Trad Gang

Guys, here is a quick question and story.  
Last week we were at a tournament.  There was a new-to-trad guy in the group asking alot of questions.  Now, also in the group was a fellar that has been shooting a stick for about 2 years and killed a deer or 2 with one last year.  The newb asked about how many deer we have killed with a stick.  The 2 year vet said 2 deer and I said several.  John, the newb, asked "well how many is several?", to which I replied that I didn't count, but I have been shooting trad for 12+ years and killed 3-4 in AR every year and 1 or 2 out of state.

He asked about shooting distance for deer.  I told him it just had to be right.  I see every shot as a go, a no-go, or a wait a minute and see what happens.  I dont have a set distance.  When I made that comment, the 2 year vet said,"Yeah, but he will only take gimme shots.  he won't shoot anything that is not a sure deal".  

Now this was meant to be sas mouthed comment, but it is true.  I agreed.  I have killed deer at 2 or 3 steps and I have killed them at 35.  Granted, my usual shot is only about 12 to 15 yards, but if it all feels right, then I take it.

Now I am not looking for a "More ethical than thou" argument.  I am simply looking for 2 things.  Do most of you have a set distance for a shot or do you have a go or no-go mindstate, like myself.  The next question is, do you think that the need to streach the distance on a shot is coming from the compound 50+ yard shot videos and hunting stories or basic lack of hunting skills to get close.

The 2 year vet has a lack of skills to get close.  I know his issue.  If he can see a deer at 50 or 60 yards, he will shoot at it.  That is a bad call with any bow in my book.  He also is a hunting video nut, which is where I think he gets the idea to streach the limits.

By the way, I beat his tail in the tourny...   :saywhat:  


God Bless,
Nathan

I will usually not shoot at a critter past about 16-17yds. That being said, if everything feels just right and I am right in my mindset, then i will take one a bit farther. I guess I would be in the go or no-go group. I do not have a set distance. If I do not feel 100% that I can make the shot, then I wait.

I have passed shots at 10yds because something did not feel right and taken a few 20+yd shots because everything did feel just right.

Bisch

Most of my shots are under 20 yards but like you I really don't have a set distance. If the shot feels right I will take it whether that is 5 or 35 yards. I think that the super light fast arrow idea is somewhat responsible for people wanting to take those longer shots but what they don't realize is that most animals and humans can move completely out of the way of an arrow from 20 yards much less 50.

Sounds to me like you have it figured out ....Getting close, being comfortable with the shot and deciding go or no go is all part of this sport we love!   :thumbsup:    :notworthy:    It's s shame more new folks sometime can't hook up with a veteran Trad hunter to mentor them instead of watching some video that may lead them down the wrong path!

Ron, I can't mentor this guy...  He has it all figured out and will tell you in a heartbeat.  Its like talking to a tree.

I don't have it all figured out.  The deer I kill must just be some dumb ones that need culled from the herd.  I have had tons of good bucks walk almost within a "go" situation, then turn and walk away for seemingly no reason at all.  I still feel blessed to have caught a glimpse of them.

God Bless,
Nathan

Limiting yourself to slam dunk shots takes maturity and discipline.  Hopefully, 2 year will grow to that point soon; it took me a few lost deer to get there.  I'm also in the go/no go mode now.  When I hunt, I'm there to shoot something, but at the same time, I'm under no real pressure to do so.  Mostly it either feels good or it doesn't.  If I thought about it, my max would be about 18 yds, but my distance calc at the moment is either close enuf or too far.  The only distances I actually know are one deer and a bear cause I paced them after the shots; 7 and 5 steps.

Nathan, you have killed a deer, you know your ideal or comfort range, That tells me you have a pretty good Idea of what your doing. As far as mentoring him, you can only do or say so much. Good luck this year and have fun!

I only have 3 deer to my credit with trad gear.  The closest was maybe 7 yards and the futherest was around 32 yards.  The common denomenator was the shot felt right.  I never once thought of the range.

I've passed up shots at 20 yards and under because it didn't feel right.  I go with that feeling of go or no go.

I'm in the go, no go camp myself. I don't know how far it is until after the shot but I do know when it's too far. It's either feels right to me or it doesn't.

Same.

I never took a deer with a bow yet . But have taken lots of other creders. I won't shoot unles I know I can for sure kill it. No set yardage. As far as gimme shots thats realy the only one you should take. With any weapon. Some gimme shots are longer than others.

My brothers used to accuse me of trying to find a reason not to shoot. I agreed with them.

When I'm deciding to shoot, or not shoot, I go by feel, not a defined distance.

I do not have any set distances.  I am in the go no go situation.  There are so many variables that constitute a go no go sistuatuion and a go situation one day may be a no go situation the next day.  A definate no go always is anything within 2 yards of base of tree when hunting from a stand.  That shot is just too tough.  When the 2 year vet matures a little and spends some more time with his bow he will more understand what go and no go means and how it can all change from time to time.  5 to 15 yards if opening is present is almost always a go for me at somepoint during the hunt.  May have to wait for the correct opportunity but at those ranges I cannot think of many times when I was wanting to loose an arrow that I didn't.  That 20 to 30 yard stuff sometimes I have wanted to loose an arrow but things just didnt feel right or the animal wouldnt cooperate.  Back when I was a 2 year vet I shot a turkey at 63 yards because it just all felt right when I raised up my bow.  Now I am more capable of making that shot than I was then but in no way would I take it again even if it felt more right than it did that day.

I use a real fancy range finder these days.  You have to know some special folks to even place an order.  They come and implant them in your eye and they don't take batteries.  During the hunt when you are preparing for the shot its signals your brain and it makes this silent beep in your head.  It just has two beeps and the sequence usually goes, too far...too far.....too far.....fixen to b killed.....fixen 2 be killed........fixen to be killed........  Thump!

I shoot every day my targets range from 15 yards to 45 yards. I feel confident with my shots out to that distance. That being said, I let 3 does walk at 20 yards this past season because as you stated it just didn't feel right...

I shoot pure instinctive I focus on the spot, draw, continue to focus for 2-3 seconds and release... If that deer is feeding constantly moving or twitch while I"m hold that bow back focusing and it pulls my attention off my spot I'll let down.

I feel it comes down to proper stand placement and sitting still so the animal comes to that chip shot range. Those shots that as soon as that deer stops and the string comes back you know, the trail will be bright and short.

I would be in the go/no go. Everything has to be right for me to take a deer long distance. Some people just think thy can make long distance and if they hit them thu can go home feeling like they kills a deer at 50 yards when all they did was wound it. My comfort shot is 18 yards

Thanks guys for talking about this, I don't know any trad hunters, just compound guys. This Fall is my first season bowhunting.  I had already decided 20 yds was my limit, and to get really close (hopefully 10 - 15).  But I like the idea of "does it feel right?"  That's good.

with any animal....i dont think about it but if I do would say my limit is 18-20 yards....though I wish they were all at 2 yards.  If I am doing really well out to 25-30yds in practice then might be more willing to take a 20+ yd shot depending on animal, conditions, etc.

I really dont think about it...I just know when it is close enough for me and then do it....  I spent too much time in my early trad hunting journey looking for the PERFECT shot and passed on many deer and bear that now would be a no brainer.  Call it experience....fear of failure....whatever...but it was a learning curve for me and I assume everyone...just some start as young kids and I started as adult.

if pressed I would say 15yds or less is my no brainer distance...

Honestly, I don't have a clue until AFTER the shot how far it was. When an animal comes in, either the switch flips or it doesn't.

I passed on a monster caribou, twice as big as the one I killed, because it felt too far. I have never regretted it, ever.

Every bad shot I ever made felt wrong...

I'm a go - or no go. Four years ago I had the biggest buck I had ever seen in my life in the woods and he got within 10 yards or less.

Only possible shot I had was a marginal quartering away shot with only the last few ribs exposed from behind a tree. The rest of the vitals where covered by a huge poplar between me and him. He stood around long enough for me calm down which seemed like an eternity until a couple coons spooked him and he just turned and left.

Was the range right? Heck ya! was the shot a go? not any day of the week for me. Still makes me all warm inside to be able to say it was good enough to be there.

I never knew what guys meant until that moment. Could I have taken him with a gun? I never would have let him get that close, LOL. What about wheelie bow? Same answer, he never would have made it closer than 30yds.

At that moment in time I think I really matured as a hunter and walked back to the truck head held high because I was strong willed enough to say NO GO.

Now if he would have stepped out from behind that tree I may very well not be the hunter I am today. I ain't gonna lie it sure was rough to see that old buck fall to a gun the following year a half mile down the road. Wish that ol' feller that took him would of decided no go LOL

I have passed game that I thought was too far ie not right. later paced it off at mere yards.  My distance judging skills are terrible but with a go no go shot I shoot better than trying to figure distance.

I think you should explain to the new guy that he should do what works for him. Questions are fine and dandy but what works for me doesn't necessarily work for the next guy. Explain to him not to take advice as gospel, just as a way to experiment.  Hopefully he will have fun with teh journey.  

as far as the other guy.... I guess its good for him that he knows everything.  I feel bad for him though because it must be boring!

For me I typically will not get a shot in the timber over 20 yards.  But at same time I have let animals pass under 15 yards.  Like all of us I believe we develop a sense of "Go or NoGo" shots.  I think this comes with experiance and the sad truth of loosing a few animals, which is part of it.  I have shot a deer at 35 yards, but something in me said take the shot and I got here, and when I finally noticed the distance I was actually shocked.  We all have had the "they are as good as in the freezer, or on the wall" thought, only to find out we missed.  I would rather have total confidence of harvesting the animal, than have that 50/50 of loosing one.  Just my opinion.

That guy one of duty experts on here by chance?   The thing about our sport is there are ways to accomodate all, even the know it alls.  YOU know what YOU can do, and live it.  I say congrats and look forward, not back at the also ran

Endeavor to maintain your own confidence and hold steadfast to your own personal ethics.
When it comes down to the moment, the situation only involves you and your quarry. As you have ascertained that the situations is right, then execute the shot as in the past.
Test and stretch your skills on the range. Expanding and improving you skills on the range by ten yards may possibly merely equate to a few yards extension in the field. Knowing, recognizing and acknowledging the ever changing effective hunting range remains key.
Our quarry deserves premium consideration each time we elect to take a shot.

Animated talk will always go on and there are those very few that can consistently connect at longer ranges.  Know and hold true to yourself.

QuoteOriginally posted by toddster:
 We all have had the "they are as good as in the freezer, or on the wall" thought, only to find out we missed.

THATS where I screw up! I've found myself thinking the same thing before I've even loosed the arrow. Its most likely a miss.
I've calmed down a LOT in the last 4 years of hunting with a stick and string. I'm definately in the go/no go camp. But I've also learned that even the slam dunk shots can be screwed up if your form goes to pot when shooting at game. It only took 2 Rod Jenkins clinics for me to get it through my thick skull that if your form is perfect, the arrow is going where you want it to go. Rod has a Tips and tricks section on his website and one of the things he points out is that we should be running our shots on game, exactly the way we would on the blank bale.

Sorry for the derail.

If I have a clear shot, undisturbed deer...I'll shoot 40 yds. I practice daily out to 40 yds. If the shot just doesn't feel right, maybe because of the animals behavior, don't care what distance, I won't shoot.

Looks like most folks are in the same park as I am, go or no-go.  I never even try to guess yardage until after the shot.  When I feel its a go, i won't focus on anything except the hair I want to hit.  Then you get that lovely sound
ffffffff  pfft...  

God Bless,
Nathan

QuoteOriginally posted by ron w:
It's s shame more new folks sometime can't hook up with a veteran Trad hunter to mentor them instead of watching some video that may lead them down the wrong path!

RON,,,,If you were closer to Oklahoma I would take you up on that!!!!    ;)    

As it is....I'm trying to figure it all out on my own!!!    :confused:

I'm in the go/no go camp as well.  Have killed several, had 3 does go by me and didn't shoot last year, had a fourth go by at a further distance and killed her with a heart shot.  Didn't feel right on the first ones, did on the last one.  

Skitch, there are several seasoned trad guys here in Oklahoma, any of us would be willing to help.  Where are you located?

The Wensel brothers summed it up the best for me... "archery is seeing how far away you can get from your target and still hit it BUT bow hunting is seeing how close you can get to the animal and not miss" ! amen

I'm in the go/no-go camp, but would guess that most of my shots are under 20 yards for sure.  And yes, my shots are all as close to sure things as you can get.  That's kind of the idea isn't it???    :confused:    

go or no go, but mostly, the go efforts seem to be around 15 to 18 yards.

I think the better hunter we get to be, the closer the shots tend to get.  

Most of the time, the deer I see are in the 'go' range.  The is the result of trial and error, scouting and a lot of thought during stand placement.  I might move a stand in one area 2 or 3 times before I get it perfectly dialed in.  If you set up the situation to be in your favor, most of the time, it will be.

This don't come overnight.

God Bless,
Nathan