Hello, I've been knapping away and making arrowheads. My question for the people who have hunted with rocks is about arrowhead profile.
I've been making my heads in the "traditional" plains style. They aren't super pointed and I think they will work fine and won't easily break. I also see photos of heads that are quite pointy with a thin "needle" tip. So for the people who have actually killed with rocks what are your opinions regarding tip profile?
This was hard to type with this big bandaid on my finger....I must me a knapper :thumbsup:
mate i've only shot one pig with stone points. it was a christmas tree style point with a profile like your standard zwickey eskimo, ace, magnus stinger.
it was devastating!
i can see the needle point ishi style points breaking tips as you say.
i've shot some very well made points into a dead water buff and the results were broken heads.
I have killed one deer with a stone head and I made it more of the plains style type. The wood arrow didn't break but the point broke at the haft but was kept together with the sinew.
My brother Mark killed this buck as well as a bison using this style point. In both cases the head was made from Kentucky flint from Don Gilson performed excelent and the heads were intact to hunt again. Mike
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/DSCN0065_0005-1.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/DSCN0021_0049-1.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/headandfletching-1.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/markbuf1.jpg)
He took a doe with an absidian head of more triangular design, but it was much thicker in the center with a much steeper angle to bevel. It worked on the doe, but he prefers the flint heads better. In each case the heads were intact after passing through the animals. Mike
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/dscn0625_000markstonedoe1.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff289/MittenM/hero/dscn0623_0002doemark.jpg)
Don Gilson's point are outstanding.
I have several arrows with stone points on them but have yet to connect with any. Maybe this year. Goal is to kill a deer with my rivercane, stone point,and Osage selfbow.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/bows/CIMG1411-1.jpg)
I think I'd choose the head in the middle, it looks a little more robust. What do the others think?
I've taken several deer with stone points. I like to use a side notch, but have used a corner notch with success. Seems like the side notch is a little more durable, maybe a little better penatration with a corner notch.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/003-3.jpg)
here are a few of the type I like to use.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/100_1361.jpg)
and one used on a nice doe two years ago.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/100_1202.jpg)
AWESOME THREAD! :thumbsup: :campfire:
seems like a broken haft is a very common occurance. however i think they break when the animal runs after the shot. if your haft is breaking on the way in we wouldn't be seeing all these pics. they would still be in the bush.
With natural hafting like sinew and hide glue, often times the blood from the animal will soften the sinew.It takes a little while, but the point can cut the binding. had it happen a few times if I tried to pull an arrow out of an animal.
The middle point "bounced" :scared: off a raccoon at 10 yards and yes he did charge me! I killed a Spike buck with the solid black obsidian head.
(http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee98/Benjy45/TradGang/DSC02672.jpg)
(http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee98/Benjy45/TradGang/DSC02681.jpg)
Benjy, that raccoon probably needs to be checked for steroid use.
I have made up my first cane shaft arrows a few weeks ago. I hope to hunt with them this coming season, and I feel encouraged by these pics.
Who sells stone hunting points? I'd perfer Ky flint. I have been thinking how great it would be to take a deer or black bear with a stone point. :campfire:
Razorsharp, do you make an App to sharpen those buggers?
Or are we resigned to still using rocks and antler tips?
GREAT THREAD! Love seeing these photos
Mongoose you live in Kentucky, if you can get you hands on some flint you should definately try making your own. It's not as hard as it seems to make an arrowhead, some of the other things are truly difficult but a small head is easy enough for anybody.
Very cool thread. I have played with the points I have made. I hope to shoot a animal with one soon.
Came across this gentleman over on AT, he has now started his own website. I personally bought a couple of obsidian knife blades from him. Great guy to deal with. http://www.nativeflakesflintknapping.com/
Profile is important but not as impportant as a "Scary" sharp edge from tip to shoulder. A very fine neeldle tip really isn't that necessary, they are fragile to produce, to carry and most likely don't aid in deep penetration. The best cross section is a double convex profile thicker in middle and feathering out to thinner sharp edge. Edge work is the real difference between a good head and a great one. Tease off those finishing flakes to provide a succession of sharp edge to next sharp edge. Two guys that helped me alot were Norm Blaker of Michigan and Larry Bodnar of West Virginia. Norm was an excellent hunter and took many Deer and Bears with his heads. He had a neat trick of using his thumbnail to put the last fine serration on his edges. By the way, the fellows who have shown you their points have their act together. Hope this helps. PERSEVERE.
Before
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Killdeer/TG%20Uploads/Archery%20Equipment/First_Flight_1997jpg.jpg)
After penetrating a vertebra on a doe
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Killdeer/TG%20Uploads/Points/AshleysHead1.jpg)
Side view
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Killdeer/TG%20Uploads/Points/AshleysHead2.jpg)
These were made by Steve Allely for me.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Killdeer/TG%20Uploads/Points/SpawningSeason.jpg)
Killdeer
Killdeer- Is that a pine pitch coating the sinew work on the second and third pic?
Dan
It is a mix of pine pitch and deer tallow. I didn't want morning dew or rain to compromise the sinew and hide glue holding the head in the notch. Pure pine pitch cracked off of the lashings. A little grease made it more tolerant of temperature changes. I think it sorta streamlined the projectile, too.
Killdeer
Stunning Points Killdeer.......
I have one special arrow made up with a hand knapped point from Doug Campbell. Been waiting for the right opportunity on a deer. I would hate to miss with that arrow.
Doug's arrows don't miss! d;^)
Don Gilson sells Ky flint.
ozy .. Yes the arrow at the notch broke after it passed through the buck and hit something hard on the ground. The doe broke the arrow in flight and the sinew held the head against the rib wall. The other arrow killed the buffalo , but the other bull that was with him broke the shaft as it licked the wound site of the deed one. You can see this on our film Essential Encounters.
Thanks for the info guys, maybe I'll try to get up with Don. I really don't have the skill to attempt knapping one myself :campfire:
Mongoose. PM for Don's phone # if you need it.
QuoteOriginally posted by razorsharptokill:
I have several arrows with stone points on them but have yet to connect with any. Maybe this year. Goal is to kill a deer with my rivercane, stone point,and Osage selfbow.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/bows/CIMG1411-1.jpg)
I have the same goal....only i will use my bow not yours! (haha)
Bisch
Thanks Jon, PM sent.
QuoteOriginally posted by calgarychef:
I think I'd choose the head in the middle, it looks a little more robust. What do the others think?
The middle one is really sharp even after lots of shots into styrofoam. It is not my best work but I feel it would definetly do the trick. It and the one on the right are both flint but different types.
How do you knappers know when the broadhead is sharp? I guess I mean how do you test them? I have made a couple (out of many tries) that I feel are adequate to hunt deer with, but am a little nervous. I want a humane kill when using them.
Thanks
alot depends on the type of stone, obsidian, kay county, novaculite would make good points for hunting. you can get them pretty sharp if you pay attention to edge preperation.
Im going to this year.
Woody Blackwell point & my Osage selfbow with complete pass through on a black bear...tippit
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v110/tippit/1st%20Annual%20Quebec%20Bear%20Quest/QuebecBearQuest07042.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v110/tippit/1st%20Annual%20Quebec%20Bear%20Quest/QuebecBearQuest07057.jpg)
QuoteOriginally posted by bondo:
I've taken several deer with stone points. I like to use a side notch, but have used a corner notch with success. Seems like the side notch is a little more durable, maybe a little better penatration with a corner notch.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/003-3.jpg)
here are a few of the type I like to use.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/100_1361.jpg)
and one used on a nice doe two years ago.
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b327/selfbow1/100_1202.jpg)
The ones in the middle picture are close to the same dimmension as the ones I make for hunting as far as length and width. I just make mine corner notched as it is easier for me to haft them in that style.
Interesting tidbit! I was doing some percussion stuff a couple days ago and a tiny little flake cut right through my glove and into my finger. It's not my first cut from flint but this one was tiny but deep, y'all should have seen the blood! About 16 hours later it broke open again and bled like hell. I've never in my life had a cut that wouldn't stay closed after that long.
Sharp stuff indeed!