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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: lunchbucket on December 21, 2011, 11:59:00 PM

Title: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: lunchbucket on December 21, 2011, 11:59:00 PM
I was at the bow shop the other day and a fellow had a longbow.He was kind enough to let me shoot it and it was a joy to shoot.I noticed I was shooting good groups with it but they were to the left about a 1 foot.Could someone explain to a rookie why this happens?
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Looper on December 22, 2011, 12:04:00 AM
Probably the difference in center cut.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Elkchaser on December 22, 2011, 12:12:00 AM
I would agree with Looper. If your recurve is similar poundage to the longbow and you were using your arrows from the recurve, they may be a little too stiff in spine when shooting from the longbow.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: fireball31 on December 22, 2011, 12:17:00 AM
I found that with a recurve I shoot with a completely straight grip. I like high wristed recurves and I use what I believe is referred to as an asbell grip. When I shoot my hill style longbow I use a slightly bent elbow. What I found myself doing until I got used to the longbow was upon release I was straightening my arm causing me to push arrows left. Similar to peeking. I think this was because I made a 15lb weight jump to the longbow.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: 30coupe on December 22, 2011, 12:26:00 AM
fireball31

You need to keep in mind also that you will lose some draw length when you switch to the low wrist grip on the longbow in addition to what you will lose with the bent elbow. I find that I lose about an inch. This will tend to make your arrows spine stiffer. If you are indeed pushing as well, your arrows have little choice but to go left.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: wildgame on December 22, 2011, 12:38:00 AM
Was it a thunder child? I think it was my bow you were shooting. I do the same when I shoot a recurve except to the right. I'm pretty sure it's the center cut of the riser that makes me shoot that way. Brad
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: fireball31 on December 22, 2011, 01:56:00 AM
30 coupe. I think it had more to do with the fact that at the time I jumped up in weight to much. 50lbs to 65 when I had only been shooting for a short time. I have noticed the draw length change as well though. I draw closer to 30" with a recurve and 29 with my longbow. There were a multitude of form issues that i had. Short draw, snap shooting, then holding till I shook, In the end it would be hard to draw any conclusions for the mess that was my form until I started paying attention to it. I followed the grip it and rip it philosophy. Now I have a very deliberate shot sequence.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: lunchbucket on December 22, 2011, 06:11:00 AM
Yes it was wildgame,and it was o joy to shoot.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Red Beastmaster on December 22, 2011, 08:17:00 AM
I go through the same thing when I switch back and forth. After several shots my brain is rebooted and I'm good to go.

The relationship of the arrow, bow hand, and eye can change from bow to bow. The ability of the mind to compensate quickly is a pretty cool thing.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Swamp Yankee on December 22, 2011, 09:08:00 AM
Could be a thousand reasons for it; bottom line is every bow may very well shoot differently for you.  If you cant the bow, simply having the arrow lower and closer to your hand will tend to make you to hit left of where you would with a higher shelf.  Different arrow tune, nock to string fit..all play a role.  As Red Beastmaster noted, it's just a matter of recalibrating the computer between your ears whenever you change anything.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Rob DiStefano on December 22, 2011, 09:31:00 AM
more important than the answer, please go fix yer topic title - it don't make no sense.   :)
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Friend on December 22, 2011, 09:40:00 AM
I opened this thread since I was curiuos as to what the actual question was.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: lunchbucket on December 22, 2011, 10:16:00 AM
I appoligize about the topic title Rob how do I fix that?
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: 30coupe on December 22, 2011, 10:31:00 AM
You can fix the title by hitting the edit post button at the top of the post (the one that looks like a pencil and paper).    :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Terry Green on December 22, 2011, 11:49:00 AM
They don't all do that...and they are not just longbows that do it....all depends on the bow, arrow and shooter.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: lunchbucket on December 22, 2011, 12:20:00 PM
Thanks alot for all the feedback,just a curious question from a learning archer.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Night Wing on December 22, 2011, 12:39:00 PM
I've only owned one longbow in my lifetime and it was a right handed 68" Belcher "Longhorn" hybrid longbow.

Every shooting session, the first arrow shot would always be 6" to the left. After a few more shots, the arrow would go where I was looking. But, in a hunting situation, the first shot is critical so I never took the longbow hunting.

I just never could get used to the grip.

I tried to correct the situation for two years. I could never correct the first shot problem so I sold the bow to Pinelander on here.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: randy grider on December 22, 2011, 02:18:00 PM
arrows spined too stiff.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: on December 22, 2011, 03:03:00 PM
There are lots of shooters that learn how a bow shoots and their own muscle memory 'knows' where their bow arm needs to point. With Hill style bows and even self bows, if the bow is canted and the proper arrows is used the arrow flies right where the arrow is pointed.  the problem comes when the shooters arm is not pointed at the target the same way the bow that they are used to makes them point. When I go to a recurve, the first thing I notice is that the arrow is not lined up right. If I do not notice this I shoot low and right with a canted bow.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Bjorn on December 22, 2011, 03:25:00 PM
It is called tuning and has little to do with the bow type.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: jsweka on December 22, 2011, 06:27:00 PM
I bacame primarily a longbow shooter a few years ago.  Every now and then when I break out my recurve, I shoot to the right.
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Ric O'Shay on December 23, 2011, 11:33:00 AM
lunchbucket -

I’ve watched this thread for a couple of days and hesitated to post. Mainly because most of the posts are correct in their own right, but never really answer the question. Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters? Given that the longbow is properly set up and the arrows are properly spined for the bow, in my humble opinion, it comes down to two things.

1. Sloppy form.
2. Improper sighting.

John Schulz stated it very succinctly in his book,”Hitting ‘em Like Howard Hill”.

   “Since an arrow basically flies up and to the left when it leaves the bow, it follows that up to a certain distance the bow hand in your sighting picture will be below and to the right of your target (if you are right handed). As you increase your distance from the target, you are coming to the apex or top of your arrow trajectory. Thus, you will eventually be ‘point on’.”

   “Learning the proper form is the basis of all your success. Learn it right, practice it thoroughly, and it will produce results.”

All of John’s instruction is directed at shooting the Hill style longbow. Not recurves. Most all recurve arrow shelves are cut either to or most frequently, cut past the center of the riser. Thus reducing the arrow paradox or the necessity of the arrow bending around the bow riser. That’s why Black Widow says you can shoot arrows spined 15 to 20 pounds heavier than the bows draw weight. The arrow goes straight through from the string to the riser side plate and does not have to bend or flex around the riser.

My recommendation - make certain your bow is properly tuned and you are getting good arrow flight. Work on the Hill style form, get it right and then learn how to properly sight the longbow when shooting.  Form first, then learn sighting. It won’t come easy, but then nothing worth it’s salt is ever easy.

Danny
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: frassettor on December 23, 2011, 11:46:00 AM
Mine do that as well. My mind is used to the longbows and when I pick up my recurve it's always left. After a few shots my mind makes the nessassary adjustments. My arrows are perfect for both my longbows and recurve, so it's not that
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Mike Mecredy on December 23, 2011, 12:06:00 PM
I'll bet the recurve you shoot is center cut, and the longbow wasn't, using a longbow you can change how you shot but using lower spined arrows, or by canting the bow.

By the design of many longbows you can control a lot by the amount you cant the bow.  I shoot both recurves and longbows quite often and when I use the longbow, center shot, short of center, or even off my hand with not shelf at all, I naturally just seem to cant the bow.  I don't with a recurve, I keep those as verticle as I can.

Another thing I've noticed it seems easier for a shooter that shoots a longbow to adapt to a recurve than a recurve shooter to adapt to a longbow.

-Mike
Title: Re: Why do longbows shoot to the left for recurve shooters?
Post by: Red Beastmaster on December 23, 2011, 01:22:00 PM
I have perfectly tuned equipment, a good release, good form and sighting, and have been at this for quite awhile. I know what I am doing.

Still, there is some instinctive adaption that I go through when I switch bows, especially with radically different grip types.

With me personally it is a mechanical allignment issue between arrow, hand, wrist/forearm, and eye. Sometimes it only takes a few shots, sometimes a few dozen, but I quickly make the needed adjustments without consciously thinking about it.

Others may have different experiences but this is how it works for me.