&1/4" draw with longbows, my buddy draws over 27" with his longbow, no short drawing on either of us, he is under 6 feet and I am 5'9" the last time I checked, but I may be shrinking. Anyway shooting left handed I open up my form a bit because my neck does not like to turn that far to the right, used to draw over 28" with my right hand target form, but I looked like I was trying to fall over backwards. That Grooves Spitfire is flat out fast. I would bet that there are a number of bows that could challenge it for speed today. For those with lighter weights or shorter draw lengths, I always like to suggest going for quicker designs. It makes a difference.
Minimum bow weight is like a minimum speed limit. It is legal but who drives it and feels comfortable doing it?
I have never hunted bear (only deer), but I agree with the guys who put skill and well tuned equipment ahead of a specific number. The lowest poundage I have killed a deer with is 45# and the heaviest is 78#. Those deer are equally dead, so it is not the poundage per se that makes the biggest difference. I would guess that whatever weight you are are most proficient at for deer ought be be good for bear, too. Currently, I shoot 65#, because that is the most I can shoot well.
i will openly admit that i have yet to kill a big game animal with trad equpitment. this thread isnt about what is the real mininum its all about what each persons views are as im new im just trying to get a feel for what the trad community feels is needed.
thats why i said "in my mind" is all opinions.
Ethical to who,,the bear or the guy shooting it? lol
Look at the thread with animals shot with 45# set-ups, that should alleviate any doubts with "lighter weight" and somewhat larger animals....
Atleast it did in my mind.
QuoteOriginally posted by collofthewild:
Look at the thread with animals shot with 45# set-ups, that should alleviate any doubts with "lighter weight" and somewhat larger animals....
Atleast it did in my mind.
very subjective, personal stuff that must be looked at on an individual basis. there is no one blanket "rule" that sez light or heavy bows are ok for *everyone*. only you can provide the right answers, if yer honest with yerself.
do you really know what yer doing when it comes to hunting bunnies, deer, speed goats, hogs, bear and elk?
will you use tackle that you are confident will get the job done under hunt venue conditions?
i've never chased bear or elk, but i'd do my homework before going hunting for those critters and make sure the tackle chosen was up to the task and that i was confident and accurate in its use. if i could only be consistently accurate with a 42# holding weight bow, i'd stick to bunnies and deer, and pass on the rest. ymmv.
I think it's a matter of being in tune with your equipment .Sharp ,Balanced, matched arrow to bow go's a long ways before poundage.
It also makes a big difference when you lose something ,you find much more .
When you're not willing to give up anything you have to find a way to make it work. some of us have lost the ability to use heavier bows. Therefore ,You have to find what works ethically. In turn when you lose something ,You gain so much more because it makes you search for the right equipment for the right reason .
Carl
I think it is easy to make an argument for a heavy bow when dealing with bears. I wanna get up to at least 70# before I go after a big bear on Prince of Wales Island
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=000380;p=2
Then it could be all about which deer or which bear. My son shot a deer that was 264 pound dressed weight. After the deer went down 20 yards from him, he shot one more arrow at it. The arrow hit high on the rib and bounced right over. If that would have been the first hit, everyone could say not enough power. If one would only judge the Hill single bevel that broke the deers spine, everyone would say that 50 pound longbow must be really powerful. I saw a blacky in Quetico two years ago that was as big as grizzly, no hunting in Quetico. He was a jolly old fart intent on eating a moose calf. Compare him to the average hundred pounder that is shot in Minnesota and you will be looking for a bigger bow and a taller tree.
I worry that we always seem to generate questions about minimums. . . what is the least I can get away with. We as people tend to do that a lot.
The askers truly want to know, however, I personally feel we do a disservice to many others of those reading the thread with much less experience.
Deer and bear have been killed successfully using .22 rifles and handguns, sure enough, but most certainly wouldn't recomend that as an adequate cartridge. Same with bows.
There is plenty of talk on this site for an active viewer to get a good idea what is considered by most to be "typical" equipment.
I think we need to be a bit careful espousing super light equipment because a few experienced folks do it. There is usually a large difference in capability between someone with a ton of experience and someone just starting out.
This response is meant to be general in nature, not pointing to or toward anybody in particular.
Maybe I just worry too much.
ChuckC
I would say it is all up to you. If you feel you can hit a bear in the goody box every time with a 40# bow than I think you should try it. I myself would prefer the bow be around 50# or so. But, then again it all comes down to what you feel confident with. For instance I can shoot a 65# bow pretty darn good, but I feel more comfortable with my 55# bow so that is what I shoot. Could I work up to the 60#-65# bow sure, but I feel comfortable that my bow and arrow setup are more than adequate for any game animal on this continent. I guess to answer your question a 40# bow will work but probably not everytime. However a bad shot into a bear's A** won't do you any good if you are shooting an 80# bow.
What is worse than someone using a light bow is using one that they cannot handle, which quite often is accompanied with arrows that do not fly well. Not to mention that anyone using light weight equipment needs to consider the performance of the bow, they need to be really fussy about the performance of the arrow. It would be better to say something like a 425 grain arrow that flies perfect, that has a sharp and easy penetrating broadhead and is traveling at perhaps 145 pfs and most important, the shooter is accurate at reasonable ranges. Not all bows are created equal for speed, the numbers don't mean all that much. The best thing is still for someone to find out their limits and use high performance equipment. Saying all of that, I shot a deer with a 36 pound at my 26 plus draw Hill the year that I injured my arm, a radical change at a time when I was normally hunting with 90 pound bows and Microflite arrows stuffed with wood dowels. I was surprised by the penetration and the effectiveness of a shaving sharp 140 grain Hill broadhead. For anyone else that is approaching those specs I would recommend the fastest shooting bow they could find and perhaps a broadhead that is easier to get to that shaving sharpness mounted on shaft that would give them over 400 gains total weight.