Ok fellows,everyone has gotten my curiosity up on the sitka hunting wear.Matter of fact i'm wondering how anyone ever killed an elk before its invention.With that said ,do i need the full set of layering gear in order to hunt elk this september?Or just the rain gear or is it all rain proof?I have been on several elk hunts and do a lot of walking.And I have been known to build a fire and pitch camp on more than one occasion when it was too late to go to base camp.I want to know what the die hard sitka guys wear on a days hunt in north west colorodo.I feel Most of the sitka website is a sales pitch.I need to hear from the hunters that wear it.Thanks in advance.
Micheal,
I am going to bed, so I will answer in more detail if necessary tomorrow, but in short it is the perfect gear for elk hunting. It works best as it was designed; as a system. Most guys that don't like it use a piece or two with their old marginal gear and expect a miracle. I have worn it from Arizona to Alaska and on hunts as rugged as Bighorn Sheep and as sedintery as Brown Bear. If there was something better I would own it!
Just received my first Sitka gear today. i got a Ascent Jacket and Pants for hunting here in Australia. It doesnt get real cold here but I will wear it with Ice Breaker merino thermals underneath when the temps get down. I will have them out Sunday for their first hunt but so just the comfort wearing them is superb. The quality is also first rate.
It's beautifully made, well designed (though sizing is small) and pretty much bombproof, but a little on the expensive side IMHO.
Yes sizing is small.. I had ro return a pair my Brothter in law bought me.. I have the Ascent pants and the vest.. Some of the best made stuff I have worn.. I wear in in the heat in Louisiana and all over.. Never hunted out west,,, Wore it one the bear quest 5 hunt every day for comfort.. And wore in under my Grey Wolf Woolskin Perdator camo for comfort when chilly or raining, It makes a great layer..
I however just wish there was a different choice in the cammo pattern.. Love predator spring green.
Now they'd really have something if they made it in Predator Camo (I am partial to Spring Green myself)! :thumbsup:
The way I understand it, Gore owns Sitka, so you are probably not going to see it in Predator camo since Gore has their own camouflage (Optifade). That said, both the Open Country and Forest Optifade are the results of scientific efforts to break up the human outline, which is what Predator and ASAT were trying to do on a less-than-scientific basis. (This strategy is different than the match-exactly-the-scenery strategy of many other designs). At "target engagement" distances, the Optifades don't look digital at all, they destroy the human outline in my opinion and I think you'd be pleased with them. (I have to admit Mountain Mimicry did well at this too, but mixing old and new Sitka is not a problem!).
A couple other thoughts on Sitka Gear. It is not cheap. But then again, I think 10-20 hard years from now, you will be wearing the same stuff you buy now...which makes it extremely economical in the long run. (And will give us all incentive to keep our weight right where it's at!). To say it's well-made is an understatement.
Another thing is that it all is designed to layer together. Because my hunting partner/best friend keeps borrowing my warm Sitka stuff, I wanted to beef up my COLD weather gear this year and really wanted the Fanatic Jacket (designed esp. for cold weather whitetails), but felt I couldn't afford it right now. But I got the Stratus jacket which is one step down in insulation from the Fanatic (but still warm), and already have a Kelvin insulation layer which will layer under it and effectively give me the R-value I'm looking for. That's the beauty of the system.
That said, I need to let some guys experienced with elk and Sitka answer your question specifically. The new Timberline and Mountain Pants are stretchy pants with knee pads and also waterproof knees/seat (Timberline). Wow!
I just got to put my hands on most of their lineup and if you have specific questions, please feel free to fire away. Mike Mitten (HerdBull here) is currently doing a question and answer over on Sitka Gear's homepage. He'd be a great guy to ask these questions of.
I purchased a set of cothes years ago that felt like saddle cloth but wasn't.They were very rain repellent quiet and breathed well.practically rain proof except maby a down poor.I guess they were ahead of there time because they went out of business. I'm trying to figure out which set of the sitkas fit that description or which one you elk hunters prefere.I dont have a store here locally carring them or i would just go look.Thanks for the info.
For what it's worth all my Kuiu sheds water like a duck's back. Not turning this into a Sitka vs. Kuiu because that's not my intent, but if you're looking at Sitka, Kuiu should be on your list to compare.
I have a few pieces. I like the Forest pattern. I think it is well made, very durable, comfortable fit and well-designed with pockets, cuffs, snaps, etc. It has caused me to retire almost every other hunting clothing I own.
I also like the packs, especially the day pack for my daily white-tail tree sits.
The Downpour Jacket by Sitka is their quiet raingear, IMO. Not completely silent, but pretty darn close and whisper-quiet enough for close-range bowhunting. I am totally satisfied with my Downpour model from about two or three years ago but this is even better with a nicely brushed surface to make it even quieter.
Stormfront and Stormfront Lite are probably too noisy for close range hunting encounters. But they are extremely light (not that Downpour is heavy, it's not). I liken the Stormfront to be worn on a river guide who is always getting pounded by water from over the bow of the boat, hauling stuff in and out of the hull, banging through brush, etc. It's bombproof.
Stormfront Lite packs down TINY! It also stretches and would be a perfect item for the guy who finds himself in frequent wet weather and wants something in his pack at all times to stay dry when they happen.
So, Hill Boy, to answer your question, the Downpour sounds the most comparable to what you mentioned. By the way, Downpour Pants feature full-length side zippers for easy on/easy off, and have an internal belt system.
Also, another point. Any Sitka item advertised as having DWR is semi-waterproof. DWR is Durable Water Repellant finish which repels water but is highly breathable. The 90% Jacket/Pants have DWR; so does Jetstream Jacket/Vest, Mountain/Timberline Pant, and Ascent Jacket/Pant.
Bowwild, I'm with you. I had a chance this weekend to mess with the Ascent 14 pack which is the most comfortable daypack I've ever seen and one in which shooting a bow with it fully loaded should not make a difference. Love that horseshoe yoke system.
Ok bryce,Is the downpour somthing you would wear all day or carry in case of a shower.If it were you how would you utilize this system.Not trying to be difficult but a once a year trip isn't a good time to experiment.Sounds like the 90% may be the way too fly with good silk/wool thermals. maby somthing fully rain proof for emergency's.Am I making sense?If you were headed to the rockies what would you wear in sitka, based on past trips?I appreciate Your input.
Micheal,
You wear any raingear, breatheable or not, humping up and down the mountans, you are going to be wet whether it is raining or not.
When I got my first Sitka Gear, it was for a bighorn sheep hunt in Colorado. I was amazed. Never in the month I hunted did I find one single moment I was uncomfortable. This included multiple daily 2500' climbs and long sits in every weather condition you could think of. I am an engineer and I enjoy testing things and figuring out how they work. I purposely kept adding layers on my climbs. I would POUR out sweat, yet I would not be overheated or uncomfortable and after 5-10 minutes into my spotting session, everything would be back to normal and I could sit for hours behind the binocs. Another thing that impressed me and applies directly to elk hunting was 5 minutes or so into my climb, the pants that were completely soaked from my walk thru the meadow were dry.
Sitka pulls moisture off you and keeps you comfy. Another interesting example for you. A couple years ago I was hunting in southern Ohio Thanksgiving week. I had quite a hike thru some hilly country to get to my stand. I decided to wear all my gear rather than pack the insulation (Kelvin) and outer layer (Stratus) like usual. I put my BlackBerry in the OUTSIDE upper pocket of my windproof jacket. It was soaked and I had to get a new one, yet on the inside 10 minutes after I got set into the stand I had to hang from zero, I was all set comfort wise and sat the entire day.
Bryce mentioned DWR coating. Same Ohio hunt. Chance of rain...nah, I won't pack my raingear. I layered under my 90% clothes and sat all day after it drizzled till noon. It works pretty good. I just did the same thing on my last night bear hunting in Manitoba. I was on stand at two and got down at 10:30...it POURED most of the eveningt and my 90% was soaked thru, BUT, I was smart enough to have my Kelvin vest on and was just fine. I can sit thru just about anything if I have a Kelvin vest or jacket on. They are the warmest/lightest piece of clothing I have ever owned.
A buddy of mine pooh poohed all my Sitka love for years. I gave him my stuff to take on a Colorado elk hunt last October. He has sold a bunch of his heavy bulky wool and has a full contingent of Sitka Gear now. He was amazed at how it performed and was buying Sitka Gear at every opportunity this winter.
I like that if it is hot out, I can hunt in my core top. It is camo and keeps you cool. I would wear my core long sleeve top all summer climbing our sledding hill or bleachers with a 40-80# pack training. Wear it under another layer and it keeps you warm.
So, what I would get as a middle of the road setup for any September elk hunt would be:
Core top and bottom
Traverse top and bottom
90% Jacket and pant
Kelvin vest
Get yourself a ponco to wear when it rains. Stop and hunker down while the cloud blows thru. If not, Stormfront light is what you want on a backpack/mountain hunt. It is not quiet like the downpour raingear, but you can shake it basically dry before you go in the tent. That brushed layer which makes the dp quiet also holds water that is not going to dry quickly. It is made for whitetail hunting where you are going to be coming to a house/cabin/motel every night and can dry it out.
You can go lighter with Ascent pieces or heavier with mountain/timberline pants and a Jetstream jacket, but you should be able to handle anything with what I listed above by mixing and matching as conditions warrant.
Like I said, most guys that don't like Sitka Gear have not used it as it was designed, as a system.
The harder the hunt is, the more you will appreciate your Sitka Gear.
Thanks Steven, That is some serious info.Just what I was looking for.So you would actually carry the whole set with you or just dress accordingly by the day? (Core top and bottom
Traverse top and bottom
90% Jacket and pant
Kelvin vest)
Well, it is not all that heavy. It would be nothing to keep what you are not wearing in your pack and adjust as necessary.
I own the 90% jacket and pants. I also own the old Nimbus rain gear, as well as some Core undergarments. I have tried on the Kelvin jacket and vest, the Celsius line, the Ascent series, etc. I personally love the 90% and Nimbus. The other series did not impress me enough, considering their cost, to warrant my money. This is certainly a matter of individual preference. The guys who know me would likely tell you that I'm no cheapskate on my gear. No matter who makes it, I evaluate every item on its own merits. I did that with Sitka, and some of it pleased me while some didn't.
If you decide to go "full Sitka"...be sure your bank account can take it. Not hard to put $1,500 on your back very quickly. Very nice gear though, all money aside.
Hill boy, I SteveO answered your question in the kind of mountain experience-based detail I was hoping you'd get.
One thing that I just learned this weekend from the guys at Sitka Gear HQ: the actual Primaloft insulation in the Kelvin series will not absorb water. Water just sits on it. And the level of insulation is comparable to 550 weight goose down.
Excellent product the key is layering, I've worn it for the past four years all over the US and abroad you won't go wrong with Sitka Gear.
I am a fan of the Optifade concept and pattern. I am not a fan of the reflective material. I put a blue spectrum light and black spectrum light up to it. As usual man made synthetic materials reflect. It will break up an outline but will reflect in contrast to rocks a vegetation as the rate of light absorbtion is different.
Great idea though. I think its a matter of which problem one is trying to solve. Using material that absorbs light at the same rate as the environment or creating a situation whereby the animal cannot focus on you. Two differnt problems. So I would say the answer is yes (hype) and then I would say no (Optifade concept)
If they created it in a soft cotton or lite wool I would own it as the light absorbtion is relatively close to terrain. The price does not concern me as it is my only hobby. I know guys who spend more than I do on beer alone and then say they can't afford something.
Gore makes synthetic material. Yes they are actually trying to sell thier material by using probably the best camo concept around.
Has anybody who wears the Sitka spent a lot of time in KOM wool? Some of my wool garments are wearing out and I have a hard time believing that I'll be as comfortable in Sitka as I would in my wool. I haven't found a direct comparison of KOM to Sitka and would appreciate anybody who knows the two products.
Also have a couple of questions.
What if you fall in water out in the wilderness with sitka gear on? Does it keep it's "thermal" properties then?? What happens if you get a hot coal from the fire on it? will it just melt through or will it go up and melt on you? hows the odor retention, and is it whisper quiet when you move?
I have had KOM and Sleeping Indian wool in full sets. Worn them for caribou, moose, deer and some other use. I thought nothing could ever beat them. I loved them for being quiet, warm and very traditional. I forgave them for accumulating smoke odors and food smells. I forgave them for being very heavy when wet. I forgave them for being hard to vent, and harder to carry in a daypack. I forgave them for grabbing burrs. I forgave them for being somewhat of a pita to clean nicely. I also forgave them for being pretty darned poor at blocking wind on cold days.
I bought Sitka and other synthetics about 3 years ago. I noticed my wool got almost NO USE after that. The synthetics stay cleaner for me. They have less odor to my nose. They layer up better, and they pack tighter. They dry faster. They have less bulk when worn. They vent much faster and easier. They stretch better than wool. They are 10x better than wool...in my playbook....for active hunting. For stationary whitetail treestanding, with low exertion, I'll be wearing whatever feels best that day. I'll go with more bulk in cold temps. I can stay very warm and comfy with $350 worth of good fluffy fleece/etc. I can't figure out how using $800 - $1000 of anything does a better job or improves my treestand experience. I'm saying that I don't use Sitka Gear for my whitetail hunts. I could afford it, I just can't find the benefit there.
I tend not to get hot coals or burns on my clothing. That's after 40+ years of hunting...so not an issue for me. As for noise, don't believe what anyone tells you as gospel. Try it and determine for yourself. I'd have no problem stalking a deer in Sitka 90%. Other shells and materials may not be as quiet.
By the way...I sold every last piece of my expensive wool, and I haven't missed it.
Falling in the water. I've done it, it stinks. If it is really cold, but not freezing, do the synthetics dry fast enough to keep you out of hypothermia?
In sub-freezing temps one could just take off whatever they got on at the time and smack that frozen artical against a tree to shed the "water" but when it's, say 35deg and/or windy, you get soaked, now what. I'm building a fire no matter what, but curious, Mr. Murphy's entance in to your "wilderness" hunt with synthetics on, what will you do waiting for them to dry?
I have wool that I like for whitail hunting in a stand.But when it come to hiking into the mountains,that is a whole different animal.A hunter that is covering a lot of ground with weather conditions changing somtimes multiple times daily has several things to consider including weight.Which is why I started this thread.To get some good thoughts from experienced hunters using sitka or new era clothing.This has been very helpful,I appreciate everyone's input.
"Falling in the water. I've done it, it stinks. If it is really cold, but not freezing, do the synthetics dry fast enough to keep you out of hypothermia?"
I think your question is a legit one, but one I can't relate to. By that I mean, a lot of things could happen on a hunt, and falling in water is one. A tree branch can fall, but I don't wear a helmet. If I fell in water during very cold weather, I'd be just as concerned with drowning...but I don't carry a pfd with me to prevent that either. I just know that not one type of fabric does everything perfectly. You just pick and choose your "issues" and then your clothes.
Incidentally, if I fell in with synthetics on: I'd immediately shake and wring as much water out as possible. Syns don't absorb water like wool fibers do. I would do the same with wools. I wouldn't count on either one to keep me out of hypothermia.
I did'nt like it. Too stuffy feeling, not breathable "enough." Lightweight S.I. Wool is my favorite. If it get's windy I put on the windproof lined wool vest, if it pours I put on a poncho. Very light considering I don't need to layer with anything but my underoos.
I do like the camo, just not the fabric. Click this pic for a quick video.
(http://i688.photobucket.com/albums/vv247/pukingguts/th_P1030759.jpg) (http://s688.photobucket.com/albums/vv247/pukingguts/?action=view¤t=P1030759.mp4)
Ok, I give up....the vid is to show us...what?
Guru. The gentleman stated he has wool, but want's to spend money on "lightweight stuff." It is my personal account on it. Look past the obvious. Today was about 67deg, humidity was high, raining. Was I frowning, wining, itching, or otherwise looking uncomfortable? Course not. Wearing wool is not only for the cold and stationary, it works everywhere. Insulation is just that, insulation. It will keep you warm or cool, just have to have the know how to thermal regulate.
Another great thing to do is call the Sitka boys at their office. They are the experts and have used it all over the world. They will answer your questions and not give you any hard sell.
877-748-5247 (877-SITKA-GR)
Sitka is great if you're moving around such as mountain style elk hunting or in moderate temps, but it doesnt hold a candle to wool for treestand hunting in frigid temps. In very cold weather, I've been extremely dissapointed in sitka and will never buy any again.
Again, you do not wear the same clothes for active hunting AND stand hunting. Two completely different activities requiring two completely different styles of clothing. Nothing will excel at both.
Having recently asked some of these same questions at Sitka HQ, I'll share what I think may help. First up, Swampthing's questions.
The Primaloft in the Kelvin insulation series will NOT absorb water according to what we're told. The Primaloft is supposed to be equal to 550 wt. goosedown (for whatever that's worth). What I know from experience is the Kelvin line is VERY warm. I would suspect that it and the Merino garments would retain much of their insulative properties when you get wet.
As for fire, I don't know.
As for odor retention, Merino has some natural properties which help hold down odor. Also many of the Sitka core gloves and garments have ATB-100 (newer) or S2 (older) Silver Technology, which reduces odor-causing bacteria. I know that I've worn core shirts several days in a row and have been amazed at how well they've done in that regard.
Whisper-quiet when you move? Most garments absolutely. Some of the raingear not so much, like the Stormfront where it's close to monsoon-proof at which point it really becomes impossible to be silent. If you have a specific garment you're wondering about how quiet it is, please ask. I would feel I could comment on MOST of the current Sitka offerings...as to whether it's whitetail quiet or not. The vast majority of the gear I have is just that quiet, including the Stratus Jacket and Fanatic Bibs I just ordered. Also the Jetstream Jacket.
BD...honestly, if you're talking about the Celsius lineup of a couple years ago, I could agree with you that it was not warm enough for truly cold-weather sits, at least for me. Of course I know guys that stay warm with half the stuff I have to wear.
That said, the current Sitka lineup for the stand hunter is MILES ahead of what it was just 2-3 years ago. I cannot imagine anybody not finding the Fanatic Jacket and Bibs (with proper insulation/core layers) to keep them warm in the coldest whitetail hunting situations. These garments are light years beyond the older Celsius style for frigid conditions.
This year, I didn't feel I could afford the Fanatic jacket, but since I already had the Kelvin insulative layer, I bought the Stratus Jacket. I'm confident that with one or two core layers, the Kelvin mid-layer, and the Stratus outer layer, that I will be set for long sits in zero degree weather. (In my opinion, Kelvin stuff is the best value in the Sitka lineup).
And the Incinerator Jacket (700 wt. down) is a step up from the Fanatic! I've not had a chance to handle that yet.
I would urge you to take a second look at the Forest Line-Up which is designed for the stand hunter. It took them a couple years to iron that angle out, which I suppose is to be expected given that this company originated with the mountain hunters who are on the go, or at least stop and go.
From warmest to least warm outerwear in the Forest Optifade, it runs: Incinerator, Fanatic, Stratus, 90%.
In Open Country Optifade, the jacket steps run: Jetstream, 90%, Ascent. The Timberline and Mountain Pants would fit in between the 90% and Ascent, closer to the 90%.
Last one tonight. Kevin makes several good points. I might expand on what he suggested about getting wet. The Stormfront and Stormfront Lite are meant to be worn "when it's raining" and taken off when it's not, esp. the Lite version. One of the things that breaks down raingear is wearing it when it's not needed and subjecting it to additional abuse, especially from brush. Both of these models can be shaken free of almost all water, put in your pack, and off you go.
Meanwhile the Downpour series is raingear that's quiet enough to hunt in and designed for the stand hunter. It has a brushed surface (for quiet) which will hold some outside moisture. But the general idea is the deer hunter is usually going home or to a cabin or motel room where the garment can dry out (it won't shake dry like Stormfront).
One item I learned from the experts is that modern raingear needs to be washed and kept clean. Too much dirt and the like will definitely have a negative effect on the ability for wonder products like GoreTex, Paclite and Windstopper and the like to move moisture vapor to the outside.
Another recommendation from the experts is that when you are hiking/exerting AND wearing raingear, you may still need to ventilate. The Stormfront has pit-zips which help this process and the chest zipper of course can help as well.
I'll add a few comments about the incinerator jacket since few people have one. It uses premium goose down for insulation and has a gore tex liner to block wind and moisture. I got one last year for December/January hunting in Iowa. For a very cold weather jacket, it is not very bulky...arm movement and shooting a bow are not a problem. I tend to not get as cold as most people. I can wear the incinerator jacket with light base layer and be perfectly warm down to about 25 degrees. The jacket blocks wind well...something we have a lot of in Iowa during deer season. I add the heavier base layer or light polypropylene turtleneck for temps down to about 10 degrees. For bitter cold, I add the Kelvin vest. Hunted several hours last year in
-10 weather and had no issues with my upper body being cold. Just make sure you get a size where the jacket fits a little loose so you can add a few layers underneath for bitter cold. My only complaint is the lenght of the jacket. It is more of a bomber jacket than a parka. For really cold you need bibs underneath to keep cold from sneaking in from mid-body.
That's my point as well, if it ain't raining, and I mean raining, I would not wear a raincoat, far too stuffy. Wool on the other hand has a enough water repelency, and thermal properties, to keep you dry, and warm, in light rain then a synthetic. Why choke your self with a less breathable product? If it is pouring then ya put on a rain coat.
They are correct though in the regard that, the fabric will not "absorb" water, the fabric itself is hydrophobic. You can, however, saturate the garment, just dunk it and you'll see that first hand. Trickey marketing right there, as they did not answer your question, merely stated "well it don't absorb water."
Are you gonna take a chance with light weight out in the wilderness. A slightly heavier garment that allows you to breathe will more than make up for the difference in weight, especially when you are in the high elevations and under exertion.
Thermal regulate my brother.
Anyway, enough of this techno mumbo jumbo, enjoy the time you get in the mountains, that is one of the many pinacles in bowhunting.
Cliff
My point was that I don't participate in active style hunting. 99% of my hunting is for whitetails from treestands. I can get wool for much cheaper than a sitka layering sytem and stay much warmer to boot, so there is no need for me to even consider sitka. I have some I wear for stand hunting in milder temps. It is very comfy and I like how it stretches, but it is WAY overpriced for what I use it for.
I bought some KOM wool back in the early 90s and thought it was ove priced at $700 (back then) for jacket and pants, but I still have it today. I hope to have my Sitka a long time as well. The question was about "hoopplaa", and I remember hearing about non-shrinking, "shingle-layered" wool that shed water like KoM and Sleeping Indian back in the day. This thread has a lot of first hand experiences from folks who have tried both and I certainly do understand the difference in oppinoins. I'm glad we have a lot of options to choose from that keep us out there in an aray of terrain and hunting styles. Mike
If Steve O says it's good stuff, believe it.
well,I feel like I have recieved some very helpful opinions.I have determined that the sitka certainly must have an advantage in the mountains while hiking.The ones who spoke very highly of it does there share of elk,goat,sheep etc.type hunting.This is the very thing I was considering it for.I'm going to see if there is a suit that would fit a september elk hunt.I don't think the whole getup would be justified for the style of hunting I do most of. Especially since I have clothing that I like for most of my hunting needs.On the other hand I don't want to be guilty of picking at it to a point that I'm not getting the true benefits that it is desighned for.
I had my first outing in Sitka Gear yesterday. Conditions were quite cool in the morning at around 5C with the afternoon getting up to about 16-17C.
My choice of gear was the Ascent Pants and Jacket. In the morning I had a 200g Merino Icebreaker top under the Ascent jacket and nothing except a pair of SKINZ shorts on under the pants.
Terrain was reasonably hilly but not extreme. We covered about 6 mile constantly moving, only stopping for a brew etc.
I had the merino layer off by lunch time and hunted the rest of the day like that. The Ascent gear would have to be the most comfortable hunting wear I have worn. It breathed extremely well but was not cold in the wind. I did not find a
position that I could put myself in that was restrictive at all.
I have only hunted Elk once which was last September in
Colorado but I hunt Sambar over here in Australia a lot which is very similar style/terrain hunting. For me the Ascent gear would be perfect coupled with good quality base layer and light weight rain gear.
Hope that helps a little.