hello the Gang, from the other side of atlantic sea i 've a question for you from a good friend of mine . This french gentleman went in 1997 to bowhunt in Idaho i suppose on public land.
With some french bowhuntersfriends they had lived their éAmerican dream" they arrived in the town of BOISE , rent a big car, baught some foods and local beverage, they went to a "ranger office" , baught licences for small games, 1 mule deer and 1 elk , and after that the put some tents at one hour and a half of dust road from the little tow of Stanley and hunted for 2 weeks close by a river called "snake river" ... finaly they shot one Mule deer and they have incredible memory about this self made bow hunting trip
do you think i'ts still possible today in 2012 to do the same thing for non resident bowhunter ?
thanks :campfire:
david
It is, still lots of public land, and the deer and elk tags can still be bought over the counter. But you now have to buy a separate achery permit, and that requires you to show proof you've completed the Bow Hunter's education program. Additionally there's lots of us on here that can give you directions to places as well.
Absolutely possible! Most of the archery elk and mule deer tags are over the counter in Idaho(on a quota system). Make sure you have the proper hunters ed certifications and go for it. I will warn you though, elk numbers in the snake river country north of stanley have depleted considerably (and depressingly) since 1997 (impact of wolves). Beautiful country, but may be advised to look elsewhere if wanting to get into good elk numbers.
Cheers, Matt
thanks guys , i will look if our hunter examination for the licence and bowhunting obligatory formation can match with your bow hunter education program !!
thanks again
My friend lives in Idaho and the wolf population in the middle of the state has depleted the deer and elk. One outfitter in Orofina,Idaho will not have hunts this 2012 because of no game. Wolfs have eaten them.
He and his boys did not get anything this 2011.
I suggest Colorado! Wonderful country in both states. My .02 cents. Ken
while idaho is way down on elk there are a few places that have good numbers of bull but few cows and calves...if you would like more info id be glad to help just email or pm me sometime...
It's true that "some" areas of Idaho have experienced a decline in elk numbers...but all is not lost (not yet anyhow). I have many friends and coworkers who shot elk in central and northern Idaho this past season. 4 off the top of my head that were hunting near Orofino. In some areas the hunting is not nearly as good as it once was, but there are still lots of elk to be found in Idaho. As far as deer go, in my opinion if you want a good chance at success and aren't picky about what you shoot your odds on harvesting a mule deer or whitetail (depending on what part of the state you hunt) are good.
I too would be happy to help in any way I could, just PM or email me.
Travis
Yes you can. I hunted the McCall Zone a few years ago and got into elk a lot. Muleys were all over too. There were definitely wolves around but if you move over a couple drainages you can still have the hunt of a lifetime.
The area around Stanley, ID is beautiful, and would be worth the trip even if you don't get a shot off. That area was part of France at one time, so when you get there and see how beautiful it is, you can thank Napoleon for letting us have it. :D
John,
A couple of years has made a huge dent in the elk population in the McCall area. I've hunted Idaho since the 80s and this year they got my last money. Moving on to greener elk pastures in Wyoming and Colorado before the wolves get them there too.
Mike
You're exactly right. I've hunted the McCall and surrounding areas for years and it has changed immensely in recent years. "Moving over a couple of drainages" doesn't do all that much any more. The wolves are proliferating and following the elk wherever they go. Yes, there are still lots of elk, but they're a lot quieter now...and it's harder to get the right situation.
It's possible to still do that.You need to contact someone from the area and maybe they will help you to find the Elk.You can pm me,that area is my backyard and I can give you some advice.
Curt
Me, my brother and father went to Idaho about 8 years ago and hunted in the Salmon-Challis area. We didn't have a clue what we were doing but got into some elk and almost got a nice one. Haven't been back since, so don't know if the wolves have hurt this area as well?
We have also a big wolf problem here too ine the alps ... in some places rams almost disappear, in my village we had 14 rams tags this year for something like 75 hunters (74 rifles . 1 bow) , only 3 were shotand i think we will have to not hunt next year ... in the national parc of mercantour 20 years ago some villages get more than 100 rams tags and today only 1 or 2 .... and chamois are so "sensitive" now it's very very difficult to approach them with a bow now ... but ... here the very green people are very happy about that "true wild nature" ... many hunters just quit ...
anyway thank for all that answers, the trip is for next year :thumbsup:
:clapper:
and 'F..." napoleon ! (but you know i prefer my american dream than a napoleon dream :deadhorse: )
There are plenty of elk here, during this past season we ran into multiple elk each day for four days. The wind and my partners first ever shot were the difference between us bringing home meat or as it turned out, us having just great memories. This took place 1.5 hours from Boise! The Elk are here, do some research, ask around and you'll find that there are great opportunities in the state of Idaho.
Interesting how these threads always become about wolves.
I had a pack run right by me while hunting this fall. I also saw plenty of elk, as long as I was willing to put the effort in.
It's worth noting that the game herd levels of the last few decades, in many parts of the West, were unrealistically high, unhealthy, and likely unsustainable, in large part due to a lack of predation - and that these unnaturally high levels are what everyone is comparing the current situation to.
I'm not saying this because I'm one of these folks who think that wolves are sacred and untouchable. But nor do I agree with the "smoke a pack a day" mentality. I just find that there are usually two extremes when it comes to the topic, and very little middle ground.
Personally, give me real wild habitat that has healthy levels of both game and predators, doing what they're supposed to do. And manage wolves like you would any other species.
And for all the folks that think wolves are a huge problem, I just hope you are also equally committed to doing something about all the other factors that are reducing habitat and healthy game levels as well.
Well said. The explosion of wolf populations are a result of overly high ungulate populations.
There is a LOT of unbiased science based studies that show a couple of things.
One is that there are naturally occurring ebs and flows of predator- prey numbers. Basic biology 101.
High numbers of elk and low numbers of predators are hard on the landscape that the elk depend on. This will, in the long run, reduce elk numbers as the ecosystem attempts to find it's biological balance.
There are other causes of "reduced" elk numbers. I put reduced in quotes not because I think the reduction of elk numbers is falsified, but simply because there are other causes of the reduction in elk numbers/ sightings. One is the wolves have changed the habits of elk. They are less vocal, found in smaller bands, and more rugged terrain. Another is the over calling by hunters. Elk are starting to wise up and shut up. Yet another is the proliferation of off road vehicular recreation. ATVs, jeep trails, etc. all impact the habits of elk and mule deer.
Don't get me wrong. I am 100% FOR hunting. 100% for controlling predator numbers.
But Smithhammer said it well when he said "Personally, give me real wild habitat that has healthy levels of both game and predators, doing what they're supposed to do."
My opinion is now that we are managing the wolves and they know they are hunted sightings have become less which has relieved pressure on the Elk where I hunt them.
Most hunters only range a few miles at most from the trail head and the wolves seem to be farther back.This buffer zone has started to hold Elk again,that's what I have experienced in my area.
Smithhammer and elk ninja spoke better than I can type. One thing I constantly hear is that wolves have "caused" the decline in the elk herds in the Selway/Lochsa area in central Idaho. I have hunted/lived in the area long before and since the wolves. What people forget is the winter of 96 is what wipped out the elk in the area, not the wolves. If you look at the numbers the elk herd declined by 75% in one winter (not 100% sure of the numbers, but if memory serves me it went from 16,000 to 4,000).
This also coincides with the "reintroduction" of wolves to the area. Now, I'm not saying that the presence of wolves have not been a major contributor in the population not recovering...but you also have to throw into that pot the change in the habitat. The fires of the early 1900's and mid 1900's that created all the brushfields that provided the elk with excellent habitat have grown over and with the fire suppression that has reigned supreme there simply isn't the quality habitat available to support the huges numbers of the early 1990's.
I guess what I'm getting at is there are many factors that are contributing to the decline in elk numbers that exist in some areas of the state. Are wolf numbers too high in some locations...absolutely. Do wolf numbers need to be regulated like any other large predator...absolutely. I actively pursue and hunt wolves, but I also kinda like hearing one howl when I'm settling into a sleeping bag in the backcountry.
Just my opinion.
Travis
I think the guy just wanted to know if he could get an over conter tag and find public land and enjoy a do it yourself hunt. But...
Yeah, we got wolves here, but the hunting's still pretty good, 5 types of grouse, 4 types of rabbits, quail, chuckar, pheasant, geese, ducks turkeys, 2 types of deer, Moose, elk, pronghorn, bighorn mtn.goat, bear,coyote, badgers, foxes, varmits, and wolves. Yes, you can hunt them too.
Don't forget to bring a flyrod! Snake River in ID has some awesome fly fishing!
Oh heck yes! I forgot to even mention the trout fishing. I plan on going back to the McCall Zone and just backpack from one lake to another with a flyrod :) There's grouse too. And those tags are cheaper.
QuoteOriginally posted by John Scifres:
I plan on going back to the McCall Zone and just backpack from one lake to another with a flyrod :) There's grouse too. And those tags are cheaper.
That would be a great trip. Between the fishing and the hunting, there wouldn't be enough hours in the day!
When game animal management becomes relegated (due to federal mandate)to an unmanaged top level predator that hunts without season or bag limit, pressures elk enough to cause abortion of calves (future elk), and also cause loss of winter body fat from this pressure you have lost much of your management control. You can see this in several areas of central Idaho. In my opinion, this pandoras box that has been opened would have been better left shut.
With that said, state game agencies have been saddled with this situation and, really, not been allowed to deal with it as they would like or as I believe they should have the right to. The fact of the matter is the less non-resident elk hunters come the less dollars come in for the management of game and nongame species in the state. Now, with wolves as a convenient means to attain a hunter-free end, the antis have what they need to suppress our hunting heritage.
We must be careful, very careful.
Now, Idaho is a wonderful place to hunt, with many opportunities at several game species and all the public land you like to roam as you wish. It really is one of my favorite places. If that's what you're after in an elk hunt, that's great. However, if I was going to travel half way around the world to hunt elk, I'd go to a place with higher densities.
Matt
QuoteOriginally posted by Mike Mecredy:
I think the guy just wanted to know if he could get an over conter tag and find public land and enjoy a do it yourself hunt. But...
Yeah, we got wolves here, but the hunting's still pretty good, 5 types of grouse, 4 types of rabbits, quail, chuckar, pheasant, geese, ducks turkeys, 2 types of deer, Moose, elk, pronghorn, bighorn mtn.goat, bear,coyote, badgers, foxes, varmits, and wolves. Yes, you can hunt them too.
Not to beat a dead horse, but there are lots of places in the rockies with no wolves and a struggling elk pop. In contrast, yellowstone has a bunch of wolves and a huge elk pop. It's a lot more complicated than "wolves eat all the elk."
Things seem to have gotten of track here. The simple answer is yes you can. I would suggest visiting Idaho fish and game website and use the hunt planner it is a great tool.
Wow Im glad you brought this up, Ive been looking into Idaho hunting as well. Are the deer tags either species or does it vary by region. I keep hearing about the under hunted white tails out there.
Izzy, you can buy an either species tag or a white tail specific tag. The gender and/or antler points vary with the unit and season however. We certainly don't have the densities of white tails that the Midwest and East have, but there are some brutes around, especially in the northern part of the state. Check the regs for sure, but most of the OTC deer tags I believe are good for the whole state...
There are lots of whitetails up here in the northern part of the state. How they compare with densities back in the Midwest I can't say. The month of September is set aside for bowhunting only, and you can choose a tag that allows either mule or whitetail. This will be the best opportunity for hunting deer that aren't spooked from being shot at with rifles, but most whitetail buck hunting savvy revolves around rut patterns, so that won't work in September.
Whereas there is plenty of public land available on which to hunt, some of the very best habitat that supports the biggest deer is private farmland. Probably the biggest difference between here and what I read about in the Midwest is that rifle season begins October 10 and runs through most of November, including the rut. Once rifle season starts the big bucks go nocturnal except for when they get careless during the rut. It takes some serious time and scouting to get yourself withing bow range.
There is also a late December archery hunt in a couple of areas of the state and if the weather cooperates they can be good.
The wolves don't seem to have much effect on the deer, focusing more on elk and moose. There are still plenty of elk around, but the thing I have noticed here in the Grangeville area is that lots of elk have moved from remote, primitive back country locations closer to populated areas where they seem to feel safer from wolf predation. It used to be the farther a bowhunter got into the remote wilderness the better the elk hunting would be. Now you can often find more elk on private land closer to human habitation.
It is also true that the habitat in the back country needs some help from fires or timber harvesting, neither of which has been happening in sufficient enough volume to accomplish the purpose. It is a complex issue that doesn't have a simple answer. Wolves have not decimated the elk herds in quite the way that was once predicted, but they have definitely changed the dynamic of bow-hunting for elk.
The short answer to the original question is that, yes, there is still plenty of good public land hunting, but it is not as easy as it was 15 or 20 years ago and you definitely need to allow plenty of time for your hunt.
JUST SO EVERONE KNOWS. If you ever want to hunt Mule deer in Units 55 or 54, those are over the counter tag for archery but draw only for rifle. I live very close to them and if you want to hunt there I can show you where.
gringol...i dont know where you got your info about elk #'s and wolves in the rockies and yellow stone but i think you should check it out a little closer...
QuoteOriginally posted by durp:
gringol...i dont know where you got your info about elk #'s and wolves in the rockies and yellow stone but i think you should check it out a little closer...
Durp, wolves certainly have an effect, but there are lots of moving parts in an ecosystem and wolves can't be blamed for all problems with the elk pop. In ID the winter of 97 killed 40% of Idaho's elk. I lived in eastern wa at the time and it was a brutal winter. Idaho fish and game studied it and said as much. Of course, there are plenty of studies on both sides of the issue, which is exactly the point. It's complicated.
Since the wolf reintroduction, elk numbers are down, they were down after the harsh winter too, but the reintroduction hindered the rebound they should have had. But they are still out there, you just have to hunt harder now than you used to. I don't elk hunt anymore, but I know plenty of bowhunters that still get an elk.
Mule deer are pretty stable, they weren't effect as bad as elk I guess. I think wolves like elk better or somthing, maybe they're easier to catch.