I'm sure the topic has been covered in the past but, I must say it can be a jolt when you really get to looking.
Five years ago broadheads averaged $25-$35 for a six pack. Bows on average ran $600-$700.
Arrows, depending on wether you made you own or paid for custom built ran $30-$85 dozen.
I understand materials and labor cost have gone up. Add in the advancements in tech. and price increases will be higher today.
But really,,,,, todays prices could scare a fellow to death.
Today it's not uncommon to see broadheads at $50-$100 for a three pack.
Bows at $1000 plus
Arrows (no lets just look at shafts) running $75 for three to six.
Will prices increase this much or more over the next five years?
I may be beating a dead horse on this one, if not, getty up jughead......
Troy
I just bought two first class custom bows on the secondary market and have less than $900 total for the pair.
You can still buy aluminum shafts for a lot less. Carbon shafts have always been expensive.
I just bought a pack of six Zwickey eskimos for $22
Not seeing it....
whoa there, welcome back troy! where you been and what you been up to? you still building those slick t/d longbows?
as to yer post - welp, i guess there's a market for everything and everyone. whilst there are $1000 bows, $25/ea arrows and $50/ea broadheads, thank goodness there are still available a heapin' handful of great quality bows, arrows and heads that won't break the bank and will bring home the meat.
Troy, now you know why cheapskates like myself make all of our archery equipment. My bows total costs are less than $2 and a little time in the shop. The down side there is also a bunch of time behind a chainsaw in seemingly impossible places, log dragging as well as lots of exercise with splitting wedge and sledge.
Might be time to dust off your forms and start producing again. You made a mighty fine bow, people are still talking about and missing "Troy's arrows".
Hey Troy! Welcome back!
I guess everyone finds their "niche" both buyers and sellers. If they can get the asking price you can't blame the sellers, and if you have money to spare you can't blame the buyers either...
I here ya on that one Troy,
Due to work, building a house and moving, I was forced out of trad for a while. Now that things have settled, I am back at it.
When I started building arrows back in the late 80s I could get some fine POC for about $8.00 a dozen. Now, OH MY GOSH!! Some times over 30 bucks and that's buying them by the 1000. Let's not even talk about feathers. Retail at $.42 each for plain ol solid colors and the barred feathers!!! RETAIL AT A WOPPING $.72 EACH!!!!! Kinda makes you what to visit the creek and cut some river cane.
:scared:
Rob,
You really don't want to know what I've been doing for the past several years. Lets just say I couldn't stand the heat if everyone knew.
As for the bows??? I'm still playing around with a few, just stopped offering them to the public. If I ever started back I'd have to buy another insurance policy and would only build and sell. Custom orders can get to be a pain.
Just finished a recurve for myself and a T/D longbow for a little buddy of mine in MO.
Like you I still find good deals around on what I call commonly used items. However, like I said, I still play around with bows and my cost for building one has only went up slightly.
The biggest shock came from looking into some of the new broadheads. OUCH!!!!!
I guess being able to make most of what I use is where alot of this is coming from. Not only that but, I still have enough shafts and feathers from the past to cover me for several more years.
Add in the fact that I still have several years worth magnus and zwicky heads tells me I'm glad I want have to buy anything for a long time.
Troy
i think a huge part of the subject that troy brings ups is, what does it really take to be a successful trad bowhunter?
welp, imho, the tackle part plays a far lesser role than we think.
a simple but very effective stick can be anything from a board bow to a cheap used wood/glass laminate. and effective arrows can and have been made with hardwood dowels, freely harvested goose feathers and inexpensive but worthy broadheads.
Hi there Troy! Glad to see ya' back here.
There'll be and are folks that will pay those prices and there'll be folks that will charge them as long as there's folks that will pay them. It's difficult for me to justify that so long as Zwickey is still makin' broadheads.
The high end broadheads are ridiculously expensive but that's why I am not a high-end buyer. Pretty much everything gives me sticker shock anyhow. I am cheap to the extreme :)
I think I might have already told you but since you live so close now, please consider coming to the 5th Annual Southern Indiana Bowhunt. It will be October 7-9. I'll post details on another thread.
Eric,
Bows are just a hobbly now...
Arrows,,, I lost interest in building them when shaft quality went to heck and back. Besides, I did my best to produce a better shaft, but when I lived down ther suitable materail was a bigger pain to find.
Patrick55,,,
Feather prices almost blew my mind. I looked at the price I was selling for before falling off the map and compared them to todays prices... Holly @#@@!
Jeff,,
I guess your right. If you have that niche and can get the price, go for it...
I guess I'll have to stick around with the average fellow.
Troy
QuoteOriginally posted by Troy Breeding:
... I guess I'll have to stick around with the average fellow.
Troy
yer in BIG and GOOD company, troy :thumbsup:
Troy,
You'd better buy 5 or 6 grand worth of stuff quick cause in 5 years gonna be double again ;) It is actually because the craftsmen and women of trad gang make such nice stuff we all thought they should get paid more. Money's made for spending, can't take it with you. There are much worse habits to invest one's money on.
David,
Before posting this thread I thought "lordy mercy when my supply of materials are gone I'll have to take a morage on the farm to restock".
Thank goodness I have a good supply....
Troy
Some people still want the newest an bestest and will pay to get it. The rest of us hoarders buy cheap, buy lots, and keep the stuff forver.
John,
Please, besure and send me info on that hunt. Still having trouble finding places to hunt around here. I only have five acres and the locals around here still look kinda funny at me when I speak. Guess they never heard redneck before.... Even though I did manage to poke one deer behind the house last season, it looks like I'm going to be forced to travel if I want to hunt a bigger plot of woods.
Troy
I recall reading somewhere awhile back that Magnus sold their line of glue-on broadheads to someone else. Now I see the price went from 21-22 to 31. I'll be looking for another broadhead for use this fall.
John,
Yep, that is a pretty good jump in price. Still, it's in a fair range. If I remember right I was selling magnus heads for something like $25 a half dozen. Thats only a dollar each increase. Exceptable in my book.
Troy
That's exactly why I have shot the same SKY longbow for the last 20 years!!
TIM B
This is how I outfitted myself when I started.
Martin Hunter: 550
6 XX75 gamegetters: 30
6 woodman broadheads: 40.00
Miscellaneous (feathers, glove, glue, rests, spare string): Probably about 200.00
I've spent more since then, but what's listed above is plenty to get started, and cost me under 1000.00. If I'd gone for a cheaper bow, I could have saved a couple hundred bucks.
The high end stuff is expensive...the question I always ask myself is: is the extra money proportional to the extra performance? If so, then maybe I could justify it. But for the most part, I can keep my archery supplies pretty cheap. I don't see myself buying another bow for a numeber of years, and my arrows will probably last until I lose them or they bend. Aluminum arrows are still pretty cheap, there's still afforable broadheads out there, and even some brand new bows can be obtained for under 500 bucks.
anyway, truth be told, it's really the arrow that's more important than the bow. ;)
Troy,
You must be very tall as You are only looking at the top shelf. I find there are a lot of Bows and Broadheads in the price range you quoted from several years ago.
Charlie,
Maybe I'm not putting as I should.
Just afew years ago an Adcocok ACS was about as high a priced bow as you could find (considering this was the biggest inavation in archery in years). If I remember right they sold for something like $725.00 - $900.00 depending on the style. Most other bows maxed out at $800.00 and those prices were from the very few bowyers that had rode out the ups and downs in archery and built a worthy name.
Today it's not uncommon to see $1000.00 or close to it on alot of bows.
Broadheads and feathers to me carry a bigger sticker shock than almost anything else. When I fell off the map, $30.00 would buy you almost any top of the line six pack of broadheads just about anywhere. The other day I was lurking around some of the sights and foud a three pack of broadheads that carried a price of over $100.00.
Feathers sold for on average for $30.00 per 100. Today they will cost you almost double if not more.
Yes, I may be only looking at the upper shelf but after 20 years in the business and another ten prior to that hunting I look alittle higher than most. Not to say I'm willing to pay it, but still I look.
Troy
Some of the prices on the broadheads, for example the new tuffhead and Abowyer. These companies are offering BH that are presharpened, shave hair out of the box. You don't get that with most BH. That is a service to others, some don't care and is not important, others will pay for that extra.
These are not big companies, they are producing a specializd product that cost alot more money to produce, on a smaller scale. Are they quality products? You bet, 100%. Do you pay for that?You bet. I recently bought some of the Tuffheads. A great looking BH, what I have wanted for years for someone to produce. Long, lean, heavy, glue on. Tru 3:1. They are expensive, about $100.00 for 6. If I think about all the money I have spent on bows, arrows, etc. well I dont want to think about it. LOL!
What I am getting at is these are mom & pop operations that are specialized. They have to charge a certain amount to keep afloat in the ecomomy. Those kinds of products have always been expensive. There are cheaper altenatives, no doubt.
If you know what you want, it is worth it to some folks to pay the extra for the best. Everything is expensive and has an inflated cost these days. Nature of the world we are living in.
its more to do with the value of the dollar then anything else. priced food, fuel or any other consumables lately... my guess is that they have increased proportionally more than bows etc.
High sticker price does not equal success. Compounders are the worlds worst about upgrading everytime a newer faster model comes out. I think the FPS stands for "fleeced per second" when it comes to the hunting industry. As for trad folks, a $1000 bow is not a must. You can take game with an old Ben Pearson out of a pawn shop. Its all up to personal preferance on what you spend. I have a BW that I LOVE. I also have a selfbow that I made as well as rivercane arrows with self knapped points. Anything I take with either is a trophy to me.
Welcome back Troy!
I'm glad you found your way!
God bless,Mudd
You can spend that kinda money. Doesn't mean you have to, or even that you should.
I can go drop 300k on a car tomorrow. Good thing my 20k model does everything I could ask for.
bows and arrow shafting aside, the thing that kinda raises my eyebrows are the "boutique" broadheads - silver flame, vpa, tuffhead, abowyer, ashby, etc. are they THAT much better than a "low end" zwickey or magnus or woodsman or etc? well, yes, in many ways they are - solid machined construction, super hard steel, wicked cutting edges. but design-wise, i don't see any major advantages. an analogy example would be the original woodsman versus a vpa. ;)
I read a newsletter long ago that kinda put boutique spending in perspective. Say a glass of water costs you a penny, and a bottle of Coke costs you a dollar. We all know the Coke tastes better, but does it taste 100 times better?
Nope.
I guess what Rob said is what I'm tryin to point out.
However, everyone knows as well as I do that to some if it cost more it's got to be better.
I don't blame the manufactures for getting what they ask. I don't even blame those that are willing to pay the price. I just hope it's not heading the trad world down the same road the wheelie popper have gone.
I know I was one of the first to say I'd never pay the price they were paying when carbons first came out. Well,,, guess all I say say now is "that crow really is good".
Troy
Jeff,
You be one heck of sweet talker..... :-) :-)
Troy
QuoteOriginally posted by Jeff Strubberg:
I read a newsletter long ago that kinda put boutique spending in perspective. Say a glass of water costs you a penny, and a bottle of Coke costs you a dollar. We all know the Coke tastes better, but does it taste 100 times better?
Nope.
maybe "yes", depending if ya have disposable dollars. :D
then again, is a $1000 bow that much better than a $100 used bow? :dunno:
many factors required to answer that question, and many folks with many different answers. it's all good.
Not doubting an increase in prices, but some things to consider:
(1) Inflation of 2-3% a year (more now) - in 5 years that is 10-15%.
(2) Higher fuel and shipping costs, which bleeds into everything. Most people's labor and cost of doing business has also increased.
(3) In many businesses there is increased specialization. The bh market is an example. There are still a lot of well priced bhs, but there are a lot of new high dollar heads.
(4) More people are getting into traditional, so there are more products at all prices.
Just some thoughts. . . . :dunno:
Troy, if I can help get you up speed Call me, I'm sure I can help with the business end of building bows ( the dollars and cents).
Thanks Bob,
Not trying to make a business of it. Really, after getting out of the arrow business everything I do now is more hobby than anything else.
Troy
How about this Troy. I've got a $50 Bill for gas money and I'm betting that even "cheapskates like myself"-Eric Krewson would match it just to see you again down here in the HEAT and HUMIDITY of BAMA - you see, the ASTB Tannehill shoot is just 11 days away, so get packing and fill your tank. I just hope I can make the trip, too.
Troy,
Kinda wish I would have done it that way. I just can't so NO to building a bow, special to the person I'm building it for. It's the business end I hate, FET, Liability Insurance. Takes ALL of the fun out of it.......
Welcome back, and please forget the sticker shock. You can get back into Traditional Archery and you don't have to be rich to do it. :campfire: :coffee:
Bob,
FET & LI along with too many arrow orders is why I stopped building bow for the public. The LI cost so much it took alot of my profit out. Subtract the FET and whats left only allowed me a small profit margin. Being an unknown to the bowyer world didn't allow me to get a high price for my bows.
Troy
Mr. Breeding,
I know exactly where you're coming from. You can only kill an animal so dead. A sharp $2 broadhead placed properly will kill just as dead as a $35 broadhead. Do you need a $1000 bow to shoot that broadhead? Sadly, I see traditional archery going the same way that fly fishing has gone-it's becoming an elitist sport. The mass produced Bears, Ben Pearsons, Wings, etc. have taken pretty much every animal on earth-many times over.
Tim,
If heat and humidy are what I have to look at then you can keep it. It's been hot and humid up here for the past month. Couldn't stand it if it is worst down there. I've got to liking the cold and snow. Told my wife the other day that when she retires I want to move to AK.
Troy
Out of my league. But, I'm pretty much set anyway.
Phil,
Did you just call me Mr. Breeding???? :-) :-)
Dang, I know I'm quickly getting into the ol' Fa$!@ catagory, but around here I'm just plain ol' Troy. No Mr. around here. I feel we are close enough friends to do away with the formal da do.
Troy
Yup, have to agree with Rob on this one! While some bowyers and manufacturers prices have gone way up, there are others who remain close to what they were 4-5 years ago. I can still get my Snuffers for 2 bucks more and I know RER bows basic bows are still with $50 or so of what they were than. I also found the carbons I have been shooting are a bit cheaper from what I paid than. If you look around there are deals to had, but yes the economy sucks and the days of old are just that OLD!! By the way, if you still have any of those awesome old shafts you sold, I will give ya $25 a dozen!! :bigsmyl: (LOL) Nice to see ya back bud!! Shawn
Always good deals in the used market. But if ya want something new or can not wait for the deal/sale or don't think ahead of needs you have to "pay" for materials/labor/overhead and the factors that contribute to their inflation in the retail world. Got a whole garage of used Archery that I do not need "yet".
Troy,
I am well into the "ol' Fa$!@ catagory" myself, just the way I was brought up!! I know of you, but have never had the pleasure of meeting you.
Phil
Kim,
I like the part about having a garage full of bow stuff you don't need yet. I thought I was the only one that had that stuff.
Phil,
My dad was a master sargent. Know exactly what you mean about being brought up proper. He still gives me a hard time when I speak to anyone older than myself, and if a lady is around it still better be yes mam and no mam.
Troy
Troy...spend some of that rusty money...dang titewad :bigsmyl:
Troy's so tight, he won't even spend my gas money. :) LOL :)
Troy that's the main reason I started building my first longbow. I wanted one real bad, but couldn't afford the price tag, so I built one and been doing it ever since, lovin every minute of it. The guys here have helped me emensly over the past year and I've come a long, long way from where I first started and my bows don't look anything like that first one. LOL
I try to make everything I possibly can to break my dependence on manufactured archery goods, but there's just some things that I have to buy and I cringe every time I have to dig into the piggy bank. Carbon arrows especially are way, way over priced! If I buy broadheads they are almost always Magnus variety and they are still one of the most reasonable priced broadheads still out there.
Welcome back from wherever ya been and maybe I can learn a few things from ya.
Rod,
Not my money anymore. Momma has control of everything now. All I get is an allowance.
Troy
Troy did you change states?
Ohio is still rumored to have some of the biggest bodied whitetail deer in this country.
What we lack in size here in Missouri we make up for in herd count plus we weigh our turkeys in as well...lol
God bless,Mudd
Mudd,
Yep, moved again. Momma to a promotion that moved us to OH.
You can be sure the deer here are huge. I thought the deer in MO were big after living my whole life in AL.
The one thing I do miss is the turkey. Very few in this area. To hunt them I have to travel alittle. In MO I took most of my turkey within 100yards of my house.
Troy
A lot of us refer to ourselves as cheap but I like to think of a lot of it as common sense. Yeah , things are priced crazy.
I see all price ranges for bows out there, if you are willing to buy pre-owned you can get em for $150-1,500.
The wait times on many of the customs are indicative of how popular they are. I think some of the custom bowyers must have other primary jobs though and build great bows on the side which adds to the time and the cost.
The time I am brought to earth is when I've paid a lot for a bow that after a few weeks doesn't strike my fancy as much as I thought it would. Or another bow that I like shooting more comes along. Then, the prospects of taking a beating keeps me from selling it.
I think the best therapy (and cheaper) for me would be to receive new bows for other people. I could look forward to receiving the new bow.Then open that new bow box! I could apply a nock locator, shoot a dozen arrows, and send it on it's way!
Archery is about the only thing I do other than work a job I love. I could certainly get by with the same equipment I had when I was 16 back in 1970 (Ben Pearson Cougar and 6 arrows with Deadheads and a $10 quiver). I'm thankful I don't have to.
Troy, where are you in Ohio???? I'm about 30 miles east of Columbus.
Bob,
About half way between Sidney and Bellefontaine. Roughly and hour to hour and a half west of Columbus.
Bowwild,
Know what your talkng about. When I started I had a Pearson recurve and 2020 alum arrows with field points and Bear broadheads. Give $45 for the whole setup. At that point in time I just knew Robin Hood's legend was in trouble.
Troy
I myself sort of "dropped off the map" as far as archery was concerned for several years (family and work related). Now that I have gotten back into it I found that I have a step-son, 2 nephews and a wife that are now interested in traditional archery. I have been able to get them all 4 bows from the classifieds here,and all the other stuff needed for under $800 including arrows. The bows are all "gently used" and shoot great. Arrows/fletching is what actually gave me the most sticker shock. Good deals are out there to be found though.