I have read a lot of threads suggesting to use a 600 grain arrow out of light dw bows to increase penetration. I'm not disagreeing, just wondering what make that weight so special.
The more weight the harder it is to stop.
Charlie
I can't speak for anyone else but for me 600 grs is a weight I can achieve pretty simply with carbon arrows, a 125 gr brass insert and a moderately heavy broadhead (150 to 185 grs). I usually shoot about 60 pounds though so at 10 grs per pound it is not an exceptionally heavy arrow for the draw weight.
I think its a good all around weight to be around 600 grains give or take a bit.They hit hard with excellant momentum.A bow tends to shoot quieter and with a little less vibration with a pleasant feel.I dont shoot over 20 yards when hunting so I dont worry about trajectory much with the heavier arrow.
I shoot around 50#s at 30 inches draw and often hunt with a CX Heritage 250 which is a heavier carbon arrow.The arrow has a 50 grain brass insert and 150 grain head.That puts me at about 600 grains.I am pleased with the results for hunting and like how the bow feels when shot with these arrows.
I also shoot CX Heritage 150s with less point and insert weight than the 250s when I want a lighter grain weight arrow for flatter trajectory.They probably weigh 50-80 grains less with an aluminum insert and 100 or 125 grain head.
Shoot what flies best out of your bow though.A heavy arrow thats not flying straight and true wont do you much good
Well it's not just a number out of the air. Dr. Ashby did extensive testing in Africa and Australia and concluded that an arrow at about 600 gr with extreme FOC and a single bevel broadhead was the king in penetration on large game with light poundage bows.
Mike
I do believe Dr. Ashby's suggested minimum weight threashold to breach heavy bone was 650 grains. If I'm wrong, please excuse me.
It's an even number and it equates to 12 grains a pound on a fifty pound bow. I don't know what you call a light draw, but it seems like a silly proposition on a 35-40# bow. An 8 GPP arrow with decent velocity may well serve you better than a 16 GPP arrow not getting anywhere near the same velocity. At the end of the day if it shoots well and you enjoy it, use it.
I also noticed that a 600gr arrow is quieter out of my longbows. I foot all my cedars with purple heart or bacote and even my fir shafts.The cedars turn out between 600 and 610. The firs can be anywhere from 630 to 680. I shoot between 57# to 70# depending on the temps.
Mike,
Your probably right, but you get the idea. Heavy arrow does the job that a light one will not when using light equipment.
Mike
Penetration, penetration, penetration. They shoot quiet and are easy on your bow. They also have great penetration.
I shoot bows that are 44@28 and arrows that are 600 grains. I like them because I have gotten used to the way the bow feels on the shot and the fact that I keep shooting through deer with them.
Ashby also did some study on lighter bows and optimizing results. I don't recall the numbers, but he determined that using a heavier arrow with even lighter poundage bows resulted in significantly better penetration.
It is great information. But Take it for what it is worth.
ChuckC
The Ashby reports are good info, but the bottom line is you should shoot what shoots best for you - JMHO. I have used heavy ash shafts with my Hill style longbow which put me at 11 gpp, but I'm leaning more towards douglas fir shafts that put me at 9 gpp. I just shoot better and have more confidence with them.
It's hard to stop. :thumbsup:
There is likely no better evidence than appropriate testing coducted by one's self while maintaining an open mind.
QuoteOriginally posted by Friend:
There is likely no better evidence than appropriate testing coducted by one's self while maintaining an open mind.
BINGO!!!!!
I shoot 580 to 630 grains normally...and don't have any penetration issues ...even with 3 and 4 blades out of my bows....
However, *I* would NOT shoot at a TX whitetail with a 600 grain arrow out of a 45# bow. ....so take note, there are always exceptions....bows, arrow, and Bheads are all tools, and all need to be applied to the game sought. Yes, there are great all around set ups, ....and that's what I use most of the time....but I do change if need be.....i.e., lighter on TX deer....and a little heavier arrow or bow on large boar hogs....or a different head if lighter bow.
There is no one weight arrow, or one bow, or one broadhead that is best for everything.....just like there is no best off road tire for every environment.
Learn your equipment, and how and when to apply it....and use common sense....and don't be afraid to change if the scenario dictates based on YOUR experiences...... :campfire:
What Terry said...........
QuoteOriginally posted by DesertDude:
What Terry said...........
x2
I have to agree with Terry as well. The absolutes so often touted in traditional bowhunting continue to perplex me. For many decades folks had no problem shooting through whitetails with 40-something-pound bows and arrows weighing between 400 and 500 grains. But today there's a contingent of folks, history be damned, who seem convinced that ethics is determined by a set of ratios, digital scale readings, or bevel counts. For a group so deeply rooted in our collective history, we sure seem selective about what we choose to remember.
So what's so special about 600-grain arrows? Nothing really.
Makes a lot of sense, I'll do some testing.
My set-ups vary per bow. From 425gr to 700gr arrows. Broad Heads from 125gr to 300gr. All depends on the game and the bow.
Lots of work and fun.
QuoteOriginally posted by charles m:
Great post. Arrow flight and accuracy far exceeds all the other stuff that folks get all caught up in. Most folks would be better served by spending more time tuning their set ups and learning to shoot better than arguing over broad heads and jumping on band wagons.
Same with all other equipment cult like stuff. Like what has been said, use common sense applications. 45# bows and 500 grain arrows have been blowing 4 blade Bear razor heads through whitetails long before we even had a man on the moon. Deer didn't grow Kevlar vest over the last 5 decades, but many would lead you to believe they have. Why? Well, I have my beliefs but I'll leave that for you to ponder.
If you can't shoot a broadhead, even a multiblade, slap through a whitetail with a 500 grain arrow, you have other issues. Just don't expect to kill a cape buff with that same arrow with regularity.
I also have to agree that certain folks want to totally ignore history, AND, what others have done successfully. What also gets me is that many of these folks parroting this stuff never even kill anything.
Quotemany of these folks parroting this stuff never even kill anything. [/QB]
That's the beauty of the internet. I have and have had many hobbies and have joined forums similar to this one for most of them through the years. It's always the same.
A 600gr arrow will give great penetration all things being equal but this penetration is worthless if you miss your target. I don't obsess over arrow weight. My cedar arrows seem to come out at around 550grs with a 125gr head so that is what I shoot. There's not much you can do to take weight off of a woodie. Spend your time trying to get good arrow flight and the weight should be fine.
My two cents and that's all it's worth.
Ross
Here is my take on this subject. I TOTALLY agree that noone needs 600 grain arrows to hunt whitetails, but at the same time, I have no problem improving penetration by shooting a heavy arrow.
I think todays bows are more efficient and are perfectly capable of shooting heavier arrows for increased penetration while still maintaining acceptable cast.
I wouldn't go so far as suggesting 600 grains for a 45# bow is a must, but I wouldn't be afraid to shoot a whitetail with one either.
Use what you want .... something that shoots well out of your bow. Like a buddy of mine always says, keep it simple Fred, it's only two sticks and a string!
Having said that, I would try and keep it at 10 gpi or above. Not all shots are perfect and one day you may need the extra punch.
I like a heavy arrow as it will out penetrate the lighter one, just about every time. However I shoot a very effecient 55# longbow that is shooting my 650 grain arrows right at 165 fps. I don't mind having a little speed to go along with the heavy arrows. Most of the deer I have killed with a trad bow were killed with a self made 49# bow shooting a 550 grain arrow at 154 fps. All these deer were killed in lower Arkansas where they are very spooky and will "duck" if they even think anything is wrong. When I shot a lighter arrow I found that they ducked more because of the extra noise made. In short I like a silent heavy arrow over a noisy light one.