I have come to the conclusion that the strutting decoy is bad most the time. I have only had one set of birds come to it a few years back and that was a competition thing with multiple very excited birds. In my experiences the action has to be hot and heavy for it to work. Countless times gobblers steer clear of it. I would bet if I had only hens out there weekend this guy would have walked right in. He sure wanted to but just wouldn't commit. He stuck around a long while just watching the decs. What are your findings???
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Same thing here with those big strutting toms BUT I have had exceptional luck with a strutting jake!
Jim, mine is a Jake. It's small, has the longer center tail feathers and a 1" stub beard.
TJ: I don't like the big strutters either, but like Jim, the Jakes have worked great. My hunting buddy just got back from 10 days in Nebraska, used the new Zink, Jake 1/4 strut decoy. Had it attacked several times and had at least 6 different gobblers come to investigate it. This one is very realistic and doesn't offer much of a threat as some of the full strutters. The bird in your picture is a young one probably two year old, he may have had his butt kicked lately and a little hesitant for another fight. The older birds usually are not that shy. But they are Turkeys and they do what they darned well please. RW
Tom a jake in half strut seems to be the best set up with a hen. IMO. I have had great success over many years getting birds in range with this setup. When I did try the full strut turkey I also had birds hang up or shy away. Just my two cents. Check out this website for some great turkey info bestturkeydecoy.com
Hey Tom, thinking back I only had one occasion when the fanned tom like your using in the photo really worked. My son and I had a good sized group of gobblers come in, maybe 12 in the group. They were all mature birds and it was a very competitive environment.
The times I've had jakes or a single tom interested they always skirted it by 50 yards. I've continued to use the big strutter decoy, only because it worked like a charm that one hunt with my son.
Now you got me thinking? :dunno:
Where's Curt, he should chime in on this one.
I have changed my set up to just running two hens,and for the last seven years it has worked out the best.Now i don't take anything but hens,and the turkeys just roll in.
Tom and Tim that websit I posted about is all about bowhunting birds. It's one of the most informative enriched sites I've read(3 times). I think it will help make for better turkey hunting in the future. Good luck fellows I'm a week away from chasing them.
I use a jake tail in a holder called the fanster and then cut off the rear end of a cheap jake decoy and set the fanster up tight to jake. i have had toms come and jump on it . punch it, spur it . Even other jakes have gotten aggressive with it.
the big full strutting tom decoy have done nothing but scare bids away.
if it is early in the breeding period it works great. almost like fishing with dynomite! now that doesn meant the 1st day of season. sometimes opening day is late in breading period or early depending on the weather. the previous two years opeening day has been perectly timed. it is the early stages of breeding and gobblers are trying to obtain dominance on other birds and they will try and fight every tom they see.. this year was another story. it was 85 deg all march and by the time april rolled around breeding period had already peaked. and most gobblers would run from a strutter.
think about that next time you set decoys out. but a good all year decoy is a hen and a jake . jake at half strut so he doesnt look intimadating
If I use a male decoy at all it's defiantly a jake at half strut. I've seen way to many birds not come all the way in when I was using a full strut.
like everyone else, its only truely worked once for me also....had toms come from two different areas, had 3 hens and the bmobile out..the first tom got there won a trip to the dinner table.
different hunt, had another tom come in very hestitant...finally brought him in on wingbone, two of us going at it.
all in all, it's hard to be a single hen decoy, maybe 2 at most.
I think the strutters are a hype honestly. When they work they work very well. I think early season just as the flocks are getting close to bustin from winter to spring groups, lots of competition for status and very very few hens ready. This is when they are really deadly. Later on when toms are henned up and the pecking order is laid...not so much.
Something you'll also notice, the real lifers...be it Zink, David Smiths, or the 'best turkey decoy' are all non strutters. The latter toting a more calm profile than worked up (its all about the snood lol).
Heavy worked wooded areas...I've found no decoy is better...more open areas a single hen does very well.
Tim,
I'm pretty sure Curt recommends a strutter early in the season.
QuoteOriginally posted by rolltidehunter:
if it is early in the breeding period it works great. almost like fishing with dynomite! now that doesn meant the 1st day of season. sometimes opening day is late in breading period or early depending on the weather. the previous two years opeening day has been perectly timed. it is the early stages of breeding and gobblers are trying to obtain dominance on other birds and they will try and fight every tom they see.. this year was another story. it was 85 deg all march and by the time april rolled around breeding period had already peaked. and most gobblers would run from a strutter.
I think you are absolutely spot on John. Our season usually begins with the birds all henned up and in bunches. This year I haven't seen a single bunch of birds. They are all alone, hens and gobblers at least in my area. I'll go all hens next outing and see what happens.
think about that next time you set decoys out. but a good all year decoy is a hen and a jake . jake at half strut so he doesnt look intimadating
David's correct, the website he recommended has some real good info! Thanks......Tim :thumbsup:
I'm with you Tim. We need to hear from Curt. Curt you out there??? I also wonder how much hunting pressure plays a roll in this as well. We had a youth weekend the weekend prior.
Birds are used to seeing strutting Toms,jakes,hens,etc...specially this time of year.. it's just natural...if birds are steering clear of your set-up it's most likely something else they are seeing...I use a b-mobile with "Great Success"...Mine goes everytime I go..wouldn't think of not taking him.
Now with that being said,I've had birds work get 60 or 70 yards from me & hang up then go the other way but I've had it happen with several different decoys as well as no decoys as at...That's just the way things happen some times....
I'm curious to hear how close are these birds getting to your set-up before they decide to go the other way.
I usually find that even in our early season a strutting jake or tom decoy tends to spook our birds.
Tom I have found they work if our season comes in right when the other males are hot for the ladies.After things cool down they seem to be a little less frisky.
At least some of you are enjoying the season....PA doesn't open for a few more weeks! :knothead:
I always use a strutting jake or posturing jake in my set-ups until the later end of the season. Very rare is it that a bird hangs up on my set-ups since I made the change from the using mature strutters. Jakes don't seem to be too intimidated either. I found that the hang ups I had in the past when using mature looking strutter decoys was due to the phase the turkeys were in at the time and the particular gobbler(s) status in the pecking order. Those gobblers that had been recently whupped were reluctant to come in, but would strut at what they felt was a safe distance from the decoy. This is was always out of range.
Since making the change to the strutting jake and posturing jake a few years ago I don't have those hang-ups hardly at all since it is obvious that the decoy is smaller and less intimidating. Therefore, even the subdominate gobblers aren't going to shy away from it, but relish in the fact that they too can chase him off (the decoy) and have his own hen(s).
I have had success with the B-mobiles, Pretty Boys, etc, but have had more consistant success throughout most of the season with the jake decoys. Now with that being said, I will still move to a gobbler decoy toward the end of the season when the gobblers begin to group back up due to lack of hens. They seem to like to come to a lone strutter to see who he is.
Personally mine has hurt me 10 to 1. I tried painting my Bmobile with a little more red and using a real jake fan with a beard cut to an inch or so and that helped some. I have since gone with a lone Avian X hen and now picked up a half-strut jake.
I think alot of 2 year old birds or younger will not like a big strutter and jet(or it seems that way to me) where as an older dominant bird might give it a go. The only time I had a decoy to really work was last week when a lone, dented decoy did the trick.
KTJ,
Have had the same experiences. The best/most consistent set up I've used is a hen set on the ground and a non-strutting jake decoy standing over the hen as if ready to breed her. Any mature tom cannot seem to stand that! Good hunting! Todd
I use mine for only the first week or so of the season. They seem to shy away after they have seen it a couple times. I put the most beat up jake fan I have on it. It still isn't a sure thing but not much in bow hunting is.
The most effective decoys I've used, by far, are by Avian X. I've got the Breeder hen and the 1/4 Strut Jake. That combination pulls gobblers in like nothing I've ever seen. My Jake has been mauled by several gobblers so far this season. I've yet to have a gobbler spot it and not come in to it. A buddy of mine has shot 4 gobblers over the pair this season already, using a shotgun.
I have never had luck with a big tom strutter. My setup is a jake and single hen. Have had great luck with this.
I've been thinking about two hens with a Montana whitetail decoy at a bit of a distance just for another distraction since I'm not using a blind. Worth a try anyway.
I hear a taxidermied hen works nearly every time!
I hope you guys are right. Ive used a full strutter for 2 seasons and didnt have any thing come into range, alot at 50+yards but nothin in solid bow range. I switched out this year with the Avian jake/hen combo so Im excited to read these posts. I was just out back and heard 4 different gobblers sounding off the AM!!! Love listening to spring time gobbles!!!!
John, Do let us know you findings after some time with the new setup.
Interesting idea Bruce. Kind of a confidence decoy set up. Seems to me that turkeys pay less attention to deer than deer pay to turkeys, but it never seems to bother them if deer are out in the field.
Hind site is 20 - 20.
KY's turkey season is short and if six birds are taken over the same strutter in one season then there is plenty of room to ponder.
Having said that, my set-ups are such that the decoys stay home.
As in whitetails, herd or flock balance most likely plays a roll also in your area. A high concentration of males brings more aggression, if there are plenty of hens does a gobbler really need to fight for love?
Tom the farm I hunt has way more hens than gobblers. Last year I probably saw 10 hens to 1 gobbler. I had three gobblers come in in spank my jake decoy last year over a two week period. I believe alot depends on the mood of the bird. JMO
best decision I have ever made was buying a full body mounted strutting jake killed my first turkey this AM with it.
Sorry fellas, just saw this....
I'm glad Mark(bluegrass) saw this and commented...he's a serious turkey slayer!
I can't believe more guys aren't killing more gobblers over strutting deke's!
I first got my b-moble strutter before the 2007 season and immediately had success. Should have had my 2 bird limit in two days had I done my part shooting. But I did get my two birds within a week.
The next spring I again used it as a full fan, long bearded tom deke and again should have had my season done in the first two days I hunted. Both toms came strutting right in...Missed the first day, killed one the next time out.
The next year, before the season started, I got to thinking.....
Even though my strutter "Floyd" had been deadly...why not make him into a strutting jake to make him even more irritating to to both mature birds and other jakes.
I changed the tail to an exaggerated jake tail with even more of a difference in the long feathers in the middle than the outer feathers.
I shortened the snood to jake length. I also made the beard length adjustable and shortened it to about 2". I've also painted mine to look more realistic.
Opening day that year, 2009, I killed the first bird that I called to as he stood side posturing trying to intimidate "Floyd".
Two weeks later I killed my second bird over a standing jake,hen combo. I have no doubt Floyd would have worked as well, but I had a long walk that morning and left him because he's a little bulkier and slightly heavier.
Second day 2010, I killed another bird over Floyd in my most memorable turkey hunt with Cade.
Yes earlier is better, and I find myself not bringing Floyd with me as the season goes on.
For me, they flat out work!
Heck there's 2 video's right now on the Pow Wow of TG members killing birds over strutting deke's.
Like Mark said, if they aren't coming in, I believe it's because of something else they don't like in your set-up. maybe they just got their butt handed to them by another bird,etc...
Kentucky TJ.....my 3 cents.......change blinds.....look at your set up.....that blind looks like a leafy Monster with 2 eyes ready to eat those decoys...if you have a tight fabric blind, use it.....those gobblers may see something in that blind they do not like and i believe that is what is happening......i like others on here has had great success on strutting decoys.....get a Double Bull would be my suggestion....i have your same exact decoy.....good luck
Joe, I don't think its the blind. I've had many walk around the back of it just as this bird did this weekend. It was 15 or so yards behind me at one point.
Is there any chance that someone else hunting near you is using a similar decoy? I think birds get smart very quickly, and at least where I hunt seem to identify a fraud very easily once they have been spooked from it. You might fool them once, but I have had terrible luck trying to get the same bird to commit to the same setup a second time. If your neighbor is using something similar he might be doing the educating for you.
Have some different decoys in your arsenal. Full strut, partial strut, erect. Feeding hen, upright hen, etc. Vary the positioning as well, and switch up the calls you are using.
The reason i suggest that is i ripped my first Double bull. it was the original in Predator around 95ish...so i threw an army surplus Shaggy Tank cover over it.....it did not work well....T-5 came out and i was back in business..I am not a fan of shaggy blinds in general.
second possibility...when i blind hunted, i learned to never call at a gobbler while he was within 80 yards or so looking at me( in the tent) and the decoy. They learn quick "something is making a turkey noise inside that fabric tent and i am going to stay clear"...now i may do a soft when they are occupied strutting or looking off,,......but they will hang up and skirt your setup very very frequent if you call out of that blind too much. especially older birds.....there are exceptions......but my 4 cents....when u see a gobbler in view and he goes into strut approaching your strutter, be quiet....let it happen...it's hard not to call becasue thats why we love to hunt these birds but go silent on him and let the decoy do its work...point the strutter head away from where you think the bird will come from....Sell the fan to him as much as possible...
or
borrow you buddys tight fabric blind
good luck
Hunted all around hard Whip.
Joe, the wind was blowing very hard this weekend maybe something to the whipping leaves on the blind. Of course all the foliage is whipping around pretty good this weekend. I'll investigate this though Thanks.
Thanks for the info Joebuck. I have had issues over the last 2 yrs with gobblers hanging up 50-60 yrds out from my full strut decoy. I'm gonna quit calling to them once they see the deke and see if that helps.
I've got mixed emotions on decoys in general, but I haven't used a strutter in three years. If I use a deke, its just one. I can't sound like two turkeys as I have a hard enough time sounding like one.
Yesterday rejuvinated my thoughts on not using any at all. Before lunch I threw on the bug jacket and grabbed my bow "just in case" as I went to check a camera. Ten minutes in I located one and within another two, he was crossing a ditch looking for me. I could visibly see him panning back and forth looking for the hen. As he worked away, I purred him right back around. With a decoy, I'm sure he would have hung up.
I wish I could say I killed him, but I sent a fir arrow under him. He wasn't huge, but with no blind and work khakis on, I was shootin. It takes skill to shoot "under" a turkey you know. Lol
That wind might just be your problem Tom. Those leafy blinds will sure get to fluttering in a good wind. Even though the bushes and leaves are moving too, the movement is a little different, and the birds might very well recognize that and shy away. Even though he didn't totally spook, he may have known that something just didn't look quite right.
I know that joebuck gave up on ghillie suits for that exact reason. They work great when it's calm, but add some wind and they have an unnatural flutter to them.
I tossed a cabelas blind also for that reason. Had birds close got just enuf wind it shook the blind, bye bye Tom. Has happened a few times now. Time for something new.
Hey TJ.....after two seasons with a full strutter the 1st bird that seen the new AvianX jake hen combo comes in on a string and gives me a 12 yards shot and all I have is black feathers... :banghead:
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The new dekes look good and mind you the jake is only 9 steps away!!
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Camera pix off my video right before the unmentionable happend..... :dunno:
Those dekes look real! No wonder they are so expensive.
I listened to the wisdom and experience of you guys on this thread and left my strutting toms at home. I also read on another thread that it is a big mistake to over call. I stuck my 1 lone hen 12 yards out and just yelped enough to let them know where I was and for 20 minutes the 2 big toms just tried to impress each other. Then like an alarm went off and they wanted to come check out the new girl. They came in strutting and gobbling the whole way.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge,
Lyle
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THATS how it supposed to work.....BIG time congrats!!!!! :thumbsup:
TJ I always start with my strutter during the youth season and see how the bird react. Last year it worked great on the youth opener as well as the regular season opener. By the first week last year birds were alittle shy of it.
This year the youth opener was a little different 2 longbeards came in from behind us and were headed strait for my hens when they came around the blind and saw my strutter they hung up and stopped, still strutting and gobbling but not advancing any. They were behind us and the kid was unable to get a shot. After 30 minutes of gobbling, strutting, drumming, basicilly torcher they moved away behind us. 30 minutes later a long bird came in from in front of us silent and causously went strait to the strutter never gobbling once or strutting. When he got to the decoy he was starting to ruffle his feathers up when the yound man with me smoked him. So for the regular season opener I left it in the truck. Results were good with just hens. I think they work best early in season and sometimes late. JMO. This weekend I'm going to setup in a strut zone area that is narrow and not use a decoy at all and see what happens on my first setup. If nothing goes I will move to another area and try the hen by itself.
Wish I had one of the avian decoys I have heard nothing but good things.
I thought strutters were to challenge DOMINANT birds? Lots more jakes and two year olds running around than big old dominant birds.
Yohon, yeah those are nice, I'd love to get a couple of those but I'd have to sell a bow or something. Dang they are pricey.
I think SteveO's onto it. If that young bird would have come in I wouldn't have shot him anyway. I had my camera in my hand and wanted some good photos.
I drank the kool-aid and bought a couple of them Avian X dekes. Perhaps that will be the KY jinx-breaker I need TJ :)
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve O:
I thought strutters were to challenge DOMINANT birds? Lots more jakes and two year olds running around than big old dominant birds.
I think it depends a lot on their mood. It seems like most guys are using a jake strutter, so that shouldn't intimidate too many.
In watching live birds they often will go to a struting tom even when they are subordinate birds. Kind of like a little whitetail buck can't resist chasing after a doe even when a bigger buck is on her tail.
I often times see jakes tagging along behind a strutting tom and harrasing his girlfreind. Sure, they get chased away, but they just can't seem to help themselves.
I killed my first"about to beat up my jake" bird yesterday. But I`ve killed more beside a lone hen.
I use a pop`up most of the time and hunt field edges or clearcuts a lot. More so in the afternoon hunts. I can tell you from experience that when I started setting my blind inside the edge instead of out in the field I had More Turkeys closer. If I can set it under a big tree with limbs to hang over even better.Good luck.RC
Went out behind the house this AM for a bit and had a hen come right up to the Avian hen puff all up and pecked right in the head!!! Never had a hen check a deke out like that before.......
Those decoys are very nice looking.
Here's a couple of my setups.
(http://i934.photobucket.com/albums/ad183/wclooper/turkeysetuponpowerline1.jpg)The first picture was the scene of quite a ruckus. That morning, I had 17 birds within 30 yards of me. There were so many birds around me, I couldn't draw without being seen. When I did decide to take a shot, on a particularly ornery jake, I got busted by a big gobbler that was only 10 feet behind me. I didn't know he was there, until he started making his alarm putt. It was pretty funny. There were 6 or 7 jakes and toms around me at that moment. I think the big tom caught me drawing. They all eventually moved off and out of range. I did call 4 jakes back to the decoy, but didn't take a shot. I had to end my day's hunt at noon, so I didn't get another shot.
The next day, I moved to this setup: (http://i934.photobucket.com/albums/ad183/wclooper/turkeysetuponpowerline-1.jpg)
I ended up calling a huge gobbler in, and he put on quite the show. As soon as he saw that jake, his head turned from bright blue to almost black. He strutted and drummed and did everything he could to frighten the jake decoy off. When it didn't run, he pecked the crap out of it several times. His final move was to spur it. I shot him as he was gloating over the knocked over decoy.
I made the shot I wanted and thought he was down for good, but he made a last short, desperate flight into the nearby thicket, and I couldn't find him. That's the first big game animal I've ever lost. I'm still sick to my stomach about it. At any rate, my buddy shot two huge gobblers out of that same setup later that afternoon with his shotgun.
In both setups, I had the decoys set about 13-15 steps from me. I had the facing me and made sure not to put them too close together. Every male bird, both jakes and toms, that saw them zeroed in on that jake. These decoys were expensive, but they should last me the rest of my life. I've spent a lot more on all of the cheap ones I've used over the years.
I may be the odd man out here since I have had a lot of success arrowing gobblers off of fanning type decoys, taking probably at 15 or so using that type of decoy . . . and not early season either. LATE season and LATER in the day. Here's how it's worked for me. Unlike the turkeys I don't get really excited about the breeding period until after the hens have put down all of their eggs and more or less settled on the nest. Where I hunt (Eastern longbeards in west KY)this may be the last week of the season. Believe it or not, I am as serious about taking mature longbeards as the Wensels are about tagging big whitetails (OK, so you don't believe that:^)). While gobblers can, and do, shy away from aggressive looking decoys I have found a method for firing them up and coaching them in. . . I'm talking "kick his butt" close. I don't set a hen, only the male, and stake him pretty tight to the ground. I rig a pull string so I can periodically lower his fan to the ground. Once a bird shows any interest at all, and this could be at 50 or more yards, I lower the tail, wrap the string around my foot to keep it down, and shake my foot (sitting in a blind of course)so that the decoy QUIVERS on the ground as if he has a hen penned underneath him. This little maneuver has tripped more switches on lonely, mid-day, post peak breeding longbeards than I can remember. Works for me.
Wow thats a great tip Gary!!! Sounds like Wensel kinda thinking too....... :thumbsup:
Hey John.....those decoys are incredibly real looking! Stay at it my friend! See you in Baltimore.
Gary,
could you post some pics of how you have your decoy rigged to lower the fan?
That is a great tip!!!
Thanks
Charlie
I just got back from scouting from my blind where I killed my first bird. (can't get #2 until Monday) I had a big ol tom come by at 15 yards and stop periodically to face my blind in full strut and spit, drum, and take advancing aggressive steps toward the blind.
Has anyone ever seen that?
Thanks for all the good advice on this thread.
This trad turkey hunting is a great time.
Lyle
Sometimes those 2 yr olds are the dominant bird! Watch a Tom whose been flogged by jakes put the breaks on when he sees your jake deke about mid season!