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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Steve O on December 28, 2011, 09:27:00 PM

Title: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 28, 2011, 09:27:00 PM
I have not made up any wood arrows in at least 20 years.  Back then I used all Bohning stuff.  I really don't want to restock all that stuff.

I have seen some real nice "stained" crown dips in many different colors.  You can still see the wood grain, but you have some color and contrast.  What do you guys use for a crown stain like that?  

I'd like to do a white stained crown as well.  What are you using for that?
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Grey Taylor on December 28, 2011, 09:54:00 PM
I primarily use commercial water-base wood stain, analine dye, and Rit dye mixed with denatured alchol.
For a white stain find some whitewash pickling stain. It's essentially a white stain: colors the the wood white but you can still see the wood grain. It's a very cool effect and not many people use it.

Guy
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: huntingarcher on December 28, 2011, 09:59:00 PM
For different colors I use spray paint.I spray it on let it dry,then take steel wool and take off as much as needed to make it light or dark.Then crest and seal with either spray or wipe on poly.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 28, 2011, 10:34:00 PM
Thanks.  Any other tips?
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Shakes.602 on December 28, 2011, 10:38:00 PM
Personally I use MinWax Stains, Dark Up Top, and Light on the Shaft. Or whatever You prefer. No Muss, No Fuss. Seperated with Masking tape and I usually Crest where the Stain Line is.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 28, 2011, 10:42:00 PM
I have made weathered wood (think gray barn siding) by mixing water and baking soda then liberally applying it to the wood and letting sit in the sunlight.  2 coats is usually sufficient.  Check out the picture frame over my stairwell Saturday when your over.  It was done that way.

I'm curently trying some of the Old Masters white pickling stain on doug fir cut offs, and I'm not to satisfied with the results.  Works awesome on oak doors, but not fir shafts in my opinion.  

I don't care for water based stains to much.  with the finish I put on, it allows the water base stain to run. It can be done, but it requires some thought.  

I have done painted crowns, but being a carpenter, I love seeing the wood grains, so the majority of my arrows are all stain.  

In my opinion, Minwax ebony stain on doug fir is the prettiest looking stain.  It would look awesome with the other color you picked (they inspired me to open the doors to the Motor City Machete shop tonight), but it would distract from the footings on them.  I will continue tinkering with the pickling stain tomorrow, and also talk with one of our painters too.

Could just keep it natural too?  I will do one with 1/2 pecan and 1/2 bare tomorrow evening.  Maybe with some of that "special paint" used to separate them, it would all flow together.  The boys (yes I was one of them too)went down there tonight with the night vision goggles and loved the way the paint looked.    :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: steadman on December 28, 2011, 11:13:00 PM
I'm doing some natural stain crowns right now. I will try to get pics up early tom. I like natural too.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 29, 2011, 06:25:00 AM
Pics would be awesome Ryan, thanks.  If anybody has pics of a white stained crown dip, please post along with what you used.

Thanks all.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Shortlongbow on December 29, 2011, 08:06:00 AM
Like Shakes I like Minwax stains. Usually with a darker crown stain and a simple crest where the two colors of stain meet. Haven't tried any white stain. The rit dye in denatured alcohol works good too.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Bigriver on December 29, 2011, 08:47:00 AM
Steve, no pics but if you use any type of white stain, make sure the finish is water white(clear). If not, you will find out that some finishes have amber hues & will change the white to green or different shades of yellow-ish white. Water based finishes are the clearest, but then you have to make sure the stain is very dry(white stain takes longer to dry) & what to put the feathers on with. If you use tape then no problem.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Pat B on December 29, 2011, 09:13:00 AM
These cedars were crowned with Krylon spray paint...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/spinetester005.jpg)

(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/spinetester006.jpg)

..and these tapered ash arrows were crowned with Rit dye in alcohol and the rest of the shaft was stained with finely ground charcoal and denatured alcohol...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/taperedasharrows003.jpg)

(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/taperedasharrows002.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: longbowray on December 29, 2011, 10:15:00 AM
Well all I use now is dye and I just have one dip tube with gasket dip clear .
(http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g308/deanfamilyalbum/49665030.jpg)
(http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g308/deanfamilyalbum/bf303bc6.jpg)
And I mix it in a glass jar so that next time I can have the same color . I make it a qt. at a time .
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Paul Mattson on December 29, 2011, 10:33:00 AM
I have been using the cheap craft paint from Walmart for all of my wood arrows for years.  They have every color you can think of from earth tones to the brightest colors.  Thin with water to make a stain or simply brush it on to cover the grain.  I have also used it in an airbrush.  


(http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e358/BadgerArrow/_B150345.jpg)

(http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e358/BadgerArrow/_1230877.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: steadman on December 29, 2011, 10:45:00 AM
(http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h160/steadman_2006/arrow.jpg)

Here is the new set. I'm going to foot them with ebony later. Have fun Steve. Hope you draw this year  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Gator1 on December 29, 2011, 06:40:00 PM
Some Beauties here....

gotta love them woods...
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 29, 2011, 06:49:00 PM
You guys do some GREAT work!

Ryan, those are so classy now I need to learn how to splice! I may have to rethink this crown.  I have a stain very close to that of yours on the main portion of the shaft and they are footed with African Blackwood.

Going to have to look up that spliced along...
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 29, 2011, 07:18:00 PM
Well Steve, I played around with it this afternoon, and after thinning down some Killz primer with water and wiping it on, I let it dry and then dipped it just to see what it would look like.  If you are looking for a translucent white, you will be happy.  Maybe 2 coats of "Killz stain" would give a deeper look, but the grain really stands out in it (douglas fir in particular), wait till you see the set I did up last night.  I did the first dip tonight and they are simply amazing.  Ready to crest now then "Turn out the light"  :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Tree Killer on December 29, 2011, 07:37:00 PM
These are some Surewood Hemlock shafts I stained the crown on. Wife really likes this look! They're now in the possession of K.S.Trapper.     :thumbsup:

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v117/treekiller/bows%20and%20arrows/earth-tone-arrows.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Tree Killer on December 29, 2011, 07:45:00 PM
double post!      :banghead:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: steadman on December 29, 2011, 08:13:00 PM
Those are nice Ron  :thumbsup:  Thanks for the comment Steve. Good luck on your arrow build!
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Gator1 on December 29, 2011, 08:18:00 PM
Nothin like good wood.....  :saywhat:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 29, 2011, 08:31:00 PM
Gator, you crack me up    :laughing:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: The Whittler on December 29, 2011, 08:46:00 PM
You can use a stain or use water base paint and cut it half with water. Lightly rub it on to see the grain.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Autumnarcher on December 30, 2011, 09:00:00 AM
Steve, if youre looking for really vibrant color, aniline dyes are the ticket. Some are water soluble, some are mixed with denatured alcohol. Many colors available, both in wood colors or primary colors.

If you want a painted crown dip, I quit using Bohning paints years ago. Tired of air bubbles, dip tubes etc. I tape them off, spray a coat of primer, then to coat with whatever color I want, then clear coat over top of that. Works better, far cheaper to but spray paint than Bohning paint, and you dont have to but a bunch just to fil a dip tube.

A light sanding with some steel wool in between coats smotths out any raised grain,allow a day or two to fully dry between coats. For cresting, I use Testers model paints, then clear coat over that with a coat of water based poly. Once that is dry, a couple more coats of either the Home Depot wood floor finish( cant remember the rand name of it, but its not minwax) or Ive used Minwax wipe on poly in a oil base,I think it has a better look than water based.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 30, 2011, 09:45:00 AM
The Home Depot product your talking about is Parks wood floor finish.  It is all I use as well.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 31, 2011, 01:12:00 PM
Killz 2 thinned with water and wiped on with a sponge gave an awesome look.  They just received their first dip of clear by Steve, and I think I just found a new product to add to the lineup.  What I like is that the grain shows thru but the white color is still there...in abundance.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: chad graham on December 31, 2011, 02:08:00 PM
(http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy138/chopperziggy/003-8.jpg)
(http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy138/chopperziggy/006-3.jpg)
i like spliced feathers too.
(http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy138/chopperziggy/004-6.jpg)
(http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy138/chopperziggy/001-10.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: 2treks on December 31, 2011, 03:40:00 PM
Nice Chad. Way to go on the splice. That is how I learned it 15 or more years ago.  Lots of work but not to hard once you get the hang of it.

Gator,be have buddy.  :saywhat:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: chad graham on December 31, 2011, 03:53:00 PM
thanks chuck,hope to see you at the bunny stomp or kazoo , have a good new year.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 31, 2011, 03:54:00 PM
I just got off the phone with Chad, and him explaining it seems not to difficult to do, and the look is so much better than a butt splice.  I'm gonna start the new year off tomorrow morning by making it my mission to learn how to do this.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: 2treks on December 31, 2011, 04:25:00 PM
Careful where you tread grasshopper, arrow making is addictive. OH! you already know that.
Geeeze what am I saying.
Tear it up Mike, I will be needing some arrows soon.   :p  
and I am sure you will figure it out just fine.
I will be at both Chad

HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 31, 2011, 04:29:00 PM
Couldn't wait till tomorrow.  Just went to the shop and figured it out.  So easy a Vines could do it!!!  I will email pics to someone who can post it for me.  I don't know how to do it from an iPod yet.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on December 31, 2011, 04:35:00 PM
Brother, you have got to clean the lens on that camera...


(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/812e5322.jpg)


Heading out now.  Happy New Year to everyone!
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 31, 2011, 04:38:00 PM
It's the shop, not the lens.     :biglaugh:
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: chad graham on December 31, 2011, 04:51:00 PM
glad you got it mike,thats something your kids can even help you with and you will have them done in no time.looking forward to seeing the finished arrows.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on December 31, 2011, 04:54:00 PM
Thank you For giving a few minutes of your time.  I really liked hearing about the cutthroat you caught.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: 2treks on December 31, 2011, 05:05:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by Mike Vines:
Thank you For giving a few minutes of your time.  I really liked hearing about the cutthroat you caught.
Who caught a cutthroat and where? Chad?


Nice job on the splice by the way
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: chad graham on December 31, 2011, 05:08:00 PM
no problem im happy i could help you out!have a good and safe new year and i will see you in kalamazoo.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on January 22, 2012, 09:30:00 PM
Well, this has been a ton of fun and I have learned a lot from Mike.  I think they are pretty good for my first attempt!

The diluted Kilz is just the look I wanted:

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220303.jpg)


The shafts are Douglas Fir footed with African Blackwood.  I made them to match my Ebony and Myrtle TallTines longbow to kill a big black bear up at Stickflingers this spring.  With that in mind, I still have not decided on the 4 Fletch pattern that will steer theses babies.  What do you guys think?

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220308.jpg)

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220307.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on January 22, 2012, 09:34:00 PM
I really like the spliced feather for looks, but I know the Scollick cut banana will give me the most broadhead control.

What do you guys think?

 (http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220305.jpg)

 (http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220306.jpg)

 (http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220304.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Duckbutt on January 22, 2012, 09:35:00 PM
Spliced Turks all the way!
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on January 22, 2012, 09:36:00 PM
AND...

I should not have any problem finding them after dark!

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220307.jpg)
 (http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/osminski/Post%20pics/P1220310.jpg)
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: magnus on January 22, 2012, 09:39:00 PM
Great job Steve. I'm partial to the ones in the middle.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: wooddamon1 on January 22, 2012, 09:51:00 PM
Yup, spliced turkey! Those are sweet!
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on January 23, 2012, 07:43:00 AM
Those things just kept amazing me everytime I would see them.  That cresting just takes them over the top.  I'm partial to the spliced look myself, but you are correct about the Scollick cut.  Plenty of steering and you will deffinately be able to see those in flight.

You did great, and your correct.  The Diluted Kills primer was the perfect finish for the look you were trying to achieve.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: wvtradbow on January 23, 2012, 08:40:00 AM
I never get enough of these arrow post,just when I thought I've seen it all,here comes the diluted Kills Primer...GREAT Job Steve O
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Dirtybird on January 23, 2012, 10:25:00 AM
Great looking arrows, tough choice.  I would go with what flys the best.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Ray Lyon on January 23, 2012, 01:59:00 PM
Steve,

Great job and welcome back to wood arrows (I just came back after a 7 year sabatical this fall).  I'm partial to the middle combination with the splice. I've always used three fletch and often would use one white cock feather and two graybarred turkey feathers with a 1 inch white splice on the back and it would be easy to follow flight with.  For my last Michigan bear I used yellow and orange fletching and yellow cap.  That shows up nicely right before zipping through a critter.  I used to use Bohning years ago too, but everything is stain and dye now.  I'm partial to yellow caps when I use them, but many times it's just fletch with a stained shaft.  

So what's going on the business end of those bad boys for bears???
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on January 23, 2012, 03:55:00 PM
Ray, probably a mish mash of Snuffers, Woodmen Elites and Abowyer Brown Bears.  Like Dave said, whatever shoots best.  I have to pick up an assortment of field points at Kalamazoo this weekend and then I can start shooting these.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Ray Lyon on January 23, 2012, 04:18:00 PM
OK, you got me daydreaming of one of Ron LaClairs bear roasts done in a cast iron Dutch Oven over the campfire. It's a culinary delight.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Steve O on January 23, 2012, 05:48:00 PM
I made a dutch oven bear pot roast for the Michigan Longbow hunt boys in October.  It was one of my top 10 meals ALL TIME!  And I have eaten at some of the finest restaurants in the world...

Come on spring!
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Mike Vines on January 23, 2012, 06:36:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve O:
I made a dutch oven bear pot roast for the Michigan Longbow hunt boys in October.  It was one of my top 10 meals ALL TIME!  And I have eaten at some of the finest restaurants in the world...

Come on spring!
That was honestly THE BEST roast (of ANY animal) I have ever had the pleasure of eating.  I have tried a few times since to duplicate it, but I think you purposely left an ingredient or 2 off the receipe so I couldn't match it Steve.
Title: Re: Crown Dip question
Post by: Ray Lyon on January 23, 2012, 06:47:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by Mike Vines:
 
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve O:
I made a dutch oven bear pot roast for the Michigan Longbow hunt boys in October.  It was one of my top 10 meals ALL TIME!  And I have eaten at some of the finest restaurants in the world...

Come on spring!
That was honestly THE BEST roast (of ANY animal) I have ever had the pleasure of eating.  I have tried a few times since to duplicate it, but I think you purposely left an ingredient or 2 off the receipe so I couldn't match it Steve. [/b]
Mike, all the best cooks don't use a recipe. You can't blame the chef for purposely forgetting something he didn't write down in the first place.  :biglaugh: