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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: WESTBROOK on August 22, 2010, 10:57:00 AM
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Hey Guys
I've been building woodies for a while, useing Helmsman spar urethane for a finish and Testors enamel for cresting, has been working fine.
BUT when I use Testors silver for highlights, the metal flake in the silver runs when I put the next coat of finish over it.
? can I spray a water base poly over the cresting to seal it and go over that with the Helmsman.
? use a different silver paint.
The silver paint is the only issue here, everything else is fine.
Thanks
Eric
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Would like to find out myself. Thanks.
Magnus
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I have seen this happen likewise. I no longer coat over the cresting,they hold up just fine.
Gordon
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I gave up on both silver and gold. They just don't work for me. Anything I put over them makes them run. No over coat and they are the first to rub off.
OkKeith
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Give Profin a try for your finish. I use acrylics and have not had an issue with them runnung.
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Eric, try letting them sit for 24 hrs if you use the silver, If you try a water based sealer the same thing will happen, ( thats all I use) it only happens with the silver, but letting it dry for a day works good for me.
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I have been cresting with blue and silver Fletch-Lac for the last 35+ years.
Never had a run or a problem with Bohning's paints.
Still using most of the arrows I originally crested in the mid-70's.
Charles.
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Luvnlongbow, your close. I just happened to remember I have some Acrylic enamel silver from Bob Burton. I put some lines on a test shaft, let it dry, went and dipped it and it looks like its holding.
So I did a real test, put some black testors on a test shaft let it set up, then put some acrylic silver lines on it. Let it dry and dipped it. I guess I rushed it a little, the black hadnt cured yet and ran down the shaft, but the silver stayed put. So I re-did it will let it set till tomorrow and dip.
Eric
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I have been using ProFin for my dipped arrow finish and it some sweet finish. I have been cresting with Testors enamel and found out the first time that the silver runs in an 'oil' based finish. Now, I coat the crest with water based Polyurethane after the Testors has dryed for a couple days. I use a foam brush to apply while the shaft spins in the crester - use enough Poly, not to thin. Let the Poly dry well and dip in ProFin and no running of the silver.
I am going to change over to acrylics for cresting to avoid that overcoating of Poly to save time.
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I don't know how long you let them sit once crested, but a good rule to live by when working with wood and finishes, is to let everything you do sit for a day. Don't rush anything, give it time to set up, and 24 hrs is just about right for everything I do.
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Ray, I'll find out tomorrow, but it looks like just switching to acrylic silver will do the trick.
Eric
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Yep, that is what I did too.... switched to all acrylic enamels from testors to use with my Profin topcoat. I had problems with gold and silver running on me in the regular enamels. If I let them dry for 3-4 days it worked okay, just got tired of waiting that long and always worrying about my gold and silver outlines running on me. No worries now with the water based acrylic enamel from testors.
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Use minwax as the sealer and minwax spray for the top coat after you have let the paint dry 24 hours. Just a couple of light coats. I would suggest the regular gloss poly as the top coat spray as the Helmsman will yellow your colors. Krylon Crystal clear works well for the sealer / top coat as well.
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I use testors clear spray over cresting and had no problems
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I use Testor Gold and next day coat with Minwax water base poly using a 1/2 in wide brush. Never had the gold run.
RonL
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Like otheres mentioned, I use testors paints. I use ProFinish oil based poly to seal my shafts after staining, then crest with testors. I let it dry at least a day, then I dip the shaft about 1/2" past the cresting in water based poly, hang it up and dry overnight. When dry, you cannot see the overlap spot of the water-poly. Then I apply either one more coat of poly using the ProFin, or I use gasket laquer. I could just leave the fletch end fishished with the last short dip of water poly, but I have found that fletch tape slips a little on water poly. So I use an oil poly for my final coat.
I like the tape, its very durable, and much faster tofletch a dozen arrows.
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Thanks for all the great info guys. Looks like my experiment worked. I put some black testors on a shaft with some acrylic silver over it (24 hrs ago), just went out and dipped it and it looks good. Its been 30 minutes and nothing moved, so it looks like a fix.
I didnt realize you could intermix oil and water base paints and finishes. So I learned a thing or 2
Thanks
Eric
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Eric.
Do you crest all colors at once or do one let it dry then the next etc... I'm new to cresting. Thanks.
Magnus
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Magnus
It realy depends. I dont leave a paint jar open longer than necessary, its suprising how fast it starts to dryout/thicken up. Paint consistancy(thick/thin) is very important, too thick-it wont flow freely and leave the paint too thick on the shaft. Too thin-gives poor coverage, can sag when the shaft stops spinning.
If you will be putting a highlight stripe where 2 colors come together, those 2 colors dont actually have to touch so you could do them at the same time and leave a hair(litteraly) gap between them that the highlight will cover.
No highlight line, so the 2 colors must come together I will do 1 at a time. Usually the time it takes to cycle through a dozen shafts is enough time to go to the next color with out messing up the first.
If the crest is, say %50 or more of 1 color I will do that 1 color and do the others on the next cycle.
Highlights, I wait till the main colors a quite dry.
I may be overly cautious, but there is no "eraser" for this stuff. Once you touch the brush down, thats it.
Hope this helps
Eric
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Magnus
The first arrow shows what this thread was about, you can see the silver next to the black was dosolved by the finish.
The second arrow, the (supposed to be)fine black lines, shows the paint is a little too thick for a fine line. Have to stir it up a little, or add some thinner once in a while.
I got a lot to learn too, but it sure is fun!
Makes ya truly appreciate the arrows the other TGer's post.
Eric
(http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h121/mandoman_2006/P8240001.jpg)
(http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h121/mandoman_2006/P8240002.jpg)
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I see what you mean. Your topic was perfectly timed. I started with testors two days ago and am going to use silver highlights with spar urethane as well. Thanks for your question. It saved me a lot of headaches. Heading to get some water base poly tonight.
Magnus
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I picked up a pint of water base yesterday to cover these before I finish dipping them.
Eric
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By the way. Nice looking arrows. Love the multiple colors.
Magnus
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Oh thanks, Thats what ya get when ya cant make up your mind...yellow or orange...lets try this. Another science project with 2 spray cans and a cordless drill. LOL
Eric
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i use every color that testor makes and never had a problem. I use a product called Zip Guard, It's a water base poly.
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I wipe on my Helmsman spar with a rag.When you go over the cresting you have a "soak in" time as I call it.You have to wipe over the gold or silver quickly,without going over the first section you did,otherwise if you wipe the section you start with you will wipe the paint right off.This will over coat the paint,and then will be sealed.Gold,silver and copper(My favorite of the metallic colors) are the only ones I've had this issue with.
What I'd like to find out is why my fletchings peel off the arrows after a period of time when using duco over any kind of poly.Still a mystery to me.Fletch tape works fine but not duco.
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If you use a water-based paint for your cresting then you can dip on oil-based over it to seal it completely without fear of dissolving the cresting. I use ProFin also. Never have a problem by doing it this way. The ProFin holds up great too.