Hey all,
First off I have never shot either of these bows and only seen a couple of Widows. As I nose through the forums I will occasionally run across pics of a Kwyk Styk. I have all kinds of pics of Widows on my hard drive, but I still enjoy seeing them in threads when people get new ones.
These Kwyk Styks are really nice though. Every comment I have ever read about them is great.
Since both of them have a similar style I thought I would ask which one you all prefer or like the most. Does one out shoot the other? If given the choice, which one would you take?
I know there are other bows that are of the same style and feel free to add those to the mix too. Of course, include pix as everyone enjoys seeing pics of beautiful bows.
Which one for you?
Thanks
Nalajr
Widow for me - I've bought and sold several and always wind up back at widow. Here's a PCH in the stand waiting for some action. It has diamondback skins that match nicely.
I have a BW PCHX 50@28 58" and a PTFX 50@28 60" and they are great bows. I think the PCH is very smooth because of the shorter riser and more longer working limbs. I have never shot a Kwyk Styk but I'm sure they are nice bows. I (like Nala) have bought and sold a lot of bows and after I bought the Widows I am done.
Kwyk Styk, I have owned several of both and as far as performance and looks the KS is has it all over the Widows. Widows are average performers at best and they have a tendency to be loud(easy to quiet but still loud)they all look the same unless you get an exotic or ask for no phenolic, stuff like that. Don't get me wrong the Widow folks are great to deal with and make a fine product, but if you want a great performer and a smooth, quiet, easy shooter, go with the KS. Shawn
Average performers at best? Really. Its strange bowreports has them within a few fps of the fastest bows made and that's with a inch plus higher brace height.
You also may want to consider the new Kempf Raven. Accepts both longbow and recurve limbs, you can get Static limb tips, same as Kwyk Styk. I know TG'ers Sergio Venneri and Randy Jackson love the new Raven.
Average yes, my KS"s were several fps. faster ith same arrows as were most of my other bows RER, Robertson, and my Borders flat out smoke a widow. Great bows as I said but average performers, like Schaffers and many other great bows that are average performers, nothing wrong with average and I have owned at least 15 Widows. Shawn
You ask for opinions, so here goes. I would get a black widow. Never owned or shot a Kwyk Styk, can't comment on those. Black Widow makes a terrific bow, built extremely well, and the company is great to deal with. Also have no problem killin critters with my Black Widow. However you can tell by my signature, I may be biased. :bigsmyl:
Scott
Fastest bow to date tested by Blacky
Acs carbon extreme 200 fps with a 9 gpp arrow. The fastest
Average performer black widow. 195 fps with 9 gpp arrow.
So between there you have your good performance bows?
I've bought and sold tons of bows on this and other sites over the years, mainly to see what I liked and what shot best for me. Without question the Widows are one of the best I've ever shot. The are rugged and hard hitting bows, both recurves and longbows alike. I currently shoot a PSAX and I wouldn't let her go for the world. I've heard some guys complain about Widows as being noisy. Well, in my opinion they just haven't taken the time to tune them properly. At the last Twin Oaks shoot here in Tennessee a fellow archer next to me stopped shooting, came up to me and told me that my bow was the quietest bow he never heard. There are several great bows out there and I definitely count the Widows among them! (http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/th_PB140105.jpg) (http://s530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/?action=view¤t=PB140105.jpg)
(http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/th_PB120087.jpg) (http://s530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/?action=view¤t=PB120087.jpg)
(http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/th_PB120079.jpg) (http://s530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/?action=view¤t=PB120079.jpg)
(http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/th_PB120075.jpg) (http://s530.photobucket.com/albums/dd342/EVANSON/?action=view¤t=PB120075.jpg)
I think both of these bows are above average,as I like the forward riser. The limb construction is the key with the standard recurve limbs versus the static limbs. I started my traditional shooting with the Black widow MAll . Loaned to me by a friend,but I now own a Kwyk Styk and enjoy it Very much. I like my Kwyk Styk. Maxx
Ive shot Alot of BW and own a KWYK STYK. That being said Jacks new Raven with static limbs is something else could be the best hunting bow for me ive ever had. The Ravin is going to be a killing machine. Joe Skipp is my Hero for Telling me about Jack Kempf.
Randy
Widows are Widows; either you like them or you don't. I to have found them to be average performers but, that being said I have never shot one that I didn't shoot well. I would love to try a Kwik Stick at some point but every time I see one for sale it's to heavy for me or short, or both. Over the last year I have shot my friends PCH and every time I do I hit where I want.......maybe I should grab one at some point. I had a Jack Kempf older one piece recurve a while back and it was a shooter. You have to try either one and make up your own mind!!
I get a kick out of hearing..."widows are average performers", or widows are loud followed up with any of the following:
But I never found one that didn't shoot well.
But their customer service is top shelf.
But the dozen or so I've shot all shot where I was looking.
But but..but...LOL...
If anybody here thinks 5 fps is going to make you a better archer then I've got a bridge with your name on it.
The best bow is the one you shoot well and have confidence in when you draw on a target. The service and support are timely and dependable and they answer the phone and email.
Very few peeps have a good enough release to see the difference in 5 FPS. And even if they could, what difference does it make if none of the above are taken into consideration.
dont discount the wildcat from hill country bows, bowyer roman hershberger, there is a thread on here titled "the one" that has pictures of mine on it and I am sold on the bow. It shoots where I look and is very fast. The workmanship is second to none as well and you could not ask for a better guy to deal with. I have not shot either the kwyk stik or a widow but love the forward riser design and I feel romans has the most grace and beauty of all those designs. JMO
I dream of owning a Quick Styk one day (and a Raven Styk...). Widows have never piqued my interest much, particularly when you look at the price tag and compare it to what else is out there. But, as with all of these types of threads, it's really about which one you shoot best.
When I threw in the But's on my post it was not to Bash a Black Widow. I just don't like a bow with a lot mass in the riser.......I had a SBS [short black stick] from Black Widow that I should have never sold, light in the hand and almost silent. I will agree the best bow is the one that pleases you and that you shoot well!!!! :thumbsup: :notworthy:
Amen!
I have had 5 Widows, and liked them all...
I would really like to try a KS though....I like the lack of noise, and efficiency of a good static tip bow.
Nala- This is ez to figure out. Buy the KS in the classifieds if it is within your specs. The price seems good but do your homework to see if it is OK and what you would want. They don't seem to come up for sale very often so I bet you could sell it fairly easy if you do not like it.
I would also "try before you buy a widow", then you can compare them together to see which one you like best. Then you can order a new widow, buy a used one here, keep or sell the KS.
BTW, I love my widow, but have never seen a KS.
Have fun, Brian
Randy; It's Joe's fault that i shoot jack's Bows also! LOL.
I've owned 9 Widows and currently a PCHV. They are shootin machines. I'M trying to buy a Kwik Styk right now if the feller would reply and tell me if its available
Never had the chance to shoot a kwik stick. I shoot habu bows...but if I were not shooting them...I'd be shooting widows. I just like that style of bow.
Widows are sometimes wrongly called too expensive, too loud, too ugly, and so forth, but AVERAGE speed? As far as expensive, there are a few others that cost as much or more. Loud? Yes some of the older designs took some experimenting to silence but the newer limbs are as quiet as any. As far as ugly, we all know beauty in in the eye of the beholder.
Some of us are never satisfied and are always buying/trading bows(like me) :) , looking for something better. Widows are known to hold their resale value better than most so that helps a lot when you get ready to get rid of it. ;)
Bill is right about the re-sale of a Widow. Price...he's right about that also. I can think of about 6 well known bows that are very desirable and all of them a more than a Black Widow.....and the wait is a lot longer, some are well over a year. Not sure what the wait is on a Kempf. Jack don't give his bows away either...LOL!
I have two Widows - they are not going anywhere.
Both are just so beautiful. I see a widow and want it. Then I see a KS and I want it.
I guess the solution is to make more money to support my bow addiction.
Nalajr
Heard a lot of good things of both. Managed to get a KS. Liked it a lot, placed order and waited in line for a year. Jack is currently making a Raven for me with both recurve and longbow limbs, follow by a KS next month.
My thought is I precious works done by the individual bowyers, especially for those hard to come by. BW are frequent shown on the classified but not the Kempf bows. You can always come to Blackwidow later.
Sergio, Yep Joe has a way doing that. Problem now is if Jack comes up with longbow limbs for the KWYK STYK.
Randy
I've owned... well I can't even really remember how many Widow Recurves... Don't personally care for the Widow Longbows.
Really like their T/D recurves, especially the SA/PSA version. They are super easy to shoot, very forgiving, take a bit to get quiet but doable. Not the fastest bow out there, but plenty quick enough. Heck their track record speaks for itself.
But, since I picked up my first Kwyk Styk I was sold. Best recurve I've ever shot. Fit me very well, quick, quiet, and have very similar manners to the Widow with the forward handle design. Now I have two and they are not going anywhere.
In the end, I don't think you can go wrong with either. I like the response above, try a used one of each. They resell quickly if they are not what you are looking for, and it is cheaper to get into a used one rather then dropping the dime on a new one of either.
You asked for a comparison from those who have had both... I have had both, and can incude a Habu Death Adder into the equation also.
Having owned 7 widows in the past including 4 with reverse mounted limbs, they were great shooters, stable, hit where I was looking. However, I could never be happy with the "Mass" and physical weight of the risers and found the performance less than anticipated..
I then went to a Habu "Death Adder", a 3 pc. with reverse mounted L/B limbs... It was an older, and now out of production bow.. It was light in weight [ way lighter than the widows] about the same performance wise, and with the skins it was wearing, I felt much prettier.
Eventually a 60" 58# Kwyk Styk with standard recurve limbs came available as a trade option for the Habu. :readit: :thumbsup:
Not to mention, I was extremely happy to pay the price, as I had been waiting for that particular bow to become available to me for some time. ;)
Bottom line.... all of those Widow's live at new addresses and have for some time... The Kwyk Styks have a permanent zip code of 98629 and don't plan on moving soon. :biglaugh:
The only thing which would change that would be if I start having additional health issues. :(
Gene
I just got a PSA V a few weeks ago, and I like it a lot! It seems quiet, dead in the hand, and shoot where I want! plus I always wanted one, I just like the look!
As for Jack's bows, I tryed puting my name on the list and contacted him a few time, talked to him once, and never herd of him after... so i don't think i'm on is waithing list, since it's been well over a year now... Maybe it didn't clic in between us!
i'm sure they are great bows!
As for the speed, I never put my bows true speed test... i think it's useless!! From all what I read about bows being tested, it falls all whitin a few fps, any where between 185 and 195, with the exceptions at 200...
Randy; jack is working on a KS longbow limb. I can hardly wait!
I have owned both. I had one of the nicest Widows PSAX on the planet. Felt Great and Shot even better. It was the envy of all the other Widow guys. I had many offers to buy it from me.
I got a Kwyk Styk................and then sold the Widow. Never looked back.
Kwyk Styk, by far, and I mean by far, is a better bow. Now, that is saying a lot because my Widow was Awesome.
My 2 cents.
Matt
That is an interesting point about the KS. All you ever see show up are the super short ones or the super heavy ones. You never see a "normal" one pop up.
If we have a bow we like better than any other, we should be able to talk about how great a bow it is without saying derogatory things about other bows. People that own those other bows want to defend them and these threads usually end up deleted which does nobody any good.
Just curious - in which ways are the Kwyk Styks better? So far I've read that Widows are "dead in the hand, great customer service, hit where you look, loud but can be quieted, quick, stable, great resale if you need to sell it" so what does the kwyk styk do differently? This isn't a defense of widow either, just wondering what the measures for people are. It seems like widows never win out in a comparison post...people say a bunch of good thing about them, and then say there are far better bows available.
I've shot both of them and decided to go with another jack Kempf bow. Good luck in your decision.
Shawn
I have 2 Widow recurves that I really like but would like to try a KS sometime.Only 2 I've ever been around were 'GURUS' lefties.
You can debate both these fine bows or any bows for that matter. The personal choice or decision comes down to Money and Time.
If your not willing to wait those 12 months for a Kempf bow then BW should be your choice. Dressing up any bow with fancy woods etc adds to the costs. An advantage BW has, you can test drive one of their bows. You have to rely on the word of Kempf owners to make a decision.
Honestly, flip a coin, either bow will serve you well on all your hunts.
For me the KS is truly hand made you can see it the way Jack finish the bow a little tweak a tweak there. I have never seen two KS look the same. For me side by side with a widow the KS is quieter, faster and very forgiving. Just saying for ME Jacks bows are the perfect hunting weapon. Not to mention Jack is one of the finest men i have ever talked too. I own and shoot 9 custom bows and own a widow and like it. But when i hunt i hunt with a KWYK STYK.
JMHO,
Randy
Is there a website for the KS bows? I'd like to look at them after reading this thread. Is he a sponsor here? Really like my Widow PSA and made in the US.
No website but you can find pics and info on Pete wards website. Or search on here for kwik styk pics and you'll see some beauties.
Shawn
Both are really nice bows, I guess your just gonna have to get one of each!
QuoteOriginally posted by Ulysseys: So far I've read that Widows are "dead in the hand, great customer service, hit where you look, loud but can be quieted, quick, stable, great resale if you need to sell it"
Take that desription (Minus Loud) and add uber speed and flat cast X 2 and you have a Kwyk Styk.
Here is a picture thread of Jack Kempf's bows. http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=095122 Matt
Bill
I undersatand what your saying about speaking in a derogative manner of a specific bows built by bowyers... No one likes to have their bow "played down".... The question however, at the start of this post was how do they, and other reverse limb bows compare ?.
In a comparison, differances have to be mentioned. I feel that's the info the guy was looking for when he asked for a "comparison"...
I realize "Widow" has a very large and satisifed fan base and it's well deserved.. Having owned and shot bows by both Widow, Kempf and a Habu, [ those are the only ones I'm familiar with] I tried to truthfully give my opinion and a fair comparision of all three...
I see others posting on this post do not agree. I can definately respect their likes and dislikes... However, I also read that many of the guys praising Black Widows also admitted to have never having owned, or actually spent much if any, time shooting a KS.
"To Each His Own".. I did, thru my long and "Expensive Search" :scared: I suggest if your considering one...that you get your name on the list or start bugging a friend that has an extra to sell it to you. I'm pretty sure you will not be dis-satsified. :wavey:
First I am a widow fan so take this for what it is worth.(I would love to try a Kwyk Styk) I like the fact that Widows are CNC machined. If I should need or want another I know I can buy new or used and get the exact same grip or performance. I like the heavy mass weight of widows also and feel that it is part of the reason for their shooting stability and consistency. I like light.mass weight bows I just don't shoot them as well. Also a PCH with the right woods would not have as much mass weight
Naw, my thread wasn't aimed at anyone in particular Gene. Although I don't own one of Jacks bows at this time, do own bows from 6 different bowyers including BW. I would at sometime like to though, but at almost 70 years of age and a couple bad shoulders, I probably wouldn't wait a year :) .
I really enjoy reading the good things others say about their bows but it seems that every time a BW is compared in a thread, it ends up with Widow being being criticized. It may have happened but I cannot remember a thread where any other bows were talked about in a negative way. I must say though,I have seen much worse said about them than has been said on this particular thread.
I have owned a lot of bows, some were great, some were just fair, and some were less than fair. The ones i didn't like, I read where others think they are top notch so we are all opinionated. I really don't see where comparing bows can be of any good as it is all subjective.
How much do the Kwyk Styk's sell for? I have now looked at them and can honestly say I don't like the way they look. The riser looks too blocky to me, but if they outperform Widows by as much as this thread makes it sound I would like to try one. If the difference in performance was 10% or less I wouldn't be interested as looks count in my book but it seems like from this thread the performance is 50% better overall at least so I would put up with a less aesthetically appealing bow for that kind of performance boost.
If you don't have your heart set on one of the two you mentioned, you might take a hard look at the Eaglewing Talon Static recurve. It has a belly mounted limb, very much like the BW or KS. Just do a search here and you can see some. The guys that have them seem to love them. He's a sponsor on this site and builds some sweet bows!
I've added a few links to some I liked,
With the top link being about as pretty a bow as a man could ask for.
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=109664;p=1
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=109329;p=1
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=101309;p=3
Jack will build the riser to your specs. A few pics of risers:
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/scan0002-2.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P9050009.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/PB010002.jpg)
This customer wanted Jack to build a thumb rest like Fedora's....
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P5110003.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/PA170026.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P6200013.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P4210004.jpg)
Joe, I really like the third and sixth pictures of the risers. They are stunning! Not too good at recognizing woods but suspect the third is cocobolo and bocote? And the sixth is hedge and either kingwood or bocote? They all look like low or medium wrist grip, I assume Jack will make any grip you prefer?
QuoteOriginally posted by Flingblade:
If the difference in performance was 10% or less I wouldn't be interested as looks count in my book but it seems like from this thread the performance is 50% better overall at least so I would put up with a less aesthetically appealing bow for that kind of performance boost.
One would think that after some of the posts they do, performance wise, shoot 50% faster which would make them close to 300 fps. But they cant be even 10% faster otherwise they would shoot a 9 gpp arrow in the area of 211 fps. That would be 11 fps faster then anything I've seen tested by a trust worthy source.
After owning Widows, Kwiks, Habus, and lastly a eaglewing talon. They are all very close in terms of speed. Everything else will be made up by the person shooting. If you are looking for craftsman ship and price I would choose the Eaglewing and they give up nothing in performance. If you want a heavier mass bow the widow is for you. No matter what you probably wont be happy until you at least try them all. And it will be a expensive trip.
Kwyk Styk all day long!
I haven't shot or handled a Kwyk Styk, but from what's already been said I am sure they are a great bow.
Aesthetically, the Widows win for me.
I can't imagine that the performance issues are significant enough to be a determining factor.
I followed the BW tuning tips in their owner's manual and have not had any problems with noise.
Another factor I took into consideration before I got my PMA was the fact that BW has been around for a long time, and will continue to produce great bows for many, many years to come. That is reassuring to me if I want another set of limbs in the future.
BW's customer service is second to none.
Jack's order form has the option of low/med/high wrist. When Curt(Guru)ordered his first Kwyk STyk, he molded up exactly what he wanted the riser and grip to be.
We shipped the mold up to Jack and he built the riser to Curt's specs.
Bill..3rd riser is Cocobolo/Bocote, 6th is Bocote/Osage.
Randy Jackson's bow was Charcoal with wavy zebra wood in riser, very pretty. Here is a pic...
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P8060015.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P8060014.jpg)
I love Cocobolo risers with Yew limbs...like my new Kempf longbow
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/PB190001.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/PB190011.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P4150003.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a281/sf1oak/P7120010.jpg)
Here is Ken Schwartz and his Kwyk Styk.....
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2167.jpg)
Here is Ken.....
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2166.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2165.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2164.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2163.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2162.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2161.jpg)
More of Ken's Bow
(http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2161.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2160.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2159.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2158.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2157.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2156.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2155.jpg) (http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac138/hemdell/Kens%20Kwyk%20Styk/IMG_2154.jpg)
Anybody got a picture of the Guru Grip. Right or left, does not matter.
Matt
I shoot a widow longbow and recurve. I have absolutely no problem with noise with either one. I had noise that went away when I removed my bolt-on quiver from the recurve.
I've shot a lot of different bows at the trad shows, and no other brand felt better than the Widows. I have no hyper-loyalty to them just because I shoot them; I'm always up to try other bows, as there are a lot of technological advances being made in limb performance & design... but the BW company makes an excellent product, for all the reasons others have listed previously. For all the banter about performance, I would be surprised to find very many TradGangers (or anyone else) whose abilities could outshoot the Widow bow. By this I mean that the bow would NOT be the limiting factor to performance; it would be the archer and his arrow set-up and technique almost every time. Those 195-200fps ranges in any bow are probably beyond the limits of all but a very few.
I have been able to get my last 3 widows quiet.The ones before were not as quiet due to different setup.I like an 8 strand astroflight or D-10 string with wool puffs or something similar.You need to have a high brace height of around 8 and 3/4er to 9 in my experience.I also shoot pretty heavy arrows.
Widows have an amazing riser with incredable strength and stiffness.Thier very stable bows and smooth shooters.
I think Blackys testing showed pretty definatably that they will perform right up thier with most any bow in the speed dept without the use of carbon and he has tested many bows.I have not seen any tests of the Kwik Stik.Could be faster.I would bet not by much if it is.Its not a big deal either way.I am sure both are plenty fast.
The Kwyk Styks sure look nice and the limb design is unique and inspiring.They recieve high praise so theirs no doubt they are a superb bow.
Some will prefer a Widow and some will prefer a Kwyk Styk for thier own reasons I do believe.Its like that with alot of bows.
I have not had the oppertuntity to shoot a Kwyk Styk.But would love to test one out sometime.
One thing that is versatile and convenient about a Widow is finding extra limbs second hand in different lengths and poundages to create a multi dimentional setup for varying purposes.Some will not need that.But some will appreciate it.
"I have been able to get my last 3 widows quiet.The ones before were not as quiet due to different setup.I like an 8 strand astroflight or D-10 string with wool puffs or something similar.You need to have a high brace height of around 8 and 3/4er to 9 in my experience.I also shoot pretty heavy arrows"
Good advice!!!!
Anyone besides me notice when one of these comparison questions comes up Black Widow is the baseline?
QuoteOriginally posted by TC in Spfld:
Anyone besides me notice when one of these comparison questions comes up Black Widow is the baseline?
Good point. Could it be that the Black Widow is great bow, but mass produced, and that Jack Kempf's bows and other great "one at a time" bowyers have a waiting list?
Jack is One Year out, Habu's are 2 years out.
Matt
Matt!
A BIG Thank You , for your Technical Support in posting the photos of my Kwyk Styk.
Thank you Ken
There were some great bowyers coming out in the 80's...Robertson, Schafer, Rocky Miller, Howard, Bighorn, Brackenbury, Fedora to name a few. Some bowyers were unheard or starting out like Kempf, Bruin, Guthrie etc....
Ken Beck of Black Widow did a tremendous job of marketing the BW line of bows. You couldn't open up a magazine cover or issue of PBS without seeing a full page Widow ad. They built a fine bow and stood behind it, and you didn't have to wait 6 months (back then).
They became the "Cadillac" of bows. Every bow seemed to be compared to them for looks and performance. Now, with all the excellent bowyers out there, the playing field is even when it comes to workmanship and performance. Their test drive program also helps in sales plus the short wait time.
Widow has a bunch of bows hanging on the wall waiting for a home...if the price is right. I firmly believe if you purchase a bow from a bowyer with a good reputation, you can't go wrong.
Well said Joe. i have 3 bows, one BW PSA V, One Caribow Silver fox, and one Bow River Archery Whitetailer long bow. And to be honest with you, thay all shoot realy well and I love them all. i'm not partial to one bowyer, and I think that all the hype about speed, is over rated. If the bow feel good, shoot well, and you are confident with it, it will be a great bow!
Just ask what is the best bow out there today, and you will get as many answers as there is bowyers an models.
Dave...I was a dealer for Rick Lepp...Bow River Archery. I sold many Whitetailer longbows and Summitt T/D's. They were great bows (another good Canadian Bowyer). I used to alternate between my Kempf Stealth and Summitt T/D and both put meat in my freezer. too bad Rick went out of business.
I agree, he was a great guy to deal with! i would like to get a bow from Jack, but the KS doesn,t realy do it for me... But the raven! Maybe one day!
David, I can tell you the my new Raven from Jack is the bow of my dreams. I finally got to tone it last night. I have 9 top of the line bows this Raven beats them all. you should take a hard look at one if your looking for a bow. Get with Joe Skipp he can get you headed in the right direction. I can shoot this bow with a open hand and it wont even fall out of my hand.
Thanks once again to Joe Skipp for telling me about Jack now if he will come hunt with me I owe him that.
Randy