OK, my wife is going through a little mid-life crisis. She has decided she is tired of the long winters and gloomy springs of Maine. She is interested in moving to the west where there is more sunshine. Loving the west myself I am interested.
My issue is I have become used to having lots of land to roam and hunt right out my back door. Game numbers are low, no matter what game you are talking about (except turkeys). And even though we don't have high populations we can get a tag for deer, turkeys etc. without a draw (moose is the exception). I can usually hunt every afternoon after I get out of school with a short drive and a hike back into stand areas or bird covers (depending on my choice that day).
My question is how do the western states handle their big game hunting. Arizona and New Mexico seem to be entirely draw formats for any big game. Colorodo I know is more liberal with over the counter tags. I have seen posts on moving west before but could not find any with my search query.
So what states would offer the best opportunities to hunt big game every year without having to drive to the other side of the state?
Colorado, Idaho, Washington, (limited elk areas) Oregon. WY & MT are good bets for getting a tag yearly as a resident outside of LE draw areas. Pick a State, then look for areas/towns outside the heavy snow areas.
ElkNut1
If you are tired of long winters, you can scratch Wyoming and Montana off the list, although the hunting, fishing and outdoor opportunities are good in both states. Now that I am old, I spend three months of our 7 month long winter in Arizona. From what I can discern from Arizona, everything is on a draw, and I know people who have lived there for years without drawing an elk tag. I have considered javelina hunting while in Arizona, but found it cheaper and easier to travel to Texas to hunt the little stinkers.
Colorado is beautiful, and in the lower elevations their winters aren't as long as Wy or Mt, but the front range is overpopulated, unless you get south of Pueblo. The western slope still has some great country that is not too peopled. New Mexico has lots of great and varied terrain, but it is my understanding that drawing tags for elk is tough.
Tradeoffs are everywhere when looking at a place to live; I love Wyoming, but the winters get really old. As I write this, it is snowing, and I live below 5000 feet. The Bighorn mountains, that I live near the eastern slope of, still have snow measured in feet rather than inches, and our runoff will be of record proportions this year. The old saying of Wyoming, Montana and other northern western states is that we have two seasons; winter and road construction. That pretty much says it.
If it were me I'd be looking at southwest Colorado. I don't know what you have for season lengths in Maine, but be aware that western bowhunting seasons are often not very long. I get tired of winter as well, but I sure do appreciate the long bowhunting seasons we enjoy here in the midwest.
Around Pinedale we'd have a big party if summer happened on a week end.
Not only that but usually we had 9 months of winter and 3 months of really bad skiing.
:bigsmyl:
Hunting is great here, but the winters are looonnnggg! I live at about 7,000 feet, snowed yesterday, and is snowing again today.
We have alot of folks move to this town, then move away after 6 months or so. That is a plus, very low population here. :thumbsup:
Hey Michael,
As a teacher in Oregon I can tell you new teaching jobs are tough to find in our state right now, but not impossible. Most districts are laying off teachers, not hiring. The upside for someone new to the profession or new to the area is that first year teachers cost less, and although no one will say it, are more desireable. Now is a good time to start hitting the different district websites for job postings.
Another state to look into not mentioned is Northern California. Good luck.
I think it can be a trade off no matter were you go. I live at about 5500 ft elevation in So Utah. It snowed yesterday by friday it will be almost 80. I have seen snow in every month on the ground here but the sun dose come out over 200+ days a year,alot more that the smogged in valleys of N. Utah. Summer temps are in the 80's to 90's and few in the 100's. Winter can get below -15 at night and 40 by afternoon(high desert temp swings).
Now the hunting is a draw system here except for archery elk is OTC. I have never went without a deer tag yet but gun hunters may go 4 years between tags. Seasons are short running from late aug. to mid sept. with an extended season in N utah that runs from late aug. thur nov. but I think it has really hurt that unit. Deer hunting is not what it use to be in Utah but I always get plenty of action. Next year it will be a 29 unit draw system that I hope will improve our deer herds. Elk hunting is good on most spike/cow units but most anybull units can be a real tuff hunt outside of limited entry units,7 to 12 years to draw with 5 yr waiting periods. Turkeys can be ok but last year they opened up the late season to OTC and has killed the turkey population around my area. Rabbits,coyotes and grouse can be good hunting with a "few areas" that are good for duck and geese. Whip may be onto something with the SW Colorado area,I know their big game herds are in alot better condition than ours. Jobs don't come easy around here even in a good economy. I hope this helps you a little...jim
I'm from southern utah as well, and I just want to echo what twitchstick said. Nice weather for over 75% of the year as well as a short travelling distance to the forest. Rifle hunts are ruining the deer hunting around here, but hopefully with the cuts they are doing the next few years things will get better. All the other hunts you shouldn't have too much of a problem with, at least no one in my family does.
I don't think snow is so much the issue as the sun. This winter we had snow shoes on to walk the dogs every day from mid-December until March. Our daily highs were in the 20's most of that time. We did not break 32 until March. Even some breaks in temp during winter and more sun would help. I had actually been researching southern CO. as a location. She loved AZ when she was there in April, but I don't think I cold handle a draw system for everything. Oh and Stan I already have 17 years under my belt of Middle school science. I am hoping the science piece will help.
Michael,
I'm originally from Maine and have lived in southern New Mexico for about eight years. My wife is a science teacher. I used to make predator calls too, so we have a lot in common. I moved here primarily because of the weather and lack of decent jobs in Maine.
Weather - The weather here is definitely better overall. I do get tired of the heat, wind and sand, but its better than the cold and snow. I miss trees, woods, whitetails and rain, but the predator calling here is great.
Jobs - I know teaching jobs in mid-coast Maine are tough to get, rural ones not so much. If you have a good job there, think twice before giving it up. There is not much hiring going on here in teaching now, but highly qualified science and math teachers are in short supply and should be able to find work without too much trouble.
Hunting - Most everything but furbearers, varmints and small game is by lottery. You missed the lottery for this year and have to have been a resident for 6 months before you can apply anyway. Elk hunting is great, but everything else is unimpressive. The main problem around here is that the lack of water forces the wildlife to live mostly in the mountains and there are a lot of people competing for those animals. Don't even consider fishing here, it will only piss you off. On the bright side there is more public land (BLM & National Forest) than you can imagine.
I don't regret moving here, but I do miss Maine. The ideal situation would be to "snowbird," but as a teacher, you would still miss the hunting seasons in Maine. Its a completely different world here. Feel free to PM me if you have more specific questions - John
I dunno I'm going to have to disagree with those saying Colorado.
We have 1. long winters and 2 Very Limited hunting (both Animals and Seasons) You might Hvae a little better luck South West Maybe New Mex Or AZ.
But I would For Sure Scratch Colorado off the list...Just my Opinion
I am opposite of Matty. I loved CO when I lived there. Lots of elk opp, good bird huinting, although you have to drive. The deer were coming back, antelope, and a chance to put in for some great species. The winters are long, but not as long as the other western states. I miss living there for sure. An added bonus is that you are not too far from Nebraska or KS to hunt whitetails to increase your season length. I would not choose NM or AZ unless you want to hunt every 10 years or so. If it weren't for the family situation, I would move back. Good luck!
Are you thinking about Washington on your short list? Well... :dunno:
My choice is Idaho...even if the wolves are moving in.
Probably the biggest adjustment guys have when they move out here is the lack of easy access whitetail & small game hunting like there is back east. You will need to be picky about location to have close by hunting. I live on the front range in Colorado and its a great place but hunting before and after work is pretty spotty. Our whitetail habitat is small and mostly private with guys lined up to get access.
Most hunting is an hour+ away and any public hunting close by is crowded unless you land some private access which is in big demand.
The trade off is that we have 10 big game species and 100s of thousands of spectacular public acres to run around on. It just requires some driving and hiking so a weekend gets chewed up pretty fast.
Weather here is pretty easy if you stay below 6000' but look to the western slope for close access to huntable lands.
I second what Blackhawk says, we have good hunting but no sun much of the year.
Maineac---Stan mentioned northern CA---and if weather is the only issue I would have to agree. Born and raised in the northern end of the central valley---it was a great place to grow up. But conditions have degraded over the decades. Recognize that the politics of the state are driven by the urban populations of the geographic southern 3/4 of the state, which tends to ignore the realities of rural folks. The predominantly rural orientation of my home area , traditionally financed by lumber and agriculture, has been supplanted by a huge infux of people fleeing the cities.
While I think you would enjoy our winters, our summers are probably another matter; typically dry, with temps often exceeding 115 degrees. I have known many families who moved in and left after the first summer. If you move to the mountains to escape the heat, winters snow depths can be problematic. Wild fires often threaten most areas, as court actions have blocked fuel reduction efforts on a lot of USFS timber land.
Local teaching job openings are few and elicit many applicants---I am told salaries are much lower than in the urban areas, and benefit packages fall way below the national average. This is balanced some by lower housing costs---however, the flight of many retirees from the cities has rural real estate prices skyrocketing.
Hunting is spotty. We have beautiful mountain areas-mostly public land, and a lot of timber company land open to hunting (but not camping). Mule deer hunting areas are all under limited draw regulations, and we get drawn every 5-6 years. Residents of those areas have to complete for tags with everyone else. Much of blacktail hunting is regulated with first come first served tags, but a lot of the prime lower elevation habitat is private land, locked up with hunting leases. Politically driven herd management practices, combined with major habit losses, have given us declining populations with wildly skewed buck/doe ratios. The one saving grace are the wilderness areas, which give us good backpacking hunt opportunities during the late summer bow season.
There are limited elk and antelope tag draws, even a few sheep in the southern Sierras.
Lots of feral pigs, mostly on private land.
As a result, my extended family is actively discussing a mass move to another state. Sorry to be so discouraging, but I am calling it as I see it.
Bruce
I live about 60 miles south of San Francisco in a very beautiful, sunny environ. A coupla days frost and occasional snow in the surrounding hills and 300+ days of sunshine. Hunting access is tough; but maybe easier in less populated areas.
As far as hunting goes, we hunt here a bit and mostly Oregon, SW WA and UT.
If I had it all to do over again, and who knows I just might, it'd be Oregon, somewhere along US Hwy. 97 north or south (but not in) Bend. Drier. That way I could pop over the hills and hunt Roosevelts (or blacktail) on the coast or head over to John Day or even further over to Baker or down to Steens. And you have all that lodgepole forest around Wickiup and Crane Prairie to hunt. And you're not that far from a quick hunt in Washington southern Cascades or Idaho's Clearwater. And Oregon just seems more bowhunter friendly than most Western states.
Oregon is 53% federal land and another 20% give or take accessible state land, plus there are westside timber company lands to access.
The economy isn't as robust as Washington or California (cough-cough) but it's steadier.
And I just like the people there. More walk than talk.
The trouble is, you can out walk the riffraff in Washington, but not in Oregon. Buncha animals.
You might consider Central WA. If I could convince my wife we'd retire in Wenatchee instead of Seattle. Four seasons, lots more sunshine, less people and a lower cost of living. One my favorite areas to hunt mule deer is just a short drive from Wenatchee.
Oregon is fast becoming less "bowhunter friendly". They upped the tag fees again. The units are slowly becoming draws instead of otc tags. There is less and less animals due to different factors like predation (cougars went from 800 to over 5,000 since the good citizens voted no hunting them with dogs!). High state income taxes. High unemployment.
If you want the sun then central Oregon is the place. You'll see the sun around 300 days a year. But it takes until April/May to see the temps up over freezing regularly. Short summers.
I would definitely take a look at SW Colorado! Lots of animals, beautiful country.
I will also have to agree with Styder, the weather is nicer in the south-central part of the state though they do get much more snow then we do on the coast. it isn't so far that you couldn't come out here for Roosevelt's or Black-tail but you also have a lot of Mulies and some white-tails we don't have on the western side. With the exception of hogs and bison you can hunt nearly anything here you can in most states.
I have never had the chance to spend anytime on Colorado but everything I have seen on film makes me want to go there.
If you don't like long wet crummy winters scratch oregon and washington. Also scratch them due to all of eastern oregon and a lot of wa are draw and preference points only. These are the 2 I've lived in for the last 35 years and believe me they are nothing to brag about. Frank
if she's looking for sun you best scratch north idaho off the list too...yesterday was the first 60 degree day since last fall...always cloudy...
someone mentioned wolves...yes we have a season on them this year but our elk seasons are going down hill fast...bulls only during bow season this year in some areas that up till last year were either sex the whole season.
and to top it off my wife is like yours and headed to maui today!!!
I live in Northwest Kansas and love it here. We are getting more and more WIHA (Walk in hunting area). Everything for archery is over the counter also. The winters are not very long at all. usually get our first snow in November and starts getting above 32 at the end of Feb or beginning of March. Some years are worse than others on both sides (stays cold longer or not as much snow). The part I REALLY don't like is the summers. By June its hitting 100 and stays within 10 degrees either way till Sep. We also don't get a lot of rain here. We've had years where we've had less than 20 inches of precipitation in a year. Another option is central and Eastern KS. They don't have the muleys but it does rain a lot more. Let me know if you have any questions.
I love the weather in california but i have no idea how the hunting is, i hope to find out soon :D
In AZ for bowhunting deer there a few areas up on the Kaibab that you have to draw for, but for the remaining areas the tags are OTC. Now elk, turkey and javelina tags are all draw, but you can hunt all the furbearing animals along with dove with an OTC.
I think AZ is a great place to hunt for bowhunters.
You might want to consider what the economy is like in your move. WA, NV, Tx, Wyo have no income taxes. The economies of ND, SD, are better than most because of the oil drilling. WA, OR, CA, AZ, NV have terrible housing markets. WA, OR, CA are having severe budget problems and education relies heavily on state funding.
I know WA & OR have or are raising hunting & Lic. fees for everything. If they aren't taxing it, it must be dead. I think hunting opportunities are good for Traditional hunters in OR, WA, Id, Co.
If rain doesn't bother you, western OR & WA get it. We set a record in April. The weather forecast for the mountains is more snow next week. There is lots of snow in the mountains, and California is over their drought for the first time in years.
A recent article in the Oregonian, said the town of Hermiston has the greatest population gain among school age kids. Some areas are loosing population and closing schools, not so in Hermiston, OR.
In Montana you get 6 weeks of bow season and 6 weeks of rifle season that you can hunt with your bow. Archery antelope starts August 15th and you can hunt from then until the weekend after Thanksgiving for something. I think about 60% of the state is public land. As far as teaching jobs I don't know the availability of those. As far as sun goes that just depends on where in the state you are. Sheep, Moose, and Goat are draw tags. Archery antelope is a garunteed draw. Black bear, mountain lion, deer, elk, turkeys, upland birds are OTC and we are going to have a wolf season again this fall!
i would have to agree with Snakebit. Kansas might be a viable option. Over the counter permits for residents, somewhat short winters, not a whole lot of snow as long as you stay away from the northeast corner. they opened up elk to the whole state recently, but i haven't seen any down here in south central Kansas yet. Hogs aren't legal to hunt here, but, a 2-3 day round trip to Oklahoma takes care of that issue. antelope if you live in the western part of the state. Down here where I am, plenty of whitetail, birds (pheasant, prarie chicken, dove), and turkey (not to mention the cottontails and squirrel). within a 30-45 minute drive of wichita you can be on public or private land hunting for most of what i listed, except quail (they're kinda scarce down here). An hour to hour and a half drive east/northeast covers the quail issue, too. If you're wanting antelope within an easy drive, i suggest doing the research and looking at the maps to see where it's open (basically the western third of the state). Summers hit the 80-100* mark with lows in the 70-80* area usually, some years rain is plentiful, others, not so much. Plenty of state lakes and private ponds for fishing, too, if you wanted. I'll be happy to give you what info I can, just let me know.
-rich
snag, yeah, I know. :bigsmyl: Oregon isn't like it was 25 years ago, but it's still better elk hunting than Washington. You get a whole month and can shoot any elk in most units and can hunt both sides of the mountains. That's still pretty cool. Plus, there's that token trad-only week in Canyon Creek.
As for Idaho and the wolves. That's a problem, for sure. It's amazing what's happened just in the last 10 years, but even so, Idaho's herds are still stronger than Washington.
In short, my friends, the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence! :biglaugh:
Thank you, some great information, and as always here, honest. Thanks
One suggestion is to look at Rapid City, South Dakota. Out here on the plains, it is called the Banana Belt because it tends to be warmer in winter than surrounding areas. There are a lot of hunting and fishing opportunities around Rapid City, and it is within a long day's drive of Yellowstone National Park.
Pheasant hunting is legendary in central South Dakota, and you are only a few hours drive from Nebraska, North Dakota and eastern Wyoming for additional outdoor opportunities.
I've had to good fortune to live all over the western US and in several different countries, Oregon is where I call home. Yes, there some issues living there as with anywhere. The tax man gets you no matter where you live so it's a moot point. It's the only place that I can think of where you ski Sat morning, go wine tasting Sat afternoon with the Mrs., then drive to the coast to fish for salmon then have breakfast at the beach Sun morning and go hunt elk and deer Sun afternoon. Once you're a resident you can buy a Sports Pac license which allows you to hunt everything but sheep, goats and antelope which are draw only, all for less than $200. It also includes your fishing permits. If nothing else, you've got a great excuse for a roadtrip!
QuoteOriginally posted by maineac:
... tired of the long winters and gloomy springs of Maine...
...My issue is I have become used to having lots of land to roam and hunt right out my back door...
I grew up in Maine hunting all my life there then came out West 19 years ago and have never looked back.
Had the same questions about hunting and, yes, its different- you adjust. You will never regret it as long as you remember Maine is a special place and no place can ever replace it, but some places have charms of their own and its a lot of fun learning about those too and its an adventure worth having, hunting wise and otherwise.
Joshua
Well said.
How 'bout Midwest instead of West? haha
We've got a saying around here. "If you don't like the weather in Southern Illinois, wait till tomorrow."
Winters hover around teens for several weeks, Springs will have you cursing the rain, Summer (the humidity) will have wondering if it's possible to melt, and fall...well, fall's perfect.
Don't come to Illinois though, our State is broke and we can't seem to keep our Governors out of jail. :)
I grew up in SW Colorado and now reside in central NM. SW Colorado has nearly unlimited outdoor activities and I preferred living there to NM but the hunting is crowded. The elk hunting in NM is excellent and the draw is not as bad as many people like to make it. Javelina and mule deer are fairly easy draws and the hunting is good for them also.
I would go for Idaho. Good hunting and even the big city of Boise has a smaller town feel to it.
As for the wolves Idaho and Montana are having a limited season this year.
Living in AZ has its drawbacks but as a lifelong resident, except a short stint in GA for the military, I must say its not that bad. We do have a draw for big game but most archery hunts, including deer, are over the counter tags with no draw. Which is part of the reason I dived into archery in the first place. Research your climates though. Where I am at the heat index can hit 135 in August. Just about mid summer I could care less what hunting opportunities there are. Bump the west head north!
I recently moved out west for all the reasons you mentioned, tired of 200" + snow a year, constant grey days, and I landed in Wyoming. The state is in great fiscal condidtion, plenty of sun throughout the year and hunting opportunities. There should be no shortage of qualified teaching positions and cold will be nothing new to you coming from Maine. One thing though is a lack of humidity, thankfully. Good luck and I know how you feel, Joe
You're making me want to move Joe! Does Wyoming have a state income tax? Sales tax?
From what I understand no state income tax and the property tax is far less than rural New York State, but I can not think of any state with out sales tax. I am not sure of the rate but it might change from county to county. It really is a great state to call home for anyone who lives outdoors.
When you young and it sound like you are , well thats the time to move or wait till retirement.I can't find work where I live an dit woul dbe even harder I think with a move at my age and My wife, well if NOT for her insurence we woul dprobably move at any rate but now is a bad time. Man I wish I had known 'bout this stuff before I got married and had moved first, this isnt working out trying to move in the economy and my age NOW[56]....GOOD LUCK !
Nv is a draw state. Lots of open, really open land.Deer elk antelope some turkey. Hot in early season. Dry. But we have Burning Man! Look it up
Recogizing that it is neither the warm west, nor west at all, but NJ is a heck of a place . The archery deer season runs almost straight from mid Sept most of the way through February. NO draw, and lots of deer. There is small game and there is lots and lots of fishing. IF you want to try bear you need to go out of state, but there is turkey and predator hunting. No elk nor moose to be had, alas.
Steve
maineac
sent you a p/m.
Most western states have budget problems-no secret. I would include Vancouver BC and Victoria BC in the mix to extend the range. It is pretty easy to get working papers if you have a job offer.
This will certainly be a researched and thought out move. We moved to Maine in our 20's with no jobs or any other foundations. Built a life. Now as I turn 50 any change will require planning. Thanks again for all the great and thoughtful comments.