I am struggling with a decision I suspect many of you on this forum have experienced. By manner of background facts, I have exclusively shot carbon arrows since converting to traditional archery in about 2000. I appreciate the sheer toughness of the carbons, along with my ability to tune them. However, I am now seriously considering a switch to wood arrows.
What I am primarily concerned about is the "toughness" of the shafts when stump shooting or tramping around in the mountains. I fully understand some extra degree of care with wood shafts because they are... well, wood. However, are wood arrows a pain to keep straight under actual "boots on the ground" hunting situations with changing temperatures, rain and all the rest?
If you made the switch to wood and feel as though you would never look back, then why?
The next and final question involves arrowsmiths. Who out there makes great custom wood arrows? Any suggestions on a particular type of wood?
Thanks for your input.
I have been shooting wood for years, almost exclusively cedars. I have never had trouble with them as far as keeping them straight, and I have arrows that have been stump shooting for hundreds, if not thousands, of times.
I am in the process of working up some chundoo (lodgepole pine) shafts that I got through TG classifieds. They look like great shafts, and are supposed to be tougher than cedar, so I will soon find out.
I have no plans to shoot anything but wood; they work, and have been taking game for thousands of years.
Carbons are no doubt more consistent than wood, but for the real world in hunting conditions, wood will get the job done time after time.
As far as arrowsmiths, I do my own, but I know when I was in the Raptor Archery shop a couple of years ago, he had some really nice arrows made up, and just last week I was in Rocky Mt. Specialties in Denver, and they make some fine looking woodies, too.
Why not shoot both? Wood is surely my favorite but carbon is fine too. I hunt with both in my quiver all of the time and wouldnt give up either. I like carbon for stumping a little better because there no emotional attachment or time invested in creating them so if I break or lose one I dont sweat it although they rarely break if you arent shooting rocks. I tend to treat woodies like artwork and put a lot of time into cresting and splicing,
I have never used carbon and have been a wood user for all but a few years (I tried aluminum). My favorite shooting is stump shooting. In an afternoon I may blow up four or five arrows - but I don't baby them and take any shot that catches my fancy. Some days are charmed, or the stumps soft, and I don't break any. Douglas fir is a tad more rugged than cedar, but maybe only 20% more so. The tips don't tend to snap as often from glancing hits with blunts.
Shooting with carbon shooters on similar shots they may break one or two to my five, so certainly carbon has it in durability.
On the other hand, I consider arrow making an enjoyable hobby and keep busy putting together three dozen shafts on a crummy winter weekend, so it is a good match.
Truly, if I was buying finished shafts I would probably have tried carbon by now. Since I make my own I use the same shafts/arrows for deer, target, stumps, small game, etc. For me that helps immensely. My mentor used to scold me for pulling out a crummy arrow for a risky shot - like at a styrofoam rabbit on a stone wall. He'd say you want your best arrow so it focuses your mind on being successful. Instead of figuring I'll likely miss and ruin the arrow. Good philosophy.
Started with wood 52 years ago... tried aluminum and carbon.. still shooting wood..
Learn to build your own, it's very rewarding.. and not that difficult.. Cedar or Douglas Fir are my two choices for material..
If I can help pm me and I'll get you my phone number..
You can only answer your questions by trying them. I find myself, at times, wanting to know if one arrow shaft or another would be of any particular benefit than the carbons I am now shooting. But, when I shoot and the arrows go where I want, and game goes down in sight, I realize that I have achieved what I wanted....a set up that works well for me so there is really no reason to change. Just from a $$$ stand point I find carbons to be the best investment.
I have shot just about everything, including wood, fiberglass, aluminum, carbon, kevlar, and combinations of some of them, but carbon fiber based arrows are my favorites. Regardless of which is the "best" material for arrows, wood is definitely very good and adds a warmer, more natural element that just feels good. I like Izzy's idea of keeping carbon shaft arrows in your quiver for the purpose of practicality, and then having the woodies for the nostalgic aspect of the sport. The main thing is to give yourself the most joy in your shooting, and wood arrows might be just the thing to accomplish that for you.
Allan
I shoot wood ,alum. and carbon. I like wood the best just for the nostalgia factor...lol! I have cedar arrows that I got in 1996 that I still hunt with [don't get many shots] and one of them I have a rubber blunt on I have stump shot for hundreds of shots.......try it , you may like it!
Snag at Wilderness Arrows does a great job. He uses Surewood Doug Fir-it is the best there is!
Izzy makes a good point. Wood arrows are another part of traditional archery that may enhance your enjoyment of the sport. Getting quality shafts from an accomplished arrowsmith will help you decide whether they are something you want to pursue. The next step would be to start building them yourself. You would need a spine tester, a taper tool (recommend the Wood Chuck if using Fir shafting) a fletching jig and a grain scale. These tools enable you to have the same capability as an arrowsmith but require an investment of $$. Quality shaft suppliers will supply you shafts in a given spine and weight range which helps by eliminating the spine tester and the grain scale but you do give up control of totally matched arrows which may or may not be important to you. Building woods that all spine the same and are within a total 5 grain spread is part of the enjoyment but not necessary for good performing woods.
Go with a good arrowsmith first. If you like them you can start down the slippery slope of learning to make the same quality arrows yourself.
Enjoy the journey.
Wood is a great choice, as is carbon. I still shoot both. If you want to try wood you should definitely do so, but make them up yourself. the cost of a hand crafted dozen is high now a days and for the cost of than wipe on with a lint free rag, use a lil 0000 steelwool between coats and let dry good between coats. Shafts cut to length and tapered can be had for $40 or even less and some feathers and nocks you are good to go, as ong as ya have a fletching jig. If you do you can make your own dozen for leass than $60 and if ya like it you can get more elaborate latter on. Shawn
Half the fun of shooting wood is making them yourself. Plently of "how to" threads on here. I used to use wood before the price jump on shafting. Now-a-days I can buy Gold Tip blems from Big Jim's at about the same price as good wooden shafts. But crafting wooden arrows is a great hobby after hunting season. Give it a try!
Check with Magnus. He is a sponsor on here and does the best work I have seen yet.
Keep shooting them while you learn to make cane arrows! (natures carbon) ;) They seem to fly good out of everything.
I switched from wood to carbon when I was shooting some maple shafts. One July day, (hot and muggy), and I was shooting crappy.
I tried some carbons that day and even though they weren't spined right they flew so much better! So I switched to carbons.
A few years ago I switched back to wood, specificly POC. They stay straight and fly great no matter what the weather. I choose my "rotten" stumps wisely as not all are as soft as they look due to breakage behind the head.
I recently tried the Internal Point Wieght Footing Jig from 3RA. I like the way it gives my arrows added wieght up front and they fly great. I need to experiment to see if they have increased durability. Either way I'm staying with wood especially with my selfbows.
Bona
If Silent Pond Shafts was still in business....I wouldn't be shooting aluminum or carbon. My arrow of choice from Mike was Barrel tapered ash.
Tough, strong, needed a tweaking now and then but flew straight. Mike would hand weigh and spine each doz for me and every animal I took were complete pass thru's at 20 yds and under and 3/4 penetration out to 35 yds.
Barrel tapered ash would be my choice....
Like Tom said try some cane or bamboo and make them yourself . They are more durable than cedar and just as much fun to make . Drew
Wow, thank you all for the excellent responses!
I would certainly love to try the arrows and make up my mind after doing so... however, a good set of matched woods from a custom shop appears to cost anywhere from $100.00 to more that $150.00 a dozen. OUCH. While I have spent that much on carbon shafting, I knew what I was getting in the bargain.
"Why not shoot both?"
X2
I'll add my $0.02.
I love wood for the enjoyment of it, lower cost (I make my own) and for me it makes me feel closer to the whole trad thing. I shoot wood more than carbon.
I also have lots of carbons and still use them, just not as often. I find that when I travel long distances to hunt with a friend or two I tend to use carbon simply because I don't have to worry about one of my buddies laying something on top of or against my woodies and giving them a set that I have to straighten. If I am by myself I choose wood. If I had to choose one for durability and consistency reasons I would have to choose carbon.
Like was said by many earlier, try them and decide for yourself... you might enjoy them!
Call John @ Twig Archery he has cundoo bought some tapered ones and they were straight and within 5 to 10 grains.Shoot nice and tuff.
My bad Chundoo
I shoot both but gravitate to wood. When cedar breaks there is a fine smell to intake. When carbon splits it's just the pits.
Spend $50 on a half dozen from Magnus. They will last longer than you think. When you do this you'll then know the quality of matched wood. You can then decide if you want to make your own stumpers etc....
They don't last too long if you are going stump shooting. Make your own it's not hard at all. I now only shoot carbons. If you shoot alot like every day stay with carbons. It is a lot cheaper. I use to make and sell a dozen years ago for $60.00 those same arrows today would sell for $150.00.
These arrows here are priceless.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/Cbireley/2coralsnakeskins-1.jpg)
Wood arrows can be repaired and toughened up using the arrow-fix tool. A 1.5" long "footing" behind the point made out of black locust makes a cedar arrow unbelievably impact tough.It is not the amount of hardness which makes the difference in the footing material, but the right combination of hardness and springiness.
Unless you want your arrows only plain, buying them from a reputable fletcher is the more economical way over time. Do yourself a favor and buy a test set before you buy your 1 or 2 dozens.
Dink's Feather Shop makes great quality arrows-very straight. Dewayne is a sponsor on this site.
I have been shooting the chundoos I recently got, and they fly great. I did manage to dead center a rock with one of them, and instead of breaking, the field point just got pushed back a bit on the shaft, so they are pretty tough. They don't smell good like cedar, though.
Wood is good. I like Douglas Fir shafts lately, but I never had a problem with Cedars.
DF is a little tougher though...
Tapered Cedar
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l502/MrDwood/DSCN1207.jpg)
Douglas Fir
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l502/MrDwood/DSCN1205.jpg)
Douglas Fir
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l502/MrDwood/DSCN1209.jpg)
Some Douglas Firs in process...
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l502/MrDwood/DSCN1220.jpg)
I shoot woods. I think carbons fly a bit better, but I shoot longbows and desire to shoot woods. I stump with them, I hunt with them. It jsut feels right to me. It feels traditional to me.
Bob.
I started out with wood because I wanted to make all my own stuff, and have shot aluminum before. I stick with wood because it works, works well, and is a blast to make.
I am going through the same process. But I'm pretty determined to make some wood arrows after the first of the year. I don't relish the thought of retuning my bow and rebuilding the strike plate build up, but maybe I won't have to. I just think if you're going to go through all the trouble of instinctive shooting you ought to at least have some wood arrows to shoot. I've refinished a lot of gun stocks, and I like working with wood. I'm kind of a consistency freak (a carryover from wheels) but I shoot so much now and my arrows get so torn up, I'm losing that bad habit. A little inconsistency isn't so bad ... it's freedom.
So. all you guys that shoot wood, If you had to buy your wood arrows would you still be shooting wood? Sounds to me all of you make your own. Sounds like Stick N Strings wants to buy his.
Craig, I'd shoot wood even if for some reason I couldn't make my own. I've seen some beautiful woods for sale and bought them at shoots and K-zoo even though I can make them myself.
To me they are the prettiest, quietest choice and if I do my part they fly just as good as any other material.
Besides, who can argue with tens of thousands of years of history? :archer2:
I make my own and if I want fancy I get a hold of Snag at Wilderness
Arrows. :campfire:
I started out buying a half dozen cedars off the big auction site. It was $40 something for the 6 and they were well made. I then bought a dozen of the no frills woodies from 3Rivers. Decent shafts and they lasted a while except for the 1 that was split from the start. They are $80 a dozen now. I then bought a bunch of different type shafts off Bill Carlsen and have been having fun for a while with them. Still have a bunch!
Wood shafts are fun, and they don't have to be expensive. I like the pretty arrows, but you can put a few coats on them fletch and go if you want.
I'm no arrow snob though. I shoot wood, carbon, and aluminum. I still like a freshly broken crimson wooden shaft! Good times there.
They really aren't a pain to keep straight. Birch for me was the hardest, but man what a hard hitting arrow and they last. Cedar, chundoo, sitka spruce are pretty easy maintenance I thought. I really don't have a favorite between the 3.
They don't have to be fancy to work. These are chundoo I got from Bill.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/varmint101/101109018.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/varmint101/101109021.jpg)
One from the auction site.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/varmint101/LongbowDoeKill1021070001-1.jpg)
3rivers which is 4yrs old there and had been shot a bunch. It had been broken, but I shortened it and used it for small game. Worked!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v75/varmint101/recurvechipmunkimg1.jpg)
Mate, as for toughness when stump shooting, nothing carbon or aluminium can beat Douglas fir. Some of our termite mounds can get pretty tough, and are death on modern-material arrows; but the Douglas fir survives again and again and again.
Hunting with any arrow is fun and challenging; but when you walk-up to game you've downed with a wooden arrow, it is a really special feeling you get inside you.
I've been shooting traditional bows for 45 years now. I've shot wood aluminum and carbon arrows. Up until this fall, I've shot carbon arrows for my hunting for the last 8-9 years. In my opinion, you will not find a better (maybe equal) arrow made from an Easton Axis shaft with a brass insert properly matched to your bow.
That being said, I've been hunting with vintage Acme Premium shafting wood arrows, that I built myself, for this hunting season. I wanted to hunt with wood arrows again. Very good wood arrows will shoot as good as you can shoot. Good wood arrows are not cheaper than carbon. But that's ok to me, because I get enjoyment from them and I can't put a price tag on that.
I'd make the following suggestion. If money is an issue, hunt with carbon arrows and buy/make a set of inexpensive (not cheap) wood arrows to go roving, small game, stump shooting with. When I get down to 4-5 arrows from a dozen wood arrows because they've been broken by a deer or something else, I use them for practice arrows, stump shooting or early season 3-D shooting and save my Sunday best for serious practice and hunting.
Many people have said it before; shooting and building wood arrows is just plain fun and good for the soul.
Good luck with your decision.